Topic: FSG (*)

[Doc Red]

What contrary factual evidence.

You are passing other people's opinions of as fact and then using it as a stick to beat me with.

I will say it again when the highest rated players on the global stage become available we aren't there competing whatever the age group. Someone earlier was trying to pass Danny Ings off as an example of us targeting the World's best young players. It is laughable. You try and pass yourself off as neutral but only really seem to disagree with people who question FSG.

You then come up with the best bit which is that me being constantly attacked is proof that it is somehow my fault. Get to fuck even when i don't post in here I still get attacked. For me the reason is crystal clear anyone who questions FSG gets the same response.

Even Graham who has done more for the supporters than the lot of you put together constantly has his motives questioned.

Top post, Al.
Having an opinion that isn't of the majority doesn't make you wrong, and the opinions of the majority aren't automatically correct simply because they are of the majority.
Additionally, it should be noted that there are plenty of posters that agree with plenty of Al's points, but they're just not as active in this thread and even if they were, it's only natural that more members will rally around and defend a critique of the owners and club officials than will rally around and defend a critique of Al.

FSG purchased Liverpool on October 2010. That's 5 full seasons + 3/4 of a season + the current season.
Looking back, how many of us believed that 6.5 years later all we would have to show as footballing success from their ownership would be 1 carling cup trophy, one title race, we'd be on our 4th coach, only once qualifed for the Champions league (obviously this season is still up for grabs), and only once finished above 6th place? That in the subsequent 6 season final standings since their ownership, we would finish 6th twice, 8th twice, and 7th once?
That during their reign, we would also end up selling some of our best offensive players?

We've had 12 transfer windows with FSG in charge, 6 of them Summer windows. How would you grade them over those 12 windows? How many times has our transfer policy seemed to change and alter, only to return to the initial premise of purchasing young and ignoring players above ages 25? How many different transfer models or structures ahve we had? Every single manager we've had has been blamed for our transfer policies and transfers in general, up to and including Klopp ("FSG were willing but Klopp didn't want to spend above his valuation of "X" player").

At what point do we start saying "the buck stops with the owners". That they can quite clearly do much better than they have done, and are doing. Is the Klopp signing the beginning of a new start whereby the club structure off the pitch is aligned with the need for footballing success on the pitch, or is it an anomoly, a case of being in the right place at the right time, akin to our title challenge in 2013-14? I hope it's the former, but judging from our 3 windows under Klopp, the same obstacles still seem to be in play and I really do worry it's the latter scenario.

[Eeyore]

Top post, Al.
Having an opinion that isn't of the majority doesn't make you wrong, and the opinions of the majority aren't automatically correct simply because they are of the majority.
Additionally, it should be noted that there are plenty of posters that agree with plenty of Al's points, but they're just not as active in this thread and even if they were, it's only natural that more members will rally around and defend a critique of the owners and club officials than will rally around and defend a critique of Al.

FSG purchased Liverpool on October 2010. That's 5 full seasons + 3/4 of a season + the current season.
Looking back, how many of us believed that 6.5 years later all we would have to show as footballing success from their ownership would be 1 carling cup trophy, one title race, we'd be on our 4th coach, only once qualifed for the Champions league (obviously this season is still up for grabs), and only once finished above 6th place? That in the subsequent 6 season final standings since their ownership, we would finish 6th twice, 8th twice, and 7th once?
That during their reign, we would also end up selling some of our best offensive players?

We've had 12 transfer windows with FSG in charge, 6 of them Summer windows. How would you grade them over those 12 windows? How many times has our transfer policy seemed to change and alter, only to return to the initial premise of purchasing young and ignoring players above ages 25? How many different transfer models or structures ahve we had? Every single manager we've had has been blamed for our transfer policies and transfers in general, up to and including Klopp ("FSG were willing but Klopp didn't want to spend above his valuation of "X" player").

At what point do we start saying "the buck stops with the owners". That they can quite clearly do much better than they have done, and are doing. Is the Klopp signing the beginning of a new start whereby the club structure off the pitch is aligned with the need for footballing success on the pitch, or is it an anomoly, a case of being in the right place at the right time, akin to our title challenge in 2013-14? I hope it's the former, but judging from our 3 windows under Klopp, the same obstacles still seem to be in play and I really do worry it's the latter scenario.

Exactly, we aren't after a sugar daddy or looking to run FSG out of town. Just a sensible evaluation of how we have performed since they arrived and how we can achieve what we all want us to achieve in the future.

[jambutty]

FSG purchased Liverpool on October 2010. That's 5 full seasons + 3/4 of a season + the current season.
Looking back, how many of us believed that 6.5 years later all we would have to show as footballing success from their ownership would be 1 carling cup trophy, one title race, we'd be on our 4th coach, only once qualifed for the Champions league (obviously this season is still up for grabs), and only once finished above 6th place?

Why, because we are the Great Liverpool of 30 years ago?

After H&G we could be fucking bankrupt under Mill Financial, mate.

FSG has done pretty well beating the top teams in England this season considering they knew fuck all about footy.

[Chris~]

For Sterlings age group yes absolutely. I know you watch the under age teams mate and for me he was head and shoulders above his peers week in week out. As for Brewster it is just a personal opinion, he may well flop but for me he has got a lot of the raw ingredients needed to make it.

Sterling stood out more as the standard was a lot lower in England at the time, in his 94 age group it was basically him and Chalobah then not a lot else, Nick Powell maybe. It was also harder to really say how he stood out worldwide as England barely ventured out of the victory shield for matches at u16 level and didn't even have an u15 side. Now they do travel the world a lot more and players like Longstaff get glowing reports:

tariq panja‏Verified account
@tariqpanja

Chatting to a Brazil youth coach who can't stop raving about Liverpool youngster Luis Longstaff after Eng U16 visit. "Reminds me of Ozil"

To be honest I don't get the Ozil comparison much, but it back up my point a bit. 

Plus we're now bringing through local players who are looking really fucking good, not just buying them in. That's surely a big positive under FSG.

 

[Butcher Knife Roberto]

Top post, Al.
Having an opinion that isn't of the majority doesn't make you wrong, and the opinions of the majority aren't automatically correct simply because they are of the majority.
Additionally, it should be noted that there are plenty of posters that agree with plenty of Al's points, but they're just not as active in this thread and even if they were, it's only natural that more members will rally around and defend a critique of the owners and club officials than will rally around and defend a critique of Al.

FSG purchased Liverpool on October 2010. That's 5 full seasons + 3/4 of a season + the current season.
Looking back, how many of us believed that 6.5 years later all we would have to show as footballing success from their ownership would be 1 carling cup trophy, one title race, we'd be on our 4th coach, only once qualifed for the Champions league (obviously this season is still up for grabs), and only once finished above 6th place? That in the subsequent 6 season final standings since their ownership, we would finish 6th twice, 8th twice, and 7th once?
That during their reign, we would also end up selling some of our best offensive players?

We've had 12 transfer windows with FSG in charge, 6 of them Summer windows. How would you grade them over those 12 windows? How many times has our transfer policy seemed to change and alter, only to return to the initial premise of purchasing young and ignoring players above ages 25? How many different transfer models or structures ahve we had? Every single manager we've had has been blamed for our transfer policies and transfers in general, up to and including Klopp ("FSG were willing but Klopp didn't want to spend above his valuation of "X" player").

At what point do we start saying "the buck stops with the owners". That they can quite clearly do much better than they have done, and are doing. Is the Klopp signing the beginning of a new start whereby the club structure off the pitch is aligned with the need for footballing success on the pitch, or is it an anomoly, a case of being in the right place at the right time, akin to our title challenge in 2013-14? I hope it's the former, but judging from our 3 windows under Klopp, the same obstacles still seem to be in play and I really do worry it's the latter scenario.

  nail on the fucking head. I'm sure the slicing and dicing of the TV money is providing a nice return to LeBron James et al. Why be world class when you can just be good and ensure you stay within the gravy train? It's not FSG's fault that they are in a position to exploit a goldmine of money, it's the Premier League peddling its wares for billions when the league, in reality, is a pile of fucking shite. I mean who the fuck would pay billions to watch Hull vs Stoke? Bollocks my arse it's the greatest league in the world. Overpriced, overhyped shite is what not is. FSG have simply seen a fantastic investment opportunity.

[Doc Red]

Why, because we are the Great Liverpool of 30 years ago?

After H&G we could be fucking bankrupt under Mill Financial, mate.

FSG has done pretty well beating the top teams in England this season considering they knew fuck all about footy.

 We've finished the season ranked 6th twice, 8th twice, 7th once, and 2nd once. And yes, we're also beating the top teams in England this season, though we are still fighting for the 3-4th place. Even if we finish the season in 3rd, our record during their reign has been the worst run we've been on since we got relegated.
Forget about Liverpool of 30 years ago, I'd take the Liverpool success of the 2000s, or even the mid-late 90s.

[SerbianScouser]

Forget about Liverpool of 30 years ago, I'd take the Liverpool success of the 2000s, or even the mid-late 90s.

Then show some freaking patience. Klopp's era has just started.

[wellred82]

So has anyone's opinion on them changed in light of the Torres piece?

Useless even back then. And even Torres himself nailed it when he said the club can't be run day to day by the owners. The role needs someone who understands football. I'm not sure if the comment about the club telling him they didn't think Suarez would be a goal getter was genuine on part of the club or just a line to keep him there a bit longer. If the former it highlights how inept they were back then.

Hate how the club put a negative spin on things to discredit him on the way out too. Taints the clubs imagine in my mind just a bit.

7 years on and with the same philosophy we haven't developed as much as we should have done. It's been 2 steps forward 1 and a half steps back. Fortunately in Klopp they have someone who can get the best out of the team.

And their strategy is to rely on him whilst not shelling out for proven quality. Maybe they get lucky and Klopp develops a few players who could be sold for profit.


[You may have an iPhone but you are still using the free version of Tapatalk and spamming us with that knowledge]

[rickardinho1]

Would be nice if Mr Henry would update his open letter from 2012.

Liverpool Football Club's principal owner John W Henry has written the following open letter to supporters:

[snip]

But a summer window which brought in three young, but significantly talented starters in Joe Allen, Nuri Sahin and Fabio Borini as well as two exciting young potential stars of the future - Samed Yesil and Oussama Assaidi - could hardly be deemed a failure as we build for the future. 

[snip]

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/john-henry-s-open-letter-to-fans

"Significantly talented starters".... "stars of the future" 

[PeterTheRed ...]

To be honest, it is not FSG's fault that we have spent £35 million on Carroll and £32.5 million on Benteke.

[El Lobo]

Nothing sank. Just pointing it out that you're hypocrite. Happy to call the owners out yourself in the past, but critical and dismissive of those that do so now.

Criticising them for making mistakes and bad decisions but now recognising they're in the past and as a club we're moving forward isn't hypocritical mate, it's balance. That's sort of the point.

[Doc Red]

Then show some freaking patience. Klopp's era has just started.

Patience?
This will be their 7th season at the helm. Should we wait another 7 before voicing our concerns ?
You don't just get to erase their tenure and start from zero everytime they bring in a manager. New manager, same owners.

[SerbianScouser]

New manager, same owners.

Same owners who are massively improving with their performance last two years or so. New massive stand, new training ground on its way, world class manager who is making massive progress with his team in his second season. It doesn't look like same owners to me, it looks like owners  who are improving and making significantly bigger impact on and off the pitch. If you can't see that but want to focus on initial period where they inherited a proper mess then that's just sad.

[rickardinho1]

Same owners who are massively improving with their performance last two years or so. New massive stand, new training ground on its way, world class manager who is making massive progress with his team in his second season. It doesn't look like same owners to me, it looks like owners  who are improving and making significantly bigger impact on and off the pitch. If you can't see that but want to focus on initial period where they inherited a proper mess then that's just sad.

You just need to look at the state of the current squad compared to the dross that has been shifted out to see that significant progress is being made. Granted, much of that dross was brought in during the early FSG years, but the important thing is that they've corrected it and seem to have found a good formula for success know with Klopp.

[El Lobo]

Patience?
This will be their 7th season at the helm. Should we wait another 7 before voicing our concerns ?
You don't just get to erase their tenure and start from zero everytime they bring in a manager. New manager, same owners.

Honestly lads, there's enough of you in this thread.

If you feel that strongly, do something about it. You're all grown ups, you're all able to organise something. So do it. Just giving it large in a thread on RAWK when you're that concerned about the direction the club is being led doesn't actually say much for how you see the club. Why not try and get some protests started to get them out?

[trimore]

Patience?
This will be their 7th season at the helm. Should we wait another 7 before voicing our concerns ?
You don't just get to erase their tenure and start from zero everytime they bring in a manager. New manager, same owners.

7 years starting from nothing. They knew nothing when they started. They thought buying Andy Carrol for 35 million was a good idea.

It takes over decade for people to become an expert in a diificult, competitive field. Ask any lawyer, any doctor, scientists etc. Understanding all the nuances take time.

[jooneyisdagod]

Patience?
This will be their 7th season at the helm. Should we wait another 7 before voicing our concerns ?
You don't just get to erase their tenure and start from zero everytime they bring in a manager. New manager, same owners.

Are they making the same mistakes they were making at the start of the tenure now? Or do you think they're making different mistakes? 

[surfer. Fuck you generator.]

Financially sound, poor to below average in creating a power structure and recruiting personnel to take the club forward. The latter is not set in stone, but their record in that regard can improve a fair bit, hopefully starting with klopp.

[Eeyore]

Criticising them for making mistakes and bad decisions but now recognising they're in the past and as a club we're moving forward isn't hypocritical mate, it's balance. That's sort of the point.

Except they are still making the same mistakes over and over again. Appointing a MD/CEO with zero football experience, appointing a DoF/SD with no track record of success, going into the season with a squad that can't compete when we have to play more than once a week, failing to recruit in January.

[Eeyore]

7 years starting from nothing. They knew nothing when they started. They thought buying Andy Carrol for 35 million was a good idea.

It takes over decade for people to become an expert in a diificult, competitive field. Ask any lawyer, any doctor, scientists etc. Understanding all the nuances take time.

Appoint experienced football people with a track record of success, problem solved.

[thisyearisouryear]

Same owners who are massively improving with their performance last two years or so. New massive stand, new training ground on its way, world class manager who is making massive progress with his team in his second season. It doesn't look like same owners to me, it looks like owners  who are improving and making significantly bigger impact on and off the pitch. If you can't see that but want to focus on initial period where they inherited a proper mess then that's just sad.

Exactly! I am all for criticizing the past fuck ups by FSG but I just don't understand how people can't see the improvement in the last couple of years. I mean of all the years under their ownership, this is probably the one time they seem to be doing things right. It takes a special intensity of negativity to not recognize that.

Also owners are largely responsible for two things - 1. Funding the club (which they have done within the club's means) 2. Appointing the right people to run the club (here they were a hit and miss in the beginning, but things seem to be improving).

Also, I don't see how are our transfer failings can 'entirely' be put on FSG. Of course they share the blame because they recruited the people who brought in the dross and the buck stops at the top guy but I don't see owners of any other club getting so much flak for failed transfers. It is usually the manager and the staff. Owners get shit when they act skint (Ashley at Newcastle).

[thisyearisouryear]

Except they are still making the same mistakes over and over again. Appointing a MD/CEO with zero football experience, appointing a DoF/SD with no track record of success, going into the season with a squad that can't compete when we have to play more than once a week, failing to recruit in January.

Which MD/CEO has substantial football experience in PL? I know I can google, but in case you already know...
And how do you measure Edwards's lack of success in his past roles?
Regarding the last bit, doesn't this fall into Klopp's domain? I have seen no evidence of even the slightest displeasure from Klopp at being handicapped in the transfer market by the owners.

[trimore]

Appoint experienced football people with a track record of success, problem solved.

Jesus. Come one, 200+ pages in and you still can't debate seriously? It's not that simple, it never is in anything difficult.

Who are these people, Mark Lawerson? Robbie Fowler? Stan Collymore? The average Brit ex-footballer is a fucking moron. Random Hamburger SV ex-DoF? Europe is littered with failed DoF's. Even Cruyff has had bad stints where everyone at the club ended up hating him. Look at United, once Fergie left, it's nothing but a mixed bag of experience and wasted money. 

It always seems oh so easy from the armchair. But it's never a guarentee. That's why this thread is so toxic. The vision of these ex-football players could be behind the times. They might have lost a step. They might want to spend more time with their family instead of extra time negotiating the deal.  They might have trouble integrating into British and American culture. They might not want to deal with UK work Visa issues. They might not want to deal with the Roman's and Sheik's without equal money to back it up. They might just have a thing against Liverpool Football Club.

It takes an expert to put together the right mix of experienced football people. To have a full infrastructure, in place to make their jobs easier, Bayern, Atletico and Barca European and domestic domination did not just spring up over night.  And it takes time to become an expert in that process.
 

[El Lobo]

Except they are still making the same mistakes over and over again. Appointing a MD/CEO with zero football experience, appointing a DoF/SD with no track record of success, going into the season with a squad that can't compete when we have to play more than once a week, failing to recruit in January.

Again Al, honestly do something about it.

Yourself, Johnny, kInKi, DangerScouse, Graham etc. There's certainly enough of you who are firmly in the camp of not wanting these guys as our owners, so why are you not doing anything about it? Why are you not starting protests?

[Johnny Foreigner]

New strategy lobo ? The standards corrupted shirt doesnt fit me or the owners anymore. Or maybe we can rally and you start FSG supporters club. Or maybe we can discuss and let the days go by

[Day1983]

Exactly! I am all for criticizing the past fuck ups by FSG but I just don't understand how people can't see the improvement in the last couple of years. I mean of all the years under their ownership, this is probably the one time they seem to be doing things right. It takes a special intensity of negativity to not recognize that.

Also owners are largely responsible for two things - 1. Funding the club (which they have done within the club's means) 2. Appointing the right people to run the club (here they were a hit and miss in the beginning, but things seem to be improving).

Also, I don't see how are our transfer failings can 'entirely' be put on FSG. Of course they share the blame because they recruited the people who brought in the dross and the buck stops at the top guy but I don't see owners of any other club getting so much flak for failed transfers. It is usually the manager and the staff. Owners get shit when they act skint (Ashley at Newcastle).

I must have imagined us finishing 8th last year!

[Doc Red]

Honestly lads, there's enough of you in this thread.

If you feel that strongly, do something about it. You're all grown ups, you're all able to organise something. So do it. Just giving it large in a thread on RAWK when you're that concerned about the direction the club is being led doesn't actually say much for how you see the club. Why not try and get some protests started to get them out?

Is that how it feels for you? It looks to me whenever anyone posts criticism there is an immediate barrage of responses. I would argue it's the exact opposite situation to what you think it is.

Secondly, what's the issue with posting criticism? Is there some golden rule of fandom whereby we either sit quiet and accept or than protest? When the time came to protest against an FSG initiative, the protest was powerful and overwhelming. Protesting because we're not happy about the lack of footballing experts (beyond the coaching staff) is a bit too far, in my opinion. Hence, why many post their opinions and critiques.

And protesting to change the owners? Unless they're systematically dismantling us like the previous owners, I don't see why that would be the case, in fact I don't recall posters making that sort of claim. And therein lies the real issue in this thread. It's not enough that posters that criticise anyone posting criticism, it's the takeover narrative that is used "so what you're saying is they should just quit, or you want a sugar daddy, or that you're saying FSG haven't done anything positive". And especially in the way you tend to post, Eel, it certainly feels as if you argue against your own counter narrative rather than what we're actually trying to say.

Yes, they have made positive changes but as we keep mentioning, they've also made mistakes. Even the stadium that is used as proof taht they've made a positive move, it's almost as if you've all forgotten the massive protest that was needed just to prevent their initial premise of fleecing the fans and recieving a quick ROI. I'm concerned because they replaced Ayre with another employee that lacks footballing credentials. I'm concerned that they do not have enough members on the board (or within the decision making hierarchy) that actually have experience of running a football club, let alone one of our stature facing the challenges of an insanely competitive league. I'm concerned enough to post on a thread titled "FSG".

Is my concern enough that I'll start considering supporting a protest? certainly not at this stage, so kindly quit with the boring provocation. If it bothers you so much, why haven't you started a pro FSG march?

Are they making the same mistakes they were making at the start of the tenure now? Or do you think they're making different mistakes?

Yes, they have made positive moves since they've come in. Our incoming transfers over the last summer was much better, however for the 4th consecutive summer we've simply replace outgoing with incoming, it's only that this last summer we've made sure the incoming were a significant upgrade over the outgoing. But the balance has left the squad light, as it did in each of the past few summers. This summer will go a massive way in showing if it's a case of the emperor's new clothes or if the structure really has changed and started to deliver on their promises.

[thisyearisouryear]

This summer will go a massive way in showing if it's a case of the emperor's new clothes or if the structure really has changed and started to deliver on their promises.

This is so true. I usually hate the transfer window and the associated muppetry. But I am quite excited for this summer. Especially if we make it to champions league. We HAVE to capitalize on it this time and move further ahead. Making sure we have a good and deep enough squad to challenge on all 4 fronts. Our last CL outing was such a disappointment.

[Billy The Kid]

Top post, Al.
Having an opinion that isn't of the majority doesn't make you wrong, and the opinions of the majority aren't automatically correct simply because they are of the majority.
Additionally, it should be noted that there are plenty of posters that agree with plenty of Al's points, but they're just not as active in this thread and even if they were, it's only natural that more members will rally around and defend a critique of the owners and club officials than will rally around and defend a critique of Al.

With respect mate, that's a load of absolute bollox. You're just polarizing the debate. As for Al's "opinions" being right or wrong: I'm not even going to go there. He makes so many outlandish claims with such frequency that it would be impossible to know where to even begin. It's a tangled mess at this stage

My bone of contention with your post is this: "it's only natural that more members will rally around and defend a critique of the owners and club officials"

No one is rallying around the owners. No one is out to defend them or stave off any criticism. Plenty of us have said that we're not pro FSG. I for one detailed my dislike for them a few pages back. I went in hard on them. So stop turning this into something that it isn't. Stop making it sound like its Al and the anti FSG brigade versus the pro FSG gang. Because it isn't. There is no pro FSG gang. Can you show me a post where someone has "rallied around" the owners? Because I don't ever recall reading one

Those of us who argue with Al aren't doing so because we're out to defend the owners. We argue with him because he says a lot of things that are outlandish, unsubstantiated, presumptuous, conjectured and simply downright unfactual. We know they're unfactual because time and time again, people have torn his "opinions" to pieces with cold hard facts. Its not that we're out to defend the owners. We're just pulling people up for talking shite. You seem to be confusing the 2

[Day1983]

With respect mate, that's a load of absolute bollox. You're just polarizing the debate. As for Al's "opinions" being right or wrong: I'm not even going to go there. He makes so many outlandish claims with such frequency that it would be impossible to know where to even begin. It's a tangled mess at this stage

My bone of contention with your post is this: "it's only natural that more members will rally around and defend a critique of the owners and club officials"

No one is rallying around the owners. No one is out to defend them or stave off any criticism. Plenty of us have said that we're not pro FSG. I for one detailed my dislike for them a few pages back. I went in hard on them. So stop turning this into something that it isn't. Stop making it sound like its Al and the anti FSG brigade versus the pro FSG gang. Because it isn't. There is no pro FSG gang. Can you show me a post where someone has "rallied around" the owners? Because I don't ever recall reading one

Those of us who argue with Al aren't doing so because we're out to defend the owners. We argue with him because he says a lot of things that are outlandish, unsubstantiated, presumptuous, conjectured and simply downright unfactual. We know they're unfactual because time and time again, people have torn his "opinions" to pieces with cold hard facts. Its not that we're out to defend the owners. We're just pulling people up for talking shite. You seem to be confusing the 2

I'm not sure you've read much of this thread!

[Graham Smith]

Again Al, honestly do something about it.

Yourself, Johnny, kInKi, DangerScouse, Graham etc. There's certainly enough of you who are firmly in the camp of not wanting these guys as our owners, so why are you not doing anything about it? Why are you not starting protests?

Never said that at all.

[ollick]

I'm not sure you've read much of this thread!

You must have, perhaps you'd like to point out some of the comments defending them?

Don't confuse questioning the validity of a posters concerns with defending the club, both sides of this (if there even is sides) have raised positives and negatives of the current ownership and there have certainly not been anyone defending them.

[Day1983]

You must have, perhaps you'd like to point out some of the comments defending them?

Don't confuse questioning the validity of a posters concerns with defending the club, both sides of this (if there even is sides) have raised positives and negatives of the current ownership and there have certainly not been anyone defending them.

No I don't want to, if you can't see it there is no point.

[ollick]

No I don't want to, if you can't see it there is no point.

You're going to do well here.

[Johnny Foreigner]

You must have, perhaps you'd like to point out some of the comments defending them?

Don't confuse questioning the validity of a posters concerns with defending the club, both sides of this (if there even is sides) have raised positives and negatives of the current ownership and there have certainly not been anyone defending them.

The whole discussion regarding the development of ARE is a good example.
With a long-term perspective, the stand should be developed and it should be a sound investment.
The owners wants a rapid pay-back, and the current price level is not able to support that.
There are plenty of people that supports the decision to wait and thereby support an ownership model that puts quick profit/return as the highest priority.

[Johnny Foreigner]

You must have, perhaps you'd like to point out some of the comments defending them?

Don't confuse questioning the validity of a posters concerns with defending the club, both sides of this (if there even is sides) have raised positives and negatives of the current ownership and there have certainly not been anyone defending them.

One of the first posts of a leading member of the anti-Al brigade..

"Again, as argued by a lot of people 2 years back, the point needs to be stressed. Fenway Sports Group and John W Henry are not rank amateurs. They know their sports industry. It might have been a masterstroke to take David Dein's recommendation to appoint Brendan, but ultimately, it was all FSG. They did the interview, they studied the ' 180 page manifesto', they interviewed both Martinez ( 4th place fight for Everton hello ! ) and Brendan and finally, they hired the man.

It was a massive gamble, but my word has it paid off. And not only will it positively impact LFC, it will reinforce the reputation of FSG as one of the shrewd-est entity in modern Sports management."

[ollick]

The whole discussion regarding the development of ARE is a good example.
With a long-term perspective, the stand should be developed and it should be a sound investment.
The owners wants a rapid pay-back, and the current price level is not able to support that.
There are plenty of people that supports the decision to wait and thereby support an ownership model that puts quick profit/return as the highest priority.

The owners haven't made a decision on the ARE yet have they? they said that they wouldn't until the MS was complete and they can find the balance of capacity/demand/ROI. Is there anything inherently wrong with that?

What is this quick profit that you talk of? They have charged the minimum interest financially and legally possible for the loan to develop the MS, that's hardly the sign of an ownership that is looking to make a quick profit out of the club (I believe that they have charged 3% less than they could have)

[Day1983]

You're going to do well here.

Thanks mate. To be honest I'm in work and don't have the time

[ollick]

One of the first posts of a leading member of the anti-Al brigade..

"Again, as argued by a lot of people 2 years back, the point needs to be stressed. Fenway Sports Group and John W Henry are not rank amateurs. They know their sports industry. It might have been a masterstroke to take David Dein's recommendation to appoint Brendan, but ultimately, it was all FSG. They did the interview, they studied the ' 180 page manifesto', they interviewed both Martinez ( 4th place fight for Everton hello ! ) and Brendan and finally, they hired the man.

It was a massive gamble, but my word has it paid off. And not only will it positively impact LFC, it will reinforce the reputation of FSG as one of the shrewd-est entity in modern Sports management."

"Anti-Al brigade" give over mate. There is no such thing as that. There are people who question his 'facts' that is all. People may be frustrated by him but there is no brigade against him.

Unless you think that there is one against CraigDS and others too?

As you haven't quoted the actual post to include dates, when was that written and by whom? was it in the midst of a title challenge or when TAW was interviewing him and everyone thought how great it was to have a manager respected and liked by the general media?

Just had a little look and you've partiallly quoted a 3 year old post to a post that was written in 2012.

Ouch ! I claim hindsight and disagree with everything you said 

Again, as argued by a lot of people 2 years back, the point needs to be stressed. Fenway Sports Group and John W Henry are not rank amateurs. They know their sports industry. It might have been a masterstroke to take David Dein's recommendation to appoint Brendan, but ultimately, it was all FSG. They did the interview, they studied the ' 180 page manifesto', they interviewed both Martinez ( 4th place fight for Everton hello ! ) and Brendan and finally, they hired the man.

It was a massive gamble, but my word has it paid off. And not only will it positively impact LFC, it will reinforce the reputation of FSG as one of the shrewd-est entity in modern Sports management.

If you went and read the post he was replying to about not knowing who FSG were and being sceptical and bearing in mind the league postition at the time and with the hindsight part you chose to miss out it did indeed seem that FSG had got it right with Rodgers.

[Samie]

When the fuck did Rawk get an 'Anti Al Brigade"?