Author Topic: Survivors: Talk about it, share it, we'll try to help  (Read 137117 times)

Offline Glorious Future

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #120 on: December 9, 2007, 11:15:31 AM »
Hello folks,

Was just 'passing', wanted to say hello to those I know and those I don't who come into this 'area' of RAWK.

Haven't been here for ages, but needs saying that peoples' efforts in all the small and large battles we have, seemingly at every turn, still, establishing the real truth with those who lie and those who know no better, are heroic and are exceptional.

Whenever I think I might be fighting a battle on my own with the small lies and the sometimes overwhelming spreading of big lies by those, for now, in the priviledged position of being in the media, I only have to have a look here at some of the fantastic efforts made by many people and it all seems less daunting and less overwhelming.

Just thanks to people who try so hard in a seemingly very shallow and ignorant world. You're stars, a people apart.

And sorry for the quotes, but you know, others can say it so much better anyway. Keep the faith.

“A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.”

“The truth, of course, is that a billion falsehoods told a billion times by a billion people are still false.”

"Never apologize for showing feeling. When you do so, you apologize for the truth."

"We know the truth, not only by the reason, but also by the heart."

 :wave
Faith is a passionate intuition.

http://www.contrast.org/hillsborough/

Offline Shanks1965

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #121 on: January 8, 2008, 11:01:52 PM »
I don't feel as though I have a right to post here. Its been 18 years and as every year goes by the feelings get that little bit worse. My feelings are those of guilt.... no not of guilt, thats stupid. They are feelings of being so very lucky that it wasnt me.

My tickets were for the stand above the Leppings Lane. That was unusual because I stood on Saturdays on the Kop and didnt do seats. Had my tickets been for the terrace I'd have been in there early and behind that goal and well.. who knows. My feelings are those of having been lucky while others weren't and as each year goes by I feel worse. I can talk about it, I get emotional, that actually helps. I can get emotional anytime and anywhere. I once had an interview with a head hunter and he asked me what was the worst thing that had ever happened to me? I think he was more embarrassed than me as this suited professional bloke started to fill up, unable to talk properly. I bet he never asked anyone that question again.

I sat there on that day in the stands and watched it all unfold. I witnessed the dead and the dying and the attempts of mates trying to save mates and strangers trying to help strangers. I saw heroism but I was spared the worst of it. I wasnt on that pitch so I shouldnt really talk about it here among those that were. So I just want to say that my thoughts are with you, the survivors, the sometimes forgotten sufferers. I've taken to wearing a HJC scarf and handing out the yellow stickers in the pub. I don't really know why, I just know it makes me feel a bit better.

I hope this post does not cause any of you that have really suffered and continue to do so any offense. My story isn't worth telling but I saw the thread and well...

God bless you all... God bless the 96.
« Last Edit: January 9, 2008, 07:59:29 PM by Shanks1965 »
Seen more titles than he can remember...

Offline cowtownred

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #122 on: January 8, 2008, 11:14:24 PM »
Well in Shanks...

You're with friends.

We all suffered to a bigger or lesser extent. We all have feelings.

I too have been guilty many times... but genuinely sad over the years.  I couldn't get time off work (a new job), and passed my ticket on.  It was sold, I believe, to one not as lucky as me.

Its fate, I should've been there too.

But, get it out to people who know where you are mate.

YNWA.

Offline the invisible man

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #123 on: January 9, 2008, 01:59:34 AM »
Shanks1965...

mate, don't ever apologise for being there...

please, please talk about how you feel with other on here... there is no right or wrong way to feel, and it doesn't have to make sense...

the guilt has been a major factor of this whole thing never getting the national coverage and attention it deserves...

If it had been Arsenal or Chelsea or any other 'important' club, it would have rated much higher 'legal attention'...

but it's just those whinging scousers, is the attitude of those who seek to run away from what is possibly the most embarrassing cover-up & tragedy of the times...

follow your heart Shanks1965, we are all here together, no shame, just anger & guilt that those who were in charge that day were "INCOMPETENT" and will never admit it...

Lemmo...
t.i.m...

Offline binge

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #124 on: January 13, 2008, 04:46:32 AM »
I don't know were to start .I'm new on rawk but av been reading the hillbrough section the last 2 days and although I'm not a surviver i thought i would post this after reading all your posts. the reason i don't know.

 I was there that fateful day but luckily I was in the north stand i was only 13 and with my arlfella and like some who have bravely posted their accounts i am similar i have not spoken about it much maybe when the subject comes up with my mates who weren't there or my bird who knows i was there they turn round an say

"binge you were weren't you"
and i say "ye"

 And thats it. even my dad who seen everything i seen we never talk about it. but we don't and didn't at the time see much of each other because he and my mum were/are divorced and when i see him its not uppermost in my mind but after reading this thread i might talk to him more and see if he really wants to talk about it .there is one or maybe a couple of times i would say

" Remember at hillsbrough we had tickets to the north stand and when we were making are way to the ground some guy was after swaps. He had leppings lane tickets and was willing to swap are 2 plus £20 and I thought ye deffo thats were I wanted to be". although i was so young i loved the atmosphere and although my dad didn't go the match as much as me  because he worked away a lot/got bored i know he loved it too.

"You thought about swapping didn't ye dad"

Arlfella."Ye i did son"

Me"why didn't you dad"

Alfella "dontknow lad" 

me  ".Good job a dad

Dad"Ye"

An thats really all I've come to speak about it. Thinking about i don't know why that is but what i do know i was no surviver just a witness watching it happen, the early signs going in to the NORTH STAND,

WHAT! my feet was not touching the floor for a few seconds my head was locked between some peoples shoulders,getting in with a full ticket because the turnstile was ch ch ch ch to relieve the pressure an that was the NORTH STAND about 2.40. Even before the game was under way I'm sure i remember looking at our end and seeing the first couple off supporters spilling over the barrier/fence/ cage and thinking whats going on there and when the game was in progress i could not stop looking at the people who had come over the fence.Even then I'm sure some of them did not know what was going on because they were watching the match.Then ofcorse we know what was happining now but it seemed /seems so unreal.Being in the north stand no one knew what was going on but i remember seeing the heroes with the advertising boards
I remember some unruly chants from the forrest end.
I remember fighting going on amongst are own in the stands.
I remember waiting for an announcement as if we were waiting for the match to restart.
I remember hearing these people on stretchers/advertising boards were dead.
WHAT."Ye mate 2 people are dead" .
How could that be there was no violence i thought.
I remember seeing an ambulance it must be true.
I remember grownups, fellas crying,
WHATS GOING ON i was thinking
I remember getting out the ground  making are way the pick up point to take us to the train station
" Alright bill whats been going on there ive heard there are afew dead " me arlfella says to someone he know
"A FEW at leased 20 mate"
WHAT WHAT WHAT.........and that was the way it  was
I remember ques for the phone boxes .
I remember loads of people on the train who didnt know were their mates where or were they themselves where . total shock .
I remember seeing a few papers floating round the train 50 feared dead, WHAT NO THATS BS.
I remember the silence.
I remember geting off that train in lime street   an the reporters waiting. BIG MISTAKE as some lads had seen ther mates die .what did they expect shoving mikes an cameres in peoples faces.
I remember coming home about 10 oclock, me mum give me an me alfella a good slap "WHY DIDNT YOU PHONE HOME TO SAY YOU WERE ALL RIGHT"................she did not know we were in the north stand what mum would.
Thinking about it now i dont know why me dad did not phone when we got to lime street.Guess he was in shock...
An thats my story as i said before no a surviver but a witness an like most witnesses in liverpool they dont wanna talk about it.....
Its 4.30 in the morning i finished typeing this about 12 and did not know weather to post it well here it is
« Last Edit: February 2, 2008, 12:39:25 AM by binge »

Offline the invisible man

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #125 on: January 13, 2008, 11:48:48 AM »
cheers binge mate...

you are a survivor & a hero mate, we all stood together as one in the grief and tragedy that unfolded that day, if you'd have been in Leppings Lane binge, you would have done exactly what those invisible hero's did...

incompetent cops...!!!

You betcha...

thanks again for posting binge...

Lemmo... :-X
t.i.m...

Offline cowtownred

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #126 on: January 13, 2008, 02:19:42 PM »
 :wave

Thanks for sharing your story binge.

Offline Arthurs Bar

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #127 on: April 11, 2008, 09:25:05 PM »
Doesn't seem like a year since I posted on this and it doesn't seem like 19 years since that terrible day. The memories are clear and the feelings of guilt refuse to subside.  I will be thinking of you all on the anniversary, especially my mate who died so close to me.

You'll never walk alone

Offline 24/7

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #128 on: April 11, 2008, 09:34:37 PM »
Flippin 'eck. 19 years.

Arthurs Bar - I have no idea how it would have felt for you back then - personally speaking though, wherever I am in the world, whatever I am doing, I make time for myself to reflect on that day. My thoughts will be with you, with all the survivors, with the victims, with all your friends and families, with fellow supporters and other decent people who are horrified at what happened before, during and after that day.

And this year I will especially think about all those people who felt they couldn't talk about it for so many years. This year I persuaded my mother (who is a qualified therapist, is senior in her field both practically and academically and is taking training now in a technique especially engineered to assist people with PTSD-type problems) to use her experience and offer sessions to people who are ready to talk, or might still be suffering.

Looks like this, a thread ostensibly for survivors, might be the place to start letting you know about that. If there's anyone in Liverpool or nearby who wants to know more, please PM me.

For the 96 and for everyone affected that day. Walk on...!
"Love does not claim possession, but gives freedom." - Rabindranath Tagore.

Offline Glorious Future

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #129 on: April 13, 2008, 09:34:56 PM »
Another kind person you are, 24/7.  Its worth saying when people start doing down the human race I only have to think of the people Ive met, heard from and read of on here.

On behalf of anyone who thinks their lives could be helped by the help of others in this way, thank you 24/7.

YNWA
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http://www.contrast.org/hillsborough/

Offline todda

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #130 on: April 14, 2008, 10:43:50 AM »
I'm not a survivor or a witness as I wasn't there.  Only due to good fortune though, not that I thought that at the time.  Only afterwards I realised how 'lucky' I was not have got a ticket, as my ST didn't end in the right No.

It doesn't stop me from thinking about Hillsborough every year though and even at other times during the year the subject comes up.

Thinking of all the families and survivors/witnesses(survivors - if you witnessed it you're a survivor) at this time of the year.  I can't make the service this year as I have work commitments but, I'll be making a big effort to get there next year.

Continue the fight for justice.  We need it for everyone, not so we can draw a line under it and move on as we can never forget what happened that day, but for the plain fact that people (who we all know of) are and should be accountable for their actions/non-actions that day.

I will be thinking of everyone at 3:06pm tomorrow.

YNWA
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Offline manchater

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #131 on: April 14, 2008, 11:32:30 AM »
well done for posting binge, I know it takes real courage to do it.

YNWA
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When I go to the supermarket or newsagents I cover that rag up with other papers and  I encourage everyone else to do the same Countrywide

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Offline welchy

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #132 on: April 14, 2008, 04:10:13 PM »
Here goes
Not even sure if I want to type this for so many reasons. The main one being guilt.
Guilt for a lot of reasons
 
Forgive me, this is gonna probably be random as I’m just going to write as things come into my head.
 
I was 18 and just a bit of a kid going to my first semi. Even getting the ticket had been an ordeal. Even though I was a st holder and had sent off my voucher for some reason it never got to lfc and I remember the wed before being close to tears as the ticket office told me they had no record of my application. (do you remember in those days you had to write the match you were applying for on the envelope. Me thinks some crafty posty got himself a spare voucher there!!!)
anyway a mate of my dads knew of a ticket going for the leppings lane and I finally picked it up at 8.30 fri evening. I was so chuffed.
I remember traveling alone that day (usually went with my bro but he’d had no luck – sounds so wrong typing that now) and hitting shitty traffic just off the mway then spending hrs queueing into Sheffield. I remember jumping off the coach at the road leading down to the leppings lane.
I wasn’t arsed about where it was parked, id find it later. Then I hit that crush outside. If I thought that was bad I had no idea what was instore for me through that turnstile.
I got in about 5 or 10 mins before the gate opened. For me, someone who always headed straight for the busiest part of the kop there was no question where I wanted to go. Smack bang behind the goal! Fuck being late I was on my own id worm my way into a good spec. but halfway down the tunnel. Bam !!! the crowd locked and I just waited. I know when the gate opened cos there was so much singing in the tunnel behind me. You know the difference between a few dozen singing and a few thousand. Anyway the next thing I know is im on the first barrier in pen 3 and that’s when things just went surreal for me and memories go a little hazy. I remember having my back to the pitch, not by choice but swung round long enough to see grobs and jockey running onto the pitch (the only 2 players I saw that day). Then I remember some old fella being pushed against a bar and he was throwing up. Still after the rush outside, then the tunnel then on the terrace not once did I think anything was wrong (mad I know). I just thought hed overdone it in the alehouse earlier.
Guilty thought no 1.
then I remember us hitting the bar (Beardsley I think) and still facing away from the pitch found it weird that people in the seats were actually watching a football match!.
By this time I was scared and im sure I was praying. The next 40 mins seemed like 40 yrs.
I remember hearing some lad screaming cos he was being crushed over the bar. Only to realize it was me! I remember a girl next to me passed out and being helpless. I remember a lad crying next to me asking me to pull his arm free. I tried but was it enough. Wot happened to him? Guilt no 2.
I remember actually getting to the now open gate at the front one arm either side of it and being totally wedged. A copper tried to pull me out but it was never gonna happen. I knew if I didn’t get away from there id be like the 2 lads under my feet! I remember another copper putting his hand on my chest and saying if u all move back it’ll be ok. Just to have one arm free at that second I swear id have killed the twat.
By the time I got away from the gate and in a position to be pulled over the fence I think the crushing was starting to ease and 2 coppers got me out.
This is where the guilt really kicks in. from getting on the pitch I remember getting a drink off some copper, then wandering round aimlessly till eventually hours later heading off to find my coach. In that critical time when other people helped their fellow supporters I did FUCK ALL.
Althought im glad I don’t remember seeing bodies, or even injured people. Ive seen all the footage of fans being carried on hoardings. Don’t remember seeing any of it. Mates and family have said later I was obviously in deep shock which is true but ive carried this guilt for 19 yrs.
Ive more to say but don’t feel like my story has any relevance in this forum that is here to honour the 96 and those THOUSANDS of heroes that helped our own.
Apologies for my ramblings
 
JFT 96
« Last Edit: April 14, 2008, 04:17:13 PM by welchy »

Offline 24/7

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #133 on: April 14, 2008, 04:27:02 PM »
.....ive carried this guilt for 19 yrs.....
Ive more to say but don’t feel like my story has any relevance in this forum that is here to honour the 96 and those THOUSANDS of heroes that helped our own.
Apologies for my ramblings

Mate - that took some courage to type - and I for one would say you should never have to apologise for 'rambling' - this is a safe place to pour your heart out and say how you feel. You know that you are not alone, yes? There are others who have carried the same or similar feelings with them all this time.

You are a survivor. You have every right to express yourself. It *is* relevant.

Forgive me for asking but do you still have this guilt? Have you not fully come to terms with your experience? I'd urge you in that case to find an appropriate source to talk this through with. No-one should have to carry this with them for all that time - remember, that day was not your fault. People died and that was not your fault. You survived and it's not your fault.

Far from encouraging you to seek someone to blame (no need for that - we know who was to blame - the c*nts just got away with it), I'm just encouraging you to come to terms with the guilt.

I and others will be thinking of you tomorrow at 15:06, just as we do any other day too.

"Walk on...!" friend. :scarf
"Love does not claim possession, but gives freedom." - Rabindranath Tagore.

Offline welchy

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #134 on: April 14, 2008, 05:02:30 PM »
Yes its still there. it doesnt eat away at me like it used to i'm happy to say.
I think theres a part of me happy to let it stay in the past. talking about it all may just open parts of my brain that thankfully closed down for me that day. I honestly can't remember when i found out people had died. I think it must have been back on the coach so i guess whay i'm trying to say is ignorance is bliss. I just wished i could have been of some use to just 1 person that day

Offline 24/7

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #135 on: April 14, 2008, 06:01:07 PM »
Yes its still there. it doesnt eat away at me like it used to i'm happy to say. I just wished i could have been of some use to just 1 person that day

Hang in there Welchy - remember, you weren't really in a position to do much to help, unlike the bastards who stood the other side of the fence refusing to help and even throwing some people back in.......
"Love does not claim possession, but gives freedom." - Rabindranath Tagore.

Offline SwedenRed

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #136 on: April 14, 2008, 07:04:31 PM »
Bloody hell... 19 years on... Time flies and I still remember everything clear as day as if it was yesterday. During this time since it happened, I've grown up, and in a way feel more mature than what I was when it happened.
I was a young immature 17 year old back then, buzzing with excitement. On the train up to Sheffield, I did everything to swap my seat with a standing ticket. I got lucky (we can now say unlucky), and one girl swapped with me. I was now in the Leppings Lane with all my mates and pals who travelled to every match back in them days. Got there very early, and as you do headed to the off-licence and to the chippy. Then enterred the ground at about 1:30. A lovely day, and we all stretched out on the Leppings Lane centre terrace (right hand side looking at the pitch) and soaked the rays. One of the girls, a great friend, Marion relaxed with us and we shared laughs and planned for the Final at Wembley and discussed the long walk back to the Station. About 2:15 we were all still there laughing and joking and a few trips through the long dark tunnel to the toilet... 15 mins later it changed like a flash.
Fans were piling in, said bye to Marion who loved to stand near the front... and arranged to meet after the game. We were approx in the middle with 10-15 mins to go, and within 5 mins we were sent literally 3 metres from the front fence. It was getting difficult to get comfortable... you always held pressure for a couple of secs and then it went back again... but this time the pressure kept on coming, and coming and coming, until I couldnt manage anymore. I was at this poing squished near the bottom corner, my knees were sandwitched between two blokes shoulders at this time. A big bloke was towerring above me on top of the fence (between the two pens), with his arm out... He pulled me out. This was frantic... I noticed on the other side of the fence 3 of my friends trying to watch the game and singing, all in acres of space... I was frantic and joined in on top of the fence pulling people out of the crush. At this time I knew something was serious, but not that serious. It dawned on me when we tried desperately to get a lad out, but we couldnt. He was stuck and probably would have torn his arm off if we tried more. Then an old fella went past me whilst I was on the fence and he looked at me...his face was blue and lifeless. It was horrible. That face will live with me for eternity.
Desperately we tried to climb the high fence, shouting at the police to open... eventually we climbed over and it was pandemonium! I didnt know what to do after that... Just tried to help people as best as I could... We rushed across the pitch twice with injured people, but then I just couldnt handle it anymore. I saw the nearest seat in the main stand, sat in it and cried my eyes out.
Later found my friend after we were told the game was abandoned, and wonderred back to the Station where we were attacked by Forest hooligans. Blaming us for the game getting abandoned, we got a good batterring and was saved by some other forest fans, who threw us into the back of an ambulance... Then set off again, and managed to go into someones house to call my mum. Cried my eyes out again.
The train back was a silent dinn... We went through our Group to see who were missing... I think it was 5 missing.

Marion wasnt there. She died.
(Crushed at the front. (She was plasterred all over the mondays daily mirror with her teeth gripping the blue mesh fence)).

Never will I forget that... Its like a horror movie EVERY year. I have tears right now as I type. Sorry for being such a wuss...I am an old fart now, but it seems like yesterday.
And on this day, and tomorrow I forget who is to blame, as its a day for remembrance to all those who sufferred.
Rest in Peace. Respect to those who were there that day.


Offline binge

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #137 on: April 14, 2008, 08:14:15 PM »
Well in for helping swedenred also sorry to hear about your mate marion


YNWA

Offline RedMike-86-

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #138 on: April 14, 2008, 11:28:27 PM »
Bloody hell... 19 years on... Time flies and I still remember everything clear as day as if it was yesterday. During this time since it happened, I've grown up, and in a way feel more mature than what I was when it happened.
I was a young immature 17 year old back then, buzzing with excitement. On the train up to Sheffield, I did everything to swap my seat with a standing ticket. I got lucky (we can now say unlucky), and one girl swapped with me. I was now in the Leppings Lane with all my mates and pals who travelled to every match back in them days. Got there very early, and as you do headed to the off-licence and to the chippy. Then enterred the ground at about 1:30. A lovely day, and we all stretched out on the Leppings Lane centre terrace (right hand side looking at the pitch) and soaked the rays. One of the girls, a great friend, Marion relaxed with us and we shared laughs and planned for the Final at Wembley and discussed the long walk back to the Station. About 2:15 we were all still there laughing and joking and a few trips through the long dark tunnel to the toilet... 15 mins later it changed like a flash.
Fans were piling in, said bye to Marion who loved to stand near the front... and arranged to meet after the game. We were approx in the middle with 10-15 mins to go, and within 5 mins we were sent literally 3 metres from the front fence. It was getting difficult to get comfortable... you always held pressure for a couple of secs and then it went back again... but this time the pressure kept on coming, and coming and coming, until I couldnt manage anymore. I was at this poing squished near the bottom corner, my knees were sandwitched between two blokes shoulders at this time. A big bloke was towerring above me on top of the fence (between the two pens), with his arm out... He pulled me out. This was frantic... I noticed on the other side of the fence 3 of my friends trying to watch the game and singing, all in acres of space... I was frantic and joined in on top of the fence pulling people out of the crush. At this time I knew something was serious, but not that serious. It dawned on me when we tried desperately to get a lad out, but we couldnt. He was stuck and probably would have torn his arm off if we tried more. Then an old fella went past me whilst I was on the fence and he looked at me...his face was blue and lifeless. It was horrible. That face will live with me for eternity.
Desperately we tried to climb the high fence, shouting at the police to open... eventually we climbed over and it was pandemonium! I didnt know what to do after that... Just tried to help people as best as I could... We rushed across the pitch twice with injured people, but then I just couldnt handle it anymore. I saw the nearest seat in the main stand, sat in it and cried my eyes out.
Later found my friend after we were told the game was abandoned, and wonderred back to the Station where we were attacked by Forest hooligans. Blaming us for the game getting abandoned, we got a good batterring and was saved by some other forest fans, who threw us into the back of an ambulance... Then set off again, and managed to go into someones house to call my mum. Cried my eyes out again.
The train back was a silent dinn... We went through our Group to see who were missing... I think it was 5 missing.

Marion wasnt there. She died.
(Crushed at the front. (She was plasterred all over the mondays daily mirror with her teeth gripping the blue mesh fence)).

Never will I forget that... Its like a horror movie EVERY year. I have tears right now as I type. Sorry for being such a wuss...I am an old fart now, but it seems like yesterday.
And on this day, and tomorrow I forget who is to blame, as its a day for remembrance to all those who sufferred.
Rest in Peace. Respect to those who were there that day.



This, and thousand of stories like it, are why I will never let it go ... well in for sharing Sweden Red. I must admit I read everying  I can find to read and speak to everyone there is to speak to about Hillbsorough - and this is the first time I realised that Forrest fans actually started hitting out that day.

YNWA.
In the land of the witless, the half-wit is king.

Offline 24/7

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #139 on: April 14, 2008, 11:42:53 PM »
- and this is the first time I realised that Forrest fans actually started hitting out that day.
Me too!  :o I am shocked and disgusted.

Well in Rich for sharing though and so sorry to read about Marion. May she rest in peace.
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Offline WOOLTONIAN

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #140 on: April 15, 2008, 09:40:13 AM »
I don't feel as though I have a right to post here. Its been 18 years and as every year goes by the feelings get that little bit worse. My feelings are those of guilt.... no not of guilt, thats stupid. They are feelings of being so very lucky that it wasnt me.

My tickets were for the stand above the Leppings Lane. That was unusual because I stood on Saturdays on the Kop and didnt do seats. Had my tickets been for the terrace I'd have been in there early and behind that goal and well.. who knows. My feelings are those of having been lucky while others weren't and as each year goes by I feel worse. I can talk about it, I get emotional, that actually helps. I can get emotional anytime and anywhere. I once had an interview with a head hunter and he asked me what was the worst thing that had ever happened to me? I think he was more embarrassed than me as this suited professional bloke started to fill up, unable to talk properly. I bet he never asked anyone that question again.

I sat there on that day in the stands and watched it all unfold. I witnessed the dead and the dying and the attempts of mates trying to save mates and strangers trying to help strangers. I saw heroism but I was spared the worst of it. I wasnt on that pitch so I shouldnt really talk about it here among those that were. So I just want to say that my thoughts are with you, the survivors, the sometimes forgotten sufferers. I've taken to wearing a HJC scarf and handing out the yellow stickers in the pub. I don't really know why, I just know it makes me feel a bit better.

I hope this post does not cause any of you that have really suffered and continue to do so any offense. My story isn't worth telling but I saw the thread and well...

God bless you all... God bless the 96.

This time every year I start typing.
The only difference this year is I'll post instead of deleteing everything
The above mirror images my day, I too was stood helpless looking down on the Leppings Lane Terrace.
I have spent all this morning looking at my watch.
I was cleaning my teeth...
I was trying to find clean socks and boxies...
The wife was stood in the kitchen..
My ticket was on the TV, it had been there all week..
I was in a bullish mood, the wife was very quiet.
She was always quiet when she knew I was heading for an away game.
Will you be alright on your own ?
Yes
Will there be trouble
Nothing expected really, but we can look after ourselves.
Are you wearing colours
No
What time is your train
just after 11
what time will you be home
I'll bunk the special on the way back, so it wont be too late
Do you know the area
Yes
Will you be having a pint before the game
Yes
Will you be having a pint after the game
Depends on the result
Get back to Liverpool before you start heavily
Yes Love
Do you want sandwiches
No
Have you got enough fags
40
Have you got enough to get a taxi home from town if you get drunk
yes love
Phone me when you get back to town
Yes love
Are Forest any good
Not as good as us, we should win
Denim jacket or Donkey
Donkey
Have you got your wallet, ticket and spare cash
Yes Love
(Kiss)
See you later
(Kiss the kids)
Bye Bye little man

1 pint
2 pints
3 pints

Dont know why I expected orderly queues at the ground, but I did. After all it was all ticket.
The view that greeted me at The Leppings lane end, was like an over stuffed pigs pen.  Just a mass of bodies aiming for what looked like three gates.
I asked a copper outside the ground if there was a seperate gate for Stand tickets. He thought that was funny.
I joined the crush.

After a few minutes I realised there were far to many people in this enclosed area and made my way to a far wall.
The crush outside got worse.
People around me started to talk.
This is bloody madness.
We started bunking kids up on the the wall to get them out of the crush.
We told them to stay up on the wall until it died down.
Two coppers came over and told us to take the kids off the wall.
Obviously they were of the opinion they were trying to bunk in.
The two fathers took their tickets out to prove they and their kids had tickets.

The coppers began to feel the crush themselves and made a swift exit.
We were edging along the wall to try and get to the nearest turnstile.
We passed a pair of big wooden gates and got close to the turnstile.
As I got one leg in the turnstile, the 2 kids shinnied down into there Fathers arms and then I think the big gates behind us went crash.

The man in the turnstile turn the stiles on "freewheel" we spilled through and onto the floor inside the wall.
Coppers came running over. They must have thought we were all bunking in.
I raised my ticket in the air as did the 2 fathers.
Where do we head, we asked
Anywhere just get in, the game is about to kick off.
There was a mad rush for what seemed like the only way in.
I stopped and said to a steward, I'm in the upper stand where do I go
He pointed to my right, right at the end he said.
I ran to the corner and up the stairs.
As everyone else was rushing toward the middle, downstairs...

To be fair, what followed is more coloured by what I read at a later date.
I just stood there NUMB.
No understanding of what was happening in front of me.
I dont know how long I stood there transfixed by what was happening in front of my eyes.

I left the ground and went back to the pub, where I had been earlier.
Via an old womans living room where she allowed me to ring home.
There was no answer.

That afternoon I climbed into a bottle.
To this day I'm still trying to climb out.

I'm told by those in the know, that it's called self medication.
I call it shame.
Living with survivors guilt is real.
Could I talk to someone face to face about my feelings ?
No
Can I talk face to face now ?
No

On this day every year I go to church and find a priest / vicar
I confess behind a screen what I think I did wrong.
I get the same answers wherever I go.
To be fair I dont even hear the words of comfort some have afforded me.
I just sit there NUMB.

I have never been to a memorial service since the very first at Paddies Wigwam.
I never will go.
I will sit in a quiet church somewhere and reflect on the day.
I will light my 24 hour candle

and swim around the bottle alll day to try and wash away the sins, I feel I have committed.

Your idea is great, but I've a feeling there must be thousands that will do what I do.
Find a quiet corner and sit there NUMB, until they decide they need a drink.

I'm lucky to have an understanding wife, she knows where I will be every minute of today.
She knows she will get a phone call later to come and find me.
Others are not so lucky.
I know lots of marriages that have broken down since Hillsborough.

There is nothing unique about my story.
There are 1000's out there who do need help.
But speaking words or hearing comforting words just isn't enough.

Hug a red today, he or she will appreciate it more than you think.



Living descendant of Sir Thomas Brodrick, Vice Admiral of the Red in the 18th Century

Offline Glorious Future

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #141 on: April 15, 2008, 09:46:29 AM »
Welchy - Don't, whatever you do, don't let guilt take over. You're head wants you to have saved them all. To have stopped it happening. Talk about it, write about it, let yourself feel about it, but don't let the worst feelings take over and do you down.

You're a brilliant human being, whatever your head might tell you.

Some lovely people here and other places have tried to help me think that, and its only right I pass on their message.

God bless all who are affected today, whoever you are, wherever you are.

And of course, God bless the 96 lost brothers and sisters. Love to you all, we'll never ever forget and never stop being your brothers, sisters and friends. Till the day we meet, rest in peace.

Edit Just seen yours there Wooltonian. I know what you're saying fella, really I do. Just remember that despite all the goings on, you're thought about as well, wherever you're sat today. I'm not trying to be 'twee' when I say this, and I don't expect it means anything anyway, but I don't like, and theres more who wouldn't either like, the idea of you having to ask forgiveness. Just know that mate.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2008, 09:57:50 AM by Glorious Future »
Faith is a passionate intuition.

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Offline Maggie May

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #142 on: April 15, 2008, 09:50:30 AM »
I can't hug you mate, but when you go out today Wooly, know that you take my love with you. 
Rather a day as a lion than a lifetime as a sheep.

I can only be nice to one person a day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look too good either.
I tried being reasonable.  I didn't like it.  Old enough to know better.  Young enough not to give a fuck.

Offline NickoH

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #143 on: April 15, 2008, 09:50:59 AM »
WOOLTONIAN......virtually the same as me.

Numb is the word.

I've never spoke to anyone about it and doubt if I ever will.

The conversation comes up and I just drift off to wherever or make my excuses....it gets no easier, it really doesn't.


I clutch the wire fence until my fingers bleed,
A wound that will not heal, a heart that cannot feel.
Hoping that the horror will recede,
Hoping that tomorrow we'll all be freed.........JUSTICE.

Offline WOOLTONIAN

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #144 on: April 15, 2008, 10:01:37 AM »
I can't hug you mate, but when you go out today Wooly, know that you take my love with you. 

Mags
How can we ever be apart when you're always in my heart.
I have many friends who will be in my thoughts today.

Nickoh
I know mate, I really do.
God bless mate
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Offline smigger15

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #145 on: April 15, 2008, 10:17:47 AM »
Great idea! Its now 10.24am and I have woken up with a lovely hangover ;)

Yet last night I was a mess....went to a friends place and had a lovely dinner, chat and a few drinks. Then headed off to catch a taxi......I knew what was building up inside! I had no intenetion of getting a taxi straight away. So off to the pub where I took two sips of a pint then its was straight outside.....balling my eyes out!  :'(

Its 17 years and Im 12,000 miles away now! You would think its would get easier.....but its the opposite! The last few years have gotten harder and harder to deal with this day....the reason is the internet. You see up until about 4 years ago I never 'surfed' the web........after Hillsborough I moved to London.....April 15 meant nothing to anyone.......then I moved to Oz 8 years later....again April 15 meant nothing to anyone. So in effect I had 'blocked' the day from my mind!

Then i got access to the net....all of a sudden I was reading accounts of that day from people who where probably just 10-20 feet away from me in that pen. It was amazing....for about 14 years I had bottled it all up, had nobody to speak who would understand and yet here before my eyes where stories that I could have literally wrote myself!

When I say its getting harder I probably just mean I get more emotional! Im doing now what I should have been doing 15 years ago....letting it all out! It feels better but I still think I have some way to go.....fuck I just wish I was in Liverpool and could speak face to face and give someone a hug who understands! But this will pass and I will get on with my life until the same time next year  :-\

I feel so much better for having a good cry last night! Does all this make sense to anyone or do I need some professional help ?  :)

************************************************************

Here is a post of mine from last year.......


THE FLAG !

This was going to be my best season as a Liverpool supporter. I was 18 years old, just got my 3rd season ticket in a row and had just started my first ‘proper’ job. So for the first time ever I had some extra cash to spend on following the Reds. The year…….1988!

September came and all the lads from our estate met up at The Gate (our local in St Helens).  There where about 20 of us. Fifteen reds and five bitters! The pre season banter was always good and this year was no exception! In fact we had all just come back from holiday together in Ibiza , so looking tanned and cash in pocket the reds headed off to Anfield for the first home game of the season……..Liverpool 1-0 Manchester United !!! “I told you this was gonna be a good season” I joked with the lads as we left the Kop

That season was great! Barnes, Beardsley and Aldridge setting the league alight and with my new found income I had been to several away games as well! Come April it was time for our next big away game. For the second year running we had drawn Forest in the semi final of the cup. Now after the humiliation of the previous years FA cup final loss to Wimbledon I was really up for us in the FA Cup this year. (As the European ban was still in place!)

So to make the game a bit more special I decided I was going make a flag for the first time. Off to the market, where I bought two big pieces of red and white material. My mum got the sewing out and produced this massive red/white/red tricolor. In the centre was a ‘LIVERPOOL – THE MIGHTY REDS’ flag that I had bought from one of the scallies at a previous game outside the Kop. It was my pride and joy!

So the Saturday morning came and all the boys head down to where the coach was picking us up. Butties and a six pack each for the journey !!. I had a problem though, all my mates had Leppings Lane terrace tickets but I had a ticket for the seats in the Leppings Lane stand. “There’s no way I’m sitting down for a semi…….I have never sat down for any match” I told my mate Alan. Problem solved halfway there when I managed to swap my ticket (plus 6 quid!) for a Leppings Lane terrace ticket……..YES!!!!!!  “This is gonna be a great day” I remember thinking. Cashed up, Lynxed up, team on top of the league, heading of to a FA cup semi final, brand new massive flag to make my presence felt and I have just swapped  tickets to be by the side of all my mates. “Nothing can go wrong…..3-1 I reckon”

We arrive about 1km from the ground and started our walk to the turnstiles. Got there about 2.30pm and it was a bit chockers outside. The fifteen of us tried to stay together but it was a waste of time. “Lets go inside and we’ll catch up with them in there” I said to my only remaining mate Nick. “We have arranged to meet up behind the goal and I wanna get my flag up on the fence”.

In we go and through the central tunnel that lead underneath the stand. “How come it’s so packed in here Branno and the other two sections are empty” asked Nick. “Dunno mate! There’s a fence at the tunnel entrance so they’ll close that soon and send everyone round the other sides” I told Nick. I had been to the semi the year before at Hillsborough and this had happened.

I tried to make my way to the fence but it was useless. “Oh forget it mate this is too much hassle, we cant get through” I shouted to Nick whilst trying to worm my way back to the tunnel. “If we go back out the tunnel and turn right. There is another entrance by the corner flag. That way we can make our way sort of back to the middle. Hopefully it won’t be as packed”. I distinctly remember the time we finally got out of the pen…..2.49pm!

Off we went and sure enough the pen to the left as you look from behind the goal was pretty empty. We looked out for the other lads behind the goal but couldn’t make any of them out, it was just a sea of heads. Finally 3pm comes around at the atmosphere is fever pitch as the game kicks off. Nick and I are stood on some railings trying to get a better view.

This also gave us a better view of the middle pen. Now, I started to really suspect something wasn’t right when it was noticeable that most of the crowd in the middle where more concerned about ‘getting a bit more space’ than actually following the game. This was very evident when Beardsley hit the cross bar at the Kop end. Normally in unison all the supporters would jump up in the air, heads in hands at such a close effort……not this time!  They couldn’t !

“It must be packed Branno, some of them at the front are trying to get out” Nick said to me. Then we noticed fans climbing up into the stand behind. “Let’s get up there” I said to Nick. At the time this was purely to get a better view of the game. What I got was a ‘better’ view of what was happening below on the terraces.

It has been well documented as to what happened in that next hour. One memory that sticks in my mind is the sight of two legs standing up in the air…..in the middle of the pen. It was like the guy was doing a handstand. “God help him” is all I could think. At the time you couldn’t really take in what was happening. Rumors filled the stand of ‘3 have died…..ten have died…..fifteen have died.’  “Yeah right!” I kept in thinking. “It’s a bloody football match, they have probably just passed out or something”.

Then you start to believe what you are hearing and then the panic sets in ‘Where are the lads Nick?.......they said they where gonna meet us behind the goal didn’t they”. The look on Nicks face is something I had never seen before, his eyes where filling up and that of course set me off! After the game had been ‘officially’ cancelled we left the stand. The atmosphere behind the stand was surreal. Anger, disbelief, confusion and frustration. We headed up to the “Currys’ store down the road where we joined the queue for a telephone. It was only when we got inside the store that it finally hit home. They had rows of televisions showing ‘Grandstand’.

Its weird, you can witness 96 people die in front of you and then have a load of fellow supporters tell you people have died and you don’t really believe them. Yet I was bloody there went it happened and yet I still only really believed it when I saw it on television !!!

I finally got to make a call. My mum’s line was constantly engaged so I thought I would ring Alan’s mum so she could pass the word around. As the phone was ringing the thought came into my head “Sht! I don’t even know if Alans is alright. What the feck do I say to his mother”. Thankfully Alan had already called her and told her all the group was OK but they couldn’t find Nick and I !!!!

Back to the coach and we gratefully caught up with lads! Hugs where exchanged and we boarded. Then came the next bit of reality, we waited and waited on the coach. Finally some 2 hours later the coach driver reluctantly headed back for St Helens……minus 8 passengers ! Halfway back Nick tapped me on the shoulder “Do you still want this” he asked. Stuffed inside jacket was the flag I had made. “Nothing can wrong” are the words that I remembered !

Only a handful of us went to the replay at Old Trafford, 3-1 after all! I was stood in the Stretford End and thought about leaving my flag there! But decided better of it “I’ll take it to the Cup Final”

On the day I actually forgot to take my flag but nevertheless we won a very emotional Cup final. I carried on going to games but minus the flag. Until the last game of the season against Arsenal and ‘that’ goal scored by Michael Thomas. In the film Fever Pitch you see some real footage of the Kop that night. In this you can clearly see ‘my flag’ waiving proudly! After the game I threw the flag into my wardrobe in disgust!

The year later we where all on holiday again in Tenerife. We rarely talked about Hillsborough but the holiday was a good opportunity to get a lot off our chests, and we did! At the end of the holiday I declared to my mates “I’m going move to London and try and get a better job, after last year I reckon we are all lucky sods, so why not?”. Alan stood up “but what about your season ticket Branno?” I just turned around and said “Mate, football used to be a matter of life and death! Now I have seen the death the life looks a much better option “

I spent 7 years in London going to the odd game and then had the opportunity to move to Australia which I took. Then last year one of my best friends with whom I shared a house with in London rang and told me he was going to move to Melbourne. He arrived a few weeks later week and we headed off for a beer. “Hey mate! I’ve got a present for you” Lyndon said all excited. I looked down to his bag “It’s either a carton of B&H  or a bottle of Jamesons” I thought. “Get a load of this!
 Bet you thought you’d never see this again!” he smiled and passed me a carrier bag.

Lyndon had taken over my room when I had left London for Australia some seven years previously. When clearing his room out he noticed this ‘red and white’ thing hiding on the wardrobe floor. “Sorry mate! It’s got a few foot prints on it” he laughed. “I thought I’d bring it with me as a reminder of back home”………the flag had found me again some 15 years and 12,000 miles later!!!!

I then proceeded to tell Lyndon the story of this flag and its history as I have just told you!  “Jesus mate I’m so sorry! I bet you never wanted to see that flag again” he muttered in embarrassment. “It’s never brought you any luck”. I put my pint down, smiled and leant across “Oh yes it did mate! I’m still here aren’t I?”

The flag now has pride of place in the spare room of my house, reunited along with the ticket stub of that day. When I have kids they will be told this story too and the flag/ticket will be passed on to them. Another generation of reds who will be able to educate their mates on what happened that day. Let’s hope Justice doesn’t take that long!   


The subject of Hillsborough is a powerful topic held close to the hearts of all fellow Reds. It’s a subject that rarely goes away and why should it? In light of recent provocation by certain opposition supporters, its ironic to point who we played our last game against before Hillsborough?........MILLWALL AWAY!   

I dedicate this to all our fallen reds, who like me headed of to Sheffield that day with all their hopes and dreams still ahead of them. May they RIP in the knowledge that that they will never be forgotten and the battle for JUSTICE continues.



Branno, here's a hug from me (XXXXX)
YNWA

Offline welchy

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #146 on: April 15, 2008, 10:28:03 AM »
to all who replied to my posts of yesterday. thank you. its good to know i'm not the only one to have had these thoughts

Offline 2dogs in LA

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #147 on: April 15, 2008, 10:42:39 AM »
I was 15.
It was my second semi at Hillsborough.
I had a season ticket with my dad from when I could remember.
We went to the semi's with Wilf, the bloke that collected our insurance.
We took the long way round, up and down the motorways this time coz of congestion on the snake pass.
We parked north of the ground by a sign that said '15 mins to ground'  and strolled in the sun singing and having a laughf.
We kept passing signs  saying '15 mins to ground' which was funny at first but then my dad didn't like it.
My dad was  a station officer at Huyton fire   station at the time so had an idea about safety and being with his son, safety was paramount.
We didn't stop to pee or sit off and do all those things we normally did.
All the pubs on our route were shut anyway.
There weren't many bizzies around  either which my dad found odd.
As we got  close to our end there was a distinct lack of bizzies  and 'check points' of barriers.
Near the turnstyles it was rammed.
A couple of horse  bizzies and a mass of excited liverpool fans.
Was Hansen going to play or what?
My dad decided to just get into the ground as quick as possible.
He had a feeling.
We had already swapped out ground tickets for the stands a few days earlier so we squeezed through and went and got pies.
Didn't see where Wilf and his son went.
We were in our seeats about the half way line, half way up well early. About 20 minutes before kick-off.
People coming in were telling us it had gotten even worse at the turnstyles.
Me dad was bemoaning the fact that John Smith (we knew a bloke that did bets for the players) had  told the FA to give us the other end coz it was bigger and more logical for our approach but the FA again had demonstrated their beligerant stupidity.

Hanson was playing!
Come on the REDS!!
Me dad goes, just at kick-off, "Somethings going on down there. I don't like this."
I was dreading it kicking off coz of having to live with being called a murderer for the past few years and we just didn't need to give THEM amunition to denegrate our city.
The me dad said, "No. It's not good this. I can smell it."
Then this lad walked past with a face of shock and a right arm the shape of a "Z".
We ran down to the pitch side to help.
A bizzie stopped us.
Me dad got his Fire brigade ID out.
The bizzie said he didn't care who he was, if he stepped on the pitch he would be arrested.
Then there was the first advertising hording with the limp arm bouncing out from under the coat covering the head.
My mates, three off them had tickets for that end.
My mum was watching it on live TV.
A blonde pony-tailed bizzie woman was standing on the fence hitting people back into the crush with her batton.
There were dead children on the grass.
I found out what the smell was that had alarmed my dad.

I wish I didn't know any of this.
I expected the best that sunny morning.
Semi's were so exciting.
WHEN YOU WALK THROUGH A STORM HOLD YOUR HEAD UP HIGH.

Offline Wilf Hunter

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #148 on: April 15, 2008, 10:50:51 AM »
I was 17 and still find it hard to think of that day. Went with my three pals and nearly lost two of them. RIP 96
There's only one 'F' in Rafa.

Offline Maggie May

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #149 on: April 15, 2008, 10:57:55 AM »
Mags
How can we ever be apart when you're always in my heart.
I have many friends who will be in my thoughts today.

Nickoh
I know mate, I really do.
God bless mate


Take my hand and come away from that dark, cold and lonely place.  You have no business there any more, and you never had.  You have no sins to repent, neither of commission or omission.  You have people who love you and cherish you because you are a person of true worth.  Wrap that love around your shoulders like a warm cloak.  You will feel safe in it.  And know that you do not need to punish yourself because you stayed alive.

Rather a day as a lion than a lifetime as a sheep.

I can only be nice to one person a day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look too good either.
I tried being reasonable.  I didn't like it.  Old enough to know better.  Young enough not to give a fuck.

Offline In Fowler We Trust

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #150 on: April 15, 2008, 11:15:16 AM »
I find today really, really hard.  Keep filling up.
"If you can't say anything nice, don't say nothing at all"  Thumper (1942)

Justice for the 96

I'm a Believer

Offline The Scouseologist

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #151 on: April 15, 2008, 11:15:52 AM »
Thought given the day I would add my memories of this day.

I was 8 years old almost 9, it was to be the 3rd semi final appearance, something I took pride rubbing in to the kids at the playground leading up to the game.

I remember my mum doing me a packed lunch in my M.A.S.K. lunchbox and putting on my Daley Thompson tracksuit and Liverpool top all ready for what I thought was going to be a great fun day.

We headed for Sheffield in the car with my step dad and his brother Gary. As we were heading over the moors I remember being bored off my head and moaning a lot about how long we had left until we arrived.

The next thing I knew the car stopped and Gary and my step dad got out, they told me to get out too. There was a sheep in the middle of the road and the two of them picked it up and said it was going in the boot to take home for a nice big roast dinner. I remember laughing my head off about it the rest of the trip and seemed to make the journey fly over.

When we arrived in Sheffield we parked next to a used car lot and Gary and my step dad got a couple of cans of beer, I remember being allowed to cross a road without holding someones hand and going into the shop for my regular of wine gums and a can of coke. I remember the lady saying "do you want a can of pop love" I had no idea what the hell a can of pop was!

I then remember being near the turnstiles holding both tickets, next thing I remember was walking through the tunnel still holding both the tickets I had for me and my step dad, we were ushed through and lost Gary.

As we got in the ground my step dad was trying to find a bar to sit me on, I remember my legs hurting but was used to this from the kop and thought nothing else at first. Next thing I know I heard people shouting we have a little kid here, I was then lifted up and passed down through the crowd, I have to admit the next part is a blank in my mind. I dont know if I passed out or just was so scared I stopped thinking what was happening around me.

How I got out the Leppings lane I don't know, through a gap or over the top I really could not tell you, next thing I remember was being out on the pitch on my own.

I was wondering around scared witless, some fella came over to me cracking jokes telling me everything was okay and all was alright and not to panic, he then put me on his shoulders saying "Come on lad we will find ur arl fella" (This guy I remembered his face and saw him on a sky one documentary talking about me years later).

Next thing I remember was seeing some really big guy throwing my step dad over the fence, he then tried in vain to get the big guy out but couldn’t. I hoped that big guy would be okay.

My step dad then took me away to the centre circle, walking there seemed to take forever, I remember seeing bodies being carried away and knowing this was bad.
As I got to the centre cirle, I later found out the cameras zoomed right in on me with Des Lynam (I think not sure if was him or Dickie Davies) announcing, “There is one safe little boy.” This was the first indication my mum knew I was okay but she didn’t know about this clip off her own accord. For anyone who sits at the Anny Road you probably recognise “Dave Crocky”

He is a really big obese fella who sells scarfs badges etc outside the anny road end, my mum said she remember seeing this big fat guy sprinting towards my mums house with a video in his hand shouting, “Joe is okay, Joe is okay.”

As I left the centre circle, my step dad took me to the Forest end, a Forest fan came over saying was a doctor and checked me over saying I appeared okay, I was given a blanket and left in the care of two Forest fans as my step dad went back to help and try and find Gary.

I remember sitting there shaking, flashes of the bodies appearing and drinking pure Orange juice although I did not like it.

My step dad appeared back alone with his shirt torn about 20 minutes or so later.

We headed back to the car and a family invited us in to use there phone to phone home. I remember just crying to my mum on the phone and watching footage on the tv drinking tea from a cup and saucer and thinking I had never seen a cup and saucer before.

I then remember starting to shake and had some kind of seizure in the ladies living room panicking and shaking uncontrollably.

Then we saw Gary walking to the car, he and my step dad embraced and collapsed to there knees I ran over and jumped on top and the 3 of us where all crying together holding on to each other, relieved we were alive but devastated and those that had died and been seriously injured.

The coming days I remember visiting the ground, I wrote a poem I left in the goal of the Kop and attended the funeral of a local guy in St Peters and Pauls in Kirkby.

I have made it my business to never forget, I fully support everything the HJC is about and ensure I attend the service each year.

I still have nightmares about the things I seen, never really seeked help or open up to many people about the mental images that will haunt me forever.

God bless the 96 and there families, god bless everybody who was hurt in someway by this horrific tragedy, my heart and thoughts are with those who lost somebody today and I know one day Justice will prevail.

You’ll never walk alone!

« Last Edit: April 15, 2008, 11:19:30 AM by The Scouseologist »
JUSTICE FOR THE 96
               
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Offline Swoop

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #152 on: April 15, 2008, 11:29:08 AM »
I was like many, hurt, confused and most of all alone in my misery, Sept 8th 2004 I managed to get this down on paper, and added it to the knowledge and understanding thread, life has been better since.





This is the first time I have ever written on the subject.  Forgive me for meandering through a little.

I was in the Army based in Chester in 89 and a regular on the Kop with a group of mates.  We we're so confident that we would all get a ticket for the Semi that I booked a mini bus, in the end there was me, my brother, my cousin and one of my Army mates.

We had been to the game in 88 so we decided to get there handy and find somewhere to settle in for a few beers and soak in the atmosphere etc.  We'll we got there late, parked up fairly close in one of the side streets and made our way to the leppings lane end. 

My mate spotted a good friend of his from another Regiment, he was asking us to swap his stand ticket for a standing ticket, we had two for the west stand and two for the leppings terrace, we didn’t swap, unfortunately he did swap his ticket.  He didn't go home.

I have always believed in following my gut instinct and after that day I have stuck to that rule and it has saved my skin on more than one occasion.  We got there and the fact that we made it to the leppings lane gates without going through a barrier checkpoint put us straight on edge.

Me and me brother had tickets for the west stand, my cousin and my mate for the terrace.  We took one look at the gates, I think there was 1 possibly 2 coppers there, I then said something which has never left me.  I turned to my little group and said, lets get in now as its going to be fucking murder getting in later .

I asked my mate to look after my cousin, he was around 13 - 14 at the time, and we all went in.

I was sat at the far end of the stand near the forest fans.  Game kicks off and after a few minutes a few people spill out onto the pitch.  Look at them fucking bastards, fucking twats will spoil if for the rest of us.  Words I spoke, not understanding.  A few more minute a lot more people on the pitch, the hoarding being ripped up, the bodies piling past.  I cant remember anything that was announced over the tanoy, all I remember know is the feeling that it took me far to long to react and get myself onto the pitch and help. I ran down the stand, jumped onto the pitch, there was a big guy lay out on the pitch with a couple of girls giving him mouth to mouth.  I took over for a couple of breaths and realised he was gone but I didn’t have the heart to tell the girls, I didn’t know if the were friends relatives or just complete strangers who where helping the guy; all I know is that I left them with him and moved off, thinking to find someone who wasn’t beyond help. 

I started towards the terrace, moving trough the police line I saw a fella screaming abuse at one of the coppers, I pulled him off and focused him in on finding his little brother, coppers couldn’t help him he needed to start looking for himself.  I never knew if he did or not.  This little incident suddenly switched me off from helping to a sudden realisation that my young cousin and my mate were in this mess somewhere.  I don’t know how long I walked in front of that terrace, fortunately I have no memory of most of what I saw, just the odd bits and pieces, a fireman giving a little kid mouth to mouth.  I remember the ambulance coming on, I remember looking at who was getting in, searching. Saw that scumbag from the Scum getting legged out of it. Mostly I remember calling out my cousin's name and searching the faces in the terrace hoping to catch a glimpse.

Not sure when I decided to go back to the stand, I realised our kid would be worrying and I was getting a little panicky, I started back to the stand,.  Found our kid and sat down in my seat and cried, I have never cried since.

Again not sure how long it was before we made our way back to the mini bus, I remember having the worst feeling of my life when I realised we were the first back.  Seemed like an age before my cousin and mate got back.   We drove off in silence somewhere along the route we stopped at some posh country hotel to call home and let them now we were alright, some guy came up to us and told us that the tv said between 65 & 75 people were dead. 

Don’t remember a thing after that really.  Never spoken about it much and probably never will.  All I know is that we were lucky on so many levels, and the what ifs haunt me on occasion.  What if everyone had gotten a ticket, how many would have been in that pen, what if we had swapped tickets with the mate outside, that would have put three of us in the stand and left Army mate on his own.
My Army mate told me later that when they got in the centre paddock was already getting full so he moved to the one at the side, which was empty, because he had my cousin with him, he would have stayed otherwise.

Like I said at the start, I protect my own sanity by not thinking of it too much and that way I get on with my life.

To Army mate, if your reading this, I don’t mean to ignore you when I see you at the game, you talk about it, I think it helps you to.  I still can't and run and hide.  I never thanked you properly for looking after cousin, but I think you know how I feel. I owe you, Im there if you ever need me.

To all you other good people, thanks for reading, I posted this somewhere else on the site but I think this is the proper place.

From those of us who were lucky,

RIP, YNWA
Its a dogs life for me

Offline Swoop

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #153 on: April 15, 2008, 11:32:20 AM »
I still dont talk about it, but it I know it helps me to write about it on occasion, for those that have done it for the first time today as some of you have, dont let it end here, go and have a talk about it - even, if like me its just to yourself.
Its a dogs life for me

Offline The Scouseologist

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #154 on: April 15, 2008, 11:36:47 AM »
First time I have put it into words like this I have to admit.
JUSTICE FOR THE 96
               
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Offline Maggie May

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #155 on: April 15, 2008, 11:50:11 AM »
I still dont talk about it, but it I know it helps me to write about it on occasion, for those that have done it for the first time today as some of you have, dont let it end here, go and have a talk about it - even, if like me its just to yourself.


First time I have put it into words like this I have to admit.

Wise words Swoop.  And I am so pleased for you that you've taken that first step Scouse.  Its a release. 

On here you are among your own kind who are with you and who understand.  There's no need to feel lonely or isolated - you're among friends.  You can say what you like.  Nobody's going to feel uncomfortable and change the subject.  There's no need for embarrassment or awkwardness here.  YNWA is more than just words in a song. 
Rather a day as a lion than a lifetime as a sheep.

I can only be nice to one person a day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look too good either.
I tried being reasonable.  I didn't like it.  Old enough to know better.  Young enough not to give a fuck.

Offline Walter Sobchak

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #156 on: April 15, 2008, 11:51:19 AM »
First time I have put it into words like this I have to admit.

Joe mate, thinking of you on this sad, sad day…..as well as all other posters on here

In unity we find strenght

YNWA

Offline The Scouseologist

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #157 on: April 15, 2008, 11:52:43 AM »
Wise words Swoop.  And I am so pleased for you that you've taken that first step Scouse.  Its a release. 

On here you are among your own kind who are with you and who understand.  There's no need to feel lonely or isolated - you're among friends.  You can say what you like.  Nobody's going to feel uncomfortable and change the subject.  There's no need for embarrassment or awkwardness here.  YNWA is more than just words in a song. 

Cheers Maggie.
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Offline Regi

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #158 on: April 15, 2008, 01:59:04 PM »
I hope that writing these personal accounts helps those of you who seek strength.
As a 12 year-old in Derry, I remember rushing home from our Saturday morning youth match to see the game on TV, but being met at the door by my mum and dad who tried to explain what was happening and trying to put me off watching.
Over the years, you try to imagine what it must have been like to be there but you can never know.
I know none of you folks but you have touched me in a way that few I know well ever could.
You are all in my thoughts.

YNWA
JFT 96
A life, Jimmy, you know what that is? It's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come
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Offline quasimodo

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Re: Ok, here goes... Survivors: Here.
« Reply #159 on: April 15, 2008, 04:24:53 PM »
I remember afterwards trying to find a phone (nobody had a mobile then) as I knew my Mum would be worried. It took ages as every pay phone had really long queues and didn’t find one until the motorway services. My brother answered with a scared ‘hello’. My Mum had gone next door to call the number they’d given out and left our phone clear.

Sunday was totally surreal. I know now I was in shock but I just sat watching the TV and all the news, etc. On Monday at work people were all asking questions and it wasn’t until the middle of the day that all of a sudden everything was too much. My boss was great and told me to take all the time I needed. I didn’t go back until the next week. I talked to a few people afterwards who had more or less the same delayed reaction. I also remember the first time I went out again in a crowd and having a sense of panic.

In all of the anguish of that time I had the love, concern and support of family and friends, something precious worth remembering again today.