Author Topic: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.  (Read 8190 times)

Offline CornerFlag

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Breaking news.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-44696813
Quote
A "healthcare professional" has been arrested on suspicion of murdering eight babies and attempting to kill six others at a hospital.

Cheshire Police said the woman's arrest was a "significant step forward" in an investigation into deaths at the Countess of Chester Hospital.

Officers have been investigating the deaths of 17 newborns at the hospital between March 2015 and July 2016.

A spokesman said the probe also covered 15 "non-fatal collapses".


https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jul/03/healthcare-worker-arrested-murder-eight-babies-cheshire-neonatal-unit
Quote
A healthcare worker has been arrested on suspicion of murdering eight babies and attempting to kill another six as part of an investigation into the neonatal unit at the Countess of Chester hospital.

Cheshire police said the woman was arrested on Tuesday morning and was in custody.

The force said it was investigating the deaths of 17 babies and 15 “non-fatal collapses” between June 2015 and June 2016.

DI Paul Hughes, who is in charge of the investigation, said: “Whilst this is a significant step forward in our enquiries it is important to remember that the investigation is very much active and ongoing at this stage.

“There are no set timescales for this coming to a conclusion but we remain committed to carrying out a thorough investigation as soon as possible.”
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Offline CraigDS

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #1 on: July 3, 2018, 10:51:13 am »
Got to wonder how so many deaths, and so much time, have been able to happen before (I assume) this was investigated and someone arrested.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #2 on: July 3, 2018, 10:59:25 am »
I remember in the 90s the Beverley Allitt case and this just makes me think along the same lines.  Horrendous and made me hug my little boy when I first read it.
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Offline Fortneef

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #3 on: July 3, 2018, 02:22:25 pm »
Lets also keep Lucia de Berk in mind until the evidence is in.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #4 on: July 3, 2018, 02:42:12 pm »
Lets also keep Lucia de Berk in mind until the evidence is in.

For anyone interested;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucia_de_Berk

You would hope that the police are aware of this and other cases, particularly cot death cases, where amateurish attempts at statistical analysis have resulted in miscarriages of justice.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #5 on: July 3, 2018, 05:39:01 pm »
Got to wonder how so many deaths, and so much time, have been able to happen before (I assume) this was investigated and someone arrested.
8 seems quite low, so for it to cause a spike significant enough to cause an investigation must mean fatalities are incredibly low at the hospital. I actually think it's good it caught so soon, assuming the professional is guilty.
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Offline CraigDS

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #6 on: July 3, 2018, 05:44:41 pm »
8 seems quite low, so for it to cause a spike significant enough to cause an investigation must mean fatalities are incredibly low at the hospital. I actually think it's good it caught so soon, assuming the professional is guilty.

She's been arrested on 8 deaths, but there were 17 during the 15 month period in question, plus a further 15 near deaths.

I'm not sure what newborn death rates are like but that sounded pretty high to me.

Offline Shankly998

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #7 on: July 4, 2018, 07:04:47 pm »
Do we think it's right to publicly name this person in every national newspaper when they've been arrested on suspicion of committing a crime but not yet actually charged?

I'd argue no as a result of this even if she's subsequently acquitted her career is almost certainly over as unfortunately mud sticks no one is going to take the risk of hiring someone as a nurse who's been publicly accused of such a crime not to mention the psychological impact on the defendant and damage to personal relationships of having your name plastered all over the place as a suspected baby killer. I'd argue there should be an injunction about reporting this publicly (Obviously the police can keep the parents of babies up to date) at least until the defendant is actually charged and court proceedings are going to happen.

I have no idea whether she is guilty or not but the fact this came to light as a result of an audit highlighting a statistical anomaly about an increased incidence of death when she will have been a nurse on the wards at the time makes me more likely to want an injunction. From reading the news reports the evidence seems circumstantial about the case there was appears to be no obvious motive and no obvious link between how the babies died (not a common method of killing like Shipman and morphine).

A CQC report mentions poor staffing at this hospital as well which could be contributory factor if they were not being monitored like they should have been which led to the increase in deaths, some of the diagnoses could have been incorrect and the babies sicker than originally thought. There's lots of things that can explain statistical anomalies and correlation does not equal causation. All I've said is based on information that's publicly available undoubtedly there'll be stuff going on we don't know about. Given what we know however it just doesn't sit right with me about this has been handled.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #8 on: July 4, 2018, 07:07:13 pm »
Yeah thought it was shocking she had been named personally. There really needs to be more control on the media and naming those who are ultimately innocent until proven guilty.

Offline drmick

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #9 on: July 4, 2018, 07:19:21 pm »
If she is innocent, the damages would be massive, so she'll be alright for a bob or two.

Offline Shankly998

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #10 on: July 4, 2018, 08:22:01 pm »
If she is innocent, the damages would be massive, so she'll be alright for a bob or two.

That's another issue if she is innocent the taxpayer will be on the hook for massive compensation because of the fact there isn't an injunction.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #11 on: July 4, 2018, 08:24:05 pm »
Do we think it's right to publicly name this person in every national newspaper when they've been arrested on suspicion of committing a crime but not yet actually charged?

I'd argue no as a result of this even if she's subsequently acquitted her career is almost certainly over as unfortunately mud sticks no one is going to take the risk of hiring someone as a nurse who's been publicly accused of such a crime not to mention the psychological impact on the defendant and damage to personal relationships of having your name plastered all over the place as a suspected baby killer. I'd argue there should be an injunction about reporting this publicly (Obviously the police can keep the parents of babies up to date) at least until the defendant is actually charged and court proceedings are going to happen.

I have no idea whether she is guilty or not but the fact this came to light as a result of an audit highlighting a statistical anomaly about an increased incidence of death when she will have been a nurse on the wards at the time makes me more likely to want an injunction. From reading the news reports the evidence seems circumstantial about the case there was appears to be no obvious motive and no obvious link between how the babies died (not a common method of killing like Shipman and morphine).

A CQC report mentions poor staffing at this hospital as well which could be contributory factor if they were not being monitored like they should have been which led to the increase in deaths, some of the diagnoses could have been incorrect and the babies sicker than originally thought. There's lots of things that can explain statistical anomalies and correlation does not equal causation. All I've said is based on information that's publicly available undoubtedly there'll be stuff going on we don't know about. Given what we know however it just doesn't sit right with me about this has been handled.

Agreed, remember a few years ago that nurse named & vilified over at poisoning deaths at one of the Hospitals in Stockport, turned out she was innocent, & someone else ended up being tried & convicted, the Media never learn.
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Offline Shankly998

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #12 on: July 4, 2018, 10:24:39 pm »
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jul/04/cheshire-baby-deaths-nurse-questioned-suspicion-murder-lucy-letby


Quote
A report by the Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health in May said staffing at the hospital’s neonatal unit, which reported a “higher than usual” number of baby deaths, was inadequate.


The review found no definitive explanation for an increase in mortality rates, but identified significant gaps in medical and nursing rotas, poor decision making and insufficient senior cover.

A mother who has spoken to detectives investigating the deaths of multiple babies at the Countess of Chester said she would never have any more children after being left traumatised by her experience, and she called for a wider inquiry.

The woman, who wished to remain anonymous, told the Guardian her son was born at the hospital by an emergency cesarean section in September 2015 and spent two days in the neonatal unit.

She said: “My son stopped breathing after I was induced and the negligence in the hospital was absolutely horrendous from the start. They had no staff and the care was just terrible. Some of the midwives were lovely but the majority weren’t. I ended up having a horrendous time after giving birth.

“My son was in the neonatal unit and I developed an infection which was due to negligence by a member of staff. We made a complaint at the time but it was brushed under the carpet.”

A spokesman for Countess of Chester Hospital NHS foundation trust said: “We will not be commenting further at this time due to the ongoing police investigation.”

A Liverpool women’s trust spokesperson said: “We are co-operating with police as part of their investigation which includes a routine review of patients cared for on our neonatal unit during the time of these placements.

“There is currently no suggestion that any patients at Liverpool Women’s came to any harm in relation to this investigation.”

You'd think the above explanation would be more likely for the increase in mortality rates rather than a rogue cold blood murderer. Someone acting negligently is far more likely than them being a murderer but again these are just the opinions of someone who doesn't have the full facts.

Offline Jake

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #13 on: July 4, 2018, 10:50:25 pm »
I really hope this was just some tragic anomaly. My partner works for the NHS and it's like that on every ward, not enough nurses, healthcare assistants on minimum wage doing medical jobs they're not adequately trained for. It's a wonder it runs as well as it does considering. She's told me stories of how people nearly die all the time cos noone was bright enough to step in and do the right thing due to a lack of training or just being lazy/thick as pig shit. It's awful.

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Offline Alan_X

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #14 on: July 5, 2018, 06:28:11 am »
Can we keep this about the story? I hope we can all agree that the state of the NHS is not an excuse for someone murdering babies if that's what the evidence shows.

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Offline RedGlen

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #15 on: July 5, 2018, 06:44:24 am »
This reminds me of the case of Lucia De Berk - a nurse who was convicted of murder based on statistical evidence that it was extremely improbable that she would have been the nurse on staff for a large number of deaths, without having contributed to them in some way. It was later found that the statistical analysis was extremely flawed, and the nurse had not in fact been on shift for some of the murders she was convicted of. But by this point she had spent 6 years in jail. Oops. There was also little evidence of wrongdoing medically speaking.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucia_de_Berk

I agree with posters who don't think her name should have been released and publicised. At the time of writing this, she has just been detained for questioning, not charged with murder. You would hope they must be damned sure she deliberately murdered those babies, or else they have potentially ruined the life of what seems to be a committed professional.

See also: faulty reasoning based on shift patterns also damned Rebecca Leighton - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/11612700/Stepping-Hill-Rebecca-Leighton-The-innocent-nurse-who-was-wrongly-blamed-for-Chuas-killing-spree.html
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Offline Jiminy Cricket

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #16 on: July 5, 2018, 07:51:13 am »
It is so easy to jump to the wrong conclusions with probability. Even so-called experts (I mean, some who have given evidence as 'official' experts) have got it horribly wrong at trial in the past (cot death syndrome, for example). One thing which is often overlooked by casual observers (I only know enough to know that I know nothing) is that when you monitor large numbers of people looking for an unlikely occurrence, there actually can be a good chance of the anomaly occurring purely by chance to someone within that population. If I explain it like this: if you monitor the UK population for a lottery winner, and you find one, you would think, well, the chance of that individual winning the lottery is tiny (1 in 13,000,000). Yes, this is true for that one winner. But, when you multiply that possibility by all the people playing, the chances of finding a winner (or loser, as in the case of at least one nurse already exampled in this thread) is actually very good. And this is just one of the ways in which people (and even some of those who have set themselves up as experts) can be caught out.
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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #17 on: July 5, 2018, 08:25:40 am »
Got to wonder how so many deaths, and so much time, have been able to happen before (I assume) this was investigated and someone arrested.

Because some babies just die, its normal unfortunately.

There was a graph with the statistics in one of the articles. It sounded like an anomaly in the statistics triggered an investigation, and not one or more 'suspicious' deaths. Statistically this is fairly simple, you compare the death rate at one hospital with the average, and there are some some tests (calculations) that tell you whether or not the rate from the hospital tested is within statistically to-be-expected variability, or not.



Agree that she shouldn't have been named, why the fuck do they do that especially on such a sensitive subject?
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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #18 on: July 5, 2018, 08:31:31 am »
She wasn't being named. As I understand it, The Sun broke ranks and put her name and picture out there and the others followed suit. How surprising.

Offline rob1966

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #19 on: July 5, 2018, 08:41:52 am »
Agreed, remember a few years ago that nurse named & vilified over at poisoning deaths at one of the Hospitals in Stockport, turned out she was innocent, & someone else ended up being tried & convicted, the Media never learn.

Definitely should have to right to anonymity at this point in time. Right now this person is innocent, yet the hate mobs will have already found her guilty and will be branding her all kinds of names, threating death etc and the red top rags will inflame the hatred. If it turns out she has nothing to do with it, the same as the nurse in Stockport, no amount of compensation will make up for the things that will have and will continue to happen. Mud sticks, people will always have suspicions, she will not be trusted by parents, it could ruin her life.
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Offline CraigDS

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #20 on: July 5, 2018, 08:43:47 am »
Because some babies just die, its normal unfortunately.

There was a graph with the statistics in one of the articles. It sounded like an anomaly in the statistics triggered an investigation, and not one or more 'suspicious' deaths. Statistically this is fairly simple, you compare the death rate at one hospital with the average, and there are some some tests (calculations) that tell you whether or not the rate from the hospital tested is within statistically to-be-expected variability, or not.

Yeah I'm not an idiot I got all that  ;D

My point was more that the numbers seemed, to me as someone who hasn't no idea about the current baby death rates, relatively high (15 deaths and 17 near deaths - not sure if these are the total numbers either) in about 15 months. So was wondering why it took 15 months for something to be triggered, or more importantly (because I'm not sure when the investigation started) why it seems to have taken year(s) before it was looked into.

Offline rob1966

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #21 on: July 5, 2018, 09:23:10 am »
Yeah I'm not an idiot I got all that  ;D

My point was more that the numbers seemed, to me as someone who hasn't no idea about the current baby death rates, relatively high (15 deaths and 17 near deaths - not sure if these are the total numbers either) in about 15 months. So was wondering why it took 15 months for something to be triggered, or more importantly (because I'm not sure when the investigation started) why it seems to have taken year(s) before it was looked into.

Story from the Echo in June last year gives the rates and both the Womens Hospital and Countess of Chester name as having high rates - the womens hospital is a special case due to the higher risk births it takes. While it gives the figures for total deaths and neonatal, it doesn't say whether the spikes are in stillbirths or neonatal deaths.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/death-rates-liverpool-womens-countess-13220778

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #22 on: July 5, 2018, 09:50:38 am »
Yeah I'm not an idiot I got all that  ;D

My point was more that the numbers seemed, to me as someone who hasn't no idea about the current baby death rates, relatively high (15 deaths and 17 near deaths - not sure if these are the total numbers either) in about 15 months. So was wondering why it took 15 months for something to be triggered, or more importantly (because I'm not sure when the investigation started) why it seems to have taken year(s) before it was looked into.

The investigation started in May last year at the latest. That’s from yesterday’s Guardian.
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Offline redbyrdz

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #23 on: July 5, 2018, 11:43:17 am »
Yeah I'm not an idiot I got all that  ;D

My point was more that the numbers seemed, to me as someone who hasn't no idea about the current baby death rates, relatively high (15 deaths and 17 near deaths - not sure if these are the total numbers either) in about 15 months. So was wondering why it took 15 months for something to be triggered, or more importantly (because I'm not sure when the investigation started) why it seems to have taken year(s) before it was looked into.

Think they collect data annually, so the earliest they could start looking into it from the statistics is a year later. However, given how long it takes to collect data and compile reports, at least 6 months on top of that is more reasonable. And then they probably wait for another year (and data) before they start doing something.
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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #24 on: July 5, 2018, 11:46:06 am »
Think they collect data annually, so the earliest they could start looking into it from the statistics is a year later. However, given how long it takes to collect data and compile reports, at least 6 months on top of that is more reasonable. And then they probably wait for another year (and data) before they start doing something.

Seems long winded for something that could be monitored internally pretty easily and on an ongoing basis.

Offline Peabee

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #25 on: July 5, 2018, 05:24:47 pm »
Yeah I'm not an idiot I got all that  ;D

My point was more that the numbers seemed, to me as someone who hasn't no idea about the current baby death rates, relatively high (15 deaths and 17 near deaths - not sure if these are the total numbers either) in about 15 months. So was wondering why it took 15 months for something to be triggered, or more importantly (because I'm not sure when the investigation started) why it seems to have taken year(s) before it was looked into.

They generally receive stats periodically, with a delay since the reports have to be compiled. They will have their own internal data, but they have to wait for the annual NHS reports to compare against the average etc. They reviewed the stats, found an anomaly, carried out their own investigation, couldn’t find any reasonable explanation and then contacted the police. The police have been collecting evidence for over a year before making an arrest.

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Offline Zeb

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #26 on: July 5, 2018, 06:00:27 pm »
Do we think it's right to publicly name this person in every national newspaper when they've been arrested on suspicion of committing a crime but not yet actually charged?

No, it's wrong to do that until someone is charged. I was a strange kid but when I heard 'someone is helping the police with their inquiries' on the news I always imagined that person was like, well, Sherlock Holmes. But that's the right level of anonymity until someone is charged. Someone wrongly charged and proven innocent get their day in court. Someone released without charge has their name tarnished with just a footnote correcting the record. Just a basic decency thing in my eyes.
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Offline Peabee

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #27 on: July 5, 2018, 06:50:37 pm »
No, it's wrong to do that until someone is charged. I was a strange kid but when I heard 'someone is helping the police with their inquiries' on the news I always imagined that person was like, well, Sherlock Holmes. But that's the right level of anonymity until someone is charged. Someone wrongly charged and proven innocent get their day in court. Someone released without charge has their name tarnished with just a footnote correcting the record. Just a basic decency thing in my eyes.

The police haven’t named her. But it would be quite difficult to keep her name out of the public domain given they’re currently digging up her garden...
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Offline CraigDS

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #28 on: July 5, 2018, 06:56:17 pm »
The police haven’t named her. But it would be quite difficult to keep her name out of the public domain given they’re currently digging up her garden...

It would be hard to completely keep it out, but the majority of the general public wouldn't have a clue what her name was if the likes of the BBC (ran it as the main story with her picture) and other mainstream media didn't run with it.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #29 on: July 5, 2018, 07:25:38 pm »
If she is innocent, the damages would be massive, so she'll be alright for a bob or two.


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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #30 on: July 5, 2018, 07:50:59 pm »
If she is innocent, the damages would be massive, so she'll be alright for a bob or two.

The question of damages will depend on how the media are reporting. If it is fairly straightforward - she worked there, lived here, studied there - she probably wouldn't have any grounds to sue.

That is unless the media go over the top, like they did with Christopher Jeffries.

Offline Andar

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #31 on: October 13, 2022, 03:46:01 pm »
Pure anger when reading this.

The evil that lives amongst us.

Offline Shankly998

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #32 on: October 13, 2022, 03:58:11 pm »
It's all definitely extremely suspicious her involvement in all this but the prosecution mustn't have any slam dunk evidence otherwise the trial wouldn't be expected to last 6 months.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #33 on: October 13, 2022, 04:04:36 pm »
It's all definitely extremely suspicious her involvement in all this but the prosecution mustn't have any slam dunk evidence otherwise the trial wouldn't be expected to last 6 months.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/oct/13/lucy-letby-police-found-note-saying-i-killed-them-on-purpose-court-hears

She seems pretty certain of her own guilt.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2022, 04:09:02 pm »
It's doubly bewildering that somebody would commit such crimes and also that they be able to get away with it and impact so many families before finally being stopped.  I guess the court case may uncover any motives but it feels like safeguards have to be in place to stop such individuals gaining access to the most vulnerable.  I say that from a position of ignorance though as I don't know the ebb and flow of a maternity ward.

It's heartbreaking for the families.  I'd be a wreck if my baby died naturally but knowing that they were (allegedly) one of many murder victims of a medical professional would make it that much worse.

Offline Shankly998

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2022, 04:10:36 pm »
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/oct/13/lucy-letby-police-found-note-saying-i-killed-them-on-purpose-court-hears

She seems pretty certain of her own guilt.

She also says the complete opposite in some of the other notes. Definitely weird don't get me wrong but maybe the actions of someone going through a breakdown who knows.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2022, 04:23:31 pm »
She also says the complete opposite in some of the other notes. Definitely weird don't get me wrong but maybe the actions of someone going through a breakdown who knows.


Sounds like she belongs in Broadmoor for the rest of her life. Evil bitch. Thankfully for her, Savile's dead now.

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2022, 05:36:28 pm »
She also says the complete opposite in some of the other notes. Definitely weird don't get me wrong but maybe the actions of someone going through a breakdown who knows.

I've been following the case, as it's pretty unique.  Sounds like she's got serious psychological issues.  She'll be alongside Beverly Allitt - an infamous, child serial killer, who will likely never leave a secure hospital.

Same MO too:

Quote
Beverley Gail Allitt (born 4 October 1968) is an English serial child killer who was convicted of murdering four children, attempting to murder three other children, and causing grievous bodily harm to a further six.[1]

The crimes were committed over a period of 59 days from February to April 1991 in the children's ward at Grantham and Kesteven Hospital, Lincolnshire, where Allitt was employed as a State Enrolled Nurse.[2][3][4] She allegedly administered large doses of insulin to at least two of her victims, and a large air bubble was found in the body of another, but police were unable to establish how all the attacks were carried out.[5]

In May 1993, at Nottingham Crown Court, she received thirteen life sentences for the crimes. Mr Justice Latham, sentencing, told Allitt that she was "a serious danger" to others and was unlikely ever to be considered safe enough to be released.[6][7] She is detained at Rampton Secure Hospital in Nottinghamshire.[8]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beverley_Allitt
« Last Edit: October 13, 2022, 05:38:15 pm by Red-Soldier »

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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2022, 05:44:37 pm »
This case is severely testing my opposition to the death penalty.
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Re: Infanticide at Countess of Chester Hospital: Woman arrested.
« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2022, 06:04:21 pm »
She also says the complete opposite in some of the other notes. Definitely weird don't get me wrong but maybe the actions of someone going through a breakdown who knows.

Not much to be read into that.That would be her survival instinct fighting in.

“I will never have children or marry. I will never know what it’s like to have a family”

This is quite a specific statement from her and the most revealing. It goes some way to explaining her motive.