Topic: Liverpool's Midfield

[SerbianScouser]

What and Sturridge doesnt need to improve?

He doesn`t. He needs support and runs from deep to distract people and give him some space.

[Fordy]

Just goes to show the importance of Henderson and Sterling. Henderson is available on a free next year but we still spend more time discussing Sterling.

Sorry Killer I am confused by this comment.

I'm convinced that the liverpool board will be talking with Hendo agent as much as Sterlings.

Henderson seems in no rush to sign a contract neither does Sterling.

However, it's the media that's highlighting Sterlings contract situation due to his worth and top clubs that will want him.

[Fordy]

He doesn`t. He needs support and runs from deep to distract people and give him some space.

He needs to improve mate.

1) be less bloody injury prone
2) be more a team player.

[LFCDynamic]

To me it's more about weighing them up, you get the feeling that Henderson would fight for the club and would be proud to be captain, whereas with Sterling I get the feeling (and from hearing what journos say) that his head could be quickly turned.

Maybe i'm wrong, but that's it for me

Nailed it

[Redman0151]

He doesn`t. He needs support and runs from deep to distract people and give him some space.

Come on mate Sturridge was poor today for large parts. Yes he was isolated but at times he wasn't making much effort to come and get the ball, and a few times it felt like he could have got to the ball but he slowed down/gave up on it. Plus, I could be wrong but I think Shelvey's free shot from the corner was Sturridge's man that he lost. Hope he's firing next week, we need him in top form right now

[SerbianScouser]

Come on mate Sturridge was poor today for large parts. Yes he was isolated but at times he wasn't making much effort to come and get the ball, and a few times it felt like he could have got to the ball but he slowed down/gave up on it. Plus, I could be wrong but I think Shelvey's free shot from the corner was Sturridge's man that he lost. Hope he's firing next week, we need him in top form right now

Ask yourself why are we not blowing teams away? Is Hendo making his trademark runs into the box like last season? Is Coutinho the profile of the player to go beyond Sturridge and give him an option? Do our wingbacks make enough or any runs within the frame of the goal? How can you not see how isolated he is - in the first half there was absolutely nowhere near him and that`s the trend since he got back. Sturridge doesn`t do rustiness he scored after 15 mins after 5 months out. We simply don`t have enough runners into the box , he is always surrounded by 2-3 players who only have to worry about him making runs behind them.

And btw with all the criticism he still came up with an insane assist.

[Redman0151]

Ask yourself why are we not blowing teams away? Is Hendo making his trademark runs into the box like last season? Is Coutinho the profile of the player to go beyond Sturridge and give him an option? Do our wingbacks make enough or any runs within the frame of the goal? How can you not see how isolated he is - in the first half there was absolutely nowhere near him and that`s the trend since he got back. Sturridge doesn`t do rustiness he scored after 15 mins after 5 months out. We simply don`t have enough runners into the box , he is always surrounded by 2-3 players who only have to worry about him making runs behind them.

Mate I said on the first line he was isolated at times, but his performance despite that was weak. If he's not getting the runners and the service he needs, then he needs to go and impose himself and get involved in the game more not just let his head get down about lack of service.


The flick was good for the assist, but if you look at the replay it actually got a huge deflection off the swansea player: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZdu4oKufF4

[shanks_legend]

How far away is Lucas?

[LFCDynamic]

Ask yourself why are we not blowing teams away? Is Hendo making his trademark runs into the box like last season? Is Coutinho the profile of the player to go beyond Sturridge and give him an option? Do our wingbacks make enough or any runs within the frame of the goal? How can you not see how isolated he is - in the first half there was absolutely nowhere near him and that`s the trend since he got back. Sturridge doesn`t do rustiness he scored after 15 mins after 5 months out. We simply don`t have enough runners into the box , he is always surrounded by 2-3 players who only have to worry about him making runs behind them.

And btw with all the criticism he still came up with an insane assist.

That's how Torres had to play.

If you're saying that Sturridge was on song tonight, you're wong. Not only are you wrong, that is also insulting to Sturridge cause he is a lot better than that.

Sturridge has the pace Torres had and the finishing Torres had too. I don't think his movement is as good as Torres. That just goes to show that there's much scope for improvemnt and that can only be exciting given the player he already is.

Anyway my point is, he didn't play well today and deserves the criticism he gets. If Balotelli had put that same shift in, we would be all over him...

[SerbianScouser]

I`m not saying Sturridge played well on the contrary but still he made the difference in the game by providing an insane flick/through ball for Henderson. He has that in his locker. Our other 3 CFs don`t.

Unless we tinker with a shape a bit to get more bodies into the box we`ll never see the best of Daniel. He`s the only one in our attack who threatens to make runs behind the opposition back 4 and that is never gonna work. We are on an amazing runs as our defence keeps us competitive with all the clean sheets and we`ll always have a goal or two in us to win the game. But the composition upfront will need to be tinkered with so we can start blowing teams away like we did last season.

[Fordy]

I`m not saying Sturridge played well on the contrary but still he made the difference in the game by providing an insane flick/through ball for Henderson. He has that in his locker. Our other 3 CFs don`t.

Unless we tinker with a shape a bit to get more bodies into the box we`ll never see the best of Daniel. He`s the only one in our attack who threatens to make runs behind the opposition back 4 and that is never gonna work. We are on an amazing runs as our defence keeps us competitive with all the clean sheets and we`ll always have a goal or two in us to win the game. But the composition upfront will need to be tinkered with so we can start blowing teams away like we did last season.

Sturridge was poor tonight and I would be tempted to play Sterling up top against UTD on Sunday.

Sturridge clearly is going to take time to get up to speed but his decision making is awful at them minute.

[Fordy]

To me it's more about weighing them up, you get the feeling that Henderson would fight for the club and would be proud to be captain, whereas with Sterling I get the feeling (and from hearing what journos say) that his head could be quickly turned.

Maybe i'm wrong, but that's it for me

Very wrong.

However when a player is VC it's easy to say that they will fight for the club.

Let's not forget Sterling has been here since he was 15 and has been fighting for this club.

Both him and Hendo are in the same situation. Let's not act like kids and try to make out one is better than the other. Both have rejected contract offers.

[Ken-Obi]

Go on then, give him Ł150k a week.

Hope you lot don't spill your coffee three years from now.

[KopThat]

Henderson & Allen have been a very solid pairing in the past few games,
so where do you play a fit Gerrard ?

push Hendo further forward ?

[Giono]

How far away is Lucas?

I had thiught I had read that he is back to full training. Allen's runs into the final third Monday made me wonder what a Lucas + Allen duo in midfield would look like. Two months ago I would have thought it too defensive. Now, I'm not so sure.

Sorry for going off-topic and not discussing Sterling's money matters.

[PhaseOfPlay]

I had thiught I had read that he is back to full training. Allen's runs into the final third Monday made me wonder what a Lucas + Allen duo in midfield would look like. Two months ago I would have thought it too defensive. Now, I'm not so sure.

Sorry for going off-topic and not discussing Sterling's money matters.

I think some of the problem for us today in the first half, and probably until Gerrard came on, was that neither Henderson nor Allen took on the role of stopper, allowing the other one to go forward. They took it in turns, but neither of them actually got forward with any real purpose. This is the value of Lucas, though. He does take it upon himself to be the stopper, with few runs forward, and that allows the other midfielder to become more box-to-box or even outright attacking as a midfielder, knowing that Lucas has the door bolt behind him. I think a Lucas/Allen pair could work, as long as Allen took realised he was the runner, and left Lucas to mind the shop. When Gerrard came on, he did the stopper job, which meant both Allen and Henderson could get forward, which increased our pressure and attacks immensely from that point on.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Henderson & Allen have been a very solid pairing in the past few games,
so where do you play a fit Gerrard ?

push Hendo further forward ?

We could change to an out-and-out 3-1-3-3:

Can---Skrtel---Sakho
Gerrard
Sterling------Henderson------Moreno
Lallana------Coutinho
Sturridge

That would also give us bench options in Markovic, Ibe, Johnson, Balotelli, Toure and Lucas. But then, ultimately, we might want to rotate Lucas and Gerrard in that system, so it could be the case of starting one and subbing in the other late on, to keep both of them fresh. There are a few options available to get Gerrard into the team without changing the shape too much

[Livo.85]

Would slightly alter that to:

Can---Skrtel---Sakho
Gerrard
Ibe---Henderson---Allen---Sterling
Coutinho
Sturridge

[spider-neil]

Gerrard is better from the bench. If he is given 20-30 minutes he can go flat out without having to worry about managing his energy for the full 90.

[bam09]

Putting Gerrard at the base of the diamond was a master class. When they sat a little deeper and allowed our backline to pass it amongst themselves, bringing him on forced them to stick a marker on him. It brought them higher, and allowed Skrtel to walk out of the defense with the ball unchallenged.

[lorenzo23]

We really can't make a system to suit Gerrard, he is leaving at end of season.

[Livo.85]

We really can't make a system to suit Gerrard, he is leaving at end of season.

Rodgers will alter it though to use him. That was clear when he came on.

[ThePeetmix]

We really can't make a system to suit Gerrard, he is leaving at end of season.

To be fair, that's at the end of the season. It was a system to win last night's game and it included Gerrard. It's another string to our bow and it should make teams even more worried.

[Draex]

Perfect game management of Gerrard, long may it continue.

[lorenzo23]

I am not saying we don't use Gerrard to the best of our ability, last night was great example of it. With that said unless we plan on getting a player with his skills set we should just make sure Gerrard is used like last night. Instead of fully changing formation to shoe him in, with the fact that the team has been settled.

[keyo]

The formation switch and clear bollocking helped but so did Gerrard. Still feel we need someone really good on the ball on that area that can put his foot on it and calm everything down. Sometimes its all rumble tumble in there.

think you are right....allen is a good conduit, but he is not likely to shape the play when we need to...gerrard can and has done it, but will be gone next season....can, for all his promise, does not look like the sort of player who will put his foot on it when we need to control play....we need someone who can impose himself and set the tempo....in the past xabi used to do it, but there are others who do it in different ways, souness was the master of imposition and molby was imperious....these days we tend to look at ball players like xavi, or deep lying midfielders like xabi....maybe we need to find another x??  matic does it for Chelsea to a degree, and sometimes imposing oneself on the play physically works (toure)....Henderson's strengths are not in controlling play or setting tempo, and his passing is not sufficient alone for the role

how we deal with that are in the future - at the moment Rodgers is doing a pretty good job of managing in reactively - will be important to how well we compete next season

[spider-neil]

A coin flip as to which was Allen best game, Swansea away or City at home. Both games I think he was incredible. Probably the Swansea game was better because he was the only player (in midfield) who was competent in the first 45 minutes.

[leivapool]

Allen and Hendo is definitely our best midfield pair.

18 points from 18 since they were paired up after Lucas got injured.

Long may it continue.

It isn't,  and I bet you weren't saying that first half......

[Caston]

Very wrong.

However when a player is VC it's easy to say that they will fight for the club.

Let's not forget Sterling has been here since he was 15 and has been fighting for this club.

Both him and Hendo are in the same situation. Let's not act like kids and try to make out one is better than the other. Both have rejected contract offers.

Where's your proof then?

[Halcyon Lissome]

A coin flip as to which was Allen best game, Swansea away or City at home. Both games I think he was incredible. Probably the Swansea game was better because he was the only player (in midfield) who was competent in the first 45 minutes.

I'd say the Swansea game. We struggled and he stood out. Not just by surviving but thriving. He drove with the ball and provided incisive passes when most of the players around him kept giving it away. Some lovely footwork also; thought I was watching David Silva for a second.

[Redman0151]

Last night is where we will get most benefit out of gerrard IMO, off the bench 60-70 minutes in where he comes in fresh and ready to go

[DeLeiva]

I know it's been said before..... but

JOE FUCKING ALLEN!

He was imperious again last night, passed his socks off and has started to add beating opponents with the ball at his feet.
Was everywhere defensively -  Can't wait to see him take it to United Sunday.

[deadsetred]

Very wrong.

However when a player is VC it's easy to say that they will fight for the club.

Let's not forget Sterling has been here since he was 15 and has been fighting for this club.

Both him and Hendo are in the same situation. Let's not act like kids and try to make out one is better than the other. Both have rejected contract offers.

Anyone with half a brain can see that Hendo is less of a worry than Sterling. It's not a conclusion you arrive at deductively, just using your basic intuition based on a number of factors.

I do believe that Sterling would ultimately like to sign a new contract however.

[Phil M]

Last night is where we will get most benefit out of gerrard IMO, off the bench 60-70 minutes in where he comes in fresh and ready to go

He certainly helped us change the game, some really astute passing and some very important interceptions. Delighted to see him back and to get 3pts.

[DeLeiva]

I'd say the Swansea game. We struggled and he stood out. Not just by surviving but thriving. He drove with the ball and provided incisive passes when most of the players around him kept giving it away. Some lovely footwork also; thought I was watching David Silva for a second.

Reminded me of Verratti's performance vs. The Rent Boys when they were down to 10 men.

Joe kept getting on the ball when we were in trouble and passing his way out, was so busy in midfield
giving people options with his movement.

Would have been awesome if he had of put his chance away.

[Djimi Smicer34]

The highest praise I could give Allen is that since he came into the team we haven't missed Lucas at all, despite him having an excellent season up to that point.

I've always rated Allen and last night he showed what he is capable of further forward.  We've seen glimpses before but its becoming almost a regular feature of his game since he's come back into the team, rather than sitting deep he's becoming more involved in our attacks and has been unlucky with a couple of efforts himself in recent weeks.  He's showing his quality on the ball in every game.  If he can sustain this form and stay fit then he's shown how important he can be for us and his partnership with Henderson looks an outstanding one. 

As good as Lucas has been, he's not getting back into the team while Allen is in this sort of form.  Long may it continue.

["21C or 70F?" SchizoidWeatherMan!]

 

As good as Lucas has been, he's not getting back into the team while Allen is in this sort of form.  Long may it continue.

Oh really? Lucas should walk back into the team when fully fit. Allen has been decent but he is nowhere near Lucas' ability when it comes to the deepest midfielder role.  I assume Rodgers will play him as soon as he is near optimum fitness levels.

[DeLeiva]

Oh really? Lucas should walk back into the team when fully fit. Allen has been decent but he is nowhere near Lucas' ability when it comes to the deepest midfielder role.  I assume Rodgers will play him as soon as he is near optimum fitness levels.

No one walks back into our team.  Doesn't work like that.

Massive Lucas fan me, but Joe Allen is bossing it at the moment.
Would be silly to take him out.

Stevie is fit again and he's not a cert for the starting team vs. United.

[Djimi Smicer34]

Oh really? Lucas should walk back into the team when fully fit. Allen has been decent but he is nowhere near Lucas' ability when it comes to the deepest midfielder role.  I assume Rodgers will play him as soon as he is near optimum fitness levels.

Absolutely, Lucas isn't walking back into the team unless Allen gets injured or his form goes off a cliff.  We won't change a winning team and Allen is doing nothing that would warrant him being taken out of the team, he and Henderson have been outstanding during this run they've had starting together. 

[Haggis36]

Missed the match but just watched the Allen compilation and what a game he had individually! He's always had the ability to put on performances like that, the problem in the past has been showing it consistently over a period of time which to be fair has been difficult with injuries.

It feels though that this is arguably his best period of form since he arrived, he looks so confident. I don't think the defensive aspect of his game has ever been in much doubt but some of the driving runs forward he was making last night, and some of the touches further up the pitch were superb. He's definitely the best suited 'pass and move' CM we have, just perpetual motion.

Really, really pleased for him. Certainly deserves that new contract.