Author Topic: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!  (Read 177433 times)

Offline rob1966

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4560 on: May 2, 2024, 08:24:39 am »
Sound.

No worries though, this thing will be awaiting your return. ;D

I'm hoping it's not. All I want is a game where we don't notice the ref, is that so hard?
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4561 on: May 2, 2024, 10:39:54 am »


It’s bullshit and we all know it is.

Of course its bullshit because Taylor has a really easy out here by giving an actual free kick when he realises Areola hasn't seen or heard the advantage. That stops the whole fuss but he gives a drop ball instead.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4562 on: May 2, 2024, 11:38:35 am »
It's reached the point where I don't derive any joy from watching us play any longer.

Sometimes feel as if I should just wait for FT, check the score, if we've won, watch the game - if we've lost, don't bother.

This is how the state of officiating (VAR included) has affected me.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4563 on: May 2, 2024, 12:03:21 pm »
What isn't even being asked is whether it was even a free kick. The main contact is with a West Ham defender. Gakpo stands his ground and doesn't even jump for the ball with Areola. Usually, if the Ref indicates advantage it is two hands out in front of him. For me, Areola is just time-wasting evidenced by throwing the ball forward and then stopping to pull his socks up.

For me, Taylor doesn't indicate a foul and an advantage he just on two occasions signals for Areola to get on with it. I mean if he was playing an advantage then he just blows his whistle and goes back to his original decision. Awards West Ham a free kick and the situation is over. He doesn't do that for me he knows he hasn't given a free kick or played advantage.

Taylor regards it as open play and just wants him to stop time wasting and get on with it. It is pretty standard for a referee to warn a player to get on with it before he books him. Things change when Areola has a brain fart and throws the ball down. Taylor isn't protecting himself he hasn't done anything wrong.

For me it was reminiscent of Tierney blowing up early against United with Mane bearing down on goal. It isn't self-preservation it is just an opportunity to stop us from taking the lead. I mean he can't think the keeper is injured because if he is then he just goes to ground and the physios would be on the touchline or even already making their way on to treat him.

Taylor actually has to physically stop him from taking the kick twice. Injured players don't do that.
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Offline rob1966

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4564 on: May 2, 2024, 01:09:24 pm »
What isn't even being asked is whether it was even a free kick. The main contact is with a West Ham defender. Gakpo stands his ground and doesn't even jump for the ball with Areola. Usually, if the Ref indicates advantage it is two hands out in front of him. For me, Areola is just time-wasting evidenced by throwing the ball forward and then stopping to pull his socks up.

For me, Taylor doesn't indicate a foul and an advantage he just on two occasions signals for Areola to get on with it. I mean if he was playing an advantage then he just blows his whistle and goes back to his original decision. Awards West Ham a free kick and the situation is over. He doesn't do that for me he knows he hasn't given a free kick or played advantage.

Taylor regards it as open play and just wants him to stop time wasting and get on with it. It is pretty standard for a referee to warn a player to get on with it before he books him. Things change when Areola has a brain fart and throws the ball down. Taylor isn't protecting himself he hasn't done anything wrong.

For me it was reminiscent of Tierney blowing up early against United with Mane bearing down on goal. It isn't self-preservation it is just an opportunity to stop us from taking the lead. I mean he can't think the keeper is injured because if he is then he just goes to ground and the physios would be on the touchline or even already making their way on to treat him.

Taylor actually has to physically stop him from taking the kick twice. Injured players don't do that.

You're right, he never signalled advantage, like you say, its both arms and additionally he has to point to West Hams goal as you point to the team getting the advantage. Taylor just sort of points down field in a get on with it manner. Then as we've all seen he keeps telling Areola to get on with the game and runs to the centre circle.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4565 on: May 2, 2024, 01:15:42 pm »
Referees have used one arm to signal advantage for about 2 years now.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4566 on: May 2, 2024, 01:19:51 pm »
Let's not fall into their trap by discussing arm gesture bollocks, if it was an advantage then he would have restarted with a free kick and not ordered the player to be injured, end of fucking story.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4567 on: May 2, 2024, 03:43:52 pm »
Referees have used one arm to signal advantage for about 2 years now.

The one-arm signal though is a palm out to indicate you have the ball you have an advantage. Plus where is the actual foul?

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Offline stockdam

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4568 on: May 2, 2024, 04:24:16 pm »
The one-arm signal though is a palm out to indicate you have the ball you have an advantage. Plus where is the actual foul?




It’s not really clear to me if he formally was playing advantage or not. Referees will use one or two arms held out horizontally to indicate advantage. As you said there was no foul but neither of these things matter.

Firstly he could have thought there was a foul and was waving play to continue.

However he restarted the game with a drop ball which means that he had stopped play, presumably to give the keeper treatment or more likely because he thought the keeper had misinterpreted his decision. Since when can the referee stop play because he thought that the keeper had messed up?

If he was playing advantage then he would have stopped play and awarded the free kick.

For me, the referee then does some “quick thinking” and realises that everyone should play to the whistle and he cannot stop play just because one player is confused. He then remembers that the keeper had gone down and then the referee tells the keeper that he needs treatment even though it is clear that the keeper was in no distress.

I think the club should insist on audio and an explanation as there is no logical reason for what the referee did and in effect he robbed us of 3 points.
« Last Edit: May 2, 2024, 04:25:53 pm by stockdam »
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Offline stockdam

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4569 on: May 2, 2024, 04:31:23 pm »
Let's not fall into their trap by discussing arm gesture bollocks, if it was an advantage then he would have restarted with a free kick and not ordered the player to be injured, end of fucking story.

Agreed. He didn’t stop play because he thought there had been no advantage as he would have restarted with a free kick.


The drop ball restart indicates that he had stopped “live play” which he can do if there’s a head injury or a serious injury that needs immediate treatment.

The most likely answer is that the referee saw that the keeper was confused and must have “misunderstood the decision” and stopped the game in the “spirit of the law”. That’s a new one to me. A player messes up and assumes there had been a free kick yet the likes of Gakpo was well aware that the ball was in play.
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Offline StigenKeegan

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4570 on: May 4, 2024, 12:31:09 am »

The most likely answer is that the referee saw that the keeper was confused and must have “misunderstood the decision” and stopped the game in the “spirit of the law”.

It's good to know that if all of our backline just stops playing in sunday  believing that the ref has blown for an offside the ref will understand that we just "misunderstood the decision" and then stop the play "in the spirit of the law". At least that will put an end to all the endless micro-analysis of every single tight offside call under VAR.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4571 on: May 4, 2024, 09:22:12 am »
Can we keep this on 115 pages forever please?
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4572 on: May 4, 2024, 10:15:05 am »
It's good to know that if all of our backline just stops playing in sunday  believing that the ref has blown for an offside the ref will understand that we just "misunderstood the decision" and then stop the play "in the spirit of the law". At least that will put an end to all the endless micro-analysis of every single tight offside call under VAR.

I am amazed Taylor didn't stop the play when Quansah misunderstood that Fernandes was there when he played the blind pass in the United game.
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Quote from: tubby on Today at 12:45:53 pm

They both went in high, that's factually correct, both tried to play the ball at height.  Doku with his foot, Mac Allister with his chest.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4574 on: May 4, 2024, 11:15:04 am »

Offline Hazell

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Offline Egyptian36

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4576 on: May 4, 2024, 12:58:18 pm »
What an absolute cheating fucking twat he is.
Something has to be done about the PGMOL mafia.

Kavanagh too. He was VAR that Tottenham game and Rodri handball

Offline Egyptian36

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4577 on: May 4, 2024, 05:47:25 pm »
You guys need to see the penalty City just got. Yet Doku on Mac which is actually a foul not given.

BTW the same VAR for both games Stuart Attwell
« Last Edit: May 4, 2024, 06:23:07 pm by Egyptian36 »

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4578 on: May 4, 2024, 05:50:40 pm »
Kavanagh too. He was VAR that Tottenham game and Rodri handball

Kavanagh was worse that game as he sent Robertson off (Tierney booked him) after ignoring the Kane assault. Jota was a stonewall pen as well that he failed to give which with the benefit of technology is inexcusable. Same with Rodri handball.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4579 on: May 4, 2024, 06:33:07 pm »
Must be a piece of piss in a title run in if you get 1 or more non-existent pens each game

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4580 on: May 4, 2024, 06:43:01 pm »
Must be a piece of piss in a title run in if you get 1 or more non-existent pens each game

I think the softest penalty I have ever seen was the one Rodri got earlier in the season at 0-0 in the Manchester Derby.



Gvardiol has got Rashford in an armlock and yet they somehow give a penalty to Rodri.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4581 on: May 4, 2024, 06:47:18 pm »
Why strive for higher standards when you can just intimidate critics into silence with fines and touchline bans for bringing the game into disrepute?
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4583 on: May 4, 2024, 06:58:57 pm »
Imagine the confidence boost as a team if you know that decisions are more likely to go your way in a game.  Imagine being able to dive knowing the ref is likely to give the decision for you (Saka) as opposed to against you (Mo) in a game.  Imagine the fear knowing decisions are more likely to go against you as a defender or midfielder, terrified a tackle 1/10000th of a second late could result in a sending off (Curtis / Alexis) but any 50/50 decision is more than 50/50 times going against you?  Imagine having a game plan based on well rehearsed free-kick routines utilsing penalty area shithousery knowing that shithousery will be passed over as "clever play" and you'll be able to "earn" numerous chances per game to attempt your well rehearsed routines regardless?

I thought long and hard about this today, asking myself whether we've been naive this past few seasons with the way we play and Arsenal have been exceptionally clever.  I've concluded that if we dived and cheated like Arsenal, we've no chance of getting the number of decisions they do anyway so to try would be ultimately pointless.  It's harder for us to win the league than any other team and would be regardless of the obstacles the Prem and PGMOL put in our way with officials and fixture scheduling.  We're still a major scalp for every team in a way that no other team is.

What's the fucking point anymore?
« Last Edit: May 4, 2024, 07:00:43 pm by wah00ey »
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4584 on: May 4, 2024, 07:00:24 pm »
Why strive for higher standards when you can just intimidate critics into silence with fines and touchline bans for bringing the game into disrepute?

Yeah seems it's their MO with willing journalists as their mouthpieces when they need one.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4585 on: May 4, 2024, 07:21:41 pm »
When you combine the shitty decisions we get with the "lucky" calls our competitors get - even accounting for the smattering of decisions in between that supposedly "even things up" - it's little wonder even the best mentality can crack.

Sad truth is, our competitors don't have to be mentality monsters.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4586 on: May 4, 2024, 07:35:13 pm »
When you combine the shitty decisions we get with the "lucky" calls our competitors get - even accounting for the smattering of decisions in between that supposedly "even things up" - it's little wonder even the best mentality can crack.

Sad truth is, our competitors don't have to be mentality monsters.
This is true for the fans too. I was getting so stressed out at how badly we suffer at the hands of the officials, whilst our rivals are the complete opposite and are gifted points throughout the season, that I’ve realised I have to step away from the game. It’s not worth it.

Offline LFCEmpire

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4587 on: May 4, 2024, 07:43:14 pm »
We are on page 115.  :-X

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4588 on: May 4, 2024, 07:45:38 pm »
We are on page 115.  :-X

Appropriate time to close the thread. It's a waste of energy. 

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4589 on: May 5, 2024, 06:24:58 am »
Page 115. Yeah either fill it with 115, like in the Cheats thread, or close it.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4590 on: May 5, 2024, 09:15:54 am »
Look at the disallowed goal for Bournemouth against Arsenal. It was a slight nudge on Raya - Foul. No goal.
Jota is full on bundled over in the box - No foul. No penalty.

The best you can hope to do is kill the game without refs being a factor at all.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4591 on: May 5, 2024, 09:40:33 am »
Look at the disallowed goal for Bournemouth against Arsenal. It was a slight nudge on Raya - Foul. No goal.
Jota is full on bundled over in the box - No foul. No penalty.

The best you can hope to do is kill the game without refs being a factor at all.

Realistically playing 11 v 15 is always going to be a big, big ask for any team. Especially when it happens every week.
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4592 on: May 5, 2024, 06:21:44 pm »
Are these bent/useless refs all getting baldy barnets in homage to the most useless/bent of them all, Howard Webb? Is it a cult?
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4593 on: May 5, 2024, 06:44:16 pm »
.


^ Gakpo fouled in area on 34' (on top of foot; Neville says it is 'an exaggerated belly flop' - no replays shown) - https://twitter.com/LFCRemy/status/1787151612261077263

BBC MOTD: VAR said it was "A very exaggerated fall out of sync with standing foot". The Havertz penalty given yesterday... VAR said: "contact, so penalty."

^ www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/live/cl40zg46r5xt#player & https://old.reddit.com/r/footballhighlights/comments/1cl3p87/bbc_match_of_the_day_2_05may2024




^ Romero handball in penalty area on 36' - https://cazn.me/m/15e0dd & https://i.redd.it/qd69phqmxmyc1.jpeg & https://twitter.com/malte16986400/status/1787194536948600868

Romero handball can be seen at 43m 30s into this video: https://footyfull.com/premier-league/liverpool-vs-tottenham-hotspur-05-05-2024 Sky commentator: "It has come to nothing."


van de Ven also looked to have handled the ball in the penalty area late on (blocking a Nunez cross - no replays shown; will try and find footage later...)


Referee Paul Tierney. VAR John Brookes.





^ not even they could give this as a penalty vs Gomez - although Brooks took his sweet time looking at it - likely much longer than he did for the Gakpo foul & Romero handball...

« Last Edit: May 6, 2024, 11:09:14 am by oojason »
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Offline HeartAndSoul

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4594 on: May 5, 2024, 06:50:01 pm »
Ridiculous then Trent got booked for time wasting :lmao

Never ever see Tierney book anyone who timewaste against us.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4595 on: May 5, 2024, 07:48:31 pm »
.


^ Gakpo fouled in area on 34' (on top of foot; Neville says it is 'an exaggerated belly flop' - no replays shown) - https://twitter.com/LFCRemy/status/1787151612261077263




^ Romero handball away in penalty area on 37' - https://cazn.me/m/15e0dd & https://i.redd.it/qd69phqmxmyc1.jpeg


van de Ven also looked to have handled the ball in the penalty area late on (blocking a Nunez cross - no replays shown; will try and find footage later...)


Referee Paul Tierney. VAR John Brookes.

 Fuck me, it's so clear he's handled it from the replay.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4596 on: May 5, 2024, 07:53:09 pm »
not going to VAR to check the Nunez offside was odd too. It was very close.

waste of time and energy though. i think most of us know we are being systematically being fucked over by PGMOL. we cant do a thing about it. I made a comment stating how i hoped the club kept something in the back pocket since the last Spurs game and was told we cant do a thing about it.

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4597 on: May 5, 2024, 08:32:55 pm »
5 points off the top and PGMOL has stolen atleast 6 points from us. Good process boys.

Online Eeyore

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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4598 on: May 5, 2024, 08:35:17 pm »
not going to VAR to check the Nunez offside was odd too. It was very close.

waste of time and energy though. i think most of us know we are being systematically being fucked over by PGMOL. we cant do a thing about it. I made a comment stating how i hoped the club kept something in the back pocket since the last Spurs game and was told we cant do a thing about it.

Not just the Nunez offside. They didn't even check to see if Vicario handled it outside of his area from the Nunez chance at the end.
"Ohhh-kayyy"

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  • For the love of god please shut the fuck up. Lomola... “The sky is falling and I’m off to tell the King!...” Places stock in the wrong opinions. Miserable F*cker! Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season
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Re: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!
« Reply #4599 on: May 5, 2024, 08:38:40 pm »
not going to VAR to check the Nunez offside was odd too. It was very close.

waste of time and energy though. i think most of us know we are being systematically being fucked over by PGMOL. we cant do a thing about it. I made a comment stating how i hoped the club kept something in the back pocket since the last Spurs game and was told we cant do a thing about it.

Var check the Gomez (winning the ball) challenge but not Gakpo getting fouled in the box.
Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season