Topic: The Klopp Template

[lamonti]

We bought him because PSV were desperate to raise money so we were able to get him below his true market value. Gakpo was player of the season last season in Holland. We paid £37m with addons of £7m. United paid £80.75m + £4.25m in addons for Antony who played in the same League as Gakpo last season.

In the current market Gakpo is a bargain.

Doesn't matter if he's a bargain if he's not the right player.

To be honest, we needed reinforcements in the front line and in the middle.

[Fiasco]

I don't think you get it. Opportunity costs speaks to what you've gained vs. what you lost. Maybe Gakpo would have gone somewhere else this window and maybe he'd make us look like mugs long term by turning into this world superstar. Odds are though that we could have bought him or someone else very similar for the same price in the summer when it became a pressing need by Firmino leaving.

So by signing him, if we take Klopp's words at face value, we used up our one available squad space and now the success of the rest of our season is seemingly going to hinge on Thiago and Keita's health or possibly Bajcetic being ready. Now if it was me that doesn't sound like something that's realistically going to hold up for the rest of the season so getting a buffer right now seems to be a more pressing need. So by signing Gakpo instead of that buffer what did it cost us? Is it worth missing out on Europe all together if Gakpo turns into a fascimile of Firmino and gets 1500-2000 minutes as he rotates with other forwards? Or would it have been better to increase our chances for Europe by getting a midfielder instead of Gakpo and then trying to find another Gakpo in the summer with our revenue not being hindered?

And this is without even getting into the fact there are rumors that Firmino is re-signing for another 2 years which at least for me would make signing Gakpo outrageous. I've been starting to doubt our recruitment lately but this would really take the cake.

It isn't about me not getting it, it is about you looking at it all wrong. You can be as patronising as you want but it doesn't mean things are always how you see them. We clearly felt that signing Gakpo this window was worth it for reasons you might not understand; we haven't committed to a deal worth north of £50 million when you factor in wages etc just for a morale boost or to play football manager. Say for example Gapko didn't move in the window and his great form continued and his stock went through the roof, his fee in the summer would then be a lot bigger and we might not have felt right going for him then.

You don't know what we've gained or what we've lost because signings aren't successful overnight. Only in the medium to long-term can you really assess things. It is likely we haven't bought a midfielder this window because the right one isn't available or the fee isn't right, do you want Klopp to sanction the signing of a midfielder just to appease the fans when that particular player might not be suited to us or be worth it financially?

[Knight]

It really is very implausible to think that for 2 windows there’s not been a CM available who would improve us for the money we spent on Gapko. It really is quite bizarre to sign a player we don’t need that much in the medium or long term instead of a player we’re desperate for in the short, medium and long term. It’s really quite strange that posters can watch this Liverpool team, with it’s completely dysfunctional midfield and only an injury prone 31 year old looking anything like a proper midfielder (from the normal Klopp picks anyway) and say, ‘yeah there’s probably a reasonable explanation for this’. I’m sure there are reasons, but they’re not good ones. And Dave’s points are reasonable responses to our weird decision making.

We’re going to need 3 CMs in the summer. Things are pretty desperate, quibbling over a few million would be perverse. Our midfield isn’t very good, finding one who’d significantly upgrade us really isn’t impossible.

[Dave McCoy]

It isn't about me not getting it, it is about you looking at it all wrong. You can be as patronising as you want but it doesn't mean things are always how you see them. We clearly felt that signing Gakpo this window was worth it for reasons you might not understand; we haven't committed to a deal worth north of £50 million when you factor in wages etc just for a morale boost or to play football manager. Say for example Gapko didn't move in the window and his great form continued and his stock went through the roof, his fee in the summer would then be a lot bigger and we might not have felt right going for him then.

You don't know what we've gained or what we've lost because signings aren't successful overnight. Only in the medium to long-term can you really assess things. It is likely we haven't bought a midfielder this window because the right one isn't available or the fee isn't right, do you want Klopp to sanction the signing of a midfielder just to appease the fans when that particular player might not be suited to us or be worth it financially?

I'm looking at it all wrong? Considering Michael Edwards was DoF for 10 years and didn't do a single interview, even now in retirement, then all we have to go on is our opinions and nothing else. There is no truth or transparency, just the actions of the club and the sound bites from Klopp whether he's even responsible for it or not. Everything you just wrote is as much conjecture as my post, you're just choosing to believe yours over mine but there is no evidence at all to support it.

I fully agree that there is a possibility that had we not signed Gakpo it may have turned into a huge missed opportunity and therefore maybe the club was right to go for him now. But you know what? There's always another Gakpo, another Bellingham, another Salah. No player is singular, well maybe sans Messi. There is always another one right around the corner or a year away. I think this is the one thing ManC has gotten consistently right sans their Grealish purchase in that if you don't get Kane or Maguire or whoever that's ok, there are other players as well that maybe aren't as celebrated or known but are just as good. You move on and you keep building.

So to that end, we're here talking about the Klopp Template and how seemingly after we've played half the games played this season this template doesn't work any more with Henderson and Fabinho and that it's certainly possible that our only hope however slim it is of getting Champions League rest on Thiago and Keita. So now if I had a choice of Gakpo or a midfielder that can at least pass for Thiago or Keita because Klopp said there is only 1 squad spot available I would choose that midfielder instead of Gakpo because even if Gakpo becomes amazing in the future as you're saying is possible it wouldn't outweigh for me the lost revenue of not getting CL.

It's not about whether Gakpo is a good player or not, just what else could that money have gotten us and how likely is each scenario to lead us to where we need to be? There is no way to truly know the answer of course but based on what we know at the moment in that this was the only money we had available at the moment and there was only 1 squad spot available for it then this is how I'm choosing to look at it.

Now if Firmino actually does extend then for 2 years then this is a whole different conversation. I guess we'll see if that happens or not.

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Yeah you get most things wrong Trigger.

[Fiasco]

I'm looking at it all wrong? Considering Michael Edwards was DoF for 10 years and didn't do a single interview, even now in retirement, then all we have to go on is our opinions and nothing else. There is no truth or transparency, just the actions of the club and the sound bites from Klopp whether he's even responsible for it or not. Everything you just wrote is as much conjecture as my post, you're just choosing to believe yours over mine but there is no evidence at all to support it.

I fully agree that there is a possibility that had we not signed Gakpo it may have turned into a huge missed opportunity and therefore maybe the club was right to go for him now. But you know what? There's always another Gakpo, another Bellingham, another Salah. No player is singular, well maybe sans Messi. There is always another one right around the corner or a year away. I think this is the one thing ManC has gotten consistently right sans their Grealish purchase in that if you don't get Kane or Maguire or whoever that's ok, there are other players as well that maybe aren't as celebrated or known but are just as good. You move on and you keep building.

So to that end, we're here talking about the Klopp Template and how seemingly after we've played half the games played this season this template doesn't work any more with Henderson and Fabinho and that it's certainly possible that our only hope however slim it is of getting Champions League rest on Thiago and Keita. So now if I had a choice of Gakpo or a midfielder that can at least pass for Thiago or Keita because Klopp said there is only 1 squad spot available I would choose that midfielder instead of Gakpo because even if Gakpo becomes amazing in the future as you're saying is possible it wouldn't outweigh for me the lost revenue of not getting CL.

It's not about whether Gakpo is a good player or not, just what else could that money have gotten us and how likely is each scenario to lead us to where we need to be? There is no way to truly know the answer of course but based on what we know at the moment in that this was the only money we had available at the moment and there was only 1 squad spot available for it then this is how I'm choosing to look at it.

Now if Firmino actually does extend then for 2 years then this is a whole different conversation. I guess we'll see if that happens or not.

I think comparing what we do to what City do or can do is not really fair. They can afford to get it wrong in the market, we can't. I don't doubt the midfield needs overhauling but I don't believe Klopp is blind to it. I'd love us to sign a midfielder (or three!) in this window but it clearly isn't on or plausible right now and blindly or not we have to trust Jurgen and the staff in their decisions.

I don't believe we had a set budget for this window and we've signed Gakpo instead of a midfielder who was available to come. I just don't believe the club would be so short-sighted.

[Dave McCoy]

I think comparing what we do to what City do or can do is not really fair. They can afford to get it wrong in the market, we can't. I don't doubt the midfield needs overhauling but I don't believe Klopp is blind to it. I'd love us to sign a midfielder (or three!) in this window but it clearly isn't on or plausible right now and blindly or not we have to trust Jurgen and the staff in their decisions.

I don't believe we had a set budget for this window and we've signed Gakpo instead of a midfielder who was available to come. I just don't believe the club would be so short-sighted.

It's not comparing what was spent, it's stating that we shouldn't get so hung up on the belief that this one player is the only one and if we were to miss him we're screwed. So there's a possibility that we couldn't afford Gakpo in the summer? So what? Unless he turns into one of the best ever it won't matter. Maybe that worked the one time for Virgil but generally speaking there is always another player.

I get the thinking that Firmino is leaving and we see Gakpo as replacing Firmino long term and we can get him in now and then we'll get our midfielders that we really want in the summer. Great. That's all fine and dandy. I also don't agree with it if it reduces our already slim chances of getting top 4 which to me it is if it was an either or scenario. There's no way to prove it was but as Knight is noting as well it seems incredulous that we couldn't find one single CM that would be available and an improvement considering how low the bar is at the moment.

[afc tukrish]

Yeah you get most things wrong Trigger.

Triggers are wonderful things...

[Fiasco]

It's not comparing what was spent, it's stating that we shouldn't get so hung up on the belief that this one player is the only one and if we were to miss him we're screwed. So there's a possibility that we couldn't afford Gakpo in the summer? So what? Unless he turns into one of the best ever it won't matter. Maybe that worked the one time for Virgil but generally speaking there is always another player.

I get the thinking that Firmino is leaving and we see Gakpo as replacing Firmino long term and we can get him in now and then we'll get our midfielders that we really want in the summer. Great. That's all fine and dandy. I also don't agree with it if it reduces our already slim chances of getting top 4 which to me it is if it was an either or scenario. There's no way to prove it was but as Knight is noting as well it seems incredulous that we couldn't find one single CM that would be available and an improvement considering how low the bar is at the moment.

Again though it depends how far you want to go down your list. Like any team, we'll have a list of players for each position and every stat available on them. But if they aren't available and you don't have unlimited funds to just throw money at it, I'm not sure buying a player who is say 7th choice in January solves your problems when you can get one of your top 3 in the summer. I'd love us to say to Brighton for example here you go, 60 million, thanks very much and we take Caicedo from them. But if it isn't on then what can you do?

As much as the midfield needs significant overhaul, I don't think our hopes of top 4 depend on it alone. The squad and team as a whole is underperforming. The players look like they can't run, can't tackle, can't press effectively or do the basics right. One shiny new midfielder won't suddenly make Salah come back to form for example, or make VVD the player of 3 years ago, or make Trent better defensively or make Henderson next to him 5 years younger. The problem is much bigger and the jigsaw pieces need to be put together properly, not just force one in in January in panic.

[Dave McCoy]

Again though it depends how far you want to go down your list. Like any team, we'll have a list of players for each position and every stat available on them. But if they aren't available and you don't have unlimited funds to just throw money at it, I'm not sure buying a player who is say 7th choice in January solves your problems when you can get one of your top 3 in the summer. I'd love us to say to Brighton for example here you go, 60 million, thanks very much and we take Caicedo from them. But if it isn't on then what can you do?

As much as the midfield needs significant overhaul, I don't think our hopes of top 4 depend on it alone. The squad and team as a whole is underperforming. The players look like they can't run, can't tackle, can't press effectively or do the basics right. One shiny new midfielder won't suddenly make Salah come back to form for example, or make VVD the player of 3 years ago, or make Trent better defensively or make Henderson next to him 5 years younger. The problem is much bigger and the jigsaw pieces need to be put together properly, not just force one in in January in panic.

Where do you see Gakpo in the pecking order once Jota and Diaz are back?

If your 7th choice transfer target for midfield is your 3rd best midfielder is that better than your 1st choice attacker being 5th on the depth chart? This is where we talk about opportunity costs. What is a more valuable thing to have and what could it cost you by not having it?

This is where we have to just agree to disagree. For me you have to believe we are just one or two midfielders away from competing again as if you're saying we also have to replace VvD and then Trent then why are you buying a Firmino replacement when you already have Nunez? We're then years away in essence and this is a long term rebuild where we should be selling off as much wages as possible.

[newterp]

Triggers are wonderful things...

Winnie the Pooh hated that bitch.

[liverbloke]

Winnie the Pooh hated that bitch.

you donkey

[Fiasco]

Where do you see Gakpo in the pecking order once Jota and Diaz are back?

If your 7th choice transfer target for midfield is your 3rd best midfielder is that better than your 1st choice attacker being 5th on the depth chart? This is where we talk about opportunity costs. What is a more valuable thing to have and what could it cost you by not having it?

This is where we have to just agree to disagree. For me you have to believe we are just one or two midfielders away from competing again as if you're saying we also have to replace VvD and then Trent then why are you buying a Firmino replacement when you already have Nunez? We're then years away in essence and this is a long term rebuild where we should be selling off as much wages as possible.

Just to clarify, nowhere did I say we have to replace Virgil and Trent. Not even close, so why you'd twist it like that I have no idea. I said they need to improve and/or their form isn't what it was, I don't think anybody can deny that. But I didn't even suggest we need to replace them.

Klopp didn't build his first great team here overnight, I don't think the rebuild will be quick either. Perhaps with a new injection of cash or ownership change (looking unlikely but who knows?) we could go on more of a spree but the pieces were gradually put together. Gakpo is clearly part of the next phase and I think you need to look at the big picture in that regard. Nobody has signed Gakpo over Klopp's head.

And in answer to your question, I think a lot depends on the system we have going forward but I wouldn't suggest as of now when everybody is fit he starts. But in a year or so as I said I would not be surprised if he starts regularly.

[Dave McCoy]

Just to clarify, nowhere did I say we have to replace Virgil and Trent. Not even close, so why you'd twist it like that I have no idea. I said they need to improve and/or their form isn't what it was, I don't think anybody can deny that. But I didn't even suggest we need to replace them.

Klopp didn't build his first great team here overnight, I don't think the rebuild will be quick either. Perhaps with a new injection of cash or ownership change (looking unlikely but who knows?) we could go on more of a spree but the pieces were gradually put together. Gakpo is clearly part of the next phase and I think you need to look at the big picture in that regard. Nobody has signed Gakpo over Klopp's head.

And in answer to your question, I think a lot depends on the system we have going forward but I wouldn't suggest as of now when everybody is fit he starts. But in a year or so as I said I would not be surprised if he starts regularly.

You're pointing out the VvD isn't getting younger and that Trent can't defend. Wouldn't that intimate that they need to be replaced if just having a competent midfield wouldn't fix that?

I completely disagree with your premise. If you look at the team we have prime aged players for every position sans midfield and Virgil's spot. If adding in prime aged CL level midfield talent doesn't turn the team into contenders then it will probably be a post-Klopp world where we are based on all of them being under contract until 2027 or 2028. LFC certainly makes enough money as is to buy some midfielders, we don't need new owners or a cash injection to accomplish that.

For the millionth time, I understand why we bought Gakpo and I'm sure it wasn't done over Klopp's head. He's also not god and is taking a calculated risk in it just like any other transfer. Salah is under contract until '25, Jota to '27, Diaz to '27 and Nunez to '28 while Firmino is still here until June. Replacing Firmino (again assuming what this actually is) isn't a crying need based on the squad at the moment even if in the immediate right now due to injuries it seems good. And that's assuming that we don't just starting using Jones or Elliott as attackers as well.

This season isn't over. There are still things to play for and again getting back to why the Klopp Template is working or not working it's my opinion that having a Firmino replacement isn't the solution to our issues at the moment especially when we spent so much money on Nunez who you want centrally anyway.

[Fromola]

It really is very implausible to think that for 2 windows there’s not been a CM available who would improve us for the money we spent on Gapko. It really is quite bizarre to sign a player we don’t need that much in the medium or long term instead of a player we’re desperate for in the short, medium and long term. It’s really quite strange that posters can watch this Liverpool team, with it’s completely dysfunctional midfield and only an injury prone 31 year old looking anything like a proper midfielder (from the normal Klopp picks anyway) and say, ‘yeah there’s probably a reasonable explanation for this’. I’m sure there are reasons, but they’re not good ones. And Dave’s points are reasonable responses to our weird decision making.

We’re going to need 3 CMs in the summer. Things are pretty desperate, quibbling over a few million would be perverse. Our midfield isn’t very good, finding one who’d significantly upgrade us really isn’t impossible.

The mad thing is we didn't have to spend loads on the midfield. Yeah, ideally if you want ready made world class players. Enzo/Caicedo/Nunes were all affordable and available last summer and now aren't.

Look at the difference a young, inexperienced player like Bajcetic made the other night and even Keita who I always thought was a big miss this season purely for the job he's capable of doing (and i'm not a big fan of his). It's not that difficult to find solid and athletic midfielders and when you add that to the world's best goalkeeper, a lethal attack (when fit), top full backs and centre backs - then a midfield that can just keep things ticking over - i.e. protecting the defence and supporting the attack - would have got us through the season at least.

Instead, for a transfer analogy, we've been in the desert dying of thirst and ignoring all the water we're passing because we want sparkling and won't drink anything else.

[spider-neil]

Triggers are wonderful things...

Where’s the trigger?! Where is it?!

[Johnny Foreigner]

How you can be an LFC fan and agree with this is mind boggling. Even worse the rest of your statement is equally wrong. Pretty sure I'm done with this conversation.

October 3 Dave - I would like to see an updated version of the memo my desk monday morning.. I am still a liverpool fan though (LFC - could be a trademark issue with the americans so i stick with liverpool)

[Dave McCoy]

October 3 Dave - I would like to see an updated version of the memo my desk monday morning.. I am still a liverpool fan though (LFC - could be a trademark issue with the americans so i stick with liverpool)

Eh? I fail to see how your premise of £100m sold and £100m bought are always the same amount of talent is now true. Or are you saying it is now proven? Not really sure here. I clarified that response in like 2 posts later saying that my initial response was over the top but sure, you're still an LFC fan regardless.

[vblfc]

Really frustrating time. Can see it in Klopp, in the team and in the stands.
He has stated we are in transition. Not just ownership stuff but probably on his template?  Transition normally brings conflicts.
We blame transfers, owners, age, coaching etc. but in reality we are largely just playing well under par.  We lack energy, belief, confidence, cohesion. We now also seem to think that turning 30 is too old. There are so many examples of this not being the case across European football. Maybe it’s not age related?
So maybe we are transitioning and are shit at dealing with it. It might be that buying 3 midfielders doesn’t solve the fact we are playing shit just now?
Millie’s performance the other night showed we can play better. Stefan, Naby, Harvey also. Maybe Fab, Hendo, VVD, Trent, Mo can also not play shit going forward?  We were going for it all last season.
(I my view) We have to believe we haven’t just suddenly fell off a cliff with no way back.  To be honest, I do believe we should invest to improve the squad, (bring in more talent/energy) but as much, if not more, lets see what Klopp’s transitioned template gets from what we already have.

[nerdster4]

Looking at Newcastle today Having to weather a shitstorm , away in a cup semi , hostile fans , then break away and score . I remember us being able to do that . We simply don’t have the athleticism , pace but more importantly the resilience currently . We need our own Bruno G type beast in midfield . And yes I am fully aware that they’re a state owned sport washing entity

[Eeyore]

I'm looking at it all wrong? Considering Michael Edwards was DoF for 10 years and didn't do a single interview, even now in retirement, then all we have to go on is our opinions and nothing else.

Michael Edwards was never our DoF

[Samie]

Same thing, diffrent title for fucks sakes Al. 

[lionel_messias]

Looking at Newcastle today Having to weather a shitstorm , away in a cup semi , hostile fans , then break away and score . I remember us being able to do that . We simply don’t have the athleticism , pace but more importantly the resilience currently . We need our own Bruno G type beast in midfield . And yes I am fully aware that they’re a state owned sport washing entity

They are but Bruno G would have been available to us, you'd have to say.

[Suareznumber7]

Not sure if this is the right place for this but after reading an article about the young Arsenal coach, Carlos Cuesta, and how he meets individually with every player and goes over video with them, I was wondering if we had someone in the same roll?  Is that part of what Krawietz does?  I know he does a lot of analysis but didn’t know if he worked with individual players as well. 

[OOS]

Not sure if this is the right place for this but after reading an article about the young Arsenal coach, Carlos Cuesta, and how he meets individually with every player and goes over video with them, I was wondering if we had someone in the same roll?  Is that part of what Krawietz does?  I know he does a lot of analysis but didn’t know if he worked with individual players as well.

I don't know names, but we have a analyst team that breaks down games and work with the coaches to give players individual feedback. We also use AI and technology so the players can practice accuracy of free kicks and set piece delivery. Think it natural practice now in the Premier League.

[royhendo]

I'm mostly off the internet at the minute because people seem to be going mental, but I'll get it off my chest because it's positive. We should have won that game yesterday - a deflection and a stupid preventable concession at the death from a set piece prevented that, as well as our continued profligacy in front of goal, but in terms of the overall unit, the starting eleven (while they were on the park) played as a good integrated unit again. Gakpo seems to be polarising fans, but he did well in dropping deeper and helping us stay compact, and he did well when he turned out of pressure and got a run on them. We were recovering the ball well, we were aggressive, and we created openings. For me that's what we now need to extend and if we do, there's a hope of the side getting some kind of mojo back to the extent we can at least contend for the champions league slots. I don't think we'll manage that but it'll be the foundation we need to reset.

So yeah - I was really encouraged - we know the midfield is a problem and we know we have fixes scheduled for the summer in some form (and we can only speculate that it's not FSG who are withholding funds, it's the manager who's being particular about how he wants to fix the problem)... but that yesterday was a decent showing away at a side we got royally pumped by, literally a few days ago, who are set up to capitalise whenever that integration as a unit isn't there.

We have a magnificent manager and he'll demonstrate that in due course.

[killer-heels]

I'm mostly off the internet at the minute because people seem to be going mental, but I'll get it off my chest because it's positive. We should have won that game yesterday - a deflection and a stupid preventable concession at the death from a set piece prevented that, as well as our continued profligacy in front of goal, but in terms of the overall unit, the starting eleven (while they were on the park) played as a good integrated unit again. Gakpo seems to be polarising fans, but he did well in dropping deeper and helping us stay compact, and he did well when he turned out of pressure and got a run on them. We were recovering the ball well, we were aggressive, and we created openings. For me that's what we now need to extend and if we do, there's a hope of the side getting some kind of mojo back to the extent we can at least contend for the champions league slots. I don't think we'll manage that but it'll be the foundation we need to reset.

So yeah - I was really encouraged - we know the midfield is a problem and we know we have fixes scheduled for the summer in some form (and we can only speculate that it's not FSG who are withholding funds, it's the manager who's being particular about how he wants to fix the problem)... but that yesterday was a decent showing away at a side we got royally pumped by, literally a few days ago, who are set up to capitalise whenever that integration as a unit isn't there.

We have a magnificent manager and he'll demonstrate that in due course.

Thats true. But I have found smashing something does bring an adrenaline filled bout of relief.

[royhendo]

Thats true. But I have found smashing something does bring an adrenaline filled bout of relief.

I'm with you there. It's always a funny one for me, that - if you point out a positive online, people automatically picture you as some sort of hindu cow style epitome of calm. Every single game (bar the obvious ones) has been pure torture this season and the dog thinks I'm deranged.

[Kopstar]

The voice of reason as usual, Roy. I keep blocking this site because all of the reactionary crap that gets posted, but like a moth to the flame, I keep coming back.
As for the game, I thought we played well and deserved a replay at least. The ref was dire for both sides, which didn't help.
Why we keep telegraphing our subs, I don't know. Gakpo was good and should allow us to phase out Bobby.  Defence was good. Midfield was too until the subs. Salah need to improve. Elliott played well.

[afc tukrish]

I'm with you there. It's always a funny one for me, that - if you point out a positive online, people automatically picture you as some sort of hindu cow style epitome of calm. Every single game (bar the obvious ones) has been pure torture this season and the dog thinks I'm deranged.

Royhinducowstylee

Cue incoming screen name change...

[Clint Eastwood]

For such an experienced group of players, they've become irritatingly oblivious to set-pieces from the opposition. The unmarked Brighton player at the back post for their second was always going to be picked out. Was it against City in the League Cup when we conceded after another obvious routine? Then the corners at Brentford. It's something I've noticed this season, particularly since the break. We've always been pretty good at this kind of stuff too, so I don't get what has changed.

[coct3au]

Not sure if this is the right place for this but after reading an article about the young Arsenal coach, Carlos Cuesta, and how he meets individually with every player and goes over video with them, I was wondering if we had someone in the same roll?  Is that part of what Krawietz does?  I know he does a lot of analysis but didn’t know if he worked with individual players as well. 

He's massive on the video recording and analysis, hence his nickname, Lensy Krawietz.

[Dave McCoy]

I'm mostly off the internet at the minute because people seem to be going mental, but I'll get it off my chest because it's positive. We should have won that game yesterday - a deflection and a stupid preventable concession at the death from a set piece prevented that, as well as our continued profligacy in front of goal, but in terms of the overall unit, the starting eleven (while they were on the park) played as a good integrated unit again. Gakpo seems to be polarising fans, but he did well in dropping deeper and helping us stay compact, and he did well when he turned out of pressure and got a run on them. We were recovering the ball well, we were aggressive, and we created openings. For me that's what we now need to extend and if we do, there's a hope of the side getting some kind of mojo back to the extent we can at least contend for the champions league slots. I don't think we'll manage that but it'll be the foundation we need to reset.

So yeah - I was really encouraged - we know the midfield is a problem and we know we have fixes scheduled for the summer in some form (and we can only speculate that it's not FSG who are withholding funds, it's the manager who's being particular about how he wants to fix the problem)... but that yesterday was a decent showing away at a side we got royally pumped by, literally a few days ago, who are set up to capitalise whenever that integration as a unit isn't there.

We have a magnificent manager and he'll demonstrate that in due course.

I don't know how you win the game where you don't actually attack for half of it. I guess we got away with that in the previous round against Wolves but I actually am getting more down about the team with seemingly each passing week. Has there been a more abject month under Klopp than this one? 6 games played, 1 win 2 draws and 3 losses with each game seemingly weirder and possibly worse than the last. Before the WC and immediately after it we were a bad defensive team that had an attack that at least still gave it a fighting chance for top 4. Now? We're a still relatively a bad defensive team and we also can no longer attack with CL spots being a complete pipe dream.

Yes yesterday was better than the league game but it was still bad. What would give me hope is that Klopp settles on a system with a group of players that for sure will be here next season and you can envision adding those one or two pieces will get us back where we need to be. I just have no faith that's what we're doing right now. Maybe the current tactics will be used the rest of the season but we're only two weeks removed from some of the wildest tactics I've ever seen in the Klopp era and we're on our 4th or 5th iteration already this season.

Some of the personnel choices are also just random. If you're committed to playing Gomez over Matip now then why not move on Matip if you can't sell Phillips? If this is a transition why aren't we trying to actually transition aside from just benching our older and now worse players? There's no way John Henry is sitting in Boston and telling Klopp he couldn't sell a player. Hell according to the majority of the board you'd think Henry would be doing nothing but telling Klopp to sell anybody he could because they're such cheap asses and there's no way we're getting CL money now. We're not getting relegated and there is very little difference between Europa League and Conference or none at all, why aren't we cycling through every player we have right now trying to see if they may have a future?

I do think Klopp will get it right but I also think in some ways he or the people that are advising him are going about this in the most difficult way possible. None of them thought this was a transition year to begin with but now that they're briefing the press it is and saying this has to happen then hopefully they'll follow through on that for the rest of the year and give us reason to think next year will be better.

[royhendo]

I just have no faith

That's what I see from your post, Mr McCoy.

I should reiterate - I don't think we'll make the top four - I just want to see them rediscover the fundamental building blocks that the success stemmed from. That's why I was encouraged.

Jurgen said the focus in training was on being integrated and compact as a unit. We sat off a little, Gakpo worked back into the midfield from the front line and that Brighton side, who tends to play through sides with ease (as we saw a few days back) struggled to progress the ball while we were set. Yes, they were missing Caiceido, but from an organisational perspective, we were much much better. The midfield three moved well as a unit and committed to pressing situations, Gakpo got around players well and that meant numerical advantage, almost as if he's seen as developing into more of a Firmino type.

That's the foundation - the attacking patterns will improve - we have wonderful footballers. Lest we forget we did score yesterday - quite a nice goal too. And we disrupted the Brighton set up several times in the first half, and Gakpo broke and showed signs of creativity for me.

The worry is the impact the subs had. Yes, we conceded two stupid goals from set pieces - it happens when things aren't going for you. But when you bring on your senior 'closers' and the wheels come off from an organisational perspective, then that's a different prism on the same problem we've had all season.

[Eeyore]

I'm mostly off the internet at the minute because people seem to be going mental, but I'll get it off my chest because it's positive. We should have won that game yesterday - a deflection and a stupid preventable concession at the death from a set piece prevented that, as well as our continued profligacy in front of goal, but in terms of the overall unit, the starting eleven (while they were on the park) played as a good integrated unit again. Gakpo seems to be polarising fans, but he did well in dropping deeper and helping us stay compact, and he did well when he turned out of pressure and got a run on them. We were recovering the ball well, we were aggressive, and we created openings. For me that's what we now need to extend and if we do, there's a hope of the side getting some kind of mojo back to the extent we can at least contend for the champions league slots. I don't think we'll manage that but it'll be the foundation we need to reset.

So yeah - I was really encouraged - we know the midfield is a problem and we know we have fixes scheduled for the summer in some form (and we can only speculate that it's not FSG who are withholding funds, it's the manager who's being particular about how he wants to fix the problem)... but that yesterday was a decent showing away at a side we got royally pumped by, literally a few days ago, who are set up to capitalise whenever that integration as a unit isn't there.

We have a magnificent manager and he'll demonstrate that in due course.

I thought we were much better yesterday.

We were much more compact and crucially we were able to pick and choose the optimum moments to press. Gakpo led the press really well. We were controlled and the players kept their shape really well.

Unfortunately, all that changed when Fabinho and especially Hendo came on. We stopped being compact and lost our shape. The prime reason was that we didn't wait for the triggers to press. Unfortunately, Hendo took it upon himself to do an impression of a primary school kid charging around the playground chasing the ball.

[RedG13]

I thought we were much better yesterday.

We were much more compact and crucially we were able to pick and choose the optimum moments to press. Gakpo led the press really well. We were controlled and the players kept their shape really well.

Unfortunately, all that changed when Fabinho and especially Hendo came on. We stopped being compact and lost our shape. The prime reason was that we didn't wait for the triggers to press. Unfortunately, Hendo took it upon himself to do an impression of a primary school kid charging around the playground chasing the ball.

Fabinho came on 25 minutes after Henderson.
Liverpool allowed 1 shot after Fabinho came on. Granted he super sloppy right at the start of his appearance

[Dave McCoy]

That's what I see from your post, Mr McCoy.

I should reiterate - I don't think we'll make the top four - I just want to see them rediscover the fundamental building blocks that the success stemmed from. That's why I was encouraged.

Jurgen said the focus in training was on being integrated and compact as a unit. We sat off a little, Gakpo worked back into the midfield from the front line and that Brighton side, who tends to play through sides with ease (as we saw a few days back) struggled to progress the ball while we were set. Yes, they were missing Caiceido, but from an organisational perspective, we were much much better. The midfield three moved well as a unit and committed to pressing situations, Gakpo got around players well and that meant numerical advantage, almost as if he's seen as developing into more of a Firmino type.

That's the foundation - the attacking patterns will improve - we have wonderful footballers. Lest we forget we did score yesterday - quite a nice goal too. And we disrupted the Brighton set up several times in the first half, and Gakpo broke and showed signs of creativity for me.

The worry is the impact the subs had. Yes, we conceded two stupid goals from set pieces - it happens when things aren't going for you. But when you bring on your senior 'closers' and the wheels come off from an organisational perspective, then that's a different prism on the same problem we've had all season.

I think this is an interesting point though. Are the current tactics a crutch for the situation we are in or a long-term plan? You don't equate passive mid-blocks where you're letting the GK stand on the ball outside his box to Jurgen Klopp,  I really don't know and of course Klopp knows more than I ever could but at least just in watching it if we're going to transition then lets transition to what we're actually going to be next. If that's ultimately a passive mid-block then so be it but color me skeptical that's actually the case.

[Fiasco]

Not sure if this is the right place for this but after reading an article about the young Arsenal coach, Carlos Cuesta, and how he meets individually with every player and goes over video with them, I was wondering if we had someone in the same roll?  Is that part of what Krawietz does?  I know he does a lot of analysis but didn’t know if he worked with individual players as well.

Vitor Matos?

[killer-heels]

I think this is an interesting point though. Are the current tactics a crutch for the situation we are in or a long-term plan? You don't equate passive mid-blocks where you're letting the GK stand on the ball outside his box to Jurgen Klopp,  I really don't know and of course Klopp knows more than I ever could but at least just in watching it if we're going to transition then lets transition to what we're actually going to be next. If that's ultimately a passive mid-block then so be it but color me skeptical that's actually the case.

This is definitely not what we want to play as. We don’t do a winter training programme which had us trying to do what we always did if we are transitioning to something new.

I personally think all we are doing is trying to get out of this season as unscathed as possible with as little confidence damage as possible now. Less goals let in, less confidence loss and then we can hopefully get more players who will suit the way we play and can start a proper transition. This is not a transition season no matter how much Klopp and Co try to say it is.

I could be doing a disservice in that maybe they are biding time until March when they hope Diaz and Jota (and Van Dijk) will be back and they can play that way.

[kavah]

I'm mostly off the internet at the minute because people seem to be going mental, but I'll get it off my chest because it's positive. We should have won that game yesterday - a deflection and a stupid preventable concession at the death from a set piece prevented that, as well as our continued profligacy in front of goal, but in terms of the overall unit, the starting eleven (while they were on the park) played as a good integrated unit again. Gakpo seems to be polarising fans, but he did well in dropping deeper and helping us stay compact, and he did well when he turned out of pressure and got a run on them. We were recovering the ball well, we were aggressive, and we created openings. For me that's what we now need to extend and if we do, there's a hope of the side getting some kind of mojo back to the extent we can at least contend for the champions league slots. I don't think we'll manage that but it'll be the foundation we need to reset.

So yeah - I was really encouraged - we know the midfield is a problem and we know we have fixes scheduled for the summer in some form (and we can only speculate that it's not FSG who are withholding funds, it's the manager who's being particular about how he wants to fix the problem)... but that yesterday was a decent showing away at a side we got royally pumped by, literally a few days ago, who are set up to capitalise whenever that integration as a unit isn't there.

We have a magnificent manager and he'll demonstrate that in due course.

Nice one Roy, great post, I needed that