Topic: Bellamy: Would choose Champions League qualification over Carling Cup

[stevedo]

what a pointless thread and argument. We'll try our best for both, can't we just leave it at that.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Thread summary:


'Hi, I'm Andy. Did you know I have a cup final ticket?'

More like the "If I'm not going I don't 'care' about this Competition' from some people.

[lfc_col]

So what if your not going but want us to win it 

[CHOPPER]

Andy, are you Basil Fawlty in disguise by any chance?

[Andy @ Allerton!]

So what if your not going but want us to win it 

Proper fan

Everyone should want us to win everything and anything we can. We could still win the league yet!

[DangerScouse]

Proper fan

Everyone should want us to win everything and anything we can.

Andy show we one post where someone has said anything different?

[sinnermichael]

will he celebrate if he scores at the weekend?

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Andy show we one post where someone has said anything different?

I can show you plenty of posts where people think that fourth is more important than this cup.

[rossipersempre]

I can show you plenty of posts where people think that fourth is more important than this cup.

That's because it is. Pull your head out of your superfan arse and you might just see the logic.

But you won't because you prefer to froth at the mouth and make ludicrous misinterpretations that people don't want us to win the cup, including Craig Bellamy.

[rossipersempre]

will he celebrate if he scores at the weekend?

Read the article maybe you'll find the answer.

[Jason_King]

That's because it is. Pull your head out of your superfan arse and you might just see the logic.

But you won't because you prefer to froth at the mouth and make ludicrous misinterpretations that people don't want us to win the cup, including Craig Bellamy.

Most fans want 4th over the carling cup. But you you wont find one Liverpool fan hoping we wont win it, because losing the CC final isnt a pre requisite for getting 4th?

What a baffling argument Andy

[CHOPPER]

Most fans want 4th over the carling cup. But you you wont find one Liverpool fan hoping we wont win it, because losing the CC final isnt a pre requisite for getting 4th?

What a baffling argument Andy

Most! If there is any gauge as to what the fans want it would be based on age, the older fans want trophies first and foremost, the younger fans want a CL spot as the main goal. Not and exact assumption but pretty much what I've encountered when talking to other reds.

[farawayred]

Most! If there is any gauge as to what the fans want it would be based on age, the older fans want trophies first and foremost, the younger fans want a CL spot as the main goal. Not and exact assumption but pretty much what I've encountered when talking to other reds.

I agree with that. And with what Rossi said above, who in his right mind wants to lose a cup final?!? But the question "fourth or the Cup" is nonsense to begin with. As it is, there is practically a zero correlation, unless one thinks that the extra game this weekend will jeopardize our push for fourth. (If anything, it can spur us on for the remainder of the season.)

[rossipersempre]

Most! If there is any gauge as to what the fans want it would be based on age, the older fans want trophies first and foremost, the younger fans want a CL spot as the main goal. Not and exact assumption but pretty much what I've encountered when talking to other reds.

Not so sure about that, you could say that older fans (who've seen us collect silverware almost by right) are used to Cups and having had a unexpected taste of it in 2005 (2007 and 2009 to a lesser extent), want to see us dominating Europe once more. I fall into that category as do a lot of mates.

Equally, you could argue that younger fans have seen a lot of CL football but only 1 domestic cup in the last 6 years (not at Wembley) so would be keen to see that.

Swings and roundabouts...

[Red number seven]

, I think the two are directly linked. We win on Sunday and it gives us a boost, a surge of self-confidence and belief to go on to secure 4th, taking advantage of a couple of London clubs in freefall. Lose, and we'll be full of doubt and regret and eke out the rest of a miserable season scraping 6th or 7th.

I think that is the correct answer. This is a ludicrously false dichotomy. We do not need to choose and, in fact, winning this makes us more likely to finish 4th.

I will go further than that, though.

Winning Saturday makes this next generation more likely to go on and win other things. Regardless of what anyone thinks of Houllier, Rafa etc, the victory in Istanbul started in Cardiff with Gerrard, Carragher et al winning their first trophy, on pens, against lower division opposition. Without that it is reasonable to think we may not have had the season we had in 2000-01, not developed the crucial trophy winning and subsequent European trophy winning experience and that generation would've been less well equipped to go all the way to the victory in Istanbul.

So beating Cardiff is a massive first trophy for the returning King, and for the squad of the next 5 years plus; Suarez, Carroll, Henderson, Adam, Skrtel, Agger, Lucas (I assume he'll get a medal) etc  have yet to win club trophies. It can bring know how and hunger for more. And there is no reason to think it will detract from the FA cup run or the push for 4th.

[Red number seven]

Not so sure about that, you could say that older fans (who've seen us collect silverware almost by right) are used to Cups and having had a unexpected taste of it in 2005 (2007 and 2009 to a lesser extent), want to see us dominating Europe once more. I fall into that category as do a lot of mates.

Equally, you could argue that younger fans have seen a lot of CL football but only 1 domestic cup in the last 6 years (not at Wembley) so would be keen to see that.

Swings and roundabouts...

I've lived through 5 European Cups, 3 UEFA cups, 6 FA cups, 7 League Cups and 11 League titles, am young at heart and want both.

[CHOPPER]

Not so sure about that, you could say that older fans (who've seen us collect silverware almost by right) are used to Cups and having had a unexpected taste of it in 2005 (2007 and 2009 to a lesser extent), want to see us dominating Europe once more. I fall into that category as do a lot of mates.

Equally, you could argue that younger fans have seen a lot of CL football but only 1 domestic cup in the last 6 years (not at Wembley) so would be keen to see that.

Swings and roundabouts...

My point entirely from my very first post, there is no right or wrong, it's about an individuals opinion. The most important thing is, is that we can actually have this debate come minor tiff. And long may it continue.

Vive la différence!

[KennyDaggers]

I agree with him however I can't wait to see us play at this Stadium and pick up a silver pot again.

If I am honest I couldn't give a toss about the Carling Cup however I've been the stadium before, it will be great to see it full of scousers and I'm really looking forward to us making the first of 3 appearances here this season.

[Haemoglobin]

If a dark mysterious wizard appeared right now on a crystal unicorn, and proceeded to offer me a choice between granting us a guaranteed 4th place league finish or a guaranteed Carling Cup win, I'm pretty certain I'd take the sure shot at Champions League football next season, and leave the cup final to chance.

But mostly I'd be thinking, "what a disappointing wizard".

[farawayred]

If a dark mysterious wizard appeared right now on a crystal unicorn, and proceeded to offer me a choice between granting us a guaranteed 4th place league finish or a guaranteed Carling Cup win, I'm pretty certain I'd take the sure shot at Champions League football next season, and leave the cup final to chance.

But mostly I'd be thinking, "what a disappointing wizard".

Lay off the drugs mate...   

[rossipersempre]

I've lived through 5 European Cups, 3 UEFA cups, 6 FA cups, 7 League Cups and 11 League titles, am young at heart and want both.

Technically I'm the same (albeit I emotionally missed out on Rome and Wembley due to age, so Paris was the 'first'), and I too would like both. And whilst I'm glad you agree both are directly linked with each other, when push comes to shove, securing 4th is ultimately a more important goal than any domestic cup in the present context.

I do get your point about our Millenium exploits, but I think we're in a very different position these days, with CL revenue the key, a new stadium yet to be built, and City and Chelsea's bottomless cash hordes to compete with.

[rossipersempre]

My point entirely from my very first post, there is no right or wrong, it's about an individuals opinion. The most important thing is, is that we can actually have this debate come minor tiff. And long may it continue.

Vive la différence!

Quite. Unless you're name's Andy of course spouting that anyone who wants 4th is a whopper (hello irony), including Bellamy who should be dropped from the squad as he couldn't give a shit obviously.

[macca888]

Look at all the shit bellamy has caused now. Now he can do with words what used to take him a 5 iron to achieve. Fuck him off, the little Welsh twatting divisive troublemaker.

[bclfc]

All of the above.  Thank you.



You're welcome.

[kennedy81]

apart from Barca and Madrid, there's no-one in this years CL that we should fear, and it pains me that we're not in it.
if you offered me 4th now, instead of the chance of 2 cups, I'd take it.
if you offered me the 2 cups in the bag, I'd take the cups.
if we only win one cup and miss out on 4th, it'll be a disappointing season I think, especially since the arse and chelsea are so bad this year.

[dave 5516]

Pro-tip: no one google this.

You do know i'm gonna have too now dontcha.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

My point entirely from my very first post, there is no right or wrong, it's about an individuals opinion. The most important thing is, is that we can actually have this debate come minor tiff. And long may it continue.

Vive la différence!

Best point in the whole thread.

How fantastic that we're even in a Cup Final.

[bobadicious]

Why choose?

[-RedTilDead-]

Why choose?

It is interesting to see where people's priorities lie.  No reason for anyone to get defensive about it.  99% or more of our fans would rather we managed both I would guess.

I would rather we won some silverware and for the record I am 35, no longer young, not quite auld 

[nocturnalvin]

Andy show we one post where someone has said anything different?

he can't. But he has the ticket eh.

[west_london_red]

What's the issue here? I'm sure just because hed rather play in the Champions League that he's not gonna exactly go out of his way to play shit on Sunday or throw the game!

[riismeister]

I'd prefer to win both cup and get CL rather than not.

[rossipersempre]

What's the issue here? I'm sure just because hed rather play in the Champions League that he's not gonna exactly go out of his way to play shit on Sunday or throw the game!

Ooh, I dunno, he might throw it given it's Cardiff. No doubt that will be suggested in seriousness soon, given we've already (predictably) seen nuggets such as this one posted...

Bellamy shouldn't be allowed anywhere near this game. I wouldn't even allow him to be on the bench. He's not interested - fine - get a player in that it means something to instead.

[Razorblade]

he can't. But he has the ticket eh.

Haha...he's been to all the finals don't you know

[What's the procedure Mr Mod?]

Who wouldn't?

[rossipersempre]

Haha...he's been to all the finals don't you know

But what colours was he wearing in '86 and '89 eh?

[Barefoot Doctor]

I want us to win the Carling Cup. But more than the CC, I want us to win the European Cup again at the next possible opportunity - and that will be next season. To do that, we need to finish top four. So yeah, I'd take top four ahead of the Carling Cup, but thankfully it's not one or the other.

[Filler.]

He's just probably trying to play things down. I don't care what he'd prefer to be honest. He gets asked the usual dull questions and he says stuff. All I know is, and all I care about, is that I know with 100% conviction that Bellamy is going to give his best on Sunday.

He's obviously going to court more and more media interest building up to the game, but I hope on the pitch he drifts OUT of the game a bit more, and not be looking to be the all energy, all happening wing forward. Not sure that approach is going to work. Obviously he's going to attack the full backs, but we might be forced to show a bit more patience than usual.

[west_london_red]

Ooh, I dunno, he might throw it given it's Cardiff. No doubt that will be suggested in seriousness soon, given we've already (predictably) seen nuggets such as this one posted...

Or he could have said he prefered winning the league cup and no doubt some people would suggest he doesn't care where we finish in the league or better still he only wants to win the league cup so he can put his feet up for the last 10 weeks of the season...

[Abrak]

Actually I dont want us to qualify for CL. The reason is if 6 players are going for 4 places in the CL, the winner is the player that can survive without being in the CL. Everyone assumes that if we qualify for the CL it will be a gravy train. While if Chelsea and Arsenal miss out they will simply spend a fortune to qualify next year. Do you really think that Arsenal are going to spend less because they do not qualify?

We of course will go on a spending spree because we have qualified and almost certainly wont qualify the following year. Look it is blatantly obvious that if 6 players are going for 4 CL places the guaranteed winner is the club who can survive without CL. So as soon as people realize that losing isnt important they win.