Author Topic: Arsenal: Top of the divers league  (Read 307989 times)

Offline The North Bank

  • Can even make the sun shine in Manchester - once in a blue moon...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 22,511
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7640 on: Yesterday at 10:11:49 am »
Two seasons of not winning anything does  not make a manager great. You are just getting sillier and sillier.

Rodgers never won anything at Liverpool I believe. I suppose thats tough when you decide to play the reserves at real madrid.

No disrespect meant for an ex Liverpool manager and if you rate him highly then im sure you have your reasons.

Don’t really want to discuss rodgers anymore, I dont want to upset the residents, I just dont rate him as highly as you do

Offline [new username under construction]

  • Poster formerly know as shadowbane. Never lost his head whilst others panicked. Fucking kopite!
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 12,359
  • Insert something awesome here!
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7641 on: Yesterday at 10:13:01 am »
Who rates Rogers highly?

Offline Redley

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,656
  • Turned doubters to believers
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7642 on: Yesterday at 10:17:19 am »
He couldn’t back it up the following season, consistency is what separates the top managers from the flashes in the pan.

I think it just shows how far your standards have fallen sadly, even this season you've never actually thought you could win the title. Even now you've given it up, and so think finished 2nd or 3rd a couple of seasons in a row with no trophies is something to celebrate. Its a shame....because its not, particularly when you've lead the league for as long as Arsenal in both seasons.

Brendan Rodgers and Roy Hodgson are the only managers not to win a trophy during their time here since the 1950s btw :D Its not really a hill anyone is fussed about dying on here, slate him all you want. That a lot of people see comparisons with Arteta is obviously quite triggering, I can understand that.


Offline The North Bank

  • Can even make the sun shine in Manchester - once in a blue moon...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 22,511
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7643 on: Yesterday at 10:28:26 am »
I think it just shows how far your standards have fallen sadly, even this season you've never actually thought you could win the title. Even now you've given it up, and so think finished 2nd or 3rd a couple of seasons in a row with no trophies is something to celebrate. Its a shame....because its not, particularly when you've lead the league for as long as Arsenal in both seasons.

Brendan Rodgers and Roy Hodgson are the only managers not to win a trophy during their time here since the 1950s btw :D Its not really a hill anyone is fussed about dying on here, slate him all you want. That a lot of people see comparisons with Arteta is obviously quite triggering, I can understand that.

That is a crazy stats about the trophies. In fairness only Rioch and Emery havent won trophies at Arsenal since the mid 80s but cant tell for certain how previous managers got on.
I wouldnt say Rodgers was a failure at Liverpool , it was a tough task managing Liverpool then and only a Klopp could turn it around. Not everyone who isnt Klopp is a failure, as im sure youll find out soon enough.
Arteta similarly took over a circus and has done great to turn it around, still at the start of the journey
.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 10:33:20 am by The North Bank »

Offline boots

  • upon a hippo only look good if they match the tutu - fact! Oor Wullie, Your Wullie, A'Buddy's Wullie.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,378
  • Klopptimistic
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7644 on: Yesterday at 10:42:43 am »
Its a little unfair criticising Arsenal. Theyre above us in the table. 2nd only to the cheats. Theyve done okay. A trophy doesnt always reflect progression. Theyre moving in the right direction (for them). Dont get me wrong, I hope they fall flat on their arse. But theyve made some progress.

Theyre still shit (in case my gooner mates read this (unlikely theyre too thick))
Typing with my finger on my computer. Other appendages are available.

Offline Kloppage Time

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 380
  • ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠⊙⁠_⁠ʖ⁠⊙⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7645 on: Yesterday at 10:49:37 am »
Let's hope wolves take advantage of their European woes
Anyone can have a good day, but you have to be able to perform on a bad day.

Jurgen Klopp

Offline Elzar

  • train station gate frustration - delia smith fan club founder ('ave it!)
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 24,139
  • Bam!
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7646 on: Yesterday at 10:52:06 am »
They have developed really well, even if we dislike how they play and go about a game. Looks like they will be staying around the top of the league for the next few seasons.

I don't understand this whole thing around not having the experience in Europe being a big factor in the defeat to Bayern though. Plenty have teams have gone on runs, beaten the best sides over 2 legs and got to finals etc without needing years of experience in their players.
We already have shit in the country, and the game of Liverpool fills life with joy. Thanks

Offline Redley

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,656
  • Turned doubters to believers
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7647 on: Yesterday at 10:56:20 am »
They have developed really well, even if we dislike how they play and go about a game. Looks like they will be staying around the top of the league for the next few seasons.

I don't understand this whole thing around not having the experience in Europe being a big factor in the defeat to Bayern though. Plenty have teams have gone on runs, beaten the best sides over 2 legs and got to finals etc without needing years of experience in their players.

Dortmund are in the semis without making a dent in the competition for over a decade, and just beat one of the most difficult teams you could face in it. And they're not full of loads of experience, certainly no more than the likes of Jesus, Havertz and Jorginho. Just seems like a bad excuse. Or maybe it just explains why they've never achieved anything in European football, constantly overthinking it like its a different sport.

Offline cissesbeard

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 922
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7648 on: Yesterday at 10:58:14 am »
not sure how rodgers got brought up in here but for my money arteta is a much better manager. seems to have improved arsenal each year, which is all you can really ask for.
think the semi v bayern was a big missed opportunity for them though.

Online Historical Fool

  • A fool in the present too. The ban on drivel from 666 has led to a remarkable increase in forum quality. Currently being spectacularly wooshed. Seemingly by, well, just about everything.....
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,460
  • FSG EOTM June ‘23
    • Fenway Sports Group
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7649 on: Yesterday at 11:00:03 am »
Finished 7th, then capitalized on a freakish Suarez year, was unable to make it count because he cant organize a defence and Liverpool shipped 50 league goals that year. Suarez left in 2014 and Brendan is now out of ideas and then gets the sack because he didn't have one player to bail him out.

Arsenal's goals are spread across the team, we don't have a titanic goal scorer. We have patterns of play that come from coaching. Its through Arteta system that we are the leagues top scorers this year. Arteta can organize a defence and team out of possession, something Brendan could never do.

And if Brendan is so good, why not take him back for next season? Dont think Celtic will stand in his way, apparently the Celtic fans cant stand him, as he taken them backwards from where Ange left them.

In a heartbeat.
You're all too fucking serious, the lot of you. Relax, we don't really matter.

Oh, and we should have an in's and out's topic, stickied.

Offline MonsLibpool

  • Glass always half empty.......
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 12,182
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7650 on: Yesterday at 11:19:05 am »

Offline zero zero

  • Karma's a bitch. Innit.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 15,518
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7651 on: Yesterday at 11:19:53 am »

Offline JRed

  • After a 2L bottle of strongbow I’d do anything!
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,220
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7652 on: Yesterday at 12:31:23 pm »
Rodgers never won anything at Liverpool I believe. I suppose thats tough when you decide to play the reserves at real madrid.

No disrespect meant for an ex Liverpool manager and if you rate him highly then im sure you have your reasons.

Don’t really want to discuss rodgers anymore, I dont want to upset the residents, I just dont rate him as highly as you do
Where did I say I rate Rodgers highly?

Offline DarkOfTheManatee

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 287
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7653 on: Yesterday at 02:52:04 pm »
Rodgers and Arteta do have some similarities: both seem like decent coaches, both lack charisma and come across as thin-skinned, and neither look like they have what it takes to get an elite team across the finish line on the biggest stages.

Rodgers has had the higher highs, but Arteta has so far avoided the latter season meltdowns that Rodgers had at both Liverpool and Leicester after a couple of seasons (and the latter pretty much getting Leicester relegated is a pretty significant black mark).

Then again, Arteta did get unprecedented power to reshape the Arsenal squad regardless of the financial implications, bombing out big players not long after they were handed lucrative contracts (which ultimately was the right decision, in fairness), whereas Rodgers - thankfully, from my POV - never had that level of control and was constantly jostling with the 'committee'.

Ultimately, I wouldn't want either of them anywhere near Liverpool, and I think it'd be very interesting to see how this Arsenal squad did under a different manager, because for my money it's a pretty handy squad that would win the league under Klopp and is maybe only a goalscorer and goalkeeper away from being pretty formidable regardless.


Offline Redley

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,656
  • Turned doubters to believers
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7654 on: Yesterday at 02:59:33 pm »
If we're being fair to Rodgers, he spent about the same on transfers (net) in his four seasons here that Arteta spent in the summer. They have spent an absolutely incredible amount of money, Rodgers (probably luckily) didn't have the financial backing Arteta has. And that has to be included in any comparison between the two, or what the expectations were.

They've apparently spent £550 million NET in his four years there  :o  :o  :o Didn't realise it was that much.

Offline The G in Gerrard

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 45,235
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7655 on: Yesterday at 03:04:14 pm »
Arteta seems to be making the same mistakes as last season (at the end of the season)?

Offline DarkOfTheManatee

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 287
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7656 on: Yesterday at 03:18:27 pm »
If we're being fair to Rodgers, he spent about the same on transfers (net) in his four seasons here that Arteta spent in the summer. They have spent an absolutely incredible amount of money, Rodgers (probably luckily) didn't have the financial backing Arteta has. And that has to be included in any comparison between the two, or what the expectations were.

They've apparently spent £550 million NET in his four years there  :o  :o  :o Didn't realise it was that much.

Yeah, since Rodgers was advocating for the likes of Benteke, Dempsey and Ashley Williams, I'm not sure how much good another £100m+ would've done him!

But yes, Arteta's spending is something that doesn't come up much when he gets praise from the pundits/media - similar to his mentor in that respect. Having said that, it does reflect the different state of play for title-challenging teams now - if you're going to compete with a team of financial dopers, and you don't have the high transfer hit rate/best-in-class manager that we've had for the last few years, then you need to splash big money to bridge the gap.

My guess would be that if Arteta and Rodgers swapped roles for next season, neither would perform much better than the other currently is - Arteta would win the SPL, and Rodgers would challenge for the league but ultimately fall short.

Offline ScottishGoon

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,914
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7657 on: Yesterday at 04:23:22 pm »
If we're being fair to Rodgers, he spent about the same on transfers (net) in his four seasons here that Arteta spent in the summer. They have spent an absolutely incredible amount of money, Rodgers (probably luckily) didn't have the financial backing Arteta has. And that has to be included in any comparison between the two, or what the expectations were.

They've apparently spent £550 million NET in his four years there  :o  :o  :o Didn't realise it was that much.

Not sure it’s fair to compare transfer prices of 10 years ago to transfer prices now when discussing how much either have spent?

Offline Mister Flip Flop

  • More flop than flip.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,680
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7658 on: Yesterday at 04:26:50 pm »
I respect Arsenal because they are a proper football club unlike 115 but that doesn't mean they aren't a bunch of cheating shithouses which they are.
Soccer - let's face it, its not really about a game of ball anymore is it?

Offline Redley

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,656
  • Turned doubters to believers
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7659 on: Yesterday at 04:27:09 pm »
Yeah, since Rodgers was advocating for the likes of Benteke, Dempsey and Ashley Williams, I'm not sure how much good another £100m+ would've done him!

But yes, Arteta's spending is something that doesn't come up much when he gets praise from the pundits/media - similar to his mentor in that respect. Having said that, it does reflect the different state of play for title-challenging teams now - if you're going to compete with a team of financial dopers, and you don't have the high transfer hit rate/best-in-class manager that we've had for the last few years, then you need to splash big money to bridge the gap.

My guess would be that if Arteta and Rodgers swapped roles for next season, neither would perform much better than the other currently is - Arteta would win the SPL, and Rodgers would challenge for the league but ultimately fall short.

I do think the play acting, constant diving, whinging at refs, faking head injuries and the bizarre mid-half team talks would stop under Rodgers. You wonder how much of a boost that would be, we've just seen the last week they've gone out of the CL because of Saka diving instead of just trying to score a goal.

Offline Bennett

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,363
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7660 on: Yesterday at 04:28:00 pm »
Rodgers is a good manager, not a truly great one. Arteta is a good manager, at the moment not a truly great one. What are we even fucking debating here?

Offline IgorBobbins

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,902
  • BOBBINS!
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7661 on: Yesterday at 04:35:41 pm »
Why? What has Arteta actually done?
He’s thrown a kettle over a pub. What have you ever done?

Offline ScottishGoon

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,914
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7662 on: Yesterday at 04:35:41 pm »
Yeah, since Rodgers was advocating for the likes of Benteke, Dempsey and Ashley Williams, I'm not sure how much good another £100m+ would've done him!

But yes, Arteta's spending is something that doesn't come up much when he gets praise from the pundits/media - similar to his mentor in that respect. Having said that, it does reflect the different state of play for title-challenging teams now - if you're going to compete with a team of financial dopers, and you don't have the high transfer hit rate/best-in-class manager that we've had for the last few years, then you need to splash big money to bridge the gap.

My guess would be that if Arteta and Rodgers swapped roles for next season, neither would perform much better than the other currently is - Arteta would win the SPL, and Rodgers would challenge for the league but ultimately fall short.

How much did the Liverpool squad cost to assemble, and how much did the Arsenal squad cost to assemble? Because I bet there isn’t much difference in how much both squads actually cost.

Where Liverpool have done better than Arsenal is selling. They had assets that they could or were forced to sell. Arsenal didn’t really have that to the same level. Most of their main assets were all ageing on big contracts that they had to release.

Offline Tonyh8su

  • Tonyign0r35u
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 5,707
  • YNWA
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7663 on: Yesterday at 06:10:53 pm »
Klopp is leaving and your replacing with a 39 year old Amorim. With the expectation he builds a new Liverpool in the subsequent years when Salah and VVD who will be phased out due them both being in the twilight of their careers. It could be a rough couple of years.

You do not sack a manager who has taken your team to banter era to challenging for the title. You do not sack a manager losing 3-2 on aggregate to Bayern Munich. If you sack a manager under those circumstances, its done on pure emotion rather than rational. Which ironically is the same thing your speaking out against.

This 'experienced manager' you speak of, that we need to hire, why didn't you hire him. Why did you hire a up and coming rookie? Why would we be better off with a more experienced manager, but not Liverpool?

Are we? Who's giving you that information?

Offline tonysleft

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,495
  • A manc
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7664 on: Yesterday at 06:34:22 pm »
How much did the Liverpool squad cost to assemble, and how much did the Arsenal squad cost to assemble? Because I bet there isn’t much difference in how much both squads actually cost.

Where Liverpool have done better than Arsenal is selling. They had assets that they could or were forced to sell. Arsenal didn’t really have that to the same level. Most of their main assets were all ageing on big contracts that they had to release.
Tbf Liverpool have done a great job selling. Solanke looks a snip at 24m now but that's almost 4 years later. The Fabinho and Henderson fees were a masterstroke for some utterly finished players I wish we could pull off with Casemiro and Varane but knowing us we won't. I can't believe some guy in Saudi watched Fabinho all of last season and turned to his agent and said "have we a spare 40m"
Great chiefs and great loves in obliterated light

Offline coolbyrne

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,490
  • Ground Control
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7665 on: Yesterday at 07:57:16 pm »
Are we? Who's giving you that information?

Don't mind him, he's the same WUM who thinks Liverpool and Arsenal are interchangeable teams because both teams have the same amount of points. And he also gave us this gem:

Quote
Arsenal fans who want Arteta out, and just like the French who collaborated with their invaders in the early 1940's. They are saboteurs.

As amusing as it is, I can't be bothered engaging with him anymore.
Oh, these sour times.

No one admires resilience when you were just plain wrong all along - that's just twattishness.

Offline decosabute

  • ...and so am I. Abu Dhabi correspondent
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,339
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7666 on: Yesterday at 08:40:17 pm »
How much did the Liverpool squad cost to assemble, and how much did the Arsenal squad cost to assemble? Because I bet there isn’t much difference in how much both squads actually cost.

Where Liverpool have done better than Arsenal is selling. They had assets that they could or were forced to sell. Arsenal didn’t really have that to the same level. Most of their main assets were all ageing on big contracts that they had to release.

According to a planet football article I saw on it from this year, Arsenal's cost around £720m, while Liverpool's cost £660m. So the difference isn't huge to be fair.

But like I always say on here, what rankles with me is that we earned being able to spend what we did - not necessarily just by selling players, but also by doing well and building the success from 2016-2019. And we're a bigger club than Arsenal to start with.

For years and years, Arsenal did zilch in the league, didn't qualify for the CL, spent fortunes on shite that ended up going for very little, and yet suddenly here they are outspending us constantly. Now linked with Isak and Oliseh for probably £160m without selling anyone.

I know you always argue that it's a different approach from the owners - the Kroenkes are happy to go for it a bit, while FSG are much more run to a formula designed to break even and not take risks. And that's all fine to say, but it doesn't half feel a bit unfair to be constantly overpowered in the market by a team who were shite for years while we were getting everything right.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 08:42:07 pm by decosabute »

Offline ScottishGoon

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,914
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7667 on: Yesterday at 08:49:46 pm »
Tbf Liverpool have done a great job selling. Solanke looks a snip at 24m now but that's almost 4 years later. The Fabinho and Henderson fees were a masterstroke for some utterly finished players I wish we could pull off with Casemiro and Varane but knowing us we won't. I can't believe some guy in Saudi watched Fabinho all of last season and turned to his agent and said "have we a spare 40m"

Oh I don’t deny that. Masters at selling, they pulled Barcas pants down for Coutinho, then there’s Benteke, Sakho, Rhian Brewster, Jordan Ibe, the list goes on. We were shocking at it. I’m envious as well. We certainly won’t get £40M from Saudi for Partey, that’s for sure.

My point is in terms of actual spend to build the squad, Liverpool probably spent similar to us in terms of Gross Soend. They’ve sold much better than us so they have a much less Net Spend. We’ve had to fund transfers by keeping the wage bill low, restructuring debt, absorbing some losses, and paying up like we’ve bought from a catalogue.

Offline ScottishGoon

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,914
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7668 on: Yesterday at 09:09:43 pm »
According to a planet football article I saw on it from this year, Arsenal's cost around £720m, while Liverpool's cost £660m. So the difference isn't huge to be fair.

But like I always say on here, what rankles with me is that we earned being able to spend what we did - not necessarily just by selling players, but also by doing well and building the success from 2016-2019. And we're a bigger club than Arsenal to start with.

For years and years, Arsenal did zilch in the league, didn't qualify for the CL, spent fortunes on shite that ended up going for very little, and yet suddenly here they are outspending us constantly. Now linked with Isak and Oliseh for probably £160m without selling anyone.

I know you always argue that it's a different approach from the owners - the Kroenkes are happy to go for it a bit, while FSG are much more run to a formula designed to break even and not take risks. And that's all fine to say, but it doesn't half feel a bit unfair to be constantly overpowered in the market by a team who were shite for years while we were getting everything right.

I get your frustration. The problem you had, was your revenues were rising but at the same time your costs, especially you wages, were rising at a similar level because you were being successful, meaning for a club that was set on breaking even you didn’t have massive wiggle room, so your sales helped fund some spend.

Our revenues were at a lower level but so were our outgoings, to the point we actually had actually cut the wage bill at one point. But you are right, at 1 point KSE became a bit more flexible in absorbing some losses, obviously the Covid affected seasons make these losses even more inflated. I think the accounts showed we borrowed an extra £41M from KSE last season, so about enough to cover a standard transfer.

However, we are at the point where with our ‘limited success’ our revenues will go up, but at the same time so will our wage bill. So will be interesting to see the transfer strategy going forward, because they always say this is a temporary measure, it’s all being done with a view to returning to a self sustaining model.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 09:14:04 pm by ScottishGoon »

Offline RJH

  • doesn't know his alphabet
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,325
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7669 on: Yesterday at 09:45:59 pm »
Hope he got a trophy 🏆 for that


Bit of an odd reply considering your previous post gave the impression that you feel Arteta's defining achievement is "finished above a Klopp side".
(Something which Ten Hag and Eddie Howe also achieved last season).


In terms of actual trophies, Arteta of course does have an FA Cup - which Rodgers also has.

Offline JRed

  • After a 2L bottle of strongbow I’d do anything!
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,220
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7670 on: Yesterday at 10:04:01 pm »
Arteta on ssn saying his Arsenal team are the best ever in the PL. said he knows what it takes as he worked at Abu Dhabi and they are the best ever so he knows what level is required, and Arsenal are there. Just listening to him speak makes your skin crawl, he is a weird, creepy person. Just like his mentor.,

Offline ScottishGoon

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,914
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7671 on: Yesterday at 11:47:41 pm »
Arteta on ssn saying his Arsenal team are the best ever in the PL. said he knows what it takes as he worked at Abu Dhabi and they are the best ever so he knows what level is required, and Arsenal are there. Just listening to him speak makes your skin crawl, he is a weird, creepy person. Just like his mentor.,

Arteta said Arsenal are the best ever in the Premier League?

Offline thejbs

  • well-focussed, deffo not at all bias......ed
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,769
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7672 on: Yesterday at 11:53:12 pm »
Arteta said Arsenal are the best ever in the Premier League?

Not even the best Arsenal ever in the premier league.

Offline tonysleft

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,495
  • A manc
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7673 on: Today at 12:06:06 am »
Not even the best Arsenal ever in the premier league.
It blew my mind to find out the runner up Arsenal team of 1998-99 conceded a 2nd place all time PL record for goals conceded of 17, and I'm sure we all know who first was. They conceded more than once in one game the entire season. I only remember mid-late Wenger swashbuckling and winning but eventually not winning much Arsenal.
Great chiefs and great loves in obliterated light

Offline ScottishGoon

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,914
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7674 on: Today at 12:48:52 am »
Not even the best Arsenal ever in the premier league.

I might be wrong, but I seen quotes talking about competing against the best team in the Premier League, not that Arsenal were.

Offline BigBrainArteta

  • Main Stander
  • ***
  • Posts: 86
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7675 on: Today at 02:28:47 am »
Yeah, since Rodgers was advocating for the likes of Benteke, Dempsey and Ashley Williams, I'm not sure how much good another £100m+ would've done him!

But yes, Arteta's spending is something that doesn't come up much when he gets praise from the pundits/media - similar to his mentor in that respect. Having said that, it does reflect the different state of play for title-challenging teams now - if you're going to compete with a team of financial dopers, and you don't have the high transfer hit rate/best-in-class manager that we've had for the last few years, then you need to splash big money to bridge the gap.

My guess would be that if Arteta and Rodgers swapped roles for next season, neither would perform much better than the other currently is - Arteta would win the SPL, and Rodgers would challenge for the league but ultimately fall short.

There is no precedent in Rodgers football teams being good out of possession and of the ball. In 13-14 Liverpool conceded 50 league goals. Its a ridiculous number that is reserved for teams that finish mid table. By contrast our defence this season has been by design. We dont have a keeper bailing us out with amazing saves week to week. We have conceded the less amount of goals simply through tactical training. There have been multiple games were we have conceded no more than 2-3 efforts on goal. We have conceded the least shots in the league. Which is by virtue of how we are set up - by design to limit the number of efforts on our goal. David Raya will win the golden glove, and it will be a very passive golden glove - he hasn't done much to earn it. But

If we swapped Arteta for Rodgers, I would fully expect the floodgates to open and we conceded around 30-40% more goals that we would under Arteta. The idea these two coaches/managers are comparable is comical. If you cant see Arteta is miles ahead, you cant see the wood from the trees.  Do people actually watch football or do they just source wikipedia for a cherry pick a stat.

This is why I dont rate Ten Hag or De Zerbi. I watch Man United and Brighton and off the ball they are rubbish. They get played through, passed though, spaces in midfield everywhere, you can say the same about Ange mate at Tottingham. By contrast, Arsenal are the hardest team to score against, the hardest team to get an effort on goal against. We never used to be this team, Arteta has made us this way.

This is why those who think Arsenal should sack Arteta = numpties. You dont sack a 42 year old manager who is showing this much promise. You back him. And im thankful KSG (our FSG) are not irrational and overly emotional, and regardless of what happens this season, Arteta will get a contract extension.

Offline Wabaloolah

  • Rocks to the East, Rocks to the West. Definitely Unscotch.
  • Matchday Commentator
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 24,575
  • Allez Allez Allez
    • My Twitter Account
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7676 on: Today at 02:47:26 am »
Let's hope wolves take advantage of their European woes
unlikely they only have 10 fit outfield players and are going to play a 15 year old kid.

More Arsenal jamminess
However if something serious happens to them I will eat my own cock.


If anyone is going to put a few fingers deep into my arse it's going to be me.

Online Historical Fool

  • A fool in the present too. The ban on drivel from 666 has led to a remarkable increase in forum quality. Currently being spectacularly wooshed. Seemingly by, well, just about everything.....
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,460
  • FSG EOTM June ‘23
    • Fenway Sports Group
Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7677 on: Today at 03:42:49 am »
There is no precedent in Rodgers football teams being good out of possession and of the ball. In 13-14 Liverpool conceded 50 league goals. Its a ridiculous number that is reserved for teams that finish mid table. By contrast our defence this season has been by design. We dont have a keeper bailing us out with amazing saves week to week. We have conceded the less amount of goals simply through tactical training. There have been multiple games were we have conceded no more than 2-3 efforts on goal. We have conceded the least shots in the league. Which is by virtue of how we are set up - by design to limit the number of efforts on our goal. David Raya will win the golden glove, and it will be a very passive golden glove - he hasn't done much to earn it. But

If we swapped Arteta for Rodgers, I would fully expect the floodgates to open and we conceded around 30-40% more goals that we would under Arteta. The idea these two coaches/managers are comparable is comical. If you cant see Arteta is miles ahead, you cant see the wood from the trees.  Do people actually watch football or do they just source wikipedia for a cherry pick a stat.

This is why I dont rate Ten Hag or De Zerbi. I watch Man United and Brighton and off the ball they are rubbish. They get played through, passed though, spaces in midfield everywhere, you can say the same about Ange mate at Tottingham. By contrast, Arsenal are the hardest team to score against, the hardest team to get an effort on goal against. We never used to be this team, Arteta has made us this way.

This is why those who think Arsenal should sack Arteta = numpties. You dont sack a 42 year old manager who is showing this much promise. You back him. And im thankful KSG (our FSG) are not irrational and overly emotional, and regardless of what happens this season, Arteta will get a contract extension.

Of course there is precedent, which suits a manager whose entire footballing philosophy revolves around death by football, pressing, and fast transitions. You can’t cherry pick one season (especially one where both he annd the ownership were clearly finding their way in the league with a team that had heightened expectations) out of many in Swansea, Liverpool, Celtic and Leicester and say this will chart the course of every team he has ever managed. If given the space to implement his philosophy, his teams are built like you would want to build a team - brilliant, exciting, fresh, defend well, play good football and are especially threatening in counter attacks.
You're all too fucking serious, the lot of you. Relax, we don't really matter.

Oh, and we should have an in's and out's topic, stickied.