Topic: Spurs: fucking useless

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Hope they draw Man City next.

Nah, hope City end up with Atletico. That would be the most challenging side for City over two legs and it would benefit us more than them facing Spurs

[Ghost Town]

Credit where it's due, 4-0 against Dortmund in a last 16 Champions League tie is a fucking great result.

Dortmund are a really good side, and so are Spurs. We'd be calling a result like that a message to Europe, I think Spurs can do the same.

I live in London now and Spurs and their fans get on my tits for a number of compelling reasons but they've smashed it here.

Not really, they drew a team bang out of form. I imagine no one is more surprised than Spurs at the ease with which they got through

[FiSh77]

Hope they draw Man City next.

Another easy draw for City then

The fume will be strong on here

[Henry Gale]

Dortmund have looked like shite for well over a month now. Just 1 win in 8. They couldn't give the likes of Nürnberg or Augsburg a game recently.  Their wonderful football and form of the first half of the season is a distant memory.

Yeah gutted really, I wanted Dortmund to smash them.

[Petadroli]

but teams like Porto, Dortmund, Wolfsburg, Sevilla and Monaco have got deeper into the competitions in recent seasons, the 'but it's spurs' argument isn't really doing it for me to be honest I don't think those teams where bigger spenders. And it's a bit of a myth he's some pauper, it's only this season they spent nothing.  At the end of the day, he (or whoever picks players there) has built an excellent team in the last 5 years, and he's coached them well, domestically. They have been a good enough squad to do FAR better in Europe than they have under him. So it is about time he got them beyond the last 16 in either CL or Europa.

Porto plays in the CL every year. Dortmund are a powerhouse of European football. Wolfsburg are playing against relegation in the BL right now and only got to the last 8 of the Europa League anyway (as if that's an achievement). Sevilla are record holders of Europa League titles. Monaco were French Champions that season and even dumped out Guardiola's ManCity.

Spurs got to the last 8 in the Europa League under Villas-Boas in 2012, not sure that was in any way important. But I agree on you with that: it's about time they do something in Europe, they've been a good team for three or four seasons now.

[Dim Glas]

Porto plays in the CL every year. Dortmund are a powerhouse of European football. Wolfsburg are playing against relegation in the BL right now and only got to the last 8 of the Europa League anyway (as if that's an achievement). Sevilla are record holders of Europa League titles. Monaco were French Champions that season and even dumped out Guardiola's ManCity.

Spurs got to the last 8 in the Europa League under Villas-Boas in 2012, not sure that was in any way important. But I agree on you with that: it's about time they do something in Europe, they've been a good team for three or four seasons now.

You might want to look at the Bundesliga table if you think Wolfsburg are fighting relegation. And the 'as if that is an achievement' thing, Spurs didn't' even get beyond the last 16 of the Europa either - that was part of my point, so thanks for proving it I guess! And getting there under Vilas Boas shows how shit Pochetinno has been with a superior team    Dortmund 10 years ago where anything but a powerhouse by the way, and even now, they are a team that lives within its means (for good reason), still buys to sell, and don't play in a league anywhere near as financially strong and deep as Spurs do. 

Surely, the team he has had, with some fantastic talent in there - which he desrves much credit for coaching well domestically should have done more in recent seasons in europe. That is my point. The 'its only spurs' argument is nonsense when you look at some of the other teams who have done more recently. BUT now he has done it, so good for him, cos goodness knows his European record up to this season was not very good.

Anyway, we could go round in circles, and we won't. All I am saying - it's about time he took this team to the quarter finals.

Yeah gutted really, I wanted Dortmund to smash them.

yeah me too, thought they would have when the draw was made too, they where flying. A few weeks is a long time in football though! And they've just struggled for weeks, lots of injuries, loss of confidence, and just a total loss of mojo!

[Petadroli]

Anyway, we could go round in circles, and we won't. All I am saying - it's about time he took this team to the quarter finals.

yeah me too, thought they would have when the draw was made too, they where flying. A few weeks is a long time in football though! And they've just struggled for weeks, lots of injuries, loss of confidence, and just a total loss of mojo!

Agree!

[4pool]

Poch is a decent manager. Nothing more. Just because he can get Spurs the top 4 of the PL doesn't make him one of Europes best. He needs to win things. Eddie Howe is a decent manager as well with what he has to work with.

I'm sure others will disagree with me. Because the media in the UK make the PL as the bestest ever league. And therefore managers and players are "World Class". The most over used term in football.

But if you hype it long enough, it will stick..

[anoopvk]

Poch is a decent manager. Nothing more. Just because he can get Spurs the top 4 of the PL doesn't make him one of Europes best. He needs to win things. Eddie Howe is a decent manager as well with what he has to work with.

I'm sure others will disagree with me. Because the media in the UK make the PL as the bestest ever league. And therefore managers and players are "World Class". The most over used term in football.

But if you hype it long enough, it will stick..

What about Klopp then?

[jillcwhomever]

What about Klopp then?

Klopp is a two time title winner with Dortmund, who took on the richest club in Germany and beat them two seasons running, as well as a cup and league double and a Champions League Final. He's had less time that Pochettino has had here and already he's making us into a title challenging team. So what is your point exactly in asking the question?

[Dim Glas]

What about Klopp then?

whereas I don't agree with 4Pool's assumption that Pochetinno HAS to win things to be considered very good (he doesn't while he stays at Spurs, but will have to if he goes to Madrid), and he's clearly miles ahead of someone like Eddie Howe. I am not sure what Klopp has to do with his comment being as he fits his criteria - ie: he's won stuff. 

[anoopvk]

Klopp is a two time title winner with Dortmund, who took on the richest club in Germany and beat them two seasons running, as well as a cup and league double and a Champions League Final. He's had less time that Pochettino has had here and already he's making us into a title challenging team. So what is your point exactly in asking the question?

You took budget into consideration for Klopp in Germany. Here Klopp is spending shit load compared Poch and hasn't won anything yet.
Poch is a good manager. May not be in Klopp's  or Pep's league, but he is really good.

[jillcwhomever]

You took budget into consideration for Klopp in Germany. Here Klopp is spending shit load compared Poch and hasn't won anything yet.
Poch is a good manager. May not be in Klopp's  or Pep's league, but he is really good.

I've not said he's not a good manager you seem to be questioning Klopp though. Does it not make a difference that he's having to take on City with all their resources?

[Dim Glas]

I've not said he's not a good manager you seem to be questioning Klopp though. Does it not make a difference that he's having to take on City with all their resources?

Yeah, not sure why Klopp is in this discussion, seems kinda odd, being as it's about Pochetinno, in a  Spurs thread.

I disagree with 4Pool too, and I hate the 'he has to win stuff' argument. Cos you HAVE to put into consideration each individual situation. There's plenty of coaches who have won stuff that you wouldn't touch with a bargepole if they become available.  At the end of the day, there are only a couple trophies to win in each league, and 2 European trophies for the whole of Europe. That isn't many. There will always be far more good coaches than there are trophies for them to win.

[TepidT2O]

Poch is a decent manager. Nothing more. Just because he can get Spurs the top 4 of the PL doesn't make him one of Europes best. He needs to win things. Eddie Howe is a decent manager as well with what he has to work with.

I'm sure others will disagree with me. Because the media in the UK make the PL as the bestest ever league. And therefore managers and players are "World Class". The most over used term in football.

But if you hype it long enough, it will stick..

No, he’s an extremely good manager.

[Chris~]

Yeah, not sure why Klopp is in this discussion, seems kinda odd, being as it's about Pochetinno, in a  Spurs thread.

I disagree with 4Pool too, and I hate the 'he has to win stuff' argument. Cos you HAVE to put into consideration each individual situation. There's plenty of coaches who have won stuff that you wouldn't touch with a bargepole if they become available.  At the end of the day, there are only a couple trophies to win in each league, and 2 European trophies for the whole of Europe. That isn't many. There will always be far more good coaches than there are trophies for them to win.

I'd argue there are only two trophies that really matter now anyway, League and Champions League. Winning anything else as a top 4/6 English club doesn't really change how you're viewed by the outside or other clubs owners. Winning the league cup or Fa cup isn't going to change peoples views on Pochettino. Spurs fans would celebrate, same way we would if we won one, everyone else will shrug and move on.

[trav2591]

You took budget into consideration for Klopp in Germany. Here Klopp is spending shit load compared Poch and hasn't won anything yet.
Poch is a good manager. May not be in Klopp's  or Pep's league, but he is really good.

Hate this line of thinking. He hasn't really spent a shit load though has he?

If Spurs sold Eriksen to Real for £120M and Poch spent that replacing one of his best players would you say "Hes spent a shitload" or "He had to replace one of his best players"

[El Lobo]

Credit where it's due, 4-0 against Dortmund in a last 16 Champions League tie is a fucking great result.

Dortmund are a really good side, and so are Spurs. We'd be calling a result like that a message to Europe, I think Spurs can do the same.

I live in London now and Spurs and their fans get on my tits for a number of compelling reasons but they've smashed it here.

The difference being we do that pretty frequently whereas Spurs messages to Europe generally lead to them going out in the next round (or even the same round) and come a few years apart

They are the current embodiment of Arsenal of the ‘10s, except Arsenal used to win trophies in between getting knocked out in the 1/4 finals in the CL (or earlier) and finishing 3rd/4th. And he was never hyped up to be this mega boss despite also having a very low net spend compared to their ‘rivals’

[Inpeace]

Hate this line of thinking. He hasn't really spent a shit load though has he?

If Spurs sold Eriksen to Real for £120M and Poch spent that replacing one of his best players would you say "Hes spent a shitload" or "He had to replace one of his best players"

I am not arguing merits as a manager but it is hard to argue that Klopp hasn't spent a lot more - ~£100M p/a on wages although our 2018 wages have not yet been announced.  (You earned the money and are entitled to spend it).

[4pool]

I'll put it to you this way when it comes to great managers v good ones.

If Rafa was in charge of Spurs, with their budget, do you think they would do more than challenge for the top 4?

If Poch was in charge of Newcastle, with their budget, do you think he could keep them up or even win the Championship with those players?

Now take your bias out and look at the managerial ability.


And before someone brings it up, this isn't about Rafa either. But it does highlight an old saying..he could win with his, and he could win with yours. Rafa is that type of manager, imho. There are others who would do as well as Rafa and those are top managers. Clearly Klopp is one as well for his work at Mainz, Dortmund, and now Liverpool. Ancelotti is another. There are a number of top managers out there.

Poch is a good manager but he's not a top manager...imho. His away record v top 4 stinks. But if your remit is make sure you make top 4, then he's doing well enough for Spurs. If his remit includes making Finals to try to win something, he's fallen short then. If his remit includes actually winning something, then he hasn't even come close to achieving that.

[Charlie Adams fried egg]

I am not arguing merits as a manager but it is hard to argue that Klopp hasn't spent a lot more - ~£100M p/a on wages although our 2018 wages have not yet been announced.  (You earned the money and are entitled to spend it).

I hate all this comparative stuff.
Given that both our clubs are up against Utd City and Chelsea, both managers have done a great job.
Agree with comments about more good coaches than trophies too. Both managers have, by any measure improved their clubs.
Cheers for acknowledging that we've spent what we've earned, which is why I can't begrudge Utd's spend when compared with City and Chelsea.

[Floydy]

Hope to god we finish their season (as far as PL goes) when we play them, we owe them a defeat for that 2008/9 defeat where Carra scored an own goal and they won 2-1 despite us battering them.   Chuck in a couple of Kane's dives  from recent seasons and we owe them big time.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Yeah, not sure why Klopp is in this discussion, seems kinda odd, being as it's about Pochetinno, in a  Spurs thread.

I disagree with 4Pool too, and I hate the 'he has to win stuff' argument. Cos you HAVE to put into consideration each individual situation. There's plenty of coaches who have won stuff that you wouldn't touch with a bargepole if they become available.  At the end of the day, there are only a couple trophies to win in each league, and 2 European trophies for the whole of Europe. That isn't many. There will always be far more good coaches than there are trophies for them to win.

If he goes to Real Madrid, and wins stuff, then he'll be in the "great manager" class. Because that will recognise two things: firstly, that he has the managerial chops to win trophies, and secondly, that he has the managerial chops to be considered by the world's biggest clubs.

Right now, he's had enough time and opportunity to win any trophy in England, and he hasn't done so. And it's not like he's had a shite team to work with. So questions about his level are legitimate until he shows what he can do in turning potential into trophy-winning.

He's a very good manager. But he's not in the top echelon yet.

[PhaseOfPlay]

What about Klopp then?

Klopp has won trophies.

[Dim Glas]

If he goes to Real Madrid, and wins stuff, then he'll be in the "great manager" class. Because that will recognise two things: firstly, that he has the managerial chops to win trophies, and secondly, that he has the managerial chops to be considered by the world's biggest clubs.

Right now, he's had enough time and opportunity to win any trophy in England, and he hasn't done so. And it's not like he's had a shite team to work with. So questions about his level are legitimate until he shows what he can do in turning potential into trophy-winning.

He's a very good manager. But he's not in the top echelon yet.

I don't really think he is a great manager, I was just saying he isn't 'average' as was stated above 

But he is a very good manager/coach regardless of whether he wins something with Spurs or not. He's still significantly better than plenty of managers who have won stuff. So many factors in cup runs and the like, that winning a cup often isn't that impressive when you look at those factors, as great as it is to have on a CV.

[PhaseOfPlay]

I don't really think he is a great manager, I was just saying he isn't 'average' as was stated above 

But he is a very good manager/coach regardless of whether he wins something with Spurs or not. He's still significantly better than plenty of managers who have won stuff. So many factors in cup runs and the like, that winning a cup often isn't that impressive when you look at those factors, as great as it is to have on a CV.

He's definitely not average. He's an excellent coach for getting his ideas across. But he's certainly no miracle worker, as is constantly being proclaimed here.

[Inpeace]

If Poch was in charge of Newcastle, with their budget, do you think he could keep them up or even win the Championship with those players?

Now take your bias out and look at the managerial ability.


And before someone brings it up, this isn't about Rafa either. But it does highlight an old saying..he could win with his, and he could win with yours. Rafa is that type of manager, imho.

Southampton?

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Southampton?

Soton had a ridiculous amount of talented players from their ranks and their recruitment was good. Benitez is managing with his hands tied behind his back. The class in players between that Soton side and this Newcastle side is substantial.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Southampton?

Look at the players he had when he took over: Shaw, Lallana, Fonte, Clyne, Schneiderlin, Lambert at his peak, Ward-Prowse, Rodriguez, and Steven Davis, to which he added Lovren and Wanyama. Not exactly a terrible side. More a side that was being under-managed by Adkins.

[Redsnappa]

He's certainly doing some world-class whingeing about his touchline ban 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47487141

[4pool]

Maybe if Poch stayed at Soton for longer than one season, then he'd have a CV to show what he could do with them.

He did well enough there. That is not in question.

[Barneylfc∗]

Klopp has won trophies.

So has Roy Hodgson 

[PhaseOfPlay]

So has Roy Hodgson 

Indeed. Making Roy Hodgson a better manager than Pochettino

[TepidT2O]

Blimey... they’ve announced their first home game.

It’s almost as if threats form the league had a serious effect.


Only six months after they intitlaly wanted their opening game mind.  Huuuuuuuuge miss.

[Hazell]

Glad to get a definitive announcement on their first game in the new stadium since the last time. And the time before that. And the time before that.

[4pool]

Tottenham will play the first competitive fixture at their new stadium in the first week of April.

Spurs were scheduled to move to the new White Hart Lane stadium in September but construction has been delayed.

Who their first opponents are hinges on Brighton's FA Cup campaign.

If Brighton beat Millwall in the FA Cup on 17 March, Crystal Palace will be Spurs' visitors on 3 April but if the Seagulls are knocked out, they will be the opposition on 6 or 7 April.

Tottenham said they have worked with the Premier League, Brighton and Crystal Palace to ensure the first competitive fixture at the stadium will be a league encounter.

Manager Mauricio Pochettino has said he expected to play their Champions League quarter-final home leg at the venue and games will be played on 9/10 and 16/17 April, following the draw on 15 March.

Prior to getting the green light for competitive matches, Spurs said in a statement that two test events "with increasing levels of attendance" must be staged "in order to achieve a formal safety certificate".

An under-18 fixture with Southampton on 24 March will allow for a capacity of around 30,000, before a legends match on 30 March will see around 45,000 fans admitted to the venue.

[Tommy_W]

Fantastic news. Hopefully give us a big lift for the remainder of the season that.

[DHKopper]

Fantastic news. Hopefully give us a big lift for the remainder of the season that.

Or you could be shit in an unfamiliar stadium and it could wreck the season run in.  I'd rather wait for next season (and you should be have to at this point anyway to be honest) than take the risk.

[Tommy_W]

Or you could be shit in an unfamiliar stadium and it could wreck the season run in.  I'd rather wait for next season (and you should be have to at this point anyway to be honest) than take the risk.

I think it's a gamble any Spurs fan would be willing to take. Things have been taking a steady turn for the worse at Wembley - attendances have been dropping off a cliff for a number of games now. It's so hard to create an atmosphere there at the best of times. It's also a royal pain in the arse to get to.

[DHKopper]

I think it's a gamble any Spurs fan would be willing to take. Things have been taking a steady turn for the worse at Wembley - attendances have been dropping off a cliff for a number of games now. It's so hard to create an atmosphere there at the best of times. It's also a royal pain in the arse to get to.

Fair enough.  I suppose if a drop off does occur it might be better to just get it out the way ASAP.