Author Topic: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)  (Read 90946 times)

Offline Weytske

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1880 on: December 11, 2017, 02:34:28 pm »
Ha ha yeah how dare we try and deny Everton a penalty.

Once agin if that’s a penalty why weren’t we awarded 20’for every time one of our players was touched when we were in the penalty area? If you’re going to defend the referee why hasn’t he been consistent.
This was also Klopp's point in his post-match interview. Not only is it really softly given but more so the referee is inconsistent. He can blow a penalty all he wants but then he should also blow everything else and book accordingly. We would've had 20 penalties and they ended up with 8 on the pitch.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1881 on: December 11, 2017, 02:34:49 pm »
Which is exactly what he was doing.

I really have entered the Twilight Zone

The ball was running away from goal after calvert lewin's touch. All Lovren was doing was trying to get to the ball first. Probably because he missed the header.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1882 on: December 11, 2017, 02:35:19 pm »
What similar incidents happened in the game that he didn't give, out of interest?

I can't remember any but then again, unless they are in the box then they are unlikely to generate as much interest therefore making it difficult to remember. Happy to be reminded, though.

Pretty easy one.

https://imgtc.com/w/C66gteJ
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1883 on: December 11, 2017, 02:35:26 pm »
What if he falls to the ground and the ref gives nothing? He'd get absolutely ripped to shreds for falling over that easily when there's an opponent in the box. Contact does not always equal a penalty, even some NBA refs wouldn't have given free throws for that amount of contact.

Can imagine Shearer: “Calvert-Lewin shrugs him off so easily there. Lovren has to be stronger” etc etc

Offline Funky_Gibbons

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1884 on: December 11, 2017, 02:36:41 pm »
What similar incidents happened in the game that he didn't give, out of interest?

I can't remember any but then again, unless they are in the box then they are unlikely to generate as much interest therefore making it difficult to remember. Happy to be reminded, though.
If you’re saying that touching someone is a penalty offence then there’s numerous examples throughout the game.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1885 on: December 11, 2017, 02:37:11 pm »
I find it amazing how anybody with the benefit of replays and the different camera angles can say its a penalty. In real time and from the Ref's angle I can see why he might have thought there was a push the Everton lad played for it and his dive was a good one, he's conned the ref.

Offline SlowRap

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1886 on: December 11, 2017, 02:37:49 pm »
Because CL has jumped into him;



The only way he could avoid touching him would have been to have his arms amputated.

Are you seriously suggesting that touching someone a penalty offence and if so why didn’t we get 20 penalties?
The more you watch it the more the Everton player is showing brains and Lovren is showing the lack of brains. Had Lovren had an ounce of spacial awareness he'd know the attacker was going away from goal, all he had to do was usher him out. Don't raise your hand even if it is to protect your ribs.


On the rotation point, you rotate players for this game not in this game as it's very important. To make 5 changes to a team that produced the performance of the season so far was a bit much.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1887 on: December 11, 2017, 02:38:19 pm »
That angle shows CL jumping into Lovren clearly, there isn’t a push, CL jumps into him and then falls to the floor, it’s not shit defending at all as he doesn’t do anything.
I'm not saying you're wrong. However, my personal view is that he can slow down and avoid crashing in to him. Yep, CL moves towards him, but for me he's shielding for the ball. I don't think he's thinking about winning a penalty until contact. He should be able to keep enough distance between them to show him away from goal without making as much contact. Outside the box, or any other game you'd probably get away with it, but against a team who haven't had a sniff, 1-0 down in the 75th(?) minute, surely a CB has to be more cautious and consider the fact that they'll be willing to make the most of any contact. For me it's careless - as the slow-motion gif shows, he's just got eyes on the ball and he's running at full speed, and in that situation I'd expect Gomez or Matip would have kept a cooler head. Having said that, I'd be equally as critical if Gomez or Matip did the same thing. I'm not just saying it's a penalty because it's Lovren.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1888 on: December 11, 2017, 02:39:50 pm »
Calvert-Lewin tries to position himself between the ball and Lovren, therefore runs across him. Lovren just runs into the back of him and puts his hand on his back and extends his arm in the same direction as Calvert-Lewin falls.

[/b]If putting your hand on someone's back and extending your arm in the same direction someone falls isn't a push then I'm not sure what is a push.[/b]
Lovren doesn’t fucking run into him, CL jumps into him, are you fucking blind, it’s oretty clear!!

The bolded part doesn’t sound like a push to me, pushing someone would involve some force being applied.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1889 on: December 11, 2017, 02:40:57 pm »
Calvert-Lewin tries to position himself between the ball and Lovren, therefore runs across him. Lovren just runs into the back of him and puts his hand on his back and extends his arm in the same direction as Calvert-Lewin falls.

If putting your hand on someone's back and extending your arm in the same direction someone falls isn't a push then I'm not sure what is a push.
CL did what Suarez used to do, get his ass in front of the defender and make the defender panic - and who better to make panic than Lovren.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1890 on: December 11, 2017, 02:42:58 pm »
Pretty easy one.

https://imgtc.com/w/C66gteJ

Isn't there an argument there that he was playing the advantage?

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1891 on: December 11, 2017, 02:43:39 pm »
The lad is running towards the corner flag at full pelt and hasn't even got the ball under control as it's bouncing to his left - can someone explain the need for Lovren to be touch tight on him there
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1892 on: December 11, 2017, 02:47:23 pm »

On the rotation point, you rotate players for this game not in this game as it's very important. To make 5 changes to a team that produced the performance of the season so far was a bit much.

It's no more important than any other game vs a lower-mid table team. You don 't get any more points for winning this game. The rotation was totally acceptable and understandable considering our fixture list. The team put out was more than good enough to beat the current Everton team.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1893 on: December 11, 2017, 02:49:25 pm »
The lad is running towards the corner flag at full pelt and hasn't even got the ball under control as it's bouncing to his left - can someone explain the need for Lovren to be touch tight on him there

You can't justify it as much as some people on here are trying to by saying we were cheated. Lovren is incompetent, he's shown that countless times during his time here and his time should've been up a long time ago.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1894 on: December 11, 2017, 02:49:26 pm »
It's no more important than any other game vs a lower-mid table team. You don 't get any more points for winning this game. The rotation was totally acceptable and understandable considering our fixture list. The team put out was more than good enough to beat the current Everton team.
As someone in the thread said it is important for those of us that live in the City and have mates who are blues. You can also say that with Chelsea losing we could have been sitting 3rd in the table.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1895 on: December 11, 2017, 02:53:11 pm »
I don't know why some of you are so persistent in arguing the toss over this

It's not the first dodgy peno thats been given against us and it wont be the last

We've also profited from our fair share of dodgy peno's over the years

Ataturk stadium 2005? Remember that one? Pretty important game too IIRC

The ref made a real-time decision based on what he saw from his vantage point

It was the wrong decision in hindsight but that's football. The end.
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Offline GregCharrua

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1896 on: December 11, 2017, 02:53:58 pm »
Wasn't able to watch this. Saw the result on my phone notifications.

Just saw the penalty. What a bunch of shit!

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1897 on: December 11, 2017, 02:54:09 pm »
Lovren doesn’t fucking run into him, CL jumps into him, are you fucking blind, it’s oretty clear!!

The bolded part doesn’t sound like a push to me, pushing someone would involve some force being applied.

For me, it looks like Calvert-Lewin runs across Lovren to try and get between him and the ball. He sees Lovren coming so tries to take a bigger leap so he can get closest to the ball - I don't see that as Calvert-Lewin jumping into Lovren.

As for the force. There is no way of knowing how much force Lovren used. But again, the way he put his hand on his shoulder and extended his arm into his back gives the referee a decision to make. I think the most force probably comes from his other hand but if the hand on his back is guiding him down then I don't see how the referee was wrong to give a penalty.

Offline wige

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1898 on: December 11, 2017, 02:58:05 pm »
The reason we only scored 1 goal, as opposed to the ten we could have got, is because of the substandard players.

The "system" worked, as in, we dominated the game, we pumped balls into the box, we passed it from left to right and back again, holding onto it until we could fashion a half chance. That's because we've got a fucking excellent football manager at the helm.

BUT

Once again, as has happened countless times, the players let the tactics down. Not through lack of effort, but through lack of skill. Henderson is great, and had a good game at doing the Henderson job. But without a Coutino or a Lallana next to him, he's got to be the one to deliver the assists and his "into the box" passing was diabolical. Outside of it, some nice passes and diagonals.

Milner the same. He produced three assists in a drubbing against a team that, to their credit, came at us and we caught them on the counter again and again. He's not right for the sort of game where we are having to unlock the door and shift a parked bus.

Oxlade played OK, but anything he did, Phil could have done 10 times better. And Jurgen took him off and left the other two centre midfielders on!

Mane had an absolute stinker, but he is a class player and should have been on, Salah pulled out a bit of magic as usual (but subbed off at only 1-0 when we've already let 37 points slip from winning positions?!), but playing Solanke in a game like this, the same as with Milner. He's not going to work it into the box, drop a shoulder and beat a man and unlock that tricky defence? No. He brought a few balls down well, fair play to him. But it's not his game.

At the back, the less said about the two in the middle the better (generally as players, not good enough for the club. Klavan had an OK game, but he doesn't bring it out into the opponents third like Matip (injured I know) or Can do. Lovren, I've already said too much on him but every time I see his name on the team sheet it pissed me off.

Robertson provided a good option on the left and Gomez was great on the right, but Gomez should have been shifted to the middle and Trent played on the right. If Everton weren't going to attack us, we could afford the better deliverer of the ball as full back.

And Simon... he didn't do anything wrong but he's not been good enough since he's been here and needs upgrading.

So for all the possession, all the crosses and long rangers, we had two players on the pitch capable of doing something in that sort of game. Great system, great manager, poor choices.

If Mane passes - this never gets written. Same for 95 % of the other shite in this thread.

Selection was fine. Performance was fine. Penalty is beyond soft, I still think it absolutely wasn't.

If Mane passes - we win. Lovren can still get harshly punished and we win. Personally, I think if we go in at 2-0 we batter them, as they HAVE to come out.

I'd have subbed him at halftime. It was 100% selfish. Cost us two crucial points yesterday.

Watch Messi, Suarez. Two of the best players on the planet - they always pass in that situation - because it guarantees the goal. Watch a Pep side - that pass is played square - its a guaranteed goal. Fuming about that yesterday. Doesn't then help when you're surrounded by idiotic Liverpool fans blaming the manager, having a pop at selection etc, criticising players for not repeatedly breaking down a well organised 11. It's not easy. We did it twice in first 45. We did our job. Mane didn't do his.


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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1899 on: December 11, 2017, 03:01:12 pm »
I don't know why some of you are so persistent in arguing the toss over this

It's not the first dodgy peno thats been given against us and it wont be the last

We've also profited from our fair share of dodgy peno's over the years

Ataturk stadium 2005? Remember that one? Pretty important game too IIRC

The ref made a real-time decision based on what he saw from his vantage point

It was the wrong decision in hindsight but that's football. The end.

It's people watching the replay and insist that's a penalty that grates. Those people are the ones who probably say in other penalty decisions the ridiculous "there's a contact" line. As if it justifies a penalty.

Oliver Kay, who is one of the best writers around, mentioned "shoving" twice in his post match article. It's pathetic.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1900 on: December 11, 2017, 03:01:46 pm »
As someone in the thread said it is important for those of us that live in the City and have mates who are blues. You can also say that with Chelsea losing we could have been sitting 3rd in the table.
Yes, but by drawing Liverpool sit in 4th, i.e. the CL spots. As for those living in the city with Everton fans, what are they saying exactly? "Ho ho, we played shit and got a draw thanks to a dubious penalty, a result that suits no one but we are getting great mileage out of because our stock has sunk so low that even getting a corner/point at Anfield constitutes a win."

You would want to be pretty thin skinned to care about that. I would be struggling to keep a straight face if Everton fans were mocking their rivals for being so much better than them that they had to play 11 men behind the ball and hang on for a result of any nature. That's not a rival in my book, that's a bump in the road. They may as well start bigging up their rivallry with Tranmere.

Everton are an irrelevance, they have been for 2 to 3 decades now.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1901 on: December 11, 2017, 03:02:03 pm »
So any hand on the back of a player is an automatic penalty?
nope any contact gives a player a chance to go down and then its a decision for the ref. If he doesn't get that tight there's no contact and no decision to make.

Offline Funky_Gibbons

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1902 on: December 11, 2017, 03:03:05 pm »
Bingo. It's that that draws the error. Whether it was a push or a shove or a tickle doesn't matter as soon as Lovren's that close to him it's always going to be a pen.
He’s as tight to him as he’s supposed to be, look at any defender and they be in exactly the same position. You can’t anticipate the player jumping into you and the referee falling for it.
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Offline wige

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1903 on: December 11, 2017, 03:04:00 pm »
I just think that it was a perfect opportunity for us to make a statement. Chelsea and Manchester United dropped points. If we'd won yesterday with a convincing win then the Christmas period really could have been special.

I still trust Klopp but there was a lot of angry people around Anfield yesterday.

But. It's gone now. Nothing we can do other than try and improve. If we do get three points Wednesday then that'll be great but if they play against us like Everton did then I can see it being a tricky festive period.

If they're angry because of the selection, then these people are a bigger issue/problem for the club than Klopp. The ones with no belief, patience. The ones who always moan and scream at players when things aren't going well.

A big, fuck off, massive weight around this club. They should fuck off and give their tickets to some young lads.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1904 on: December 11, 2017, 03:07:11 pm »
If Mane passes - this never gets written. Same for 95 % of the other shite in this thread.

Selection was fine. Performance was fine. Penalty is beyond soft, I still think it absolutely wasn't.

If Mane passes - we win. Lovren can still get harshly punished and we win. Personally, I think if we go in at 2-0 we batter them, as they HAVE to come out.

I'd have subbed him at halftime. It was 100% selfish. Cost us two crucial points yesterday.

Watch Messi, Suarez. Two of the best players on the planet - they always pass in that situation - because it guarantees the goal. Watch a Pep side - that pass is played square - its a guaranteed goal. Fuming about that yesterday. Doesn't then help when you're surrounded by idiotic Liverpool fans blaming the manager, having a pop at selection etc, criticising players for not repeatedly breaking down a well organised 11. It's not easy. We did it twice in first 45. We did our job. Mane didn't do his.

Sorry, agree with everything else but I don't think that's true. The very best players USUALLY make the best decisions. That's what makes them the best players, and Mane is one of ours. But lets not pretend even the very best players don't sometimes make the wrong choice. Luis certainly did. You don't get to that level without also being pretty selfish. Mane is usually very good at making the right choice, he's helped in a few of our breakaway goals with a pass at the right time. So I wouldn't massively chastise him for that yesterday. It was fucking daft, but I think he's earned enough slack to be able to do that sort of thing without getting major grief for it.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1905 on: December 11, 2017, 03:07:29 pm »
At this point some of you need to move the fuck one, some absolutely emberassing things being posted as if we lost the match!

Move on. We have two more games to play with this lot and put them in their place.


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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1906 on: December 11, 2017, 03:08:15 pm »
If Mane passes - this never gets written. Same for 95 % of the other shite in this thread.

Selection was fine. Performance was fine. Penalty is beyond soft, I still think it absolutely wasn't.

If Mane passes - we win. Lovren can still get harshly punished and we win. Personally, I think if we go in at 2-0 we batter them, as they HAVE to come out.

I'd have subbed him at halftime. It was 100% selfish. Cost us two crucial points yesterday.

Watch Messi, Suarez. Two of the best players on the planet - they always pass in that situation - because it guarantees the goal. Watch a Pep side - that pass is played square - its a guaranteed goal. Fuming about that yesterday. Doesn't then help when you're surrounded by idiotic Liverpool fans blaming the manager, having a pop at selection etc, criticising players for not repeatedly breaking down a well organised 11. It's not easy. We did it twice in first 45. We did our job. Mane didn't do his.

What Suarez have you been watching mate? Seriously?

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1907 on: December 11, 2017, 03:09:37 pm »
The derby is not the biggest game of the season, no matter how you try and spin it. I wouldn't even have it in the top 5.

The derby is a part of the culture and traditions of supporting LFC. 

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1908 on: December 11, 2017, 03:10:06 pm »
The more you watch it the more the Everton player is showing brains and Lovren is showing the lack of brains. Had Lovren had an ounce of spacial awareness he'd know the attacker was going away from goal, all he had to do was usher him out. Don't raise your hand even if it is to protect your ribs.


On the rotation point, you rotate players for this game not in this game as it's very important. To make 5 changes to a team that produced the performance of the season so far was a bit much.

I accepted the decision yesterday and was fairly calm about as nothing could change the result. TODAY however I have been totally riled by so called pundits, journalists and most of all fans across the board and especially our own who think that it was a penalty despite having the benefit of the replant. CL does run towards the ball but plays the man by jumping into Lovren. Heck, he even falls ahead of the ball. Loren doesn't change his line towards the ball. If you cannot see that and agree that it is dive and concede that Lovren had no chance whatsoever - then one of us have no idea of how the game is played. Deplorable decision. Ref got conned and CL should be called up for deceiving the ref. With the general consensus to the contrary I won't be holding my breath.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1909 on: December 11, 2017, 03:10:29 pm »
If they're angry because of the selection, then these people are a bigger issue/problem for the club than Klopp. The ones with no belief, patience. The ones who always moan and scream at players when things aren't going well.

A big, fuck off, massive weight around this club. They should fuck off and give their tickets to some young lads.

They have belief and patience. But were frustrated that we didn't batter Everton like we should have done.

I just hope it doesn't bite us on the arse later in the season.

Some of these lads have been going to the game since the 60s - who are you to tell them they shouldn't be going to the game?
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Offline Elzar

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1910 on: December 11, 2017, 03:10:29 pm »
The lad is running towards the corner flag at full pelt and hasn't even got the ball under control as it's bouncing to his left - can someone explain the need for Lovren to be touch tight on him there

The point is, he isn't touch tight. Calvert Lewin is nowhere near Lovren if he is running for the ball but he changes his run to make sure Lovren runs into him. Watch from the normal TV angle, he runs at Lovren, with the ball bouncing a few yards away. Lovrens hands go up as a natural reaction when someone runs at you.

If he had the ball under control and Lovren just ran into the back of him, it wouldn't be an argument, it would be a clear pen.
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Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1911 on: December 11, 2017, 03:11:40 pm »
Because CL has jumped into him;



The only way he could avoid touching him would have been to have his arms amputated.

Are you seriously suggesting that touching someone a penalty offence and if so why didn’t we get 20 penalties?

Obviously that angle shows it wasn't a penalty and the incorrect decision was made. But that's not the angle the referee had, so when all said and done, differing angles are essentially irrelevant until we have VAR. The angle the referee had was Lovren putting his hand into Calvert-Lewin's back with a forward momentum.

I'm glad Klopp has blamed the referee. It was the second soft as shite penalty given against us in back-to-back league games. That sort of thing needs to be highlighted and discouraged so that refs think twice next time.

Behind closed doors, however, I hope Lovren isn't getting away scot-free. I like him and have defended him regularly on here, but he needs to wisen up and fast. You can - or certainly should be able to -touch players, but you can't use forward momentum with your hands otherwise you run the risk of giving a foul away. In that situation it simply wasn't worth the risk.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2017, 03:13:16 pm by LallanaInPyjamas »

Offline Funky_Gibbons

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1912 on: December 11, 2017, 03:13:21 pm »
Obviously that angle shows it wasn't a penalty and the incorrect decision was made. But that's not the angle the referee had. The angle he had was Lovren putting his hand into Calvert-Lewin's back with a forward momentum.

I'm glad Klopp has blamed the referee. It was the second soft as shite penalty given against us in back-to-back league games. That sort of thing needs to be highlighted and discouraged so that refs think twice next time.

Behind closed doors, however, I hope Lovren isn't getting away scot-free. I like him and have defended him regularly on here, but he needs to wisen up and fast. You can - or certainly should be able to -touch players, but you can't use forward momentum with your hands otherwise you run the risk of giving a foul away. In that situation it simply wasn't worth the risk.
He doesn’t use forward momentum with his hand, CL jumps into him, there’s nowhere else for his hand to go, he touches his back, doesn’t push.
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Offline Sudden Death Draft Loser

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1913 on: December 11, 2017, 03:14:24 pm »
He doesn’t use forward momentum with his hand, CL jumps into him, there’s nowhere else for his hand to go, he touches his back, doesn’t push.

He is clearly trying to pull his hand back, not push it forward
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Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1914 on: December 11, 2017, 03:14:59 pm »
He doesn’t use forward momentum with his hand, CL jumps into him, there’s nowhere else for his hand to go.

Nonsense. He might have to touch him, but he doesn't have to fling his left hand forward like he does. I've had plenty of strikers back into me like Calvert-Lewin does to Lovren, and never once have I pushed them when I've been inside the box. It's clumsy and naive defending.

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1915 on: December 11, 2017, 03:16:54 pm »
Obviously that angle shows it wasn't a penalty and the incorrect decision was made. But that's not the angle the referee had, so when all said and done, differing angles are essentially irrelevant until we have VAR. The angle the referee had was Lovren putting his hand into Calvert-Lewin's back with a forward momentum.

I'm glad Klopp has blamed the referee. It was the second soft as shite penalty given against us in back-to-back league games. That sort of thing needs to be highlighted and discouraged so that refs think twice next time.

Behind closed doors, however, I hope Lovren isn't getting away scot-free. I like him and have defended him regularly on here, but he needs to wisen up and fast. You can - or certainly should be able to -touch players, but you can't use forward momentum with your hands otherwise you run the risk of giving a foul away. In that situation it simply wasn't worth the risk.
agree with this, something will be said behind closed doors like with mane and passing in that situation in future. The question is whether those players will keep making those mistakes

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1916 on: December 11, 2017, 03:17:45 pm »
Nonsense. He might have to touch him, but he doesn't have to fling his left hand forward like he does. I've had plenty of strikers back into me like Calvert-Lewin does to Lovren, and never once have I pushed them when I've been inside the box. It's clumsy and naive defending.
Naive defending? He’s literally jumped into.
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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1917 on: December 11, 2017, 03:18:20 pm »

The only way he could avoid touching him would have been to have his arms amputated.

It's Ok now, they have bought each other an lp:
Calvert-Lewin got him this:

and here is Lovrens for him:
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Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1918 on: December 11, 2017, 03:18:37 pm »
Naive defending? He’s literally jumped into.

Yes, and he retaliates by flinging his left hand half-way into his back in a forward motion. It's not enough for a penalty in my view, but that doesn't mean it's not naive or clumsy.

Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool 1 v Everton 1 (Salah 42’)
« Reply #1919 on: December 11, 2017, 03:20:50 pm »
agree with this, something will be said behind closed doors like with mane and passing in that situation in future. The question is whether those players will keep making those mistakes

Unfortunately for Lovren, he does keep making them. Like I said, I like him and have defended him, but it's difficult to do so when you keep seeing similar mistakes from him regardless of how much/little pressure we are under as a side.

Ultimately these errors clearly mean that he shouldn't be a first-choice defender for a club with our ambitions. We know that, he probably knows that, hopefully Klopp does. In the meantime I hope he can recover from this because, particularly aerially, he's an important player for us. Watching Klavan under the high ball yesterday was fucking painful.