Topic: PL: Crystal Palace 1 v 3 Liverpool VVD 8’ Ox 32’ Edouard 54’ Fabinho 89’

[Son of Spion]

...The question should be is it a free-kick or not. Or has the player been fouled or not. Based on this alone then for me the answer is that Jota was fouled and therefore it’s a nailed on penalty IMHO.

I'm no referee. Just some clown on the internet giving an opinion but, no, I don't think it's a foul.

The ball was on its way out, Jota gave upon it then deliberately leaned towards the keeper to initiate contact. For me, that's Jota being either a twat or very clever indeed. Delete as appropriate.   

[redmark]

I'm no referee. Just some clown on the internet giving an opinion but, no, I don't think it's a foul.

The ball was on its way out, Jota gave upon it then deliberately leaned towards the keeper to initiate contact. For me, that's Jota being either a twat or very clever indeed. Delete as appropriate.   

I also don't think it's a foul or a pen, but I don't think Jota was quite that crafty: I think he attempts to flick the ball to the right over the keeper and shifts his movement right to follow the ball/tap it in. He either just flicks it straight on with his toe or misses it entirely, but his body is already moving to the right (those saying he didn't move toward the keeper are kidding themselves ). He then actually tries to straighten and follow the ball, but at that point collides with the keeper. But that's a coming together, with most of the movement coming from Jota.

[Jshooters]

The “VAR/referees/league/PGMOL/world is out to get Liverpool Football Club” boys will be quiet tonight. 

Liverpool are awarded a soft penalty that every other club would get. Media Narrative dictates that Liverpool get favourable treatment.

‘Fair’ poster on RAWK flexes hard

[FowlerLegend]

Was a shambolic 2nd half display. For 30 odd minutes I was steeling myself for an eventual equaliser, just couldn't see how we could survive unless we grabbed a 3rd.

They had too much pace for us and most of our players have played 3 games in a row (some 4) and it showed. VVD was so slow to react but I'll give them all a pass based on energy levels. We just haven't got enough bodies fit to rotate with all the absences.

Was surprised the pen was given by VAR, it wasn't a nailed on pen but the goalie does take him out without getting anywhere near the ball so I understand why its given. I think people get confused with the ball  running away with a last man red card offence rule. The ball can be 10 yards away and a foul/pen can still be given!

Things will be far better after the intl break, get some R&R and come back fresh.

The thing teams catch us out with - West Ham away, Leicester, Palace - is runners at pace through the midfield. Either someone running at pace with the ball or simply running through the midfield.Often we give them the ball switching off making a simple pass.

On the plus side, all our issues look like they could be relatively simple fixes. Some of them come about from a complete drop in intensity/casualness. The remainder from us having more pace/athleticism in the midfield.

[Jshooters]

I'm no referee. Just some clown on the internet giving an opinion but, no, I don't think it's a foul.

The ball was on its way out, Jota gave upon it then deliberately leaned towards the keeper to initiate contact. For me, that's Jota being either a twat or very clever indeed. Delete as appropriate.   

This ball was going out and the striker initiated contact (2.20):

https://youtu.be/lmYU-n0MHYE

Us lot kicked off about it at the time but it was given with no controversy outside of our fanbase.

As was this (2.07):

https://youtu.be/Cg6PPblyf_Q

Neither of these should’ve been given but they were so I’m comfortable accepting the one we were awarded today

[stockdam]

It was more the Nat Phillips one that followed, and it sounded harsher than I meant it. Ignore the occasional outburst .

I do think a fit Gomez is/should be ahead of a still slightly raw Konate, though - and at his best, ahead of Matip.
Double checking his appearances, Gomez started the three earlier EFL games at CB and managed the full 90. I don't recall any lack of pace standing out, and I'd have been looking for it coming back from injury. Three sub appearances in each of the league and CL - 4 of those straight swap at RB (the other two I don't recall and was subbed on for a midfielder or attacker).

Was getting fairly regular involvement from late September to the end of October, but none in November (was that when he had the setback?) and a couple later in December. Used twice in the last 10 days though, so maybe getting back to fitness again.

I think Konate has shown that he is a very good defender but is obviously different to Gomez. Konate is great when we need a physical centre half who is good in the air. Gomez is better when we need pace at the back. He’s obviously coming back from a serious injury and therefore his opportunities are going to be limited especially with Matip and Konate playing well. We have 4 top class centre halves and I think Gomez has been a bit unlucky in not getting more games. Could he be used as a sub for TAA when we are under the cosh like today or maybe when we decide to play 3 at the back (which isn’t often).

[the_red_pill]

Was anyone else shitting it in the second half, fearing any ball over the top?

Not really. I knew they'd have chances and maybe equalize, but I never got the feeling we would settle for a draw or a loss.

[redmark]

The thing teams catch us out with - West Ham away, Leicester, Palace - is runners at pace through the midfield. Either someone running at pace with the ball or simply running through the midfield.Often we give them the ball switching off making a simple pass.

On the plus side, all our issues look like they could be relatively simple fixes. Some of them come about from a complete drop in intensity/casualness. The remainder from us having more pace/athleticism in the midfield.

Between this coming break and the last, we've played 17 games in 64 days. Palace have had 12 - both had one game postponed (not including our EFL first leg, which was rescheduled and played in the same period).

Fatigue and a drop in intensity is inevitable at times in a period like this. We could have been 3 or 4 up in half an hour, in which case we could have sat deeper, dropped the tempo entirely and killed the game against opponents without any hope of getting back into it. A couple of sloppy moments after 35/40 minutes seemed to put us slightly on edge, and that both brought our fatigue to the fore, and gave them some encouragement. Nothing to be overly concerned about, and we rode it out.

[NarutoReds]

+ thisisanfield.com: Matip's difficult day

There's something about Selhurst Park that seems to affect Liverpool centre-backs from time to time.

Maybe it's just coincidence, or maybe it's just that Dejan Lovren and Martin Skrtel had nightmares pretty much everywhere across the course of their Anfield careers.

Today it was Joel Matip struggling with the concepts of space and time.

Particularly, the great big spaces behind him which their forwards kept running into, and the time it takes him to catch up with pacy wingers.

There was certainly more than just one person at fault for Edouard's eventual goal, but an awful lot of Palace's near-misses certainly originated down Matip's channel.

Unfit or just a bad day? Either way, why Konate didn't start or make an entrance is a question that needs answering.'

- https://www.thisisanfield.com/2022/01/pressure-on-city-after-alisson-saves-the-day-5-talking-points-from-crystal-palace-1-3-liverpool/

[redmark]

I think Konate has shown that he is a very good defender but is obviously different to Gomez. Konate is great when we need a physical centre half who is good in the air. Gomez is better when we need pace at the back. He’s obviously coming back from a serious injury and therefore his opportunities are going to be limited especially with Matip and Konate playing well. We have 4 top class centre halves and I think Gomez has been a bit unlucky in not getting more games. Could he be used as a sub for TAA when we are under the cosh like today or maybe when we decide to play 3 at the back (which isn’t often).

He was today, very late - and against Arsenal in the first leg. His pace could have been ideal today against pacy forwards/breaking midfielders. Of course it would have been a risk to throw him in entirely cold, but that comes back to the lack of game time he's had over recent weeks and months. Looking back if that was largely a result of an injury in November that set him back a while, maybe something we'll see more of in the next couple of months.

[Black Bull Nova]

So the Salah, Mane Keita drought is pretty much over barring injury.


Not too shabby really, especially considering we had Origi and Elliot absent.


The last 3 games before they went we had 2 draws and 1 loss (4-5), the 3 games (calling the 2 leg one games) without them 3 wins (8-1)


Considering all the angst about it, not too bad although the teams in January were slightly more favourable than December. Normal service resumes but now with Eliiot, Gomez, Thiago and Origi to add to the roster (plus we might buy someone, you never know)

[Eeyore]

Was anyone else shitting it in the second half, fearing any ball over the top?

I had a feeling a goal from a ball over the top was inevitable. Then Trent delivered the pass of the decade and a goal resulted.

Forget the so called defensive issues, forget the penalty nonsense and focus on one of the best passes ever.

The pass from Trent to Jota was pure filth. I blame Robbo for drawing level on assists.

Leave the rest to the pathetic pundits.

[Son of Spion]

This ball was going out and the striker initiated contact (2.20):

https://youtu.be/lmYU-n0MHYE

Us lot kicked off about it at the time but it was given with no controversy outside of our fanbase.

As was this (2.07):

https://youtu.be/Cg6PPblyf_Q

Neither of these should’ve been given but they were so I’m comfortable accepting the one we were awarded today

Oh, I'm fully accepting this one too. 😄 Especially seeing how much opposition piss it's boiling even though it wasn't even the winner in the game.

We've had so many appalling penalties given against us, so this one going our way is nice.

[royhendo]

It didn’t affect the result this time tho. Would rather have had the Spurs one called correctly!

[the_red_pill]

We did well to earn the 3 points.
Lest we forget- City went there and got a bloody nose- 0-2 and a red!

[redmark]

It didn’t affect the result this time tho. Would rather have had the Spurs one called correctly!

Yep. And that really was stonewall.

[the_red_pill]

Oh, I'm fully accepting this one too. 😄 Especially seeing how much opposition piss it's boiling even though it wasn't even the winner in the game.

We've had so many appalling penalties given against us, so this one going our way is nice.

Nah.. just a way to say it "evens out" after the $hite they had us go through to make sure we dropped points.
We didn't need it.
"Keep them 'happy'.. by giving them a meaningless pen"... while United and City get game-deciding pens.

[Son of Spion]

I also don't think it's a foul or a pen, but I don't think Jota was quite that crafty: I think he attempts to flick the ball to the right over the keeper and shifts his movement right to follow the ball/tap it in. He either just flicks it straight on with his toe or misses it entirely, but his body is already moving to the right (those saying he didn't move toward the keeper are kidding themselves ). He then actually tries to straighten and follow the ball, but at that point collides with the keeper. But that's a coming together, with most of the movement coming from Jota.

You could well be right. I suppose only Jota can tell us for sure. I reckon he has enough mischief about him to have been that clever, but who knows?

I have to say, I'm really enjoying these three points, and also the piss-boiling this non-game-deciding penalty has caused across the country. It's beautiful.

[Son of Spion]

Nah.. just a way to say it "evens out" after the $hite they had us go through to make sure we dropped points.
We didn't need it.
"Keep them 'happy'.. by giving them a meaningless pen"

I'm not one who does believe things even out. Bad decisions really can cost over the course of a season. Things can be so tight that a decision in just one game can make or break a title challenge.

Today it was just nice to see a shite decision go our way for a change, despite the fact it wasn't really a decisive one.

[the_red_pill]

I'm not one who does believe things even out. Bad decisions really can cost over the course of a season. Things can be so tight that a decision in just one game can make or break a title challenge.

Today it was just nice to see a shite decision go our way for a change, despite the fact it wasn't really a decisive one.

I understand mate. By that same token, we'll get one against us again and it won't be pleasant so I celebrated half-heartedly.
This meangless pen just gives them leeway to take away an important one from us or give one against us- so celebrating it....

[Eeyore]

Is it just me or does Jota just follow the path of where he was attempting to flick the ball.

[redmark]

Is it just me or does Jota just follow the path of where he was attempting to flick the ball.

I also don't think it's a foul or a pen, but I don't think Jota was quite that crafty: I think he attempts to flick the ball to the right over the keeper and shifts his movement right to follow the ball/tap it in. He either just flicks it straight on with his toe or misses it entirely, but his body is already moving to the right (those saying he didn't move toward the keeper are kidding themselves ). He then actually tries to straighten and follow the ball, but at that point collides with the keeper. But that's a coming together, with most of the movement coming from Jota.

Doesn't make it a penalty, though - but I don't think he 'manufactured' contact.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

The “VAR/referees/league/PGMOL/world is out to get Liverpool Football Club” boys will be quiet tonight. 

Oh yes. We've rocketed to the top of the 'LFC gets more VAR decisions than anyone else tabl...."


WAIT A MINUTE!!

[Son of Spion]

I understand mate. By that same token, we'll get one against us again and it won't be pleasant so I celebrated half-heartedly.
This meangless pen just gives them leeway to take away an important one from us or give one against us- so celebrating it....

You make a very valid point, unfortunately.

"They got a soft one the other week, so they aren't getting this one today..."

[4pool]

Jurgen handing out a few beers..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYsj7O9VN_U

[Dougle]

A somewhat lucky result, all things considered, but considered in the totality, this has been an amazing period of grit and determination by Liverpool over the last few weeks. In the absence of key players and after a number of illnesses, Liverpool have really stepped up and showed the form of champions. Whatever criticism that can be made around transfers and gaps in the squad, this was an incredibly difficult period and not only have Liverpool stepped up, they have made a cup final with the core of the team including young players and fringe squad members.

I care not how Liverpool beat Palace, I just wanted to give credit for the team for their performance going into the break. Marvellous stuff.

Said it for me. Excellent, Delighted with the win, the month and the fight we showed. Reminds me of the last 10 games of last season.

[FowlerLegend]

Between this coming break and the last, we've played 17 games in 64 days. Palace have had 12 - both had one game postponed (not including our EFL first leg, which was rescheduled and played in the same period).

Fatigue and a drop in intensity is inevitable at times in a period like this. We could have been 3 or 4 up in half an hour, in which case we could have sat deeper, dropped the tempo entirely and killed the game against opponents without any hope of getting back into it. A couple of sloppy moments after 35/40 minutes seemed to put us slightly on edge, and that both brought our fatigue to the fore, and gave them some encouragement. Nothing to be overly concerned about, and we rode it out.

I take your point to an extent. For instance Van Dijk has played a lot after coming back from the injury and we have played a lite more games relatively.
That said, the issues of us being vulnerable in midfield is nothing at all new.

[Son of Spion]

Said it for me. Excellent, Delighted with the win, the month and the fight we showed. Reminds me of the last 10 games of last season.

I must have missed that post earlier. I have to agree too. Many feared this month, but the players have stepped up, fought hard and made us proud.

We don't seem to like things easy, and in a tough month we have shown what we are made of. Sometimes silky and slick. Other times getting through via guts, determination and will to succeed.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

I must have missed that post earlier. I have to agree too. Many feared this month, but the players have stepped up, fought hard and made us proud.

We don't seem to like things easy, and in a tough month we have shown what we are made of. Sometimes silky and slick. Other times getting through via guts, determination and will to succeed.

"Many feared this month"

Only titheads mate.

I thought the lads would do us proud and they have.

[mainone]

 match of the day bollocks vardy pen think  he was clever their ronaldo pen he was clever their sterling pen he was clever , jota pen he initiated the contact fuck off c*nts carragher micah who the fucking ell are you and jj fuck off too

[Bobinhood]

Yeah lets not forget the first half we just toyed with them. Its just the deadly 2-0 disease. the one serious Achilles heel we really have is not a high line, its thinking the jobs done too soon sometimes when we are comfortable and not being challenged. and its so hard to get it back when the pendulum swings on you.

for all that we dug in well against a highly concerted upping of the game by palace and im pretty confident we would have seen it out before the pen silver plattered it very late.

Alisson was awesome also a nice thing to have in these circumstances.

[Son of Spion]

"Many feared this month"

Only titheads mate.

I thought the lads would do us proud and they have.

Well yes. Something this squad/manager/club certainly has is character when the chips are down.

[stockdam]

I had a feeling a goal from a ball over the top was inevitable. Then Trent delivered the pass of the decade and a goal resulted.

Forget the so called defensive issues, forget the penalty nonsense and focus on one of the best passes ever.

The pass from Trent to Jota was pure filth. I blame Robbo for drawing level on assists.

Leave the rest to the pathetic pundits.

Yes it was a fantastic pass to setup Jota.....absolutely world class.

[stockdam]

He was today, very late - and against Arsenal in the first leg. His pace could have been ideal today against pacy forwards/breaking midfielders. Of course it would have been a risk to throw him in entirely cold, but that comes back to the lack of game time he's had over recent weeks and months. Looking back if that was largely a result of an injury in November that set him back a while, maybe something we'll see more of in the next couple of months.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see. I'd tend to stick with what is working until injuries force a change. Up until recently Matip has been excellent and Konate has been very good when he has had a chance. Gomez is suffering a bit as these two are starting ahead of him and so that makes it very hard to get back up the pecking order. He needs a chance but then again if we carry on winning with Matip and Konate playing then he may have to wait..........that's just unfortunate as he was playing really well before his injury.

I think he may play in the cup final and if so I hope he has a cracker game.

[kcbworth]

I think Gomez has been a bit unlucky in not getting more games

It's reminding me a bit of Agger's final years here, where he suddenly was behind Skrtel in the pecking order and it was difficult to pinpoint exactly what the catalyst was

[jckliew]

"Many feared this month"

Only titheads mate.

I thought the lads would do us proud and they have.

Maybe we should retain the same team and have Mo and Sadio as our subs just in case.   

[Ghost Town]

Yeah lets not forget the first half we just toyed with them. Its just the deadly 2-0 disease. the one serious Achilles heel we really have is not a high line, its thinking the jobs done too soon sometimes when we are comfortable and not being challenged. and its so hard to get it back when the pendulum swings on you.

Yep. The penalty is a big shiny twirling thing and everyone has duly been distracted by it, when the more important issues are why we seem to get complacent after going a couple ahead and why we sometimes lose not only control but the ability to play our natural game after a setback like conceding a goal. After conceding today we looked like a different side to the one who went two up. Just nothing happening attackwise until Trent's worldie pass.

I can certainly accept that tiredness played a big part, but I wish we could find a way of reducing the drop in intensity and the Jekyll and Hyde change in in-game character. If it's going to happen (due to tiredness, for example) then we need to plan for it and train ways to ameliorate the impact.

for all that we dug in well against a highly concerted upping of the game by palace and im pretty confident we would have seen it out before the pen silver plattered it very late.

Yep, the pen, once again, has grown into something it wasn't, due simply to people dwelling on it. Without it we would still have won.

Alisson was awesome also a nice thing to have in these circumstances.

He is our rock and upon that rock we build our church. Testify!

[Chakan]

Just finished watching the game.

Without Allison we're fucked, he had to be completely on his game today. What a tale of 2 halves wow. Dominant the first and all over the place in the second.

The pen was very soft, i'd be fuming if that was given against us.

We were lucky to win that.

[GreatEx]

The ball can be 10 yards away and a foul/pen can still be given!

That's not entirely true - if it's Ederson then a foul/pen cannot be given.

[Armand9]

No. We were scrappy and they created a few half chances, but I never had that feeling of an equaliser being inevitable.

i wish i could watch a game like you my friend, an equaliser looked inevitable to me and if it came soon enough they would go on to win the game (tho benteke coming on buoyed my spirits a tad)

unfortunately we've allowed a number of teams back in a game we would ideally see out and a game like today only furthers the impression that we're a side that can be pegged back, even tho we did see it out in the end. perception in football isn't the be and end all of a situation but it is a factor, hence terms like fortress anfield etc (back in the day OT the same), where ex-players admit that rolling up to such places you felt you'd lost before you even stepped into the ground, that's a huge advantage to go into a game with for the home team.

i feel the same is true of teams where if they get their noses in front the game is done, in reality that's not the case over a season but the perception of that in the mind's of the opposition is again a huge advantage. so not only does allowing teams back in concern me going forward, as we have this season, but just the perception that 'they'll give you a chance if you give it a go' is damaging and has the potential to make seeing games out harder cos the opposition never give up, when in the past we've seen teams accept their fate that they're done

even with our main attack away at AFCON we've been pretty fucking good on the scoring front (and all credit to the lads stepping up), if we can get back to our defensive best we showed in our title winning season we can finish off games earlier (not all, some teams wont drop off no matter what, but some for sure) which has numerous benefits all round, apart from the most obvious, we dont squander points dropped from a winning position