Author Topic: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!  (Read 180527 times)

Offline GreatEx

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4720 on: May 23, 2024, 10:45:47 pm »
Why would referees engage in murky betting conspiracies when they can openly take bribes from club owners and the only response from the press or authorities is "gee, I hope they won't be jet-lagged"?

Offline Judge Red

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4721 on: May 23, 2024, 11:26:45 pm »
Has anybody answered the question why we are reffed by a significantly less pool of ref than all the other teams? Been looking at the stats and not only do we get the smallest in number (12) but are reffed by the same bunch over and over. Its wild.

https://www.whoscored.com/Teams/26/RefereeStatistics/England-Liverpool
« Last Edit: May 23, 2024, 11:31:18 pm by Judge Red »

Offline Son of Spion

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4722 on: May 23, 2024, 11:27:47 pm »
Multi-millionaire football players being dragged into the murky world of gambling, yet people find it hard to believe referees are caught up in the same issues, when it’s much easier for them to influence games.
We all know that the world of football has corruption. The only question is who is involved and how deep does it go?
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4723 on: May 23, 2024, 11:30:19 pm »
Has anybody answered the question why we are reffed by a significantly less pool of ref than all the other teams? Been looking at the stats and not only do we get the smallest in number (12) but are reffed by the same bunch over and over. Its wild.

The answer will be, because we're in a lot of top-level games, so they send their best refs to ref our games more often than for others, which makes our ref pool smaller. I don't buy it, but I'm 100 percent the argument would be something along that line.

Offline Judge Red

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4724 on: May 23, 2024, 11:33:58 pm »
In that case wouldn’t city and arsenal have the same set of refs with the same amount of games?

6 refs have officiated 30 of our 38 games between them. Taylor and Kavanagh have done 12 (6 each).
« Last Edit: May 23, 2024, 11:37:13 pm by Judge Red »

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4725 on: May 23, 2024, 11:43:58 pm »
Send their best refs  :lmao
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Offline Son of Spion

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4726 on: May 24, 2024, 12:25:02 am »
The answer will be, because we're in a lot of top-level games, so they send their best refs to ref our games more often than for others, which makes our ref pool smaller. I don't buy it, but I'm 100 percent the argument would be something along that line.
That would be my guess too. Although, like you, I don't buy it.

As Judge Red just suggested. This theory would also see Abu Dhabi and Arsenal in the same predicament, but it appears they aren't.
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Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4727 on: May 24, 2024, 12:49:04 am »
There should be a gnats cock between them all, none of this best bollocks.

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Offline JRed

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4728 on: May 24, 2024, 08:40:53 am »
We all know that the world of football has corruption. The only question is who is involved and how deep does it go?
Exactly. There is no way the refs can be this bad at their jobs. It is impossible. The only question is why they are cheating. Is it for their own club preferences, is it to do with monetary gain from gambling/ bribes. Or is it even more sinister where they have been ‘leaned on’ by nefarious characters?

Offline kasperoff

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4729 on: May 24, 2024, 09:03:59 am »
They all talk about it being "evened itself out over the course of the season". So we we robbed in the Arsenal and CIty games with the handballs, and royally screwed over in the Spurs game. All decisions that were wrong by anyone's judgement. Even Gary Neville's.

I don't watch enough of City or Arsenal. But did they also have 3 similar howlers that cost them at least 5 points, and possibly 7?
I think the same, can't stand him, but if you could have a £1million pound cheque or steve bruces head hollowed out and filled with pound coins which would you have?

Offline Judge Red

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4730 on: May 24, 2024, 09:38:15 am »
Not into the corrupt side of things just interested to see how they don’t help themselves. It’s a difficult job officiating. If any of you have had the experience of being the man in the middle or running the line, you’ll know how difficult it is just covering the basics and thats just at kids footy. I just don’t believe they help themselves and make them open to suggestions of foul play by not being regulated

Offline JRed

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4731 on: May 24, 2024, 09:39:55 am »
Not into the corrupt side of things just interested to see how they don’t help themselves. It’s a difficult job officiating. If any of you have had the experience of being the man in the middle or running the line, you’ll know how difficult it is just covering the basics and thats just at kids footy. I just don’t believe they help themselves and make them open to suggestions of foul play by not being regulated
Yeah I did a little bit of reffing kids games and it is incredibly difficult. What is not difficult however is watching endless replays on a screen from various angles.

Offline BoRed

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4732 on: May 24, 2024, 09:40:52 am »
That would be my guess too. Although, like you, I don't buy it.

As Judge Red just suggested. This theory would also see Abu Dhabi and Arsenal in the same predicament, but it appears they aren't.

Posted this earlier:

Seen this recently, no idea what the source is:

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F1qo1f8jbudwc1.jpeg

Just 20 refs on this list, not 27, but its striking that five out of those 20 don't do Liverpool (or Everton) games. Presumably, some because they like us, some because they hate us, some because they're from Liverpool.

This, in itself, is probably not surprising. What is remarkable, though, is that there's not a single ref there that doesn't do Man Utd (or City). To start with, many are from (Greater) Manchester. And if you picked 20 random people across England who were all growing up in the 1990s, how likely would it be that none of them had any (either positive or negative) feelings towards Man Utd? And these are not random people, they are people who obviously had some affinity with football all along.

Also interesting, "Darren Bond, from Wigan, never involved in Liverpool, Everton or Wigan Athletic matches" and "Paul Tierney, from Wigan, Wigan Athletic fan" (record breaking involvement in Liverpool matches).

Given that we are both the most loved and most hated team in England, it's not surprising that the pool of referees that can referee us is smaller than, for example, City, who no one cared about when the current refs were growing up. But while so many refs apparently can't ref us because they either like us or hate us, it is surprising that none of them have any strong feelings towards Man Utd.

Offline Eeyore

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4733 on: May 24, 2024, 06:38:25 pm »
Amazing what you can get away with if you work for the PGMOL.


A former Premier League referee has been banned for five months by the Football Association after making a racist remark to a black official after a game.

It emerged on Friday that Rodger Gifford, the ex-official in question, stopped working as a referees observer for refereeing body PGMOL in January during the early stages of an FA investigation into his comments.

Gifford was unanimously proven, external by an independent regulatory commission to have used "abusive and/or insulting and/or improper" language which included "a reference, whether express or implied, to colour and/or race and/or ethnic origin".

The incident took place in a post-match debrief following an FA Cup second-round game between Newport County and Barnet in December 2023 when he addressed the official, who was working as an assistant referee coach.

Gifford denied the charge but his comments were corroborated by a number of witnesses in the written reasons released by the FA, who also imposed a £400 fine and ordered him to attend an education course.

"His submissions that his comments were in some way light-hearted designed to reflect [the assistant referee coach's] personality were not accepted," said the independent regulatory commission.

"It is evident that the comments made by Mr Gifford included a reference to race.

"It is difficult to reconcile Mr Gifford’s position. He held a position of trust and responsibility within PGMOL. There is no place in the game, or society, for comments of this nature. There is no other position."

BBC Sport understands Gifford was not an employee of the PGMOL but was used on a freelance basis, and has not worked as an observer after the game at Newport.

This was Gifford's second offence as he had admitted a similar breach in 2022 and was suspended for eight weeks, fined £200 and ordered to undertake an education programme.
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Offline JRed

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4734 on: May 24, 2024, 06:43:21 pm »
Should’ve just elbowed him in the face, he would’ve got away with that.

Offline Peabee

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4735 on: May 24, 2024, 06:44:27 pm »
He's done it previously? Any other company would cut ties.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4736 on: May 24, 2024, 06:45:45 pm »
He's done it previously? Any other company would cut ties.

What if he doesn’t wear a tie?
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4737 on: May 24, 2024, 07:06:33 pm »
For anyone interested, in the current case, in the post-match brief it was talked about how on one side of the pitch it was pretty dark and he said to assistant-referee coach, a black man, that luckily he wasn't on that side, as he could not have seen him, except maybe if he had smiled. In the one two years ago, it was another post-match brief and he told one of the assistants (who had come to the UK from Bulgaria in 2003) to "Shut up, you're not in Bulgaria now". It's insane that they still kept working with him after that one, let alone having him do stuff for them in the first place. The guy is fucking 76 years old...
« Last Edit: May 24, 2024, 07:08:27 pm by stoa »

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4738 on: May 24, 2024, 07:18:04 pm »
For anyone interested, in the current case, in the post-match brief it was talked about how on one side of the pitch it was pretty dark and he said to assistant-referee coach, a black man, that luckily he wasn't on that side, as he could not have seen him, except maybe if he had smiled. In the one two years ago, it was another post-match brief and he told one of the assistants (who had come to the UK from Bulgaria in 2003) to "Shut up, you're not in Bulgaria now". It's insane that they still kept working with him after that one, let alone having him do stuff for them in the first place. The guy is fucking 76 years old...

So five years younger than Joe Biden? ;D

Offline Eeyore

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4739 on: May 24, 2024, 07:44:23 pm »
For anyone interested, in the current case, in the post-match brief it was talked about how on one side of the pitch it was pretty dark and he said to assistant-referee coach, a black man, that luckily he wasn't on that side, as he could not have seen him, except maybe if he had smiled. In the one two years ago, it was another post-match brief and he told one of the assistants (who had come to the UK from Bulgaria in 2003) to "Shut up, you're not in Bulgaria now". It's insane that they still kept working with him after that one, let alone having him do stuff for them in the first place. The guy is fucking 76 years old...

For the first offence he was suspended for 8 weeks, fined the sum of £200 and ordered to undertake an education programme.

Then after repeating the offence he gets suspended for 5 months, fined £400 and is ordered to undertake another education programme.

The PGMOL just live in their own world and can basically do what they want. It is no wonder there is little diversity and inclusion within refereeing.
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Offline Peabee

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4740 on: May 24, 2024, 07:54:30 pm »
What if he doesn’t wear a tie?

Chop his fingers off?
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