Topic: Lucas

[PeterTheRed ...]

Milner is a solid starting XI player, so the "star" status is debatable.

Also, the overall cost of these deals is what matters to FSG, and signing a player on a free for £150k per week on a 4 year deal is £10m cheaper than signing a player for £20m and with £100k wages.

Once again, that doesn't change the fact that Milner costs us £7.8 million per season. And Lucas costs us £4.2 million per season, which is fine for his role on the team.

[joekim87]

We should pay players relative to their ability, their status, in part their position (attackers will always be paid more) and their relative contribution and importance to the team. Lucas is one of our highest paid players, despite being a utility squad player only used in emergencies. If (as expected) we sign another midfielder and defender in the summer, he'll be incredibly fortunate to even make the matchday squad most weeks. Can's contract negotiations have come to a standstill because we aren't sure about handing over £100k a week to a player who isn't even a guranteed starter when everyone is fit, but you can absolutely understand him asking for it when he looks and sees Lucas on £80k a week, and Can is better, younger, fitter and way more important to this team in just about every single imagineable way. You think though that FSG would be happy to pay Lucas £80k cos he's a boss character?

Name me another club in the league who pays their 3rd choice midfielder £80k a week - you're looking at maybe City with Toure, and they've been trying to get rid of him for a while.

I think Toure is on closer to 200k a week and isn't the great supportive character off the pitch like Lucas is.

I think loyalty is important in sports and it'd be shitty of the club to suddenly half his wages when he's been such a great servant. I say sign him up for 2 more years on that 80k and give him a good club role afterwards.

[rickardinho1]

I think Toure is on closer to 200k a week and isn't the great supportive character off the pitch like Lucas is.

I think loyalty is important in sports and it'd be shitty of the club to suddenly half his wages when he's been such a great servant. I say sign him up for 2 more years on that 80k and give him a good club role afterwards.

FSG don't sign new contracts with 30 year olds, especially not contracts worth 80k for them to sit in the stands most of the season.

Lucas will at best be 5th CB/3rd DM, and it will be up to him if he wants to see out the last year of his contract, or if he wants to leave for first team football elsewhere. There's probably numerous clubs in the PL (and elsewhere) who would love to sign a classy professional like him.

As two examples, he'd easily improve Stoke's midfield (which would be attractive to Lucas as he wouldn't have to move from the Liverpool area), and I'm sure Rafa at Newcastle would be very interested in signing him to help make Newcastle competitive next season too.

[Redcap]

I'd say offer him 40k and let him be a squaddie. If he wants to stay on the same wages, he'll have to move on. The reduced wages would reflect a less important role in the squad.

Would like to see him stay, because after him Henderson is our second most capped player, and he's been with us for 'only' 6 seasons. He's also clearly a pretty handy player to have. The question is if we can do better than him for a 5th placed CB/3rd placed DM. I think we'd be in real trouble right now if we didn't still have him, so I think we would certainly need to replace him if he goes.

[Haggis36]

I think Toure is on closer to 200k a week and isn't the great supportive character off the pitch like Lucas is.

I think loyalty is important in sports and it'd be shitty of the club to suddenly half his wages when he's been such a great servant. I say sign him up for 2 more years on that 80k and give him a good club role afterwards.

Loyalty is great, especially given it's so rare these days. Mind you, it's pretty easy to be loyal when no better club has ever been interested and no other club would pay you anything anywhere near what we have for the past 3-4 years. Daresay a lot of players could afford to be loyal, given the circumstances. Not quite sure it warrants the hero worship..

[Sangria]

Loyalty is great, especially given it's so rare these days. Mind you, it's pretty easy to be loyal when no better club has ever been interested and no other club would pay you anything anywhere near what we have for the past 3-4 years. Daresay a lot of players could afford to be loyal, given the circumstances. Not quite sure it warrants the hero worship..

I'm pretty sure he's had other offers, perhaps not so prestigious, but certainly paying him at least what he gets here. Judging from what previously no-name players from no-name clubs are getting, I'm sure they'd be willing to pay over the odds to snaffle a player from Liverpool.

[Titi Camara]

I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that Lucas is "one of our main squad players", and even that he is in our second 11.

15th most used player this season

[mc_red22]

Regardless of whether he stays or goes this summer, I hope he gets a testimonial. Will always have huge respect for him for how he's handled himself in the past 10 years and how he developed into a very good defensive midfielder after looking out of his depth early on.

[JerseyKloppite]

£4m a year to be a boss lad in the dressing room? Mad. Oh to be a footballer.

No-one is saying that.

This, as per many discussions on here, seems to keep getting reduced to stark statements which don't reflect anyone's positions or opinions. The previous poster was just suggesting that he offers more than his basic abilities as a footballer.

He is a combination of 1) useful squad player 2) our only specialist DM and 3) an experienced and positive influence in the dressing room.

That may well be worth £80k a week - it's not my decision to make but it's not an obscene amount of money in the modern game (relative to the obscene amounts of money paid to players, clubs, agents etc generally).

[El Lobo]

When Jesse Lingard is on £100,000 a week and they're talking about extending Herreras to £120,000 a week, £80,000 for Lucas suddenly doesn't look particularly drastic.

[Sangria]

No-one is saying that.

This, as per many discussions on here, seems to keep getting reduced to stark statements which don't reflect anyone's positions or opinions. The previous poster was just suggesting that he offers more than his basic abilities as a footballer.

He is a combination of 1) useful squad player 2) our only specialist DM and 3) an experienced and positive influence in the dressing room.

That may well be worth £80k a week - it's not my decision to make but it's not an obscene amount of money in the modern game (relative to the obscene amounts of money paid to players, clubs, agents etc generally).

And more relevantly for the arguments being given, it's somewhat insulting to suggest that he's only here for the money, when he's had offers that would at least par that, and probably more.

[rickardinho1]

When Jesse Lingard is on £100,000 a week and they're talking about extending Herreras to £120,000 a week, £80,000 for Lucas suddenly doesn't look particularly drastic.

The main difference being that Herrera is a central cog in United's machine and even being talked up as a future captain by some of their fans, whereas Lucas will be sitting in the stands most of next season...

[Aldo96]

I don't think he'll be the only left back, but he may well still be the first choice left back to start the season, and why not, he's been really good.

The problem this season that we had no other option at left back, being as the boss has come to the understandable conclusion that Moreno isn't to be trusted. So Milner has been overplayed, similar to Clyne I suspect. But otherwise, Milner has been really good.

So why not have him - but with a good younger left back also, that the manager trusts, and that will get matches, meaning that Milner doesn't have to play constantly, make a good pairing that.

Without derailing the thread, although I agree the Milner experiment has been a good one- personally I really wouldn't want him as our main LB next season. He seems incapable of stopping a cross (although I admit this could be systematic as it appears none of our full backs can) and for me he just slows our approach play down so heavily because he has to cut back onto his right foot almost every single time.

[Dim Glas]

Well, it is probably worth mentioning that Klopp has kept Sebastian Kehl in the same role at Dortmund until the age of 35.

but Kehl played a heck of a lot more than Lucas is ever likely too next season. When he was fit, Kehl played.

I honestly think he'll go, not cos the club want him to leave but simply because at age 29/30 he now wants to play more as he knows he only has 2 or 3 seasons left at the highest level.

[Haggis36]

And more relevantly for the arguments being given, it's somewhat insulting to suggest that he's only here for the money, when he's had offers that would at least par that, and probably more.

You think there were clubs queuing up to offer him £80k off the back of doing his ACL? There's been a number of links to various clubs over the years, notably Inter Milan and one or two Turkish sides, and I'd suggest none of the clubs mentioned would pay close to those sorts of wages.

[Sangria]

You think there were clubs queuing up to offer him £80k off the back of doing his ACL? There's been a number of links to various clubs over the years, notably Inter Milan and one or two Turkish sides, and I'd suggest none of the clubs mentioned would pay close to those sorts of wages.

I know what kind of offers he's had. And given what other information is out there, it's reasonable to surmise that he could easily have at least equalled his Liverpool wages. Liverpool are by no means the highest paying club in the world.

[B0151?]

I know what kind of offers he's had. And given what other information is out there, it's reasonable to surmise that he could easily have at least equalled his Liverpool wages. Liverpool are by no means the highest paying club in the world.

Premier League is comfortably the highest paying league in the world though nah? I don't think it's reasonable to assume that really, hard to know how important those clubs had him earmarked as.

[El Lobo]

Its not really a big deal either way is it? If he stays, he's no more than a squad player and if he goes his position is pretty easily filled.

[Sangria]

Premier League is comfortably the highest paying league in the world though nah? I don't think it's reasonable to assume that really, hard to know how important those clubs had him earmarked as.

It depends on the offer. There are clubs that can and will pay comfortably more than Liverpool will, including clubs that wanted Lucas.

[Haggis36]

I know what kind of offers he's had. And given what other information is out there, it's reasonable to surmise that he could easily have at least equalled his Liverpool wages. Liverpool are by no means the highest paying club in the world.

If you know what other offers he's had, then surely you know if he's been offered the same, rather than "reasonably surmising". Unless you just mean the teams? In which case I'd be interested to know who they were. The only teams routinely paying more than us are the likes of your Munichs, PSGs and other teams top of the bigger leagues. Even teams like Napoli pay a fraction of the wages we do. The only other big spenders these days are clubs in far flung places of the world, that most people don't want to go to.

[Sangria]

Its not really a big deal either way is it? If he stays, he's no more than a squad player and if he goes his position is pretty easily filled.

Whether he's here or not after this summer (I don't expect him to be) is up to the higher ups. But we should at least give him due credit, rather than minimise it or seek to smear him. That's the least we should do for every Liverpool player that doesn't disrespect the club.

[DangerScouse]

The extent to which some people go to disparage certain players never ceases to amaze me. Bellends.

[DaveCharlie]

Same as it always was for Dirk Kuyt, a supporter's opinion of Lucas Leiva is the most accurate yardstick upon which one can measure their understanding of football (and more often than not their level of general intelligence). I don't care if that offends some of you posting in this thread. It's true.

Lucas has been my favourite LFC player since the Rafa days and the Phil Neville goalkeeping escapade remains one of my favourite LFC memories of all time. That the pen to win that game was sealed by none other than Dirk the Diggler means I rest my case on the paragraph above.

New contract or not... I demand a testimonial.

LFC vs Brazil at Anfield in the Summer of 2017.

Imagine the squads that Lucas could muster from across his 10 year career. Here's my go:

LFC:
Reina
Riise
Carra
Hyypia
Arbeloa
Lucas (c)
Gerrard
Alonso
Kuyt
Torres
Suarez

Bench: Mascherano, Agger, Benayoun, Skrtel, Sturridge, Henderson, Mignolet
Manager: Rafa


Brazil (people Lucas played with at LFC/Brazil NT or EPL battles):
Julio Cesar or Cavalieri or Doni
Dani Alves
David Luiz
Thiago Silva
Aurelio
Ramires
Willian
Kaka
Coutinho
Firmino
Neymar

Bench: Ronaldinho (doesn't get in the team over Phil and Bob!), Maicon, Pato, Robinho, Oscar, Anderson (old Gremio teammate), A keeper
Manager: Scolari

Who've I missed!? Maybe this should be a thread in its own right!

[Keita Success]

Same as it always was for Dirk Kuyt, a supporter's opinion of Lucas Leiva is the most accurate yardstick upon which one can measure their understanding of football (and more often than not their level of general intelligence). I don't care if that offends some of you posting in this thread. It's true.

Lucas has been my favourite LFC player since the Rafa days and the Phil Neville goalkeeping escapade remains one of my favourite LFC memories of all time. That the pen to win that game was sealed by none other than Dirk the Diggler means I rest my case on the paragraph above.

New contract or not... I demand a testimonial.

LFC vs Brazil at Anfield in the Summer of 2017.

Imagine the squads that Lucas could muster from across his 10 year career. Here's my go:

LFC:
Reina
Riise
Carra
Hyypia
Arbeloa
Lucas (c)
Gerrard
Alonso
Kuyt
Torres
Suarez

Bench: Mascherano, Agger, Benayoun, Skrtel, Sturridge, Henderson, Mignolet
Manager: Rafa


Brazil (people Lucas played with at LFC/Brazil NT or EPL battles):
Julio Cesar or Cavalieri or Doni
Dani Alves
David Luiz
Thiago Silva
Aurelio
Ramires
Willian
Kaka
Coutinho
Firmino
Neymar

Bench: Ronaldinho (doesn't get in the team over Phil and Bob!), Maicon, Pato, Robinho, Oscar, Anderson (old Gremio teammate), A keeper
Manager: Scolari

Who've I missed!? Maybe this should be a thread in its own right!

How Old are you? 

[DaveCharlie]

How Old are you? 

Old enough, laddie.

[Haggis36]

The extent to which some people go to disparage certain players never ceases to amaze me. Bellends.

Who has been disparaging him? I've not said anything unfair or had a go at him, I've not even been particularly critical of him as a player, I only said we should be aiming higher and that his wages are a bit too high given his playing status to justify keeping him around purely for experience or the odd game here or there. Providing a little balance to the hero worship or those saying we should give him a longer contract (scroll back, there are a few) does not equal disparaging the player, people are so insanely precious on here sometimes.

For what it's worth, I don't recall everyone coming out to praise Skrtel's loyalty to the club when everyone wanted him binned off last year, seems to only apply if you actually like the player.

[PeterTheRed ...]

Loyalty is great, especially given it's so rare these days. Mind you, it's pretty easy to be loyal when no better club has ever been interested and no other club would pay you anything anywhere near what we have for the past 3-4 years. Daresay a lot of players could afford to be loyal, given the circumstances. Not quite sure it warrants the hero worship..

Lucas had an offer from Inter Milan in January. They are a big European club, with ambitious new owner. Not to mention that the pace of the league suits him better, and the quality of living in Milano compared to Liverpool. Yet, he decided to stay.

[joezydudek]

Lucas had an offer from Inter Milan in January. They are a big European club, with ambitious new owner. Not to mention that the pace of the league suits him better, and the quality of living in Milano compared to Liverpool. Yet, he decided to stay.

That seems a bit logical, but I'm sure anyone who doesn't like him for whatever reason will convince themselves that Inter were going to pay him peanuts.

[JohnSullie]

great player hope he stays

[jepovic]

The main difference being that Herrera is a central cog in United's machine and even being talked up as a future captain by some of their fans, whereas Lucas will be sitting in the stands most of next season...

That sounds like wishful thinking from manu fans, not market salaries. Herrera will probably demand more like 200-250 k/w to extend, and he would be mad to sign at 120 when you see what for instance Pogba is earning.

[Aldo96]

Lucas had an offer from Inter Milan in January. They are a big European club, with ambitious new owner. Not to mention that the pace of the league suits him better, and the quality of living in Milano compared to Liverpool. Yet, he decided to stay.

Give me leafy Woolton any day of the week!

[JackWard33]

Lucas had an offer from Inter Milan in January. They are a big European club, with ambitious new owner. Not to mention that the pace of the league suits him better, and the quality of living in Milano compared to Liverpool. Yet, he decided to stay.

It was a loan offer to the end of the season as cover wasn't it?
He's not going to a bigger club when he leaves this summer. If he wants first team football at a lesser club then at this stage of his career that's his choice
Honestly though the perception of him on here from some is so out of whack with his current level its crazy.

[El Lobo]

It was a loan offer to the end of the season as cover wasn't it?
He's not going to a bigger club when he leaves this summer. If he wants first team football at a lesser club then at this stage of his career that's his choice
Honestly though the perception of him on here from some is so out of whack with his current level its crazy.

I've been way overly critical of him, and his recent form has made me look a bit (a lot) twatty.

But yeah, agree with that. It is what it is, the last few games have been about scrapping through and honestly wouldn't say there's a player who hasn't played his part in that. We need another CM, at least, and another CB, at least. That would push him further down the pecking order. Now if the lad is happy to play third/fourth fiddle then £80,000 a week or whatever isn't really much in this day and age. But the idea that he'd need assurances of more regular football next season? Nah. We need better than the players he's had to replace because of injury, let alone him.

[heylookitsjacob]

Honestly though the perception of him on here from some is so out of whack with his current level its crazy.

Anybody in particular? I've read this thread off and on but I haven't seen anybody make any outlandish comments about the guy's ability?

[JackWard33]

I've been way overly critical of him, and his recent form has made me look a bit (a lot) twatty.

But yeah, agree with that. It is what it is, the last few games have been about scrapping through and honestly wouldn't say there's a player who hasn't played his part in that. We need another CM, at least, and another CB, at least. That would push him further down the pecking order. Now if the lad is happy to play third/fourth fiddle then £80,000 a week or whatever isn't really much in this day and age. But the idea that he'd need assurances of more regular football next season? Nah. We need better than the players he's had to replace because of injury, let alone him.

I can't remember your posts specifically but I don't think good recent performances mean previous assessments of him were wrong. He's put in some shocking displays in the last couple of years.
He's fine as a player at a certain level, when rested, and he's very good defensively (in midfield) in the right system and in the right kind of game but he's not good enough for where we want to be and the football we want to play - especially in the system Klopp wants. I just don't see the point of having him take a wage allocation and a squad slot when we should be aiming so much higher.
Doesn't mean I think he's 'shit' or without merit, doesn't mean I've got something against him personally - the opposite he's a great role model - I just want us to have a squad good enough that he can't get a sniff of the first team 

[mallin9]

The main difference being that Herrera is a central cog in United's machine and even being talked up as a future captain by some of their fans

Hahahaha dearie me!  So he is aspiring to reach the level that Fellaini is currently at??  The only similarities I see between this United squad and a 'machine' is that their games, when forced to watch this shower of shit, feels like being locked in a room with only "Machine" from the film 8MM for company......

[fowlermagic]

The way the game is going we will soon be lucky to have players staying 5 years here never mind 10. You see fans giving other teams players more credit than they do of Lucas so maybe the lad should shuffle away and sign for Stoke as they may appreciate him more there as we sign a filler in, pay him 50k and delight in the 'massive' savings. Perhaps I am grasping at straws as I remember other dynasties having several players in the squad with 300 plus appearances completing a strong core to any team as each of them understood the importance of the club to the city. Success leads to that core which is why our current squad has very little history to it. A constant flow of managers the past decade has seen each managers squad getting dismantled. Its quite amazing Lucas has seen 5 managers over his time here. Its probably his time to go but I think its down to his decision more than Klopps as he wants more game time as he enters his early 30s. Klopp probably would love for him to stay as he has shown to be more than a fringe player in recent weeks. Our smallish squad has taken a hit with injuries and Lucas stepped in and all of a sudden a somewhat shaky backline looks a little steadier. The auld man at 30 still knows when to put a vital interception in and will continue to do for another 5 years at least as his game is not built on speed but more on reading of the game. Hes a lot more perceptive of that than a lot of his younger counterparts.

[rickardinho1]

Hahahaha dearie me!  So he is aspiring to reach the level that Fellaini is currently at??  The only similarities I see between this United squad and a 'machine' is that their games, when forced to watch this shower of shit, feels like being locked in a room with only "Machine" from the film 8MM for company......

I didn't say it was a very good machine...

[joekim87]

How much does a squad player get these days for LFC? 50k-ish a week? Well then:

50k-ish for being a squad player.
+ 20k for being a leader and a good influence off the pitch
+ 10k loyalty bonus

Simple 80k justified.

[rickardinho1]

How much does a squad player get these days for LFC? 50k-ish a week? Well then:

50k-ish for being a squad player.
+ 20k for being a leader and a good influence off the pitch
+ 10k loyalty bonus

Simple 80k justified.

He's already on that, it's just a matter of him deciding if he wants to stay and be a squad player or if he wants to play regularly elsewhere.