Topic: Man City - cheating bastards rumbled

[Chakan]

If you're watching City and only see the oil then you're also missing something.

We don't see Oil, we see corrupt cheating club owned by a more corrupt, horrible, murderous regime.

What else can you see? So they play good football sometimes, whoopie fucking doo. Why do they play good football sometimes, well they have the players to do that, how do they have the players for that, well they bought them didn't they, how did they buy them, well fucking cheating didn't they?

Everything they fucking do is tainted.

You can't look at Lance Armstrong without seeing what a fucking cheating rioded up cyclist he was who won all those medals because he cheated to do it.

They're not inseparable. That's what sportswashing is, showing you something you admire and then claim is normal while all behind it's fucking deplorable.

So people like you can come and say "Hey you're missing the good part of it"

[rob1966]

We don't see Oil, we see corrupt cheating club owned by a more corrupt, horrible, murderous regime.

What else can you see? So they play good football sometimes, whoopie fucking doo. Why do they play good football sometimes, well they have the players to do that, how do they have the players for that, well they bought them didn't they, how did they buy them, well fucking cheating didn't they?

Everything they fucking do is tainted.

You can't look at Lance Armstrong without seeing what a fucking cheating rioded up cyclist he was who won all those medals because he cheated to do it.

They're not inseparable. That's what sportswashing is, showing you something you admire and then claim is normal while all behind it's fucking deplorable.

So people like you can come and say "Hey you're missing the good part of it"

[newterp]

We don't see Oil, we see corrupt cheating club owned by a more corrupt, horrible, murderous regime.

What else can you see? So they play good football sometimes, whoopie fucking doo. Why do they play good football sometimes, well they have the players to do that, how do they have the players for that, well they bought them didn't they, how did they buy them, well fucking cheating didn't they?

Everything they fucking do is tainted.

You can't look at Lance Armstrong without seeing what a fucking cheating rioded up cyclist he was who won all those medals because he cheated to do it.

They're not inseparable. That's what sportswashing is, showing you something you admire and then claim is normal while all behind it's fucking deplorable.

So people like you can come and say "Hey you're missing the good part of it"

Ouch.

Haha.

[JRed]

You make a couple of valid points but STOP with that bullshit in bold. Pumping a state’s wealth into a football team using self-inflated sponsorship deals, off-books payments and general rule breaking is the antithesis of running a club well. If the owners sold up tomorrow, it would take incredible wealth from the next owner to avoid them being in financial dire straits.

This is it. They are only ‘well run’ as long as the state funds continue to be pumped in via all the related ‘sponsorship’. If the Abu Dhabi state did sell up and anyone was naive enough to buy them, all that ‘sponsorship’ would disappear.

[idontknow]

This is it. They are only ‘well run’ as long as the state funds continue to be pumped in via all the related ‘sponsorship’. If the Abu Dhabi state did sell up and anyone was naive enough to buy them, all that ‘sponsorship’ would disappear.

Which is roughly what FFP was meant to avoid, a club that would go bust if the owners bailed.

[BOBSCOUSE]

You said "If you're watching City and only see the oil then you're also missing something." That is exactly what they want to achieve with their sportswashing, they want to paint a nice pretty image, they don't want anyone to look beyond that. With City, you have to look beyond what is happening on the pitch and see how they got to this point. They got there through inflated sponsorship deals, off the books wages and all kinds of other stuff. If they had followed the rules, they would not be where they are now.

Plus, having achieved all the above and bought a status that would normally have taken years of evolution City can simply fall into line if the league/UEFA suddenly grew a pair.  Nothing effective can be done now for it's gone as far as it needed to as far as City are concerned. 

A few weeks back there was talk of a rule change, that sponsorships have to be seen to be at "normal" rates compared with those a club has negotiated in the last 5 years - well fuck me sideways, City have been getting bumped up sponsorships for more than 5 years now, so anything they pull in now will look like "normal" rates for them.  Absolutely bloody convenient to ignore that since 2008 their "commercial" income went stratospheric from a position of fuck all, yet here we are, look back over the last 5 years and it's a case of "nothing to see here, everything is normal, divert your eyes thataway thank you".

Open. Door. Stable. Horse. Bolted - and now that scruffy c*nt of a horse with its lack of self-awareness, having broken out of the knackers yard, is prancing around like it owns the fucking place and the sad thing is, it absolutely fucking does.

[FlashGordon]

You're not really saying something new, just repeating your first outburst. But since you ask so nicely....

FIRST, if you can, try to remember the CONTEXT of what I was writing. The context was Ronay piece on how City have combined cheating and competence to get to where they are. So obviously they have been really good at something other than just getting and spending money, since other clubs have done that woth getting to their level. Whether you like it or not, that is a FACT. As such it's a strange thing to get angry about. Acknowledging their competence IS NOT condoning or forgetting their cheating!

SECOND, as I stated, a thing can be more than ONE thing. Most reasonably intelligent people understand this. The City thing is all of the things you call it, but even with all the cheating to build it is still mastery. You could steal a Formula 1 car and get into a race, you'd be able to go really fast, but in the end you'd kill yourself because you are not a good enough driver. So the way they play, their consistency, that is the work of a master. I get that you hate it, I hate it, I get that you don't recognize their achivevements, neither do I, but that was not the point of the whole discussion. You yourself would never go on a tantrum like this if City did the exact thing they're doing only with much less skill. If City were 8th in the PL you wouldn't really care about how they got there. You care because they're really good at what they do.
Recognizing Pep as a great coach does not mean to accept what he's part of.

Football are many many things; art, passion, togetherness, comfort, sport, belonging, equality, tribalism, playfulness, business, money, agendas, politics etc etc etc... It is ALL of those, both together and separately. In the same way that your interest in football can be ONLY too feed your tribal needs, it is possible to view a football match devoid of any passion through stone cold tactical analysis, or as a tactical game of chess.
If you are able to enjoy football as an expression, a complicated game, a beautifully coreographed piece of art, outside of just your own tribalism, outside your need to win, outside of the football business, even outside of morals then you can look at City and see that some of the things they do as a team are really really hard to do and that it takes more than just a lot of money to do it. You might say that that doesn't matter, that it is not interesting. Fine, then thats' YOUR reality, but it doesn't mean that these things that you don't like doesn't exsist in the world. If you can't see it or won't recognize it, it doesn't go away. Having a go at someone for suggesting that reality might have more than one dimension, and insisting that you get to decide what dimension matters doesn't make you right, it doesn't make you a better fan, it doesn't make you more hardcore, or standing up more against the cheaters.
It just makes you into a small minded pocket-dictator. Cheats.

[rob1966]

This is it. They are only ‘well run’ as long as the state funds continue to be pumped in via all the related ‘sponsorship’. If the Abu Dhabi state did sell up and anyone was naive enough to buy them, all that ‘sponsorship’ would disappear.

This is why I am happy with the way FSG runs us, as they could walk away tomorrow and nothing changes. Abu Dhabi goes and so does Etihad, Etisalat, Visit Abu Dhabi, Dubai EXPO, Emirates Palace Abu Dhabi Hotel and Masdar.

They have no global reach, they have no worldwide fan base, they have a small support in Manchester, I'd reckon they have less supporters than Everton. they are not worth the value of the deals and sponsors would flee in their droves.

[JRed]

Why use a hundred words when you can use one 

[rob1966]

I do see what you're trying to say but I think what most people on here are pointing out is that it matters very little how well run City are, because the largest factor in them being so well run is the cheating.

 I could plan an excellent strategy with Monopoly if I kept stealing the money from the tray whilst the rest of the players stuck to the rules of the game. So do you concentrate on how well I've played after stealing the money or do you admit that the whole thing is worthless because I'm cheating whilst everyone else isn't?

I don't even think they are that well ran. They buy a player, he doesn't work out, they buy another, etc etc. no other club in the PL could waste £170million on Mendy, Danilo, Stones and Nathan Ake for example, but they can. We have to work hard to make sure we get our signings spot on, or we suffer for it. It's easy when you can just lash money at a problem until you get it right.

[RedSince86]

HOW am I defending them?

[idontknow]

to keep trolling

hotblooded partisanship.

I NEVER sad to forget about the cheating and enjoy their game. I never said that their achievements should be hailed. I get that you "really really hate City", you're a proper "super-fan" I'm sure you can find actual people who love City/Pep/Money to have a go at, but leave me out of your angry fantasy world.

I'm not a superfan, and hot-blooded partisanship, no idea what that might look like.
Angry fantasy world, no, I'm fairly sure after a good think I can say no on that one. In fact even at times I maybe should have  justififiably had an angry fantasy world thinking back I didn't.
Trolling? Don't think I'm the one doing that.

I have noticed everybody else is too bored to respond to you now though.

Pep is a managerial whore.
Manchester City have utterly corrupted the game.
They haven't done it through cleverness or smarts, but by money, corruption, and courtroom bullying.

And everything they have on the pitch, that they do on the pitch is a direct result of that.

And their players might be dumb footballers, but their manager is not, he knows exactly what vast advantage he has, and why he has it. He knows he's a cheat, and he does not care.

They are indefensible, on every level.

But ok, I'm a superfan in an angry fantasy world trolling.

[reddebs]

I find it unbelievable that there are people defending and/or excusing how these have achieved what they have 

They've cheated plain and simple.

They've broken every rule put in place to prevent that cheating.

They've hidden behind the ownership regime that has facilitated that cheating.

If they were a gang of criminals, rather than middle Eastern royalty, they'd be accused of money laundering, not lauded as a well run business.

[LFCEmpire]

I'm not a superfan, and hot-blooded partisanship, no idea what that might look like.
Angry fantasy world, no, I'm fairly sure after a good think I can say no on that one. In fact even at times I maybe should have  justififiably had an angry fantasy world thinking back I didn't.
Trolling? Don't think I'm the one doing that.

I have noticed everybody else is too bored to respond to you now though.

Pep is a managerial whore.
Manchester City have utterly corrupted the game.
They haven't done it through cleverness or smarts, but by money, corruption, and courtroom bullying.

And everything they have on the pitch, that they do on the pitch is a direct result of that.

And their players might be dumb footballers, but their manager is not, he knows exactly what vast advantage he has, and why he has it. He knows he's a cheat, and he does not care.

They are indefensible, on every level.

But ok, I'm a superfan in an angry fantasy world trolling.

Agree with every word mate.

Fuck off City you worthless c*nts.

[Alan_X]

Deleted a load of posts. If anyone wants to justify Abu Dhabi FC's cheating please do it here: https://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/forums/bluemoon-forum.1/

[JRed]

Deleted a load of posts. If anyone wants to justify Abu Dhabi FC's cheating please do it here: https://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/forums/bluemoon-forum.1/

Nice one.
A useful link for the sportswashed out there.

[rob1966]

Deleted a load of posts. If anyone wants to justify Abu Dhabi FC's cheating please do it here: https://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/forums/bluemoon-forum.1/

His posts remind me of Kaizer

[Andy @ Allerton!]

A cracking and well deserved win for the Reds yesterday, but I'm starting to agree that the league is already done in January.

This isn't being defeatist, but you are playing a team with three first team squads. With AFCON, Covid and injuries, there are few that can compete.

It will only take a few seasons of this before TV fans will switch off and walk away. You only have to see other countries and the way their top sides throttle their leagues and see how popular they are across the world to see the truth in this.

Manchester City have killed the league and the Tory government are 100% complicit in the death of English football.

[bradders1011]

Guardiola is the football equivalent of those "I bought my own house at 22!" people from the papers who turn out to have been given £500k by their dad.

[Alan_X]

Guardiola is the football equivalent of those "I bought my own house at 22!" people from the papers who turn out to have been given £500k by their dad.

A bit like this:

[killer-heels]

A bit like this:

Hahahaha is that actually a Times article and not a Onion article?

[bornandbRED]

Just seen their financial results.

They’ve actually…. become a pretty self sustaining and very well run club in the last 5 years. With the caveat there might be some brown envelopes flying around in there somewhere.

[Alan_X]

It's real - they also decided to downgrade from an Audi A3 to a Tesla as a money-saving tip..

[JRed]

Just seen their financial results.

They’ve actually…. become a pretty self sustaining and very well run club in the last 5 years. With the caveat there might be some brown envelopes flying around in there somewhere.

Don’t you start…

[1892tillforever]

A cracking and well deserved win for the Reds yesterday, but I'm starting to agree that the league is already done in January.

This isn't being defeatist, but you are playing a team with three first team squads. With AFCON, Covid and injuries, there are few that can compete.

It will only take a few seasons of this before TV fans will switch off and walk away. You only have to see other countries and the way their top sides throttle their leagues and see how popular they are across the world to see the truth in this.

Manchester City have killed the league and the Tory government are 100% complicit in the death of English football.

The cynic in me thinks their massive cheating will suddenly become a problem if Liverpool FC experience a drop off after Klopp leaves and the oil cheats are stopping other teams from competing.

Their successful sportswashing is possible due to media complicity sure, but tribalism plays a huge role too. As long as they stop the nasty Scousers it's okay. Likewise, if Arsenal were in our position, for example, Spurs fans and fans of other clubs would want the oil cheats to win and so on. What these morons don't realise is that this cheating hurts ALL clubs. Without them and the London cheats, other teams would have the chance to challenge for the title or at least get a Champions League place. The likes of West Ham and Leicester would be in a good spot for such an opportunity.

City, specifically, were a shit yo-yo club before winning the blood money lottery. This affects teams in the relegation battle and those fighting it out in the Championship playoff/promotion spots and so on. With City being their old shit selves, they would probably be in relegation battles most seasons and get relegated as they have done before. How many teams have missed out on the Premier League or missed out on staying in the league because of this cheating? Yet no one seems to think about the huge effect it has had AWAY from the top of the table. Newcastle is another example. Their blood money takes away a Premier League spot from someone else because let's be honest, they were going nowhere fast as a club until the takeover.

[Alan_X]

Just seen their financial results.

They’ve actually…. become a pretty self sustaining and very well run club in the last 5 years.

Hahahahaha...

[Alan_X]

The cynic in me thinks their massive cheating will suddenly become a problem if Liverpool FC experience a drop off after Klopp leaves and the oil cheats are stopping other teams from competing.

Their successful sportswashing is possible due to media complicity sure, but tribalism plays a huge role too. As long as they stop the nasty Scousers it's okay. Likewise, if Arsenal were in our position, for example, Spurs fans and fans of other clubs would want the oil cheats to win and so on. What these morons don't realise is that this cheating hurts ALL clubs. Without them and the London cheats, other teams would have the chance to challenge for the title or at least get a Champions League place. The likes of West Ham and Leicester would be in a good spot for such an opportunity.

City, specifically, were a shit yo-yo club before winning the blood money lottery. This affects teams in the relegation battle and those fighting it out in the Championship playoff/promotion spots and so on. With City being their old shit selves, they would probably be in relegation battles most seasons and get relegated as they have done before. How many teams have missed out on the Premier League or missed out on staying in the league because of this cheating? Yet no one seems to think about the huge effect it has had AWAY from the top of the table. Newcastle is another example. Their blood money takes away a Premier League spot from someone else because let's be honest, they were going nowhere fast as a club until the takeover.

If City win the next five league titles (not out of the question) the ability to market the Premier League as the "Best League in the World" is going to be severely damaged, whether Liverpool are successful or not.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

The cynic in me thinks their massive cheating will suddenly become a problem if Liverpool FC experience a drop off after Klopp leaves and the oil cheats are stopping other teams from competing.

Their successful sportswashing is possible due to media complicity sure, but tribalism plays a huge role too. As long as they stop the nasty Scousers it's okay. Likewise, if Arsenal were in our position, for example, Spurs fans and fans of other clubs would want the oil cheats to win and so on. What these morons don't realise is that this cheating hurts ALL clubs. Without them and the London cheats, other teams would have the chance to challenge for the title or at least get a Champions League place. The likes of West Ham and Leicester would be in a good spot for such an opportunity.

City, specifically, were a shit yo-yo club before winning the blood money lottery. This affects teams in the relegation battle and those fighting it out in the Championship playoff/promotion spots and so on. With City being their old shit selves, they would probably be in relegation battles most seasons and get relegated as they have done before. How many teams have missed out on the Premier League or missed out on staying in the league because of this cheating? Yet no one seems to think about the huge effect it has had AWAY from the top of the table. Newcastle is another example. Their blood money takes away a Premier League spot from someone else because let's be honest, they were going nowhere fast as a club until the takeover.

Yeah good post.

The problem isn't Manchester City or Newcastle though.

The problem is the organisations that are set up to prevent this not doing their jobs.

The way it's set up is amateur and laughable. There should be no way to hide finances. Every aspect of every financial transaction should be public and visible.

Any deviance from this and any hiding of any funds from any source should lead directly to points deductions, relegation and the like.

Financial fines are worthless against the holdings of an oil rich nation.

If you break the law. If you go against the rules. Minimum is a 10 point deduction. Do it 2 or 3 times and it's relegation with no appeals.

[1892tillforever]

If City win the next five league titles (not out of the question) the ability to market the Premier League as the "Best League in the World" is going to be severely damaged, whether Liverpool are successful or not.

That's a logical take Alan but I'm not so sure it will affect things that much. We'll still get the lavish ads and BS hyperbole as pundits salivate over the oil cheats and focus on the 'race for the Top 4' by January each year. Most clubs never challenge for a title in any case so they won't care that much. Other major European leagues are just as uncompetitive in the long run so it isn't as if there are other leagues to turn to.

Long story short, I'm not confident that football fans will revolt and start switching off.

Of course by then Newcastle will likely have their feet under the table and be challenging so we'll be 'treated' to a 2-horse race every year  There is also the possibility that United get their act together by then (unlikely but who knows?)

[spider-neil]

Deleted a load of posts. If anyone wants to justify Abu Dhabi FC's cheating please do it here: https://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/forums/bluemoon-forum.1/

I understand you want to clean up the thread and delete a ton of posts with impunity but it's quite annoying when you delete posts that some people have gone through a lot of time and trouble to type up and submit.

[El Lobo]

I dont really think they give a fuck if its competitive, the 'we dont care as long as we all get paid' mantra has dripped pretty quickly down from the top.

[Alan_X]

I understand you want to clean up the thread and delete a ton of posts with impunity but it's quite annoying when you delete posts that some people have gone through a lot of time and trouble to type up and submit.

I understand that but it would have helped if people hadn't kept engaging with ridiculous posts. If I had an hour or two I'd have taken more time to read through each of those posts before cleaning up the thread but given the volume of shite I had to take a broad brush approach. It's a two way street  - we try not to over-moderate and prefer not to delete unless necessary, but the thread had descended into insults and was a complete mess.

[Jm55]

The optimist in me thinks that it’s unlikely the TV contracts get sold for their current value if City keep pissing the league every season (which hopefully they won’t this season but it’s far from beyond the realms).

Really, if you want to see a genuine title race, or at least start a season with 3 teams that have a genuine chance of winning it, then La Liga is the best bet currently with Real, Barca and Atletico (I know that Barca are nowhere near it currently but I can’t imagine it will be too long before they are again).

The annoying thing is you watch great matches like ours vs Spurs and Chelsea and the likes of Neville will hype it up suggesting that it’s illustrative of the competitiveness of the division, and in isolation he’d have a point, but the reality is that more often than not, these matches, despite being great to watch, will have little impact on where the title ends up because City will be streets ahead generally.

The hope has to be that Guardiola fucks off and City revert to their pre-Guardiola levels which meant that yes they still won the league, but it wasn’t every year and you didn’t need 95 points to have a realsitic chance of beating them, luckily Guardiola isn’t the type to hang around too long so hopefully that continues.

[Crosby Nick]

If City win the next five league titles (not out of the question) the ability to market the Premier League as the "Best League in the World" is going to be severely damaged, whether Liverpool are successful or not.

I do agree. But if in the next five years two or three other English sides win a Champions League or make the final (not beyond the realms of possibility) there could still be an argument that it’s the strongest. But yeah, certainly wouldn’t be the best if they end up with something like 9 out of the last 10.

[Alan_X]

That's a logical take Alan but I'm not so sure it will affect things that much. We'll still get the lavish ads and BS hyperbole as pundits salivate over the oil cheats and focus on the 'race for the Top 4' by January each year. Most clubs never challenge for a title in any case so they won't care that much. Other major European leagues are just as uncompetitive in the long run so it isn't as if there are other leagues to turn to.

Long story short, I'm not confident that football fans will revolt and start switching off.

Of course by then Newcastle will likely have their feet under the table and be challenging so we'll be 'treated' to a 2-horse race every year  There is also the possibility that United get their act together by then (unlikely but who knows?)

European leagues that are dominated by one or two clubs (Bundesliga, La Liga, Serie A) get about half the money that the Premier League gets.  Ligue Un gets a quarter of the money and from there it goes down to a tenth or less.

[1892tillforever]

European leagues that are dominated by one or two clubs (Bundesliga, La Liga, Serie A) get about half the money that the Premier League gets.  Ligue Un gets a quarter of the money and from there it goes down to a tenth or less.

True again but if no other league is particularly competitive, do you think the 'best league in the world' will retain its prominence solely by default? If not, where will the money go? Will we see the bubble finally burst in football as a whole?

[rob1966]

The optimist in me thinks that it’s unlikely the TV contracts get sold for their current value if City keep pissing the league every season (which hopefully they won’t this season but it’s far from beyond the realms).

Really, if you want to see a genuine title race, or at least start a season with 3 teams that have a genuine chance of winning it, then La Liga is the best bet currently with Real, Barca and Atletico (I know that Barca are nowhere near it currently but I can’t imagine it will be too long before they are again).

The annoying thing is you watch great matches like ours vs Spurs and Chelsea and the likes of Neville will hype it up suggesting that it’s illustrative of the competitiveness of the division, and in isolation he’d have a point, but the reality is that more often than not, these matches, despite being great to watch, will have little impact on where the title ends up because City will be streets ahead generally.

The hope has to be that Guardiola fucks off and City revert to their pre-Guardiola levels which meant that yes they still won the league, but it wasn’t every year and you didn’t need 95 points to have a realsitic chance of beating them, luckily Guardiola isn’t the type to hang around too long so hopefully that continues.

Sadly I think they will, as people don't subscribe, especially those from abroad, to watch City, they want to watch footy in general, but mainly it us and the Red Mancs that is the big draw as far as the PL is concerned.

[Jm55]

Sadly I think they will, as people don't subscribe, especially those from abroad, to watch City, they want to watch footy in general, but mainly it us and the Red Mancs that is the big draw as far as the PL is concerned.

They do but us and United start the season with a genuine belief that we can win the title, granted I United’s case that belief is misplaced but it exists nevertheless.

If the league reaches a stage where the title is virtually done before a ball is kicked as is the case generally in Germany and France save for the odd mad season, then I just think the product loses its value somewhat and the games lose their edge which surely affects the marketability of the product.

What may save the PL in the event that that happens is the top 4 race which should always remain relatively competitive, I mean Chelsea have had shitloads of money for almost 20 years now and they still fail to qualify now and then (and I wouldn’t absolutely rule out that happening this season if they drop points again any time soon). As I said above the hope is that City lose their manager and revert to a previous normal level, my worry is that the management of the club has setup an infrastructure which makes it easier for Guardiola’s successor to carry the process on without a massive drop off.

[Pistolero]

The only realistic chance of a more level PL playing field is a post-Guardiola, unstable Man City bouncing through a succession of managers....would love to think Jurgen would still be here to make hay when that happens - he and we deserve every accolade in the football book for going toe to toe with them over the past few years...

[Lycan]

City Xtra
@City_Xtra
Officials at #ManCity were thoroughly unimpressed by Jim Beglin referring to the Etihad Stadium as the ‘Emptyhad’ during the 1-0 win vs Chelsea, and they complained to in-house broadcaster Premier League Productions while the match was ongoing.

[via @MikeKeegan_DM
]

https://twitter.com/City_Xtra/status/1482846305219133451

They've become such sensitive souls.