Author Topic: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)  (Read 38617 times)

Offline tubby

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #120 on: November 15, 2023, 08:53:44 am »
Could say the same about us.  We've only conceded the least goals due to Alisson.  He's going to have to be right on it for this one.
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Offline Coolie High

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #121 on: November 15, 2023, 10:38:21 am »
A bit worried about the Doku TAA match up.

Offline tubby

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #122 on: November 15, 2023, 10:39:41 am »
A bit worried about the Doku TAA match up.

Depends what they do with Doku when we have the ball, I think.  We might get caught in the transition when they win it back and I'm more worried about Matip coming over and having to deal with him instead of Konate (if he can't make it in time).
Sit down, shock is better taken with bent knees.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #123 on: November 15, 2023, 10:58:46 am »
4

1  <-- swarmed him/that area (lots of space on either side of him)

x

x

And the wingers stayed out wide at times- stretching City.
I don't think we can afford not to go with Endo at least. It would be suicide not to go with a recognized DM against this lot. (On the other hand, they might target Endo)
The ref will.
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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #124 on: November 15, 2023, 12:04:01 pm »
The ref will.

Urgh.....that has completely killed any enthusiasm I may have had - there is zero chance this will be officiated with competence / fairly.

Offline shank94

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #125 on: November 15, 2023, 12:29:21 pm »
Woohoo, looking forward for this one! Big test for the right side and the number 6. Hoping Nunez and Mac return in one piece. I think Jota Nunez Salah have established themselves for the main 3 for a this spell.
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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #126 on: November 15, 2023, 01:08:55 pm »
A bit worried about the Doku TAA match up.
Handled Mitoma really well against Brighton. I think he’s fine when we’re set defensively but in transition his positioning needs to be better.
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Offline SMASHerano

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #127 on: November 15, 2023, 01:54:21 pm »
Not looking forward to this one. For some reason we've been really poor whenever we've played them at the Emptyhad the past few seasons.

Hope we break the trend this time.

Offline Zlen

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #128 on: November 15, 2023, 02:28:55 pm »
Not looking forward to this one. For some reason we've been really poor whenever we've played them at the Emptyhad the past few seasons.

Hope we break the trend this time.

Those past few seasons, where bulk of our team were players who have had their collective hearts broken by City in a series of grueling near miss races for the title.

I think we’re a slightly different beast now. I think we have enough new blood that will walk out in that theater of lies and go ‘Yeah - fuck you. Bring it on.’

Offline stonecold_jpm

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #129 on: November 15, 2023, 02:34:56 pm »
We need a 2017-18 repeat when the team were hell bent on being the one team to take them on with no fear.

Offline SinceSixtyFive

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #130 on: November 15, 2023, 04:08:01 pm »
‘Yeah - fuck you. Bring it on.’

Definitely worth a quote that  :wellin :thumbup

Offline Larse

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #131 on: November 15, 2023, 10:18:02 pm »
We ended 2022/23 with 7th best away record in PL. 9th best away from home in goals conceded.

On a ppg record I think we have the 8th best record in PL so far this season.

On a goals conceded per game we are currently joint 7th best.

For the last 5 PL winners the average goals conceded away from home in a season is 14, with the most being 17. Even title winners don’t batter teams regularly away from home. It’s about grinding out wins most of the time based on defensive solidity.

We’ve not kept a clean sheet away from home in any game. Conceded 8 in 6 away in PL. That type of record is trending towards conceding a fair few over 20 away from home in the PL

Unless we tighten up defensively away from home then we have virtually no chance of winning PL. City away is the ultimate test in that regard. I’d take a 4-4 draw now but in reality for potential long term success we need to show our defensive solidity away from home. Go to City and get a clean sheet. Keep the goals against in remaining 13 PL away games to 12 or less. If we don’t then we just won’t accumulate enough points away from home to be a team that breaks 85 points, nevermind 90.

our away games this season were:
chelsea
newcastle
brighton
wolves
spurs
luton

thats some very tough games there to be honest and we got shafted against spurs and should have easily won against luton if not for some crazy misses...

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #132 on: November 16, 2023, 02:49:28 pm »
This City team can be got at - and that has been the case since Pip arrived. They do struggle when teams actually have a go at them - Chelsea at the weekend did and at times City looked like they could have conceded even more. This is especially so against pace - and that is something we have in abundance. Nunez could have a field day if he is fit and ready.

I really do think that we will get a result there.
Teams mostly try to have a go though Qston- almost every matchday.. it's only the really defensive teams - of which there are fewer these days that pack teams behind the ball.
It's just that having a go plays exactly into City's hands and they end up demolishing them. It's the same for us- we want you to have a go- a real go, cause then there is space galore. We'll take a goal or two against us, cause we know we can score more than you.

The other thing is- it isn't easy to have-a-go at these if you're a smaller team. Pretty soon, they force you into a low-block against your will- either by the way they play or the score is now 4-0 after you decided to take the game to them(which they were salivating for).. and now it's damage limitation, which is exactly what we see every matchday.
We then mistakenly sum it up as "...another team being scared of City."

It's not having-a-go that exposes City. You don't have any strengths against City, which affords you the right to attack them with abandon. You can only play on their weaknesses and that is a tactical game. Since they approach most games like a cookie-cutter- they won't really play any different against you than most everyone else.

What will undo them is tactics, WHILE having a go. Like we sometimes do and like Chelsea did over the weekend.
As much as it pains me to say, but Chelsea did terrific. Pochettino's tactics were spot on and prevented City from playing their usual game.

If we have a good tactic or two and we play to our best under the circumstances, we can do these. Yes, even away.

City play very narrow. They force you to commit players in the middle so that their wingers can have more space. Somewhere in there... there is a weakness... we need to exploit it. Chelsea forced the wingers to have to draw nearer to midfield by swarming Rodri, which meant there was loads of space from time to time, on the wings for them(Chelsea).
« Last Edit: November 16, 2023, 03:15:47 pm by the_red_pill »
"Some listen to understand. Others listen to respond."
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In such a sumptuous festival of shite, I wouldn't be so quick to pick a winner..

But he'd make the shortlist

Offline Draex

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #133 on: November 16, 2023, 02:54:10 pm »
Ederson and Rodri out of the internationals with "niggles"..  Sure.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #134 on: November 16, 2023, 02:55:55 pm »
Wonder which of our players will get knocks on international duty...?
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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #135 on: November 16, 2023, 03:10:15 pm »
I hope we smash these c*nts.

In reality though, whether we win the title (or not) will not come down to this game in isolation. A nice bonus, for sure, but ultimately if we (mostly!) beat the bottom twelve home and away, we will be there or thereabouts – especially given our points total after a tough set of opening fixtures.

We should go out there and play with the freedom of having nothing to lose and see what we end up with.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #136 on: November 16, 2023, 03:21:08 pm »
I hope we smash these c*nts.

In reality though, whether we win the title (or not) will not come down to this game in isolation. A nice bonus, for sure, but ultimately if we (mostly!) beat the bottom twelve home and away, we will be there or thereabouts – especially given our points total after a tough set of opening fixtures.

We should go out there and play with the freedom of having nothing to lose and see what we end up with.

A title would be a nice bonus, but to be honest, I don't expect it.
I am firmly looking forward to securing 4th. I was afraid at one point that we may not be in a position to make 4th this season and so even though I am the optimistic type, I headed into this season with a worrying feeling we're going to miss out on 4th again perhaps.

Now- if you ask me, those doubts are mostly gone. But I'm not going to sour my season by dreaming for more... and losing out on something which wasn't on the cards in the first place. I wasn't ready for a challenge- we weren't ready for one. In my mind, we're still in a transitional season. Anything can happen.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2023, 03:24:27 pm by the_red_pill »
"Some listen to understand. Others listen to respond."
"A fool does not delight in understanding, but only in revealing his own mind."
In such a sumptuous festival of shite, I wouldn't be so quick to pick a winner..

But he'd make the shortlist

Offline Zlen

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #137 on: November 16, 2023, 03:40:52 pm »
I hope we smash these c*nts.

In reality though, whether we win the title (or not) will not come down to this game in isolation. A nice bonus, for sure, but ultimately if we (mostly!) beat the bottom twelve home and away, we will be there or thereabouts – especially given our points total after a tough set of opening fixtures.

We should go out there and play with the freedom of having nothing to lose and see what we end up with.


Yeah, but beating Machester City - twice preferably, is the quickest way to be right in the mix for the title.
We're instantly 6 points better off compared to them.

Offline Brain Potter

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #138 on: November 16, 2023, 04:53:21 pm »
I hope we smash these c*nts.

In reality though, whether we win the title (or not) will not come down to this game in isolation. A nice bonus, for sure, but ultimately if we (mostly!) beat the bottom twelve home and away, we will be there or thereabouts – especially given our points total after a tough set of opening fixtures.

We should go out there and play with the freedom of having nothing to lose and see what we end up with.

Preventing Man City winning against us would make a massive difference…I don’t think we go there with nothing to lose..a defeat would be a massive blow.

It’s effectively a 6 point swing if we lose…
« Last Edit: November 16, 2023, 05:02:07 pm by Brain Potter »

Offline DangerScouse

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #139 on: November 16, 2023, 05:31:43 pm »
Yeah, but beating Machester City - twice preferably, is the quickest way to be right in the mix for the title.
We're instantly 6 points better off compared to them.

Arguably 12!

Offline markedasred

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #140 on: November 16, 2023, 06:15:29 pm »
Thanks for the well written and inspiring OP Grobbelrevel. My first thoughts on the game are that Baldie will overthink his approach, and Klopp will keep it simple, turning us in to the offensive side in their plastic gaff.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2023, 06:19:30 pm by markedasred »
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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #141 on: November 16, 2023, 07:04:10 pm »
Preventing Man City winning against us would make a massive difference…I don’t think we go there with nothing to lose..a defeat would be a massive blow.

It’s effectively a 6 point swing if we lose…
It's too early for that. Look at it the other way round. Beating them doesn’t mean we'll win the league. They look more beatable than recent years.

Their previous teams wouldn't have lost to Wolves and Arsenal. So, it's just one game and not a title decider.

« Last Edit: November 16, 2023, 07:05:41 pm by MonsLibpool »

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #142 on: November 16, 2023, 07:08:20 pm »
Preventing Man City winning against us would make a massive difference…I don’t think we go there with nothing to lose..a defeat would be a massive blow.

It’s effectively a 6 point swing if we lose…

It isn't lose at the Emtyhad win at Anfield later in the season and it is a zero point swing. The pressure is firmly on City. They usually beat us at home, anything else is a bad result.
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Offline PatriotScouser

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #143 on: November 16, 2023, 07:16:30 pm »
I think we stand a better chance of winning if we do not do the invert with Trent, especially if Doku starts.

But apart from that I think our chances of very decent of picking up a result.

Offline Jookie

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #144 on: November 16, 2023, 07:59:23 pm »
Their previous teams wouldn't have lost to Wolves and Arsenal. So, it's just one game and not a title decider.


In a literal sense this is true but if you look at recent past City title wins there are some unusual results in 1st 12 -14 games (up to mid Nov break)

20/21  beaten by Leicester, drew with Leeds, WBA

21/22 beaten away at Spurs, draw at home v Southampton, defeat at home by Palace

22/23 drew with Villa and Newcastle, beaten at home by Brentford

I understand everyone looking for a weakness but over the last few seasons City have been vulnerable to some poor results early in the season. Getting beat by Wolves and getting beat away by your nearest title challenger from the season before isn’t necessarily some massive evidence of a new weakness. Maybe it will be a sign of a bigger flaw this season. Maybe it’ll just follow the recent trend of them getting better as the season progresses.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2023, 08:01:07 pm by Jookie »
I think Jookie might just be the best fisherman on this thread.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #145 on: November 16, 2023, 08:27:49 pm »
In a literal sense this is true but if you look at recent past City title wins there are some unusual results in 1st 12 -14 games (up to mid Nov break)

20/21  beaten by Leicester, drew with Leeds, WBA

21/22 beaten away at Spurs, draw at home v Southampton, defeat at home by Palace

22/23 drew with Villa and Newcastle, beaten at home by Brentford

I understand everyone looking for a weakness but over the last few seasons City have been vulnerable to some poor results early in the season. Getting beat by Wolves and getting beat away by your nearest title challenger from the season before isn’t necessarily some massive evidence of a new weakness. Maybe it will be a sign of a bigger flaw this season. Maybe it’ll just follow the recent trend of them getting better as the season progresses.
They are gradually losing that element of control due to their players getting old, having a smaller squad (to appear to be in compliance with FFP) and their new players just not being as good as their predecessors.

It's more apparent in away games.  At their best, they wouldn't have struggled against that Chelsea side. Arsenal is a team that they always beat comfortably. Even when Arsenal were at their best last year, City beat them easily. I'm looking at it from that perspective.

Offline Jookie

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #146 on: November 16, 2023, 08:35:01 pm »
They are gradually losing that element of control due to their players getting old, having a smaller squad (to appear to be in compliance with FFP) and their new players just not being as good as their predecessors.

It's more apparent in away games.  At their best, they wouldn't have struggled against that Chelsea side. Arsenal is a team that they always beat comfortably. Even when Arsenal were at their best last year, City beat them easily. I'm looking at it from that perspective.

Maybe that’s true.

I’m just not convinced they are any worse than they’ve been since about 2021.I think this version of City is a notch below the 2016-2019 version, despite doing the Treble last season.

I’m just not convinced, at this point, the current City side is any worse or better than the sides of the last 2-3 years. I’d be amazed if they don’t get 85 points at least.
I think Jookie might just be the best fisherman on this thread.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #147 on: November 16, 2023, 08:38:40 pm »
Maybe that’s true.

I’m just not convinced they are any worse than they’ve been since about 2021.I think this version of City is a notch below the 2016-2019 version, despite doing the Treble last season.

I’m just not convinced, at this point, the current City side is any worse or better than the sides of the last 2-3 years. I’d be amazed if they don’t get 85 points at least.
Their squad depth is weaker and some of their key players are getting on. That's an increased risk of injuries.  Did you see the seismic drop off when Rodri missed 3 games?

Offline Larse

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #148 on: November 16, 2023, 09:11:57 pm »
I think people are underrating citys losses this season. the narrative seems to be that they always lose games in the autumn. And while this is true, the style of these losses early in the season was always very different to the losses they had this year. They always had way more possession and created lots of xg and lost these games only because of bad finishing and a lack of focus.

They lose points this year because they struggle to control games and dominate possession which is Guardiolas number 1 priority. They also papered over some cracks this season with some great individual goals and an easy start to the season.

Their average possession numbers are also among the lowest they've had since pep came in.

Having said all that I still think we need at least one step up from the last couple of performances if we want to beat them. despite them struggling in some games away from home they still won every game convincingly at home this season. Ive looked up their results and it seems like they have a winning streak dating back to 2022 at home (all competitions). Last draw at home was against everton on new years eve 2022. Thats actually very impressive and makes me come to the conclusion that a draw may actually be a very good result there.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #149 on: November 16, 2023, 09:21:20 pm »
Maybe that’s true.

I’m just not convinced they are any worse than they’ve been since about 2021.I think this version of City is a notch below the 2016-2019 version, despite doing the Treble last season.

I’m just not convinced, at this point, the current City side is any worse or better than the sides of the last 2-3 years. I’d be amazed if they don’t get 85 points at least.

City may not be any worse but there are more sides that have the capability to take points from them. For me there are far more progressive coaches who are willing to take City on. They have lost four domestic games this season. The major difference is that those games haven't been games in which teams have been dominated but got lucky.

Teams like Wolves, Arsenal and Newcastle have gone toe to toe with them and beaten them. Chelsea did the same and could easily have beaten them. In previous season those teams were beaten before they kicked off. 
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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #150 on: November 16, 2023, 09:23:04 pm »
Why do you think Pip is claiming his players are "injured"? He's shit scared of us and is using the full 2 weeks to prep for us.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #151 on: November 16, 2023, 09:37:45 pm »
Haaland played final 45 against faroe islands tonight (friendly). Knock to the ankle 5 minutes before the end.. Norway playing scotland in meaningless qualifier sunday. most likely without haaland i suppose
It’s not even about individuality, it’s about the team. Our game was based on his controlling of the tempo. Squeeze the life out of the opposition and then strike. That is our game. Like a pack of pythons.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #152 on: November 16, 2023, 10:33:55 pm »
A bit worried about the Doku TAA match up.

He is usually fine going backwards when he knows that the player who he is directly up against is particularly dangerous. I still maintain that his first leg against Leroy Sané in 2018 is one of the best defensive performances I have ever seen.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #153 on: November 16, 2023, 10:35:42 pm »
Why do you think Pip is claiming his players are "injured"? He's shit scared of us and is using the full 2 weeks to prep for us.

If you take a walk in his brogues for a moment, it is easy to see why this is a massive game for City. Win it and they pull away. Losing it is a massive setback.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #154 on: November 17, 2023, 04:32:00 am »
Klopp will be hoping Jones has recovered because he is essential for an aggressive press and keeping the under half pressure.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #155 on: November 17, 2023, 06:26:09 am »
Until the boys are back in the barracks I’m not going to think too much about who Klopp picks for this. Feels pretty big.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #156 on: November 17, 2023, 11:29:33 am »
Been playing around with stuff...
If you're interested, this is City's first 12 PL matches for the past 3 seasons. Make of it what though wilt. The gaps are losses- the halves are draws. Matchday 1 is on the left:



EDIT: De Bruyne's injury history:

« Last Edit: November 17, 2023, 12:00:50 pm by the_red_pill »
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In such a sumptuous festival of shite, I wouldn't be so quick to pick a winner..

But he'd make the shortlist

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #157 on: November 17, 2023, 11:33:53 am »
Until the boys are back in the barracks I’m not going to think too much about who Klopp picks for this. Feels pretty big.

Has your inner lining perished?

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #158 on: November 17, 2023, 11:35:39 am »
Been playing around with stuff...
If you're interested, this is City's first 12 PL matches for the past 3 seasons. Make of it what though wilt. The gaps are losses- the halves are draws. Matchday 1 is on the left:



The other seasons are a bit more inconsistent, at this time of year they were susceptible to a bad result at random, that you never saw coming. This season it just looks like they were a bit fucked without Rodri. Hopefully there’s a bit more to it than that! Chelsea have us a bit of grounds for optimism.

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Re: Pre-match thread: Manchester City vs. Liverpool | 25/11/2023 | 12:30(BST)
« Reply #159 on: November 17, 2023, 11:53:26 am »
Been playing around with stuff...
If you're interested, this is City's first 12 PL matches for the past 3 seasons. Make of it what though wilt. The gaps are losses- the halves are draws. Matchday 1 is on the left:



Be interesting to see that compared to De Bruyne injuries/playing time. May well be no correlation but could play a part ?
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