Author Topic: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC  (Read 164258 times)

Offline kesey

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1000 on: May 18, 2019, 06:29:14 PM »
I've already played 83439434 scenarios in my head about this match, I can't take another 15 days of this :D

Me too.

Ox or Robbo with the winner .
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Offline 12C

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1001 on: May 18, 2019, 06:30:50 PM »
Dunno if this has been posted but it made me chuckle

https://twitter.com/legofootball/status/1129733029658791940?s=21

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Offline SweetSilverSevens

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1002 on: May 18, 2019, 06:52:08 PM »
Hopefully that will be the case, but in football in one match, when there isn't a night and day difference in quality between the two sides on the pitch, anything can happen. We are the better side and I am confident in us against anyone, but at the same time there are no guaranties.

I am certain however that we will be angry and motivated beyond description after last year, hopefully that gets us through

Coaches and players don't think like this at all. They believe, or have to believe, they can control almost everything in the match, from defence to attack, to the momentum and flow of the match.

As the better team, if you perform at your absolute maximum mentally / physically / technically / tactically, then you will win the match. Spurs could do all of the above (far from guaranteed) but will still need to rely on us being a few percent off our best to get over the line. That's what we needed with Milan, and that's what Chelsea needed with Bayern. Not forgetting that both Milan and Bayern won the CL almost immediately after those CL final disappointments, and we're in the same situation after last year (where we were very unlucky).

We're not relying on Spurs being below their best, we just need to focus on ourselves. No doubt our experience in the PL and CL over the last two seasons will stand us in good stead.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2019, 06:53:49 PM by SweetSilverSevens »

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1003 on: May 18, 2019, 09:02:25 PM »
Coaches and players don't think like this at all. They believe, or have to believe, they can control almost everything in the match, from defence to attack, to the momentum and flow of the match.

As the better team, if you perform at your absolute maximum mentally / physically / technically / tactically, then you will win the match. Spurs could do all of the above (far from guaranteed) but will still need to rely on us being a few percent off our best to get over the line. That's what we needed with Milan, and that's what Chelsea needed with Bayern. Not forgetting that both Milan and Bayern won the CL almost immediately after those CL final disappointments, and we're in the same situation after last year (where we were very unlucky).

We're not relying on Spurs being below their best, we just need to focus on ourselves. No doubt our experience in the PL and CL over the last two seasons will stand us in good stead.

I am not disputing any of that so I am not sure why you're bringing it up. Being the better side on paper doenst guarantee an outcome on the pitch you have to go on the pitch and show that. Which if we do we.should.win.


Offline SweetSilverSevens

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1004 on: May 18, 2019, 09:22:05 PM »
I am not disputing any of that so I am not sure why you're bringing it up. Being the better side on paper doenst guarantee an outcome on the pitch you have to go on the pitch and show that. Which if we do we.should.win.

You were talking like the players and the manager have no control over anything. That everything is down to luck and fate, and nothing is in our hands.

Everything is in our hands.... if our players perform to their best, use their experience of the last two seasons and find solutions to problems during the course of the match (something they've been doing all season)... that's all in our control. We have all the resources we need and are far more equipped than our opponents. That's how you have to think, there's no other way. We certainly couldn't have beaten Barca if the players/manager thought like you are now. We knew we were better than Barca even after the first leg result, and we proved it. We even proved we can win big games without Mo Salah... that belief wasn't there in last year's final.

In 2007, Milan faced the same opponents who beat them in 2005 and a chance for redemption. In 2013, Bayern faced a domestic opponent who they could not under-estimate.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2019, 09:27:50 PM by SweetSilverSevens »

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1005 on: May 18, 2019, 09:38:36 PM »
Quote
You were talking like the players and the manager have no control over anything. That everything is down to luck and fate, and nothing is in our hands.

Nope never said a word to suggest anything of the sort. Didnt say that we cant control our performance  or productivity on the pitch. All I said was that anything can happen ala Istanbul which is a fact. I said we are the better side I said I trust these.players and have belief in them, but the performance needs to be there for us to be successful on the night. A little bit of luck doesnt hurt either, its a cup final.

The rest of your post like I said I am not disputing I already know all of that and have mentioned that in various instances.

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1006 on: May 18, 2019, 09:40:36 PM »
Quote
We even proved we can win big games without Mo Salah... that belief wasn't there in last year's final.

Lack of belief wasnt an issue. We equalized without Salah. Problem was lack of options on the bench but the main issue was our keeper gifting them 2 goals. You cant win like that

Offline SweetSilverSevens

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1007 on: May 18, 2019, 10:10:09 PM »
Nope never said a word to suggest anything of the sort. Didnt say that we cant control our performance  or productivity on the pitch. All I said was that anything can happen ala Istanbul which is a fact. I said we are the better side I said I trust these.players and have belief in them, but the performance needs to be there for us to be successful on the night. A little bit of luck doesnt hurt either, its a cup final.

The rest of your post like I said I am not disputing I already know all of that and have mentioned that in various instances.

The tone of your previous posts says it all. Just putting posters down by a quick "we're the better team but nothing is guaranteed". The manager/players will believe they can guarantee it. They will believe everything is dependent on how well they prepare for the game and how well they perform on the day.

Istanbul only happens when the opponent becomes complacent. Again, that's in our players' control. They've played way too many big games this season at such a high standard, I have so much belief in them.

I feel like some fans would prefer going into a cup final as underdogs the way they're so keen to remind us that luck could go Spurs' way. They would prefer being underdogs as that's what we're used to in recent decades, and even softens the blow of any potential disappointment. I'm sorry but if you want Liverpool to consistently win trophies, get to more CL finals and win the league title, you have to get used to the reds being boss and being favourites going into cup finals and title run ins.

Istanbul could happen, but then again some Watford fans thought they were destined to win the cup today after their cup run and amazing comeback in the FA Cup semi-final.

All the cup finals we lost recently? We were underdogs. It is harder to win when you're not as good as your opponents.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2019, 10:43:16 PM by SweetSilverSevens »

Offline SweetSilverSevens

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1008 on: May 18, 2019, 10:17:39 PM »
Lack of belief wasnt an issue. We equalized without Salah. Problem was lack of options on the bench but the main issue was our keeper gifting them 2 goals. You cant win like that

True, but don't want someone saying "what if Salah gets injured in the final like last time", we've overcome that hurdle... and we've got a better goalkeeper. We're also far more safety conscious when it comes to potential concussions.

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1009 on: May 18, 2019, 10:41:02 PM »
Quote
The tone of your previous posts says it all. Just putting posters down by a quick "we're the better team but nothing is guaranteed".

Look mate you're being tedious for sake of it. I am not arsed to type 5 paragraphs of text in every response, it's not about putting posters down, that's just pure nonsense on your part.

From a very straightforward sentence [we are a better team,I believe in the team, nothing is guaranteed] you've come to some complete absurd conclusions . I can' make it any more clearer to you I BELIEVE IN OUR SIDE IN OUR PLAYERS AND OUR MANAGER, I BELIEVE WE ARE A BETTER TEAM, BUT ITS A CUP FINAL, THE PERFORMANCE NEEDS TO MATCH THE QUALITY OF THE TEAM WE HAVE. Milan were the better side on paper in 2005, but it ment fuck all in the end. Our side in 2007 was better than the side we had in 2005, and Milan were a poorer version of themselves compared to 2005, but in the end in meant fuck all. Nine times out of ten, the better sides wins the match but you still need to go out and perform. That's all I've said.

I've mentioned how much angry and aggressive and motivated we'll be, I mentioned how we'll be eager to put things right. I can't be arsed repeating everything over and over again to satisfy you.


Quote
The manager/players will believe they can guarantee it. They will believe everything is dependent on how well they prepare for the game and how well they perform on the day.

Is English your first language mate? Where on earth did I say that they would be believing in themselves and in their ability?

Quote
Istanbul only happens when the opponent becomes complacent. Again, that's in our players' control. They've played way too many big games this season at such a high standard, I have so much belief in them.

I gave you an example of football being unpredictable. Not why it happened, I am not arsed to why it happened, and I didn't say I didn't have belief in our players, I've made that abundantly clear.

Quote
I'm sorry but if you want Liverpool to consistently win trophies, get to more CL finals and win the league title, you have to get used to the reds being boss and being favourites going into cup finals and title run ins.

I am not arsed who is the favourite in the match or isn't. You're preaching to the wrong choir. I believed in our lads last year against Madrid and felt that we were more impressive in the entirety of the CL than they were leading up to the final.

Quote
True, but don't want someone saying "what if Salah gets injured in the final like last time", we've overcome that hurdle... and we've got a better goalkeeper. We're also far more safety conscious when it comes to potential concussions.

You can't prevent what someone is going to say, you're on a forum



Offline Red Berry

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1010 on: May 18, 2019, 10:44:20 PM »
We are better than we were last year.  Spurs are not as good as Madrid - and nowhere near as dirty.

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Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1011 on: May 18, 2019, 10:49:15 PM »
We are better than we were last year.  Spurs are not as good as Madrid - and nowhere near as dirty.

They're still massive diving bellends, just as bad in that regard

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1012 on: May 18, 2019, 10:59:21 PM »
They're still massive diving bellends, just as bad in that regard

VAR
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Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1013 on: May 18, 2019, 11:09:01 PM »
VAR

You think they're going to be using VAR on every single action on the field? Not involving goals or penalties, but I hugely doubt that they'll be puling up VAR to see whether or not Alli dived for a free kick every single time.


Offline Peabee

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1014 on: May 18, 2019, 11:09:54 PM »
Is this argument going to continue until the final?!  ;D
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Offline Red Berry

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1015 on: May 18, 2019, 11:11:18 PM »
They're still massive diving bellends, just as bad in that regard

We'll have VAR, and it wont be a PL ref they're trying to con either.

If they were squaring off against Barca they probably wouldn't be under any pressure; nobody would really expect them to get a result.  But they're playing against us, and it's a Liverpool side who just beat Barca and is enjoying back to back European Cup Finals for the first time in over 30 years.  They'll feel that. ;D
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Offline SweetSilverSevens

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1016 on: May 18, 2019, 11:13:17 PM »
I BELIEVE IN OUR SIDE IN OUR PLAYERS AND OUR MANAGER, I BELIEVE WE ARE A BETTER TEAM

Play it on repeat! :scarf :scarf :scarf

Adding in a previous post I wrote:
The only reason Spurs might get some "luck" is if our players become complacent, and our players will not be complacent after what's happened in the league and what happened in Kiev.

Our luck in Istanbul stemmed from Milan's complacency and once we got it back level, we weren't letting them beat us. Spurs' luck in the semifinals came from Ajax's complacency. Once you get complacent it's hard to get your head back in the game again and your head's wrecked by the damage it's done.

Our players will be more driven and determined to do this than the Spurs' players and our quality and the standards we've reached this season will shine through. We will not be complacent.

We may have lost a few finals recently, but that's because we were underdogs. It's a lot harder to win finals if you're not as good as your opponents. Underdogs winning finals is a lot rarer than you think.

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1017 on: May 18, 2019, 11:17:40 PM »
Just win and we'll discuss the options later ;)

Offline Jm55

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1018 on: May 18, 2019, 11:41:27 PM »
Coaches and players don't think like this at all. They believe, or have to believe, they can control almost everything in the match, from defence to attack, to the momentum and flow of the match.

As the better team, if you perform at your absolute maximum mentally / physically / technically / tactically, then you will win the match. Spurs could do all of the above (far from guaranteed) but will still need to rely on us being a few percent off our best to get over the line. That's what we needed with Milan, and that's what Chelsea needed with Bayern. Not forgetting that both Milan and Bayern won the CL almost immediately after those CL final disappointments, and we're in the same situation after last year (where we were very unlucky).

We're not relying on Spurs being below their best, we just need to focus on ourselves. No doubt our experience in the PL and CL over the last two seasons will stand us in good stead.

I agree with this although it’s worth noting that Klopp usually subscribes to the idea that anything can happen in 90 minutes, publicly at least. I’ll always remember his pre-match press conference before the away leg against United when we were 2-0 up and he was asked what he thought would happen and he said ‘I don’t know.’ I’ve always thought that he was saying that publicly but privately felt that he knew what would happen, but to a certain extent you can only go off what people say rather than what you think they actually mean, especially in this context where few of us know Klopp personally.

It’s an interesting question and one which probably differs from coach to coach. I suppose if you set out with the intention of getting the kind of points total we got this season then you must believe you can control the majority of your destiny.

Offline Red_19

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1019 on: May 19, 2019, 12:39:08 AM »
The biggest game in a generation? Win and we’ve gone back 12 months and banished Kiev which would give us the belief/confidence to come back in 12 months and win the league. A generation defining game. An era defining game. Let’s do this reds let’s start a decade of dominance. YNWA
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Offline disgraced cake

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1020 on: May 19, 2019, 02:46:24 AM »
The biggest game in a generation? Win and we’ve gone back 12 months and banished Kiev which would give us the belief/confidence to come back in 12 months and win the league. A generation defining game. An era defining game. Let’s do this reds let’s start a decade of dominance. YNWA

Every European Cup final is a truly special occasion for this club and any club, but I think this is our biggest match in general since Istanbul. Most would probably disagree given we've come close to winning the league a few times since, and played another 3 European finals, but this one on a personal level feels like our biggest.

I feel like the outcome of a Liverpool match has never meant more in my lifetime, the difference between winning and losing. Win and I feel we can become possibly the dominant force in Europe and England for the next decade or so, or at least one of them. Lose it and I think it'll be an incredible blow not only for the players but the fans too, given Kiev and the title race.

I'm confident we can do the former of those and see our dreams come true again. The last thing we need at this moment in time is another 'nearly win.'
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Offline Red Berry

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1021 on: May 19, 2019, 10:05:19 AM »
Jürgen Klopp does not adapt to English Football.  English Football adapts to Jurgan Klopp.

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Offline free_at_last

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1022 on: May 19, 2019, 11:39:23 AM »
We'll have VAR, and it wont be a PL ref they're trying to con either.

If they were squaring off against Barca they probably wouldn't be under any pressure; nobody would really expect them to get a result.  But they're playing against us, and it's a Liverpool side who just beat Barca and is enjoying back to back European Cup Finals for the first time in over 30 years.  They'll feel that. ;D
How does VAR work for penalties? I understand that if Mane gets upended and the ref doesn't see it and play continues VAR would contact the ref to have a look but what if kane performs one of his dives and the ref gives the pen? Does VAR look at it and ask the ref to reconsider...then restart somehow from a dead ball?

Offline gamble

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1023 on: May 19, 2019, 01:31:07 PM »
Nearly two more weeks left to go? Bloody ridiculous.


Anyway, if you were Spurs and Pochettino, how would you try to win the game? If Kane is anywhere near recovered do you throw him in?


I would worry if it goes to pens. The longer spurs can drag it out the more frustrated we will be. Will they play 3 at the back which didn’t work or try something different with us?


Offline andyw79

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1024 on: May 19, 2019, 02:00:42 PM »
How does VAR work for penalties? I understand that if Mane gets upended and the ref doesn't see it and play continues VAR would contact the ref to have a look but what if kane performs one of his dives and the ref gives the pen? Does VAR look at it and ask the ref to reconsider...then restart somehow from a dead ball?
VAR would look at it, if a player has dived for penalty then decision would be overturned, yellow card to offending player with a free kick  awarded where the dive took place I would think.

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1025 on: May 19, 2019, 02:02:39 PM »
Nearly two more weeks left to go? Bloody ridiculous.


Anyway, if you were Spurs and Pochettino, how would you try to win the game? If Kane is anywhere near recovered do you throw him in?


I would worry if it goes to pens. The longer spurs can drag it out the more frustrated we will be. Will they play 3 at the back which didn’t work or try something different with us?

I disagree. We've shown patience numerous times when the match wasn't going our way and in the end find a solution without getting frustrated.

If it goes to penalties then its anyones game, hopefully it doesn't.

Offline SteveLFC

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1026 on: May 19, 2019, 02:41:03 PM »
Every European Cup final is a truly special occasion for this club and any club, but I think this is our biggest match in general since Istanbul. Most would probably disagree given we've come close to winning the league a few times since, and played another 3 European finals, but this one on a personal level feels like our biggest.

I feel like the outcome of a Liverpool match has never meant more in my lifetime, the difference between winning and losing. Win and I feel we can become possibly the dominant force in Europe and England for the next decade or so, or at least one of them. Lose it and I think it'll be an incredible blow not only for the players but the fans too, given Kiev and the title race.

I'm confident we can do the former of those and see our dreams come true again. The last thing we need at this moment in time is another 'nearly win.'

Total bollocks mate. Its a final, win and we celebrate like mad, lose and we feel down for a bit and then we go again..

Offline phil236849

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1027 on: May 19, 2019, 05:43:19 PM »
I initially thought this 12 subs rule could lead to a load of kid on the bench, but if firmino is fit, and assuming ox and Lallana also fit, it may be just Brewster making it.  Suspect Spurs won’t have the same depth

Offline deFacto

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1028 on: May 19, 2019, 05:53:11 PM »
Potential bench

-Mignolet
-Lovren
-Gomez
-Moreno
-Milner
-Ox
-Sturridge
-Origi
-Shaqiri
-Brewster
-Lallana
-??

Struggling to think of the 12th sub?

Offline Chris~

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1029 on: May 19, 2019, 06:01:10 PM »
Potential bench

-Mignolet
-Lovren
-Gomez
-Moreno
-Milner
-Ox
-Sturridge
-Origi
-Shaqiri
-Brewster
-Lallana
-??

Struggling to think of the 12th sub?
Woodburn

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1030 on: May 19, 2019, 06:13:49 PM »
Total bollocks mate. Its a final, win and we celebrate like mad, lose and we feel down for a bit and then we go again..

You are so right. I remember, walking down Wembley Way after losing to the Mancs in 1977. Half way down the sadness went and Rome beckoned. Same in Madrid, we will win but if we don't the anticipation of the glory our club can now achieve will still be there.

Offline phil236849

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1031 on: May 19, 2019, 07:03:47 PM »
Woodburn

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1032 on: May 19, 2019, 07:33:39 PM »
Potential bench

-Mignolet
-Lovren
-Gomez
-Moreno
-Milner
-Ox
-Sturridge
-Origi
-Shaqiri
-Brewster
-Lallana
-??

Struggling to think of the 12th sub?

Is Lallana fit?

Woodburn more than likely.

Offline DangerScouse

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1033 on: May 19, 2019, 07:58:48 PM »
Lack of belief wasnt an issue. We equalized without Salah. Problem was lack of options on the bench but the main issue was our keeper gifting them 2 goals. You cant win like that

There was an immediate shift in our approach when he went off. Not having that one bit that him going off didn't affect the mindset of the players. He'd scored 44 goals!!

Offline Jm55

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1034 on: May 19, 2019, 08:08:41 PM »
There was an immediate shift in our approach when he went off. Not having that one bit that him going off didn't affect the mindset of the players. He'd scored 44 goals!!

Indeed.

Not that I really apply any criticism for that. At the end of the day if you lose Mo Salah in a European Cup Final and replace him with someone who hasn’t played for months then it’s always going to be an uphill battle. We did well to equalise really.

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1035 on: May 19, 2019, 08:15:47 PM »
Potential bench
.........

Struggling to think of the 12th sub?

Jurgen......could get a winners medal?
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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1036 on: May 19, 2019, 08:24:17 PM »
Remember being gutted in the stands in Wembley '88 , numb in Athens '07, like shit after the '96 Fa cup final. It happens, even with the better side and even sometimes if we play better on the day. Hence why I hope the players are truly focused on the performance rather than the prize right now.  All i ask is they work their nuts off and play to their best ability as individuals and as s collective.  A tough game awaits us but as always we need to be canny & clinical.
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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1037 on: May 19, 2019, 09:06:37 PM »
No doubt there's massive pressure on us going into this but it's our 9th final and Spurs's first with it being arguably the biggest game in their history. I suspect they'll be feeling the pressure more when you also factor in this is our second consecutive final. It'll be interesting to see how they handle it.

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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1038 on: May 19, 2019, 09:07:39 PM »
Probably a silly question, but this just crossed my mind. What's the situation with contracts that expire at the end of the season, they usually start on June 1 with the pre-agreed signings. If a player's contract is such and it ends on May 31, are there additional clauses to make them available for the CL final? I don't recall if the CL has ever been in June any other year.
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Re: European Cup Final 1/6/19. LFC v THFC
« Reply #1039 on: May 19, 2019, 09:20:32 PM »
Probably a silly question, but this just crossed my mind. What's the situation with contracts that expire at the end of the season, they usually start on June 1 with the pre-agreed signings. If a player's contract is such and it ends on May 31, are there additional clauses to make them available for the CL final? I don't recall if the CL has ever been in June any other year.
Just checked transmarkt, Sturridge deal ends June 30th and would expect that with the rest of expiring contracts as July 1st is normally the first day you can register players irc.