Topic: Just a separate Mbappe thread, until he retires, is all I ask

[Paul JH]

Exactly.

*If* the published figures are trues, then it's an oddly small contract (which is why I think there's more to it)

We were prepared to pay £110m transfer fee for Caicedo.

The £128m signing on payment is in lieu of a transfer fee. And £250k/week is well within our wage structure.

We could have done it - but I don't think we wanted to, and I'm happy with that. Bit of a bellend and the media would be typical arseholes for all the time he was here. If Mo was leaving this summer (hope he doesn't) and Mbappe played on the right, then there's a big case to be made, but I'm most arsed that RM now won't sign the odd-looking cyborg chap (but even that doesn't bother me as much, because I don't think he makes the sportwashing cheats that much better all-round)

How could we have done it? He's getting a £128m signing on fee paid over 5 years, so he'll be on the equivalent of £800k a week? (or close to). So the fee / wages means nothing when you add that on top.

We just aren't that kind of club at all.

[MonsLibpool]

You don’t need to look at PSG when you can just look at Madrid with Ronaldo Benzema Modric Kroos, or Barcelona with Neymar Suarez Messi, PSG are the rare example of having the best players not leading to the big honours.

We slapped a big spending Barcelona side who replace Neymar with a £140m player and we would have beaten that Madrid side in 2018 before Mo's injury.

I'm just saying that people tend to get carried away. A "team" can compete with and beat them regardless. Buying many star players doesn't guarantee that they'll dominate European football.

However,  it doesn't fit into the narrative so I'll leave it there.

[Paul JH]

I'm just saying that people tend to get carried away. A "team" can compete with and beat them regardless. Buying many star players doesn't guarantee that they'll dominate European football.

100% agree. Football fans love to repeat the same mantras. Real actually won CL when they didn't have as good a team as people thought a few seasons ago, or as in the past, and have not won it when they've been littered with Galacticos.

[rhysd]

Any word on how much his agents/advisors got?

[Coolie High]

100% agree. Football fans love to repeat the same mantras. Real actually won CL when they didn't have as good a team as people thought a few seasons ago, or as in the past, and have not won it when they've been littered with Galacticos.

Real have always been littered with Galaticos, they’ve won like 5CLs in the last ten years being littered with Galaticos.

[Coolie High]

We slapped a big spending Barcelona side who replace Neymar with a £140m player and we would have beaten that Madrid side in 2018 before Mo's injury.

I'm just saying that people tend to get carried away. A "team" can compete with and beat them regardless. Buying many star players doesn't guarantee that they'll dominate European football.

However,  it doesn't fit into the narrative so I'll leave it there.

If we’re going on past precedence buying many star players does guarantee you dominate European football, I think that’s why Madrid currently have 14 Cls and have won like 5 of the last 10. Before that it was Barcelona who had star players, I think people like to delude themselves that this isn’t the case, when even during our best times we’ve lost two CL finals to Madrid teams who have a manager lesser than Klopp.

[Nobby Reserve]

How could we have done it? He's getting a £128m signing on fee paid over 5 years, so he'll be on the equivalent of £800k a week? (or close to). So the fee / wages means nothing when you add that on top.

We just aren't that kind of club at all.

If we paid a £128m transfer fee (payable to the selling club over 5 years) and £250k/week, would that be more acceptable to you

[A-Bomb]

If we’re going on past precedence buying many star players does guarantee you dominate European football, I think that’s why Madrid currently have 14 Cls and have won like 5 of the last 10. Before that it was Barcelona who had star players, I think people like to delude themselves that this isn’t the case, when even during our best times we’ve lost two CL finals to Madrid teams who have a manager lesser than Klopp.

They're building a new look team with some excellent players - however, they've still got it all to do. They still need to get the balance right amongst the group and starting x11.

Mbappe is a terrific player, but he does rock the boat in where the space he likes to operate in and one of their current best players Vinicus likes to work. That's not to say they won't find a solution, but it's also not a given they will work together well.

Their midfield is under going a change, and whilst they have excellent players, they will miss the likes of Kroos and Modric who were more elaborate on the ball than perhaps their existing players are who are more functional and reminiscent of our midfield triumphant of Hendo, Gini and Fabinho.

Their defense is not the strongest and their goalkeeper is coming towards the latter years in his career. Then there's Ancelotti - how long will he there for?

So it's no forgone conclusion this group will emulate the teams of the past decade.

[Redley]

He's wanted to go to Real Madrid for as long as he's been a footballer Why are people debating whether we could have afforded him?

[Ziltoid]

Who gives a flying fuck (I do in a way because i said to my lads that he was signing 3 years ago, as a bit of a laugh) 

[killer-heels]

If we paid a £128m transfer fee (payable to the selling club over 5 years) and £250k/week, would that be more acceptable to you

He was never coming here. He was destined to go Madrid and thats what he has done. The links with him were mental, driven by social media and the press constantly linking him with us to generate clicks.

[Fromola]

We slapped a big spending Barcelona side who replace Neymar with a £140m player and we would have beaten that Madrid side in 2018 before Mo's injury.

I'm just saying that people tend to get carried away. A "team" can compete with and beat them regardless. Buying many star players doesn't guarantee that they'll dominate European football.

However,  it doesn't fit into the narrative so I'll leave it there.

Real never have a manager who'll stay that long either like Guardiola or Klopp. Zidane was only there 3 or 4 years despite everything he won (and the CL's were a real fluke, they weren't even playing well in most of the ties and I think he only won the league once).

Real Madrid have only reclaimed the title ONCE since 1990 in what is most of the time a two team league and that's despite Galactico eras and some poor Barcelona teams and spells.

[Draex]

Why isn’t it smart?

Maybe smart is the wrong word, I meant it's not super clever scouting unearthing gems but more paying top dollar for the well known best players from South America v's for example how Brighton operate.

[Redley]

If we’re going on past precedence buying many star players does guarantee you dominate European football, I think that’s why Madrid currently have 14 Cls and have won like 5 of the last 10. Before that it was Barcelona who had star players, I think people like to delude themselves that this isn’t the case, when even during our best times we’ve lost two CL finals to Madrid teams who have a manager lesser than Klopp.

When did Barcelona dominate European football....? Their Suarez, Messi, Neymar team got to and won one final and that was it. Their win before that was literally homegrown plus Villa, Masch, Abidal and Alves (hardly Galactico's). And Real have had plenty of teams full of 'star players' that didnt dominate Europe (I might be wrong but I dont think their actual labelled Galactico's won the CL?).

[WhereAngelsPlay]

They're at 14 CL because they got a head start & help from the dictator.

[Nobby Reserve]

He was never coming here. He was destined to go Madrid and thats what he has done.

I'm not disputing that!

But people have been saying for years that we couldn't afford him so shouldn't even bother having a discussion on it. If (and I made the point earlier that I have some doubts) the figures quoted are correct, then it's very much in our affordability bracket.

Another point I made is that I don't think we actually wanted him at this point.

It also bloody annoys me how, especially over the past 10-20 years, a narrative has grown (assisted by a fawning media) that Madrid is the pinnacle of football clubs and all players worth a fig should have playing for them as their ultimate ambition. Proper fucks me off.

[Coolie High]

When did Barcelona dominate European football....? Their Suarez, Messi, Neymar team got to and won one final and that was it. Their win before that was literally homegrown plus Villa, Masch, Abidal and Alves (hardly Galactico's). And Real have had plenty of teams full of 'star players' that didnt dominate Europe (I might be wrong but I dont think their actual labelled Galactico's won the CL?).

The last 2 decades who has won more CLs than Madrid and Barcelona? How is Villa Alves Henry  Mascherano Messi Xavi Iniesta hardly Galaticos those were  the best players in the world.

And the labelled Galaticos did win the CL, the team with Figo and Zidane won it at Hampden Park against Leverkusen in 01-02.

[Coolie High]

They're at 14 CL because they got a head start & help from the dictator.

Right but they’ve also won 5 CL in the last 10 years.

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Right but they’ve also won 5 CL in the last 10 years.

And 6 whist they were nothing but a fascists toy playing in a cup that didn't include most countries.

[killer-heels]

I'm not disputing that!

But people have been saying for years that we couldn't afford him so shouldn't even bother having a discussion on it. If (and I made the point earlier that I have some doubts) the figures quoted are correct, then it's very much in our affordability bracket.

Another point I made is that I don't think we actually wanted him at this point.

It also bloody annoys me how, especially over the past 10-20 years, a narrative has grown (assisted by a fawning media) that Madrid is the pinnacle of football clubs and all players worth a fig should have playing for them as their ultimate ambition. Proper fucks me off.

But they all end up there. Unless you have a limitless budget, the very best players end up there and there is very little competition.

Which english club has signed the absolute best talents in Europe? Probably PSG with Mbappe, us with Van Dijk, City with Haaland. But the rest end up in Madrid.

[Vegeta]

Courtious
Frimpong ??- Rudiger - Militao - Davies
Camavinga ChuChumeni
Bellingham
Rodrygo / Valverde - Mbappe - ViniJNR


Could we something like this next season ??

[MonsLibpool]

The last 2 decades who has won more CLs than Madrid and Barcelona? How is Villa Alves Henry  Mascherano Messi Xavi Iniesta hardly Galaticos those were  the best players in the world.

And the labelled Galaticos did win the CL, the team with Figo and Zidane won it at Hampden Park against Leverkusen in 01-02.

So the same number as our team featuring the likes of Djimi Traore

[TheShanklyGates]

Has anyone checked on Mac Red?

[Boaty McBoatface]

Has anyone checked on Mac Red?

Closing his online Nike account.

[Coolie High]

So the same number as our team featuring the likes of Djimi Traore

Yep but they won a league also, you could flip it and say the same amount as our team featuring the likes of VVD Salah Trent Alisson.

[killer-heels]

Has anyone checked on Mac Red?

Mac ran off after we got beat by Arsenal. He seemed quite ashamed.

[MonsLibpool]

Yep but they won a league also, you could flip it and say the same amount as our team featuring the likes of VVD Salah Trent Alisson.

We didn't spent crazy money on Galacticos. People assumed they would dominate but a team like that with those players shouldn't go FOUR years without a trophy.

It's a team game. If players like Hendo, Gino and Millie can boss that 2018 Madrid team then we still have a good chance.

[ABZ Rover]

He’s a one man circus, the chief clown.  Hopefully he absolutely fucks that dressing room up.

[elbow]

This is so untrue, you have the rare example where it applies but most of the times the teams with the best players win the most trophies, this is exactly why Madrid have won the most CLs in the last 7 years and have us beat us in two finals despite us having a better team and manager.

Also the original Galaticos won a CL in 02-03.

How come City have only won one then?

[Coolie High]

How come City have only won one then?

Winning one CL is hard as it is, they don’t have the history or fans to push them over the edge when they’ve needed and Guardiola isn’t as good as someone like Ancelotti or Klopp in a cup setting.

They probably win it this year though saying that.

It’s hard to win the CL when you don’t have a couple of top 5 players in the world, we had that when we won it, Salah VVD Alisson Mane could argue to be top 5 players at the time.

I’m not saying we can’t get to that level again, what I’m saying is that when you’ve got the amount of top class players Madrid have and their history, then winning CLs becomes much easier, it’s wishful thinking to think it will all go pear shape.

It doesn’t take a once in a generation manager to get a team containing Mbappe, Bellingham, Valverde, Vini Jr, Camavinga to win a big trophy.

[Coolie High]

We didn't spent crazy money on Galacticos. People assumed they would dominate but a team like that with those players shouldn't go FOUR years without a trophy.

It's a team game. If players like Hendo, Gino and Millie can boss that 2018 Madrid team then we still have a good chance.

The thing is they have their own version of Hendo Gini and Millie, in Camavinga, Valverde and Tchouaméni, workhorse midfielders who can also play but have high endurance stamina and aren’t as good on the ball as some of the midfielders they’ve had in the past.

Also I’m not sure we bossed 2018 Madrid at all, I can remember many of us coming to the conclusion that we actually needed similar type midfielders to Modric and Kroos to play alongside our workhorses.

[elbow]

Well, I'm not throwing in the towel just yet. Fuck Madrid.

[harleydanger]

They're at 14 CL because they got a head start & help from the dictator.

One of the things that grinds my gears more than anything.

The first 5 were literally, in every sense of the word, against handpicked teams of farmers for them to beat.

yet everyone just goes along with the bullshit.

[harleydanger]

Well, I'm not throwing in the towel just yet. Fuck Madrid.

Do you really want m'bappe moving into the giant personality vacuum Klopp will leave at the club?

Disastrous.

[MonsLibpool]

The thing is they have their own version of Hendo Gini and Millie, in Camavinga, Valverde and Tchouaméni, workhorse midfielders who can also play but have high endurance stamina and aren’t as good on the ball as some of the midfielders they’ve had in the past.

Also I’m not sure we bossed 2018 Madrid at all, I can remember many of us coming to the conclusion that we actually needed similar type midfielders to Modric and Kroos to play alongside our workhorses.

They didn't get a kick until Ramos injured Salah. The mental gymnastics are unnecessary. They simply got bossed by a less talented set of players and they needed to injure a key man to regain control.

LOL at the comments about their current midfielders who are a lot more talented than you're giving them credit for.

[Knight]

They're building a new look team with some excellent players - however, they've still got it all to do. They still need to get the balance right amongst the group and starting x11.

Mbappe is a terrific player, but he does rock the boat in where the space he likes to operate in and one of their current best players Vinicus likes to work. That's not to say they won't find a solution, but it's also not a given they will work together well.

Their midfield is under going a change, and whilst they have excellent players, they will miss the likes of Kroos and Modric who were more elaborate on the ball than perhaps their existing players are who are more functional and reminiscent of our midfield triumphant of Hendo, Gini and Fabinho.

Their defense is not the strongest and their goalkeeper is coming towards the latter years in his career. Then there's Ancelotti - how long will he there for?

So it's no forgone conclusion this group will emulate the teams of the past decade.

Just re the midfield, obviously none of them are Modric but then who is? And Bellingham, Camavinga and Tchouameni are all brilliantly technically AND they’re supreme athletes. They’ll lose something by way of progressive passing with those 3 as opposed to Kroos and Modric (I just checked their progressive pass number son fbref and they’re both in the 98/99th percentile for it) but they’re all hugely press resistant and still able to progress the ball via passing or dribbling.

[Redley]

The last 2 decades who has won more CLs than Madrid and Barcelona? How is Villa Alves Henry  Mascherano Messi Xavi Iniesta hardly Galaticos those were  the best players in the world.

And the labelled Galaticos did win the CL, the team with Figo and Zidane won it at Hampden Park against Leverkusen in 01-02.

The actual Galacticos, when they'd signed Ronaldo and Beckham and were properly in the phase of signing one big star a season, didn't win it.

Barca were very much homegrown, plus a few really good players. Certainly not Galacticos in terms of signing big stars which is what your whole point was in the first place. Unless your point is that you need to have top players if you want to dominate Europe...? In which case yes, we all agree

Real have had one period of dominance (2014-2018) in the European Cup, ignoring the ridiculous 'trophy' they won at the start five times. Without that they're three ahead of us, and lucky not to just be one ahead of us considering the 2022 final. Certainly not proof that signing Galactico level stars guarantees success in Europe.