Author Topic: The Labour Party (*)  (Read 184742 times)

Offline Banquo's Ghost

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5040 on: March 20, 2017, 11:38:57 AM »
If the alternative to Corbyn is nothing, then why should they expect people to vote for them then? This is what I don't understand.

I don't think the organisations you mention are asking anyone to vote for them. The Labour Party is the one offering itself to the electorate, and that is currently led by Jeremy Corbyn. It is his policies that the party will stand on.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5041 on: March 20, 2017, 11:43:24 AM »
No10 have continued to firmly say that there will be no early General Election

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5042 on: March 20, 2017, 11:46:45 AM »
How can they call a "snap" election?  I thought there was legislation in place?

They're the government so they can change the legislation. It's not a constitutional issue.
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Offline killer_heels

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5043 on: March 20, 2017, 12:12:43 PM »
I dont think there will be an election. But a Labour destruction is the best thing that can happen right now.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5044 on: March 20, 2017, 01:12:16 PM »
I hope there isn't a snap election.

The crushing defeat will be down to Corbyn/McDonnell not having enough time to implement their plans..

Give them more time will be the cry.....

Cry being the appropriate word...
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5045 on: March 20, 2017, 01:22:30 PM »
@britainelects
On who is better able to manage the economy:

May & Hammond: 44% (+1)
Corbyn & McDonnell: 11% (-1)

(via ICM)
Chgs. w/ pre-budget poll.


Shambles of a budget - Tories still improve.


@britainelects
Westminster voting intention:

CON: 45% (+1)
LAB: 26% (-2)
UKIP: 10% (-1)
LDEM: 9% (+1)
GRN: 4% (-1)

(via ICM / 17 - 19 Mar)


Just the 19 point gap now....
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5046 on: March 20, 2017, 01:23:58 PM »
Just 19% behind in today's poll... :(

(Beat me to it!)
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5047 on: March 20, 2017, 01:41:00 PM »
So is there a discussion to be had about not actually voting for Labour now?

I know the sheer thought of that brings people out to say that by association you are basically voting for the Tories. But by voting forLabour, are you not just helping the fringe just take complete control of the party?

Why should the party not just be left to die?

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5048 on: March 20, 2017, 01:42:06 PM »
What's the alternative is Labour is left to die?  A brand new party?
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Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5049 on: March 20, 2017, 01:43:25 PM »
So is there a discussion to be had about not actually voting for Labour now?

I know the sheer thought of that brings people out to say that by association you are basically voting for the Tories. But by voting forLabour, are you not just helping the fringe just take complete control of the party?

Why should the party not just be left to die?

I joined the party after Corbyn's whipping for the Brexit vote to try and get him out.  I'll be voting Lib Dem again, mainly because they are only party to have a chance against the Tories round here.

Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5050 on: March 20, 2017, 01:44:20 PM »
What's the alternative is Labour is left to die?  A brand new party?

A new progressive, centre-left party.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5051 on: March 20, 2017, 01:44:39 PM »
So is there a discussion to be had about not actually voting for Labour now?

I know the sheer thought of that brings people out to say that by association you are basically voting for the Tories. But by voting forLabour, are you not just helping the fringe just take complete control of the party?

Why should the party not just be left to die?

As ever you need to vote tactically. If you were in a Lib Dem / Labour marginal you may have the luxury of switching.

If you live in a safe Tory or Labour seat you could cound switch.

For everyone else the cost is probably too high.

Offline killer_heels

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5052 on: March 20, 2017, 01:46:52 PM »
What's the alternative is Labour is left to die?  A brand new party?

Maybe not. But is voting for the party even productive anymore? All that ends up happening is that we prop up a party that has no interest in representing the centre ground.

I understand people will still always vote Labour. I have always voted Labour. I cannot bring myself to vote for this lot though.

Offline Sangria

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5053 on: March 20, 2017, 01:47:10 PM »
What's the alternative is Labour is left to die?  A brand new party?

I'll vote for the most likely Europhilic party. If the centrists can bring themselves to form a new party, I'll vote for them. Having voted Labour all my life, I won't be voting for them again while the current lot, and that's not just Corbyn but also his backers, are in power.
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Offline killer_heels

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5054 on: March 20, 2017, 01:50:35 PM »
As ever you need to vote tactically. If you were in a Lib Dem / Labour marginal you may have the luxury of switching.

If you live in a safe Tory or Labour seat you could cound switch.

For everyone else the cost is probably too high.

Yes I live in a strong Tory seat. Lib Dems have been in charge once and close a few times but generally Tory.

Offline ShakaHislop

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5055 on: March 20, 2017, 01:54:54 PM »
Another leadership challenge is essential before Labour diehards should even consider jumping ship. Even if that challenge is lost, the margin of defeat will be a valuable piece of info. A significantly smaller majority for Corbyn should be taken as encouragement to keep chipping away at him and his supporters' enthusiasm.

I'd be fine with nominating every single member of the PLP for a leadership challenge in succession. Surely Corbyn would get tired of that, and once the Messiah is gone, in-fighting amongst his supporters may begin.

Offline Banquo's Ghost

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5056 on: March 20, 2017, 02:42:51 PM »
So is there a discussion to be had about not actually voting for Labour now?

I know the sheer thought of that brings people out to say that by association you are basically voting for the Tories. But by voting forLabour, are you not just helping the fringe just take complete control of the party?

Why should the party not just be left to die?

It's not an easy decision for many people.

In my case, assuming there is an election this year, I will vote for my current MP, for whom I have the highest respect as a man and as a MP. I worked hard to get him elected back in 1997 against the vile, homophobic cretin that the Tories put up for a previously one-nation conservative marginal and have been proud to be associated with him and his work ever since. Unfortunately, he is high on the deselection hitlist of the Corbynites.

If he is deselected, for the first time in my adult life, I will not vote Labour. If he stands, I will be voting for the man (which incidentally might help stop the Tories retaking the seat as well) not the party, in the hope Ben will be at the forefront of a new rebirth of our party.

However, all this will be moot if the election is in 2020, as I will be long gone from this country, and I do not believe in expatriate voting (i.e. I have no appropriate stake in the country if I live and pay tax elsewhere. Even if the election were called this May, I would be in two minds casting my vote for this reason).

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5057 on: March 20, 2017, 03:15:21 PM »
I do not believe in expatriate voting (i.e. I have no appropriate stake in the country if I live and pay tax elsewhere. Even if the election were called this May, I would be in two minds casting my vote for this reason).

Shame all the Costa del Sol bellends I saw talking about us being 'overrun' didn't stay out of the Brexit vote on similar principles...

Offline oldfordie

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5058 on: March 20, 2017, 03:27:00 PM »
It depends on what your priority's are. my priority is the best interests of the countrys future. not in the patriotic sense, just full employment and a strong economy. you can forget any improvements if you dont have this. everything depends on money. Corbyn can make any promises he wants but if he supports Brexit then he is fooling himself as he wont be able to deliver the promises hes making without money. supporting Brexit and promising full employment, yeah sure.
A year ago I would have thought it would be impossible for me to vote Lib Dems. seems I have no alternative as the Brexit issue to me is more important than Labour being in power for another 5 yrs.
Hoping for a split government, political chaos resulting in a U turn on Brexit, a new Labour leader supporting this U turn.
Another GE in late 2020. Labour back into power.
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Offline zebenzui

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5059 on: March 20, 2017, 04:16:06 PM »
Shame all the Costa del Sol bellends I saw talking about us being 'overrun' didn't stay out of the Brexit vote on similar principles...

Since you brought it up...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2017/mar/16/british-expats-in-spain-count-the-costa-brexit-video

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5060 on: March 20, 2017, 04:37:43 PM »
I remember how Geoff was castigated on here for having the temerity to vote for the Greens once. He was disillusioned by the party's leadership and registered a protest vote in a safe constituency, at no cost to the party whatsoever. An unforgivable act of treason, according to some.

Now, not even a decade later, others (including some who castigated Geoff for doing the above) are disillusioned by the party's leadership. Only, unlike Geoff, they're not registering a protest vote in safe constituencies, but are actively advocating voting for other parties in the hope that Labour lose. And this, apparently, is considered very much understandable and acceptable.

When we had Hodgson as manager, we all knew he was crap, and we wanted him out. But we didn't go to Old Trafford hoping we get hammered. Nor did we start supporting Everton. Criticise Corbyn all you like, work on removing him from within if you want, but don't think you can save either Labour or the country by voting for the Lib Dems.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5061 on: March 20, 2017, 04:49:34 PM »
I remember how Geoff was castigated on here for having the temerity to vote for the Greens once. He was disillusioned by the party's leadership and registered a protest vote in a safe constituency, at no cost to the party whatsoever. An unforgivable act of treason, according to some.

Now, not even a decade later, others (including some who castigated Geoff for doing the above) are disillusioned by the party's leadership. Only, unlike Geoff, they're not registering a protest vote in safe constituencies, but are actively advocating voting for other parties in the hope that Labour lose. And this, apparently, is considered very much understandable and acceptable.

When we had Hodgson as manager, we all knew he was crap, and we wanted him out. But we didn't go to Old Trafford hoping we get hammered. Nor did we start supporting Everton. Criticise Corbyn all you like, work on removing him from within if you want, but don't think you can save either Labour or the country by voting for the Lib Dems.

Why are you so upset? Your side has won, irrevocably. Your side will be in control of the Labour party now, in the future, and for ever more. Corbyn and Momentum are the Labour party, and will be so for the future too. Blairites, or whatever you call Blairites, will never control the Labour party again.
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5062 on: March 20, 2017, 04:53:33 PM »
I remember how Geoff was castigated on here for having the temerity to vote for the Greens once. He was disillusioned by the party's leadership and registered a protest vote in a safe constituency, at no cost to the party whatsoever. An unforgivable act of treason, according to some.
Nah. He voted Green in the 2015 election as a protest against Tony Blair. He then had the audacity to lecture posters on not showing loyalty to Jeremy Corbyn.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5063 on: March 20, 2017, 04:59:04 PM »
Why are you so upset? Your side has won, irrevocably. Your side will be in control of the Labour party now, in the future, and for ever more. Corbyn and Momentum are the Labour party, and will be so for the future too. Blairites, or whatever you call Blairites, will never control the Labour party again.

Yawn. Quote me. I've been posting on about ten Labour topics since the 2015 GE, and I'm pretty sure I never endorsed Corbyn in any way. Other than by saying some of you deserve no better.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5064 on: March 20, 2017, 05:45:22 PM »
Will be interesting to see how this develops. article a bit long to post in full.

Labour campaigners have hatched a plan to PROVE how Jeremy Corbyn is to blame for dire poll ratings

Stoke and Copeland were regularly warned the leader’s lack of popularity was a problem.
The party saw off the UKIP threat in the Potteries but surrendered the Cumbrian constituency to the Tories in a triumph for Theresa May.
Moderate MPs and supporters were furious when Mr Corbyn’s allies blamed the weather, poor local transport and even Tony Blair for the disastrous Copeland defeat.
They accused the leader and his top team of refusing to take any responsibility for the loss.
Now, they want to amend official Labour canvassing forms so doorstep views about Mr Corbyn are fed back to party HQ.
They accused the leader and his top team of refusing to take any responsibility for the loss.
Now, they want to amend official Labour canvassing forms so doorstep views about Mr Corbyn are fed back to party H
If anyone doubts the reasons people are not choosing Labour then all our supporters and activists should be empowered to record what voters tell us on their doorsteps.
“We have the means of doing this on our canvass sheets and it would provide proof that it isn’t the lack of a car or bad weather that is deterring support.
"Some surrounding the leader are in denial about the challenge he poses directly.
“If they have guts they’ll accept the change to canvass forms and allow accurate data to be recorded.”
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/labour-campaigners-hatched-plan-party-10033965#ICID=sharebar_twitter
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5065 on: March 20, 2017, 05:45:50 PM »
Yawn. Quote me. I've been posting on about ten Labour topics since the 2015 GE, and I'm pretty sure I never endorsed Corbyn in any way. Other than by saying some of you deserve no better.

Not your style to endorse anyone. You have however consistently sniped at anyone who has posted anything negative about Corbyn, so it is probably a reasonable assumption as where you sit in that debate.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5066 on: March 20, 2017, 06:15:29 PM »
Not your style to endorse anyone. You have however consistently sniped at anyone who has posted anything negative about Corbyn, so it is probably a reasonable assumption as where you sit in that debate.

Anything negative? Like this, you mean:

I say he failed on all counts, and pretty much all of it is down to him.

Or this, from August 2015:

"We all know that Corbyn won't stand any chance of winning the next general election, even without the foreign policy issues. The hope and the optimism will evaporate much sooner than that anyway."

Or this glowing endorsement, from September that same year:

"It's almost as if he's been planted by someone on the right (of the party or the country) precisely in order to discredit those perfectly decent views so many decent people share."

(Can't quote since the topics have been locked.)

I've objected to double standards, but certainly not to all criticism. I've objected to people pretending Corbyn is the only problem, as if everything was hunky-dory before him. I've objected to good decent Labour party members being labelled entryists or trots, when you'd struggle to find half a million trots on the entire continent, never mind the UK Labour party.

But I've also objected to Corbyn supporters having a go at another perfectly decent Labour party member, Sadiq Khan, when he expressed his preference last year's leadership election:

"If everyone shared Khan's views, things would look a lot better for the Labour party."

And since we're talking explicit endorsement, you can easily find me agreeing with Khan's choice in that election:

"There's very little in his article that I disagree with, including his choice."

(Again, can't quote as the thread is locked.)

I think I've been consistent with my views throughout, and I haven't shied away from stating them, whatever you may think of my style (I didn't know I had a reputation around here :)). I think the worst you can throw at me is that I've been objective, and now is not the time for objectivity.

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5067 on: March 20, 2017, 06:37:21 PM »
So is there a discussion to be had about not actually voting for Labour now?

I know the sheer thought of that brings people out to say that by association you are basically voting for the Tories. But by voting forLabour, are you not just helping the fringe just take complete control of the party?

Why should the party not just be left to die?

 This has been my thinking for a long time. It's extremely upsetting but it's for the best that Labour is wiped out and something new is able to replace it. Personally I wish socially liberal, pro-Europe, pro-business politicians had formed their own new party after the Brexit vote - David Miliband, Nick Clegg, Ken Clarke etc. There were enough big beasts who were more or less totally aligned on the big issues to really challenge this whole shambolic process and possibly replace Labour as the sensible voice in British politics. Alas not.
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5068 on: March 20, 2017, 06:56:32 PM »
So is there a discussion to be had about not actually voting for Labour now?

I know the sheer thought of that brings people out to say that by association you are basically voting for the Tories. But by voting forLabour, are you not just helping the fringe just take complete control of the party?
Would it not depend on the Labour candidate that's put up for election?


I'll admit to having been more promiscuous than many on here, with the only consistency shown being that I voted for the candidate most likely to challenge the Tories. I grew up in an area where Labour were nowhere, so I voted for the Liberals under David Steele. Lost every time. Now I have a Tory Cabinet minister for an MP with Labour as the only realistic challenger. There's obviously been a surge in Corbynites to my local CLP, but even if they get "their" candidate to stand I can't see myself voting anything but Labour unless something drastic happens in the political landscape.

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« Reply #5069 on: March 20, 2017, 08:20:45 PM »
I remember how Geoff was castigated on here for having the temerity to vote for the Greens once. He was disillusioned by the party's leadership and registered a protest vote in a safe constituency, at no cost to the party whatsoever. An unforgivable act of treason, according to some.

Now, not even a decade later, others (including some who castigated Geoff for doing the above) are disillusioned by the party's leadership. Only, unlike Geoff, they're not registering a protest vote in safe constituencies, but are actively advocating voting for other parties in the hope that Labour lose. And this, apparently, is considered very much understandable and acceptable.

When we had Hodgson as manager, we all knew he was crap, and we wanted him out. But we didn't go to Old Trafford hoping we get hammered. Nor did we start supporting Everton. Criticise Corbyn all you like, work on removing him from within if you want, but don't think you can save either Labour or the country by voting for the Lib Dems.

It's a completely different situation.

2010

In 2010 Labour needed every vote it could get. It was a centre-left party and had spent the previous 13 years in power enacting legislation that benefitted the poor and vulnerable. However the country seemed tired of Labour after three terms in Government and Labour suffered from being in power during the global crash. A lot of people believed that 'they're all the same anyway' and it made no difference whether you voted Labour or Tory. FPTP means that different proportions of votes are not reflected in the numbers of seats. Voting Lib Dem or Green (or Tory to give Labour 'a bloody nose') in 2010 could split the non-Tory vote and allow them in.

Seats before           210         349           62
Seats won              306         258           57
Seat change            +97         -91           -5
Popular vote    10,703,654   8,606,517    6,836,248
Percentage           36.1%        29.0%        23.0%


The result was a hung parliament. There was a possibility that Labour and the Lib Dems could have formed a coalition but in the end, Nick Clegg decided to go with the bigger party and aligned his 57 seats (almost 7m votes and 23%) to the Tories. Anyone who could have voted Labour but either abstained or voted for another party was complicit in the Tories gaining power.

Following the election Brown resigned and there was a leadership election. David Milliband was the winner in the first round but the unions preferred the more left-wing Milliband and the union votes carried the day. It's worth noting that John McDonnell was eliminated before the voting started and Diane Abbott was eliminated in the first round.

2014

The Scottish referendum was held in 2014 and although there was a 'No' vote it politicised Scotland and the SNP became the most popular party in the opinion polls with headlines such as "Could the SNP take 25 seats from Labour?" http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/10/could-snp-win-25-labour-seats-2015.

There is no way of knowing whether the SNP would have become that popular without the referendum.

Also in 2014, the Labour leadership decided to change it's leadership election from an electoral college (one third MPs, one third unions and one third members) to a rigid OMOV system and allowed registered 'supporters' to sign up and vote for £3. This radically reduced the input of Labour MPs.

2015

In 2015 Labour went into the election with the unions' and the left's choice as leader (for the far left's candidates see above). The polls showed that Labour was ahead and a close election was expected.

The consequences of the Scottish referendum (SNP gained 50 seats from Labour and Lib Dems) and the backlash against the Lib Dems (lost 49 seats) meant that despite increasing Labour's popular vote they lost 26 seats and the Tories gained 24 seats to become the government with a slim majority.

Last election           306 seats      258 seats
Seats won               330*           232
Seat change     Increase 24    Decrease 26
Popular vote     11,334,576      9,347,304
Percentage             36.9%          30.4%
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Even more so than in 2010, the Labour Party was the only credible party of government going into the election and every vote counted.

After the election Milliband resigned, some MPs backed Corbyn to 'push the debate' and the new electoral system resulted in his election. Corbyn was backed by Unite and a new organisation that's now called Momentum.

In the time since Corbyn's election the Labour Party has become a laughing stock. Corbyn's performance has reached ever greater depths of incompetence with the nadir being his abject performance in the EU referendum campaign.

In his time as leader the party's popularity has been in steady decline:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election#2015

And his personal unpopularity is off the scale.

But the 2014 rule change means that as long as his support holds up in the membership he is untouchable. And Corbyn and his backers in Unite and Momentum have a different agenda to any previous Labour Party leadership.

2017

And that is where we are now. In the last two general elections I've tried to persuade any doubters that voting Labour was the only way to defeat the Tories. That Labour and the Tories weren't 'just the same'. That Labour being in government improves the situation of the most vulnerable and increases social justice.

That doesn't apply anymore. Under Corbyn there is no chance of a Labour government short of a total collapse by the Tories. Corbyn and Momentum represent an existential threat to the Labour Party and I can understand why some people feel that only the shock to the system of a catastrophic election defeat will shake some vestige of reality into the minds of the members who follow him unquestioningly. Those people aren't thinking of doing it because of Corbyn. They're considering it because they believe in the Labour Party and believe that the future electability and continued existence of the Party as a real political force trumps any traditional voting loyalties.

I'm not there yet. Quite frankly I'm not sure where I am - I have voted Labour all my life, and voting against the Party doesn't sit right. And anyway I think it's entirely possible that anyone still supporting Corbyn now will see a general election defeat as proof of some conspiracy bollocks or other. It will be the press, the PLP, the Red Tories, Tony Blair (of course) and the answer will be to double down and move farther away from electability.

It's a fucking shit show.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 08:24:59 PM by Alan_X »
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« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 08:36:06 PM by Mag Hull »
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5071 on: March 20, 2017, 08:51:20 PM »
It gets worse......

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/20/momentum-no-secret-plot-want-fair-say-labour-party

Jesus wept.

They are like Trump fans. The lot of them. The obsession they have with one 'leader' is incredible.

Maybe they all sit round a table and are poisoned with cakes spiked with some mind altering drug, in place of the sugar that Corbyn doesnt believe in.


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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5072 on: March 20, 2017, 09:29:26 PM »
As I said before, setting up a new political party from the ground up is no easy task.  You're asking grassroots members who have slaved and canvassed their whole lives voluntarily for the cause to abandon the party to the hard left and take a major step into the unknown.  Without these people a new party will be choked off at birth.

You're asking unions to pick a side - hard left, soft left or centre left - and switch funding.  How will their own members react?  Union bosses are elected too.

You're asking people who would vote for a chicken if you stuck a red rosette on it to vote for a party that likely wont have the word "Labour" in it.

This party will have to appeal to progressives and knuckle draggers alike.

Corbyn and his cabal may well have permanently marginalised left wing politics in a UK that will be out of Europe and left fending for scraps in Mike Pence's colon.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2017, 09:31:06 PM by Red Beret »
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5073 on: March 20, 2017, 09:32:01 PM »
Oh dear...


All out war broke out at tonight's PLP meeting

http://news.sky.com/story/labour-plp-meeting-erupts-in-fury-with-shouting-at-corbyn-10809203

Kinnock saying things are worse than in '85 :(
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5074 on: March 20, 2017, 09:35:52 PM »
Oh dear...


All out war broke out at tonight's PLP meeting

http://news.sky.com/story/labour-plp-meeting-erupts-in-fury-with-shouting-at-corbyn-10809203

Kinnock saying things are worse than in '85 :(

Good. Now is a rare opportunity to fuck Corbyn and c*nts like Milne off, I hope it is seized

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5075 on: March 20, 2017, 09:37:16 PM »
Oh dear...


All out war broke out at tonight's PLP meeting

http://news.sky.com/story/labour-plp-meeting-erupts-in-fury-with-shouting-at-corbyn-10809203

Kinnock saying things are worse than in '85 :(

What if Tom Watson resigned?  Not saying he will, as he is clearly fighting hard to keep the party together, but would there be any ramifications?  I find it hard to believe Corbyn would even bat an eyelid. 
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5076 on: March 20, 2017, 09:38:01 PM »
What if Tom Watson resigned?  Not saying he will, as he is clearly fighting hard to keep the party together, but would there be any ramifications?  I find it hard to believe Corbyn would even bat an eyelid. 
There would be an election for shadow leader...

What difference would it make?
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5077 on: March 20, 2017, 09:39:10 PM »
What if Tom Watson resigned?  Not saying he will, as he is clearly fighting hard to keep the party together, but would there be any ramifications?  I find it hard to believe Corbyn would even bat an eyelid. 

He won't do that. He's elected, and it would make it easier for Corbyn's cronies. Better to be forced out and let them get the blood on their hands rather than affirm the Trump-esque conspiracy bullshit their supporters espouse

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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5078 on: March 20, 2017, 09:44:22 PM »
Quote
And former Deputy Prime Minister John Prescott was forced to deny claims he told the party leader: “You're not a leader and you never will be while you have a hole in your a***.”

Deny claims.. snigger.... as if
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Re: The Labour Party (*)
« Reply #5079 on: March 20, 2017, 09:48:18 PM »
Is Seamus Milne taking the Steve Bannon role in terms of tearing down the Labour Party from the inside?
Fo the life of me I can't see what the endgame is that Corbyn/McCluskey/Momentum are driving towards. As any fule kno the main issues we have to counter are natural constituents being seduced by the Kippers, and floating voters not having any sort of clue what the Party stands for.
God alone knows how any of this would be resolved by driving Labour to the hard left - they're not living in an echo chamber but a vacuum.

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