Author Topic: The Irish Politics Thread. (Read 460312 times)

WhereAngelsPlay · « **Reply #4840 on:** May 26, 2018, 12:57:26 am »

Quote from: Corkboy on May 25, 2018, 11:45:21 pm

So, if I have this right, I can now hunt babies?

Just be careful that your Jack Russell doesn't get stuck in the tunnel.

BarryCrocker · « **Reply #4841 on:** May 26, 2018, 01:51:21 am »

TheShanklyGates · « **Reply #4842 on:** May 26, 2018, 04:56:08 am »

Quote from: BarryCrocker on May 26, 2018, 01:51:21 am

Society advances one funeral at a time.

BarryCrocker · « **Reply #4843 on:** May 26, 2018, 06:06:34 am »

Quote from: TheShanklyGates on May 26, 2018, 04:56:08 am

Society advances one funeral at a time.

Couldn't have said it better.

One does have to consider that 65+ bracket had the fear of eternal damnation forced down their throat for generations by the church.

1892tillforever · « **Reply #4844 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:08:41 am »

Very proud of my country today.

conman · « **Reply #4845 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:18:04 am »

Quote from: TheShanklyGates on May 26, 2018, 04:56:08 am

Society advances one funeral at a time.

conman · « **Reply #4846 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:19:31 am »

Quote from: Sarge on May 25, 2018, 10:50:28 pm

This was a truly difficult decision for so many. It wasn't straight forward for the quiet middle. I'm proud that a huge majority listened to the stories and the evidence and made this decision despite possible, and understandable, misgivings.

This is not a celebration but a step forward for Ireland and her people.

and despite the shithousery from the no campaign.

So… Howard Philips · « **Reply #4847 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:23:03 am »

Quote from: BarryCrocker on May 26, 2018, 06:06:34 am

Couldn't have said it better.

One does have to consider that 65+ bracket had the fear of eternal damnation forced down their throat for generations by the church.

I've just finished reading Fergal Keane's "Wounds", the story of his family's involvement in the IRA and the Irish Civil War.

He comments that by 1922 the Republic had got rid of the English overlords and the Catholic Church immediately filled the vacuum. I think those chains have been broken.

Sarge · « **Reply #4848 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:24:17 am »

Quote from: Corkboy on May 25, 2018, 11:45:21 pm

So, if I have this right, I can now hunt babies?

Only on Bank Holiday Tuesdays.

Sarge · « **Reply #4849 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:26:49 am »

Quote from: TheShanklyGates on May 26, 2018, 04:56:08 am

Society advances one funeral at a time.

Yup, was just thinking that the future of Ireland is very Liberal, thank fuck.

FlashGordon · « **Reply #4850 on:** May 26, 2018, 11:52:58 am »

As a matter that is very close to me personally I am absolutely thrilled at the outcome of the referendum. I think the most amazing aspect of this referendum is the ability of the elder generations who have been indoctrinated in a certain way of thinking for so long being able to use their minds and vote with the their hearts and heads. That isn't meant to be patronising it's truly astonished me how open minded some people have been when it came to this whole process.

Congratulations lads, hopefully we cap it off with a win tonight.

KERRYKOP · « **Reply #4851 on:** May 26, 2018, 04:37:56 pm »

Delighted to see Kerry and home of the Healy Rae's Kilgarvin vote Yes

Up the Kingdom. Up the Republic

Libertine · « **Reply #4852 on:** May 26, 2018, 06:25:29 pm »

66.4% in the end. Slightly less than the exit polls, but I guess there would be a small shy vote no effect.

Extraordinary, historic day though. Not one I was confident of ever seeing, growing up in that environment.

Goodbye to the 8th. Now let's bring home the 6th......

thejbs · « **Reply #4853 on:** May 27, 2018, 02:22:15 am »

This is the only thing comforting me tonight. As much as I love this club, this was the victory I wanted most today.

Caligula? · « **Reply #4854 on:** May 27, 2018, 05:46:04 am »

Congratulations to Ireland.

In a world where the supposed leader of the free world - The United States - is sliding deeper and deeper back into a dystopian and backwards functioning reality that existed ages ago, it's nice to see another nation take a leap forward into modernity.

kennedy81 · « **Reply #4855 on:** May 27, 2018, 09:14:21 am »

It was a brilliant day yesterday. Haven't felt that proud to be Irish in a long time, if ever. To see the faces of those pro-life c*nts like McGuirk, Mullen and those Iona Institute pricks was absolute gold. Fuck the lot of them.

A great day for Ireland, especially the women who've finally had their voices heard. It's a shame it took so long.

fowlermagic · « **Reply #4856 on:** May 27, 2018, 10:59:29 am »

Forget the county where 5 of the 6 local TDs were on the NO side but the county still voted around 70% for the repeal. Nice to see your local politician having his finger on the public pulse.

thejbs · « **Reply #4857 on:** May 27, 2018, 02:24:43 pm »

Feel bad for Donegal. Getting so much vitriol. I know people from there (and Tyrone who couldn't vote) that canvassed hard for Yes. Donegal has an ageing population and for the result to run so close should be considered a victory of sorts - I was expecting it to be a runaway 'No' there. And besides, plenty of young people that have had to leave the county for work will no doubt have made up the Yes numbers in other counties.

Chip Evans · « **Reply #4858 on:** May 27, 2018, 10:41:16 pm »

Quote from: thejbs on May 27, 2018, 02:24:43 pm

Feel bad for Donegal. Getting so much vitriol. I know people from there (and Tyrone who couldn't vote) that canvassed hard for Yes. Donegal has an ageing population and for the result to run so close should be considered a victory of sorts - I was expecting it to be a runaway 'No' there. And besides, plenty of young people that have had to leave the county for work will no doubt have made up the Yes numbers in other counties.

Looking at the figures, Donegal had more people vote yes than Mary Lou's Dublin Central. Percentages didn't get there - but when you consider less than 18 percent were against it in Donegal '83 - it's still a huge social change. T4Yes were at pains today to emphasis how well organised they were on the gound and the work they did there. 48 - 52 is a coin flip as the brexit repealers will tell you.

thejbs · « **Reply #4859 on:** May 28, 2018, 01:35:39 am »

Typical that Theresa May has bowed yet again to her DUP overlords. She says abortion legislation for NI is an issue for Stormont, knowing too well that 1) Stormont isn't operational and 2) Even if a majority of Stormont MLAs voted in favour of legalising abortion, the DUP would use a petition of concern to block it.

This is spineless 'leadership' and all the more galling coming from a woman.

KissThisGuy · « **Reply #4860 on:** May 29, 2018, 12:14:27 pm »

Quote from: thejbs on May 27, 2018, 02:24:43 pm

Feel bad for Donegal. Getting so much vitriol. I know people from there (and Tyrone who couldn't vote) that canvassed hard for Yes. Donegal has an ageing population and for the result to run so close should be considered a victory of sorts - I was expecting it to be a runaway 'No' there. And besides, plenty of young people that have had to leave the county for work will no doubt have made up the Yes numbers in other counties.

I think I'm left on every issue I have ever voted on. But people thinking this was a black and white voting case has me confused.

Wigwamdelbert · « **Reply #4861 on:** May 30, 2018, 01:37:14 pm »

Quote from: thejbs on May 28, 2018, 01:35:39 am

Typical that Theresa May has bowed yet again to her DUP overlords. She says abortion legislation for NI is an issue for Stormont, knowing too well that 1) Stormont isn't operational and 2) Even if a majority of Stormont MLAs voted in favour of legalising abortion, the DUP would use a petition of concern to block it.

This is spineless 'leadership' and all the more galling coming from a woman.

Not really quite that simple, there are "devolved" matters, "reserved" matters and "excepted" matters. the first are what they say they are, matters for which responsibility has been passed from Westminster to Stormont via the NIA. reserved are things which, for the time being, are retained by Westminster, but may be devolved at some point. Excepted are those which Westminster will always hold.

Abortion is a devolved matter, and to legislate on a devolved matter Westminster will have to play around with the NIA. That won't go well with many (not me, I'm all for it), but it isn't just as cut and dried as "May should just do it".

Even if by some miracle we did get Stormont back up, and the members at least pretending to earn their salary, the latest (failed) negotiations had a complete re-working of the Petition of Concern so that no one party had an effective veto. Foster and her crew knew that would allow marriage equality, but were content that they could save face by tabling the petition and voting against, only to be defeated by a majority vote on the floor. So the PoC thing shouldn't have the same impact if and when they are back.

Elmo! · « **Reply #4862 on:** May 30, 2018, 03:23:05 pm »

Of course the Tories would never consider legislating on devolved matters without consent from the devolved parliament.....

https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/12716/david-mundell-refuses-rule-out-uk-government-ignoring-holyrood-s-democratic

drmick · « **Reply #4863 on:** June 2, 2018, 01:24:43 am »

Quote from: BarryCrocker on May 26, 2018, 01:51:21 am

Just goes to show you the wording of the referendum can make a difference. I know a few people who are very anti-abortion, but really couldn't vote No in this. If only Brexit asked the question differently.

fowlermagic · « **Reply #4864 on:** June 14, 2018, 09:35:59 am »

Heard on the radio yesterday the prices of houses have increased by 15% approx already this year. Great for homeowners who bought at the height of the boom times but here we go again as we creep to another big bubble burst.

Corkboy · « **Reply #4865 on:** June 14, 2018, 09:57:44 am »

Quote from: fowlermagic on June 14, 2018, 09:35:59 am

Heard on the radio yesterday the prices of houses have increased by 15% approx already this year. Great for homeowners who bought at the height of the boom times but here we go again as we creep to another big bubble burst.

Doubt it. There's nowhere near the same level of lending as last time out.

Bullan · « **Reply #4866 on:** June 14, 2018, 12:45:31 pm »

Quote from: fowlermagic on June 14, 2018, 09:35:59 am

Heard on the radio yesterday the prices of houses have increased by 15% approx already this year. Great for homeowners who bought at the height of the boom times but here we go again as we creep to another big bubble burst.

Where I live in Dublin most of the homeowners I know are hovering in or around negative equity still some of them might break even after paying 10+ years of mortgage it's utterly fucked here and rents are reaching a level which will move beyond most families means soon.

fowlermagic · « **Reply #4867 on:** June 15, 2018, 09:49:03 am »

Quote from: Bullan on June 14, 2018, 12:45:31 pm

Where I live in Dublin most of the homeowners I know are hovering in or around negative equity still some of them might break even after paying 10+ years of mortgage it's utterly fucked here and rents are reaching a level which will move beyond most families means soon.

I was once told buying a house was the smartest thing I could ever do...that was before the market went crazy as now there is many owners who are house poor. Basically it may be their kids who may prosper from their purchase as the parents may never see any ROI. Maybe that was the problem as the goal was always to own a house but when you see 15% increases in 6 months never mind a year investors are driving the market, pretty much flipping properties while potential long term owners are left on the sidelines unable to afford a house that was well within their price range just 2 or 3 years ago.

Quote from: Corkboy on June 14, 2018, 09:57:44 am

Doubt it. There's nowhere near the same level of lending as last time out.

I hope not as its not as if we ever repeat history.

Interesting to see the trend in Ireland as for 3 decades the prices remained within a certain price point pretty much. The average increase in house prices mirrored the increase in inflation. Then you see a huge surge of nearly 400% over ten years and by the time the market imploded certain experts around 2010 were saying the current average price of 200K for a house was a true reflection of the property value. We have seen prices surge again by 50% since 2013/14 so while I am no expert the signs may be there for another wee pop in the market. When we cant control the rental market then what chance do we have in an investment that is giving developers huge returns. Greed gets the best of us I fear.

Bullan · « **Reply #4868 on:** June 15, 2018, 04:24:36 pm »

Quote from: fowlermagic on June 15, 2018, 09:49:03 am

I was once told buying a house was the smartest thing I could ever do...that was before the market went crazy as now there is many owners who are house poor. Basically it may be their kids who may prosper from their purchase as the parents may never see any ROI. Maybe that was the problem as the goal was always to own a house but when you see 15% increases in 6 months never mind a year investors are driving the market, pretty much flipping properties while potential long term owners are left on the sidelines unable to afford a house that was well within their price range just 2 or 3 years ago.

I hope not as its not as if we ever repeat history.

The part I struggle to understand is how someone can pay off a loan for 10 + years and the poxy thing never goes down.

I was not living here during the boom so I cannot speak to what kind of mortgages people were taking but we had the same thing back in Iceland where people just never made a dent in the loan they took out to buy the property.

What I've been told is that there are some very well connected special interests (ie landlords) who more or less are shaping the housing policy here and I fear if that is the case things will never change.

fowlermagic · « **Reply #4869 on:** June 15, 2018, 07:07:38 pm »

Quote from: Bullan on June 15, 2018, 04:24:36 pm

The part I struggle to understand is how someone can pay off a loan for 10 + years and the poxy thing never goes down.

I was not living here during the boom so I cannot speak to what kind of mortgages people were taking but we had the same thing back in Iceland where people just never made a dent in the loan they took out to buy the property.

What I've been told is that there are some very well connected special interests (ie landlords) who more or less are shaping the housing policy here and I fear if that is the case things will never change.

I really dont know about the connected special interests as thought the brown envelope brigade was done away with

but I pretty much missed the Celtic Tiger years as well so was always taken back by how the prices kept going through the roof every time I visited home. My friends seem to be very accepting of it as I often heard "the price to get a house is whatever the price is right now". My own village saw 4 bed houses going for 600K around 2007 (without a garage even) and at the time that was close to 800K US dollars. I wouldnt be far off saying 400k - 500K was the average price for a detached 4 bed at the time and when you think the gross household income was 60k maybe, people were getting mortgages x 6 / 8 times their income. That was surely a formula for an implosion and right now I think the household incomes are still around 60k so the mortgage ratios must be lumbering to x 5 / 6 times x average wage.

Sarge · « **Reply #4870 on:** July 21, 2018, 06:41:43 pm »

POLL: STimes/B&A
(July 5-17, MoE ±3.3%)

FG 34 (+3 in 5 weeks)
FF 21 (-3)
SF 22 (-2)
Labour 3 (-1)
Inds/others 10 (+1)
Ind All 4 (+1)
Greens 2
Sol/PBP 1 (-1)
SD 1
Renua 0

Come in Micheal your time is up and Labour at 3% fucking hell.

Libertine · « **Reply #4871 on:** July 22, 2018, 12:59:56 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on July 21, 2018, 06:41:43 pm

POLL: STimes/B&A
(July 5-17, MoE ±3.3%)

FG 34 (+3 in 5 weeks)
FF 21 (-3)
SF 22 (-2)
Labour 3 (-1)
Inds/others 10 (+1)
Ind All 4 (+1)
Greens 2
Sol/PBP 1 (-1)
SD 1
Renua 0

Come in Micheal your time is up and Labour at 3% fucking hell.

Extraordinary that the main government party has such a big lead at this stage in the lifetime of the Dail. Only one thing has moved the polls to any extent in the last couple of years - Varadkar taking over FG. They are very lucky to have him.

The fragmentation in the smaller parties, and the still high % for independents, is quite depressing though. Seriously, what is the point of SD and Renua?

Sarge · « **Reply #4872 on:** July 22, 2018, 04:31:02 pm »

The smaller parties like SD, Renua, PPP/AAA will take a beating in the next Generals. Indos may too. SF will gain, FF will hold and FG will increase a little going by this. FF have to ditch Martin and now.

FG/SF coalition, could it be?