Author Topic: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.  (Read 24354 times)

Offline Penfold78

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #480 on: May 7, 2023, 05:36:48 pm »

The lost art of a sensible debate eh?

Liverpool as a community has an understandable reason to be suspicious of the national government and cynical of everything that embodies the south east, as the part of the country that took control of the Hillsborough narrative and as the part of the country that prospered through Thatcherism at the cost of the North, Midlands and South Wales. In the minds of many from these deprived areas the country was split during the 1980s into competing geographic factions: the old working class communities that enabled the Industrial Revolution against the new service industry based middle classes of the Home Counties. So anyone with an ounce of emotional intelligence can understand how the royal family can be wrapped up in Liverpool’s world view as being on the other side, geographical, economically, politically and culturally. And the connections to the Irish community clearly play a part too.

What’s to say about the other side of the argument? First of all, none of us really know what the royal family really think of Liverpool, there is no evidence of positive or negative attitudes from them towards Liverpool. Second, many deeply working class communities rely on the royal family, and more broadly, national pride,  as a social tool to build their communities around. You can argue this is perverse (it is) but it is irrefutably evident not just in the council estates of the South but the North too. People who haven’t got enough money to fill the car can still find a way of taking positives from their lives by following the progress of William, Kate, Harry, George etc. To some, prayers help, for others, it’s the footage of Louise waving badly from the balcony. I’m not justifying it, it’s batshit crazy, but it is true. Third, we who use the argument of economic disparity ought to take a second look at our line of argument. 2023/24 home kits going for £125, kids equivalents at £60. The club needlessly changing kits once a year. We covet sightings of players who earn more in a month than all of us lot will earn in a lifetime. We sing and we chant eagerly about people who hold more wealth than even some of the extended members Royal family will ever dream of. We help to create economic inequality in hundreds of inadvertent ways each time we interact with this club.

I’m not here to say what’s right or wrong. I’m here to say let’s hold our views a little more loosely.

Offline A Red Abroad

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #481 on: May 7, 2023, 05:39:20 pm »
nice

like the way you've put the king in red whilst using our logo nicely placed

and kenny is cut out nice and sharp but it doesn't look like a cut'n'paste job - and the hand overlaying the text is a nice subtle touch

nice kerning too - one critique i have is that the leading is a bit tight so from a distance the words could meld as one

but top effort  :wave

Graphic designer per chance?

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Offline A Red Abroad

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #482 on: May 7, 2023, 05:52:09 pm »
What’s to say about the other side of the argument? First of all, none of us really know what the royal family really think of Liverpool, there is no evidence of positive or negative attitudes from them towards Liverpool.

Based on them being happy to use £millions of taxpayer's money to pay for their 'jolly' - in the middle of a cost of living crisis and food banks required everywhere - I'd suggest they don't think much of 'their subjects' at all - whichever city.

If I was a gambling man, which I'm not, I'd bet that they don't give a single f*ck about you or me - apart from maybe hoping that we keep paying our taxes. :)



Second, many deeply working class communities rely on the royal family, and more broadly, national pride,  as a social tool to build their communities around. You can argue this is perverse (it is) but it is irrefutably evident not just in the council estates of the South but the North too. People who haven’t got enough money to fill the car can still find a way of taking positives from their lives by following the progress of William, Kate, Harry, George etc.

I can't get onboard with this at all. Sorry. Folk need to be weened off living through 'celebrities' - if that is indeed what they're doing. Abolition of the monarchy would be a good start.

I live in a country where they celebrate topping their aristos. It also gets way more 'tourists' than the UK (I only added this because I still hear/read the 'they're good for tourism' trope).



I’m not here to say what’s right or wrong. I’m here to say let’s hold our views a little more loosely.

Me neither. Just my 'loose' views.

:)
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Offline liverbloke

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #483 on: May 7, 2023, 06:36:52 pm »
Graphic designer per chance?

;)

guilty as charged - here's your £5 ;D
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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #484 on: May 7, 2023, 06:45:15 pm »
I explained my feelings about all this yesterday, I probably (certainly) have a very unnecessary worry about the image of the club and foremost the city of Liverpool, and as I said it's a 'me thing'.
On the way home from the match yesterday I was chatting to my lad about it all and I repeated my view point about what people might think.
His reply was "don't worry about it dad, I find the rest of the country and the brexit voting c*nts repulsive"  :lmao


Offline rewood

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #485 on: May 7, 2023, 06:56:03 pm »
Maybe need to change the Differences post back to hate.

Offline A Red Abroad

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #486 on: May 7, 2023, 07:00:35 pm »
I explained my feelings about all this yesterday, I probably (certainly) have a very unnecessary worry about the image of the club and foremost the city of Liverpool, and as I said it's a 'me thing'.
On the way home from the match yesterday I was chatting to my lad about it all and I repeated my view point about what people might think.
His reply was "don't worry about it dad, I find the rest of the country and the brexit voting c*nts repulsive"  :lmao

Good lad!  ;D
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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #487 on: May 7, 2023, 07:05:57 pm »
I have no problem with people idolizing royalties, there are many sillier hobbies,  but why should I pay for it?
Privatize it. Take their massive properties and let them find their own income. I dont think it would be too hard for them.

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #488 on: May 7, 2023, 07:22:51 pm »
In case you missed it in the main thread there's 5 good podcasts from the Guardian about the cost of crown & the royals etc, if you can be arsed.
https://www.theguardian.com/news/series/todayinfocus

Offline Oldmanmick

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #489 on: May 7, 2023, 07:38:23 pm »
We sing and we chant eagerly about people who hold more wealth than even some of the extended members Royal family will ever dream of. We help to create economic inequality in hundreds of inadvertent ways each time we interact with this club.

Could that be because we have a strong, mutual, connection with those people ? We invest our time, money, & emotions, in the grand hope that they can make us happy, & quite often they do. There is also a connection when we see a young promising lad rise through the ranks & become a world class player. A lot of us, at one point in our lives, held dreams of being that young lad. Nobody dreams of being a royal family member because there is no connection & it's a closed shop.


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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #490 on: May 7, 2023, 07:46:54 pm »
We sing and we chant eagerly about people who hold more wealth than even some of the extended members Royal family will ever dream of. We help to create economic inequality in hundreds of inadvertent ways each time we interact with this club.
Yes, but we do it voluntarily. We dont force other people to support LFC, we dont collect tax money for LFC.
Also, LFC doesnt have a history of murdering and enslaving innocent people.

Offline Penfold78

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #491 on: May 7, 2023, 08:46:18 pm »
Could that be because we have a strong, mutual, connection with those people ? We invest our time, money, & emotions, in the grand hope that they can make us happy, & quite often they do. There is also a connection when we see a young promising lad rise through the ranks & become a world class player. A lot of us, at one point in our lives, held dreams of being that young lad. Nobody dreams of being a royal family member because there is no connection & it's a closed shop.

Seems a fair point.

Offline Penfold78

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #492 on: May 7, 2023, 08:48:39 pm »
Yes, but we do it voluntarily. We dont force other people to support LFC, we dont collect tax money for LFC.
Also, LFC doesnt have a history of murdering and enslaving innocent people.

Yep, good point. Do you think LFC (and elite football generally) is free of a more casual form of financial exploitation? I’m not sure. The amount of money we need just to complete at elite level requires some very profitable income streams. And big profits don’t come without some kind of flip side. Not wanting to cast a cloud on us but just a little of my personal worries about a club that is diehard socialist and republican on the outside but is the 7th richest club in the world on the inside  :)
« Last Edit: May 7, 2023, 09:00:23 pm by Penfold78 »

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #493 on: May 7, 2023, 09:06:26 pm »
In what seems an attempt at trolling, YNWA is being sung at the Coronation Concert.

Offline Illmatic

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #494 on: May 7, 2023, 09:09:23 pm »
In what seems an attempt at trolling, YNWA is being sung at the Coronation Concert.

It was a great rendition of it nonetheless.
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Offline Penfold78

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #495 on: May 7, 2023, 09:12:32 pm »
YNWA. Windsor. And there’s a little olive branch if ever I’ve seen one. It’ll fall on lots of deaf ears I suspect. But I heard it.

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #496 on: May 7, 2023, 09:14:30 pm »
Andrea sang it at the m&s arena when he came to Liverpool on his tour. Good rendition

Offline stewy17

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #497 on: May 7, 2023, 09:15:54 pm »
YNWA. Windsor. And there’s a little olive branch if ever I’ve seen one. It’ll fall on lots of deaf ears I suspect. But I heard it.

Lol

Offline Illmatic

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #498 on: May 7, 2023, 09:17:24 pm »
YNWA. Windsor. And there’s a little olive branch if ever I’ve seen one. It’ll fall on lots of deaf ears I suspect. But I heard it.

I must say it is a rather unexpected gesture - it shows the boos are being listened to somewhere. 
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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #499 on: May 7, 2023, 09:18:52 pm »
In what seems an attempt at trolling, YNWA is being sung at the Coronation Concert.

I would say if it was trolling it backfired on them. How many thousands of people have just clapped and cheered at the end of YNWA. Most of the people there are probably tories. London clubs will be outraged that no one booed or jeered it.

Offline DangerScouse

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #500 on: May 7, 2023, 09:20:27 pm »
YNWA. Windsor. And there’s a little olive branch if ever I’ve seen one. It’ll fall on lots of deaf ears I suspect. But I heard it.

 :lmao

Offline mikey_LFC

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #501 on: May 7, 2023, 09:20:56 pm »
Camilla was signing along too. That plus the picture of her in the Old Barn pub near the ground and the evidence is mounting that she’s a massive Red.  :P
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Offline Redric1970

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #502 on: May 7, 2023, 09:26:25 pm »
Lionel Richie sounded awful, my wife used to love him.

Offline Ghost Town

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #503 on: May 7, 2023, 09:26:56 pm »
YNWA. Windsor. And there’s a little olive branch if ever I’ve seen one. It’ll fall on lots of deaf ears I suspect. But I heard it.
:D

Olive branch, lol. This isn't an unfortunate falling-out that needs patching up, the feuding parties needing to be brought together
« Last Edit: May 7, 2023, 09:31:02 pm by Ghost Town »
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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #504 on: May 7, 2023, 09:30:11 pm »
Lionel Richie sounded awful, my wife used to love him.
Didnt even do Dancing on the ceiling. c*nt.

Offline Ghost Town

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #505 on: May 7, 2023, 09:30:43 pm »
Didnt even do Dancing on the ceiling. c*nt.
Hello
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Offline RedBec1993

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #506 on: May 7, 2023, 09:31:17 pm »
I must say it is a rather unexpected gesture - it shows the boos are being listened to somewhere.

Do we think it’s got anything at all to do with it? 🤣

Offline Redric1970

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #507 on: May 7, 2023, 09:32:04 pm »
Didnt even do Dancing on the ceiling. c*nt.

He reminded me of Paul McCartney great singers both, but the voices aren’t there any more unfortunately.

Offline Ghost Town

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #508 on: May 7, 2023, 09:34:03 pm »
I must say it is a rather unexpected gesture - it shows the boos are being listened to somewhere. 
Seriously? You really think it was a 'gesture'?

It's a feelgood song that's often sung at big events. Just ask Ev fans. They're forever walking out of weddings, concerts, celebration, bar mitzvahs....
"Every man has a right to utter what he thinks truth, and every other man has a right to knock him down for it."
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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #509 on: May 7, 2023, 09:36:39 pm »

Offline A Red Abroad

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #510 on: May 7, 2023, 09:38:29 pm »
Seriously? You really think it was a 'gesture'?

It's a feelgood song that's often sung at big events. Just ask Ev fans. They're forever walking out of weddings, concerts, celebration, bar mitzvahs....

I *think* he was kidding mate. :)
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Offline DangerScouse

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #511 on: May 7, 2023, 09:40:34 pm »
I really can't tell whether some posters watching that tripe are serious. The fact they are watching it in the first place suggests they may well be! :P

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #512 on: May 7, 2023, 09:43:46 pm »
Fuck the royals

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Offline liversaint

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #513 on: May 7, 2023, 09:45:38 pm »
In what seems an attempt at trolling, YNWA is being sung at the Coronation Concert.

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You dont win friends with Salad

There is another option. Mr Ferguson organises the fixtures in his office and sends it to us and everyone will know and cannot complain. That is simple.

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #514 on: May 7, 2023, 09:53:10 pm »
I *think* he was kidding mate. :)
Heh possibly, it's hard to tell these days.

Anyway I mainly just wanted to get that swipe at The Ev in ;)
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Offline liversaint

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #515 on: May 7, 2023, 10:02:06 pm »
Just when you think it’s hit rock bottom, Mark Owen turns up
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You dont win friends with Salad

There is another option. Mr Ferguson organises the fixtures in his office and sends it to us and everyone will know and cannot complain. That is simple.

Offline A Red Abroad

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #516 on: May 7, 2023, 10:10:31 pm »
Heh possibly, it's hard to tell these days.

Anyway I mainly just wanted to get that swipe at The Ev in ;)

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #517 on: May 7, 2023, 10:21:38 pm »
Seriously? You really think it was a 'gesture'?

It's a feelgood song that's often sung at big events. Just ask Ev fans. They're forever walking out of weddings, concerts, celebration, bar mitzvahs....

Coronation celebrations…….

Offline Peter McGurk

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #518 on: May 7, 2023, 11:44:36 pm »
I have no problem with people idolizing royalties, there are many sillier hobbies,  but why should I pay for it?
Privatize it. Take their massive properties and let them find their own income. I dont think it would be too hard for them.

As far as I'm aware, the Royal Family generates its own income. As individuals, they own a smaller proportion but they pay tax on what they privately own. The 'Crown Estate' pays its net income over to the government and the government pays back a percentage to 'run the monarchy'.

Big events (like the coronation) are paid for by government as state occasions but Royal Weddings for example are private and paid for by the family

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/sep/14/the-sovereigns-wealth-uk-royal-familys-finances-explained#:~:text=Since%201760%20the%20monarch%20has,now%20called%20the%20sovereign%20grant.

« Last Edit: May 7, 2023, 11:59:34 pm by Peter McGurk »

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Re: Liverpool to play the national anthem v Brentford.
« Reply #519 on: May 8, 2023, 12:48:13 am »
As far as I'm aware, the Royal Family generates its own income. As individuals, they own a smaller proportion but they pay tax on what they privately own. The 'Crown Estate' pays its net income over to the government and the government pays back a percentage to 'run the monarchy'.

Big events (like the coronation) are paid for by government as state occasions but Royal Weddings for example are private and paid for by the family

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/sep/14/the-sovereigns-wealth-uk-royal-familys-finances-explained#:~:text=Since%201760%20the%20monarch%20has,now%20called%20the%20sovereign%20grant.



The Crown Estate is basically assets owned by the country.

The royal family do not own the crown estate.

"Ohhh-kayyy"