Topic: THE NON-LIVERPOOL TRANSFER THREAD

[Sangria]

I don't have a problem selling a player who wants to leave, but I am not seeing any of our star players pushing for a move. Why would any club in our position sell a star player who wants to stay?

You keep ignoring my point that not all our players want to stay. Real and Barca aren't always going to be as financially anaemic as they are now. When they have money, they will have glamour.

[PeterTheRed ...]

You keep ignoring my point that not all our players want to stay. Real and Barca aren't always going to be as financially anaemic as they are now. When they have money, they will have glamour.

I must have missed something. What star player on our current team has expressed a desire to join Real Madrid or Barcelona? Anyway ...

Inter are waiting for Paris Saint-Germain to send the improved official bid around €70m [add ons included] to complete and sign Achraf Hakimi deal. Just a matter of time then he’s expected to join PSG.

Personal terms agreed until 2026, confirmed. Hakimi wants PSG.

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1407824993740800006?

[killer-heels]

According to ESPN, PSG have agreed a fee with Inter for Hakimi.

[Sangria]

I must have missed something. What star player on our current team has expressed a desire to join Real Madrid or Barcelona? Anyway ...

Bloody hell. Is concrete evidence necessary now for discussing future plans? Can I hold you to your own standard of discussion?

[FowlerLegend]

That’s not how we operate. We sign players who have some proven ability behind them. That reduces the risk, but increases the price.

We have to adapt. We haven't been in this situation before. Mane replaced a player whereas now we are not necessarily looking for a player to start ahead of Mane from 1st game of the season. We are looking for someone to replace him gradually over a season or two.
If Doku's father is to be believed we saw that player being Doku. The best way to do it is slowly, like Utd did with Ronaldo. It is also cheaper.

[PeterTheRed ...]

Bloody hell. Is concrete evidence necessary now for discussing future plans? Can I hold you to your own standard of discussion?

Oh, I get it now. You are saying that we should sell our star players, even though they don't want to leave, so we can afford players who might be stars in the future. To be honest, I don't like the idea. Too much risk involved ...

[Sangria]

Oh, I get it now. You are saying that we should sell our star players, even though they don't want to leave, so we can afford players who might be stars in the future. To be honest, I don't like the idea. Too much risk involved ...

Ok. So your preferred MO is to ask for exact evidence, and then to deliberately misread the point in order to support your own argument, before coming to a disingenuous conclusion. I think I will hold you to your own standards in the future.

[FowlerLegend]

We don't cook our books, and most of our ready money goes into wages.

How about gifting the stadium money for the main stand and Anfield Road end. Not having £160m to payback would help somewhat I would imagine or is that not possible either?
I think what you are basically trying to say that it isn't that City and Chelsea have more committed owners, it's just that they cook the books to invest as there is no legit way our owners can put in more money as it needs to come from commercial revenues?
In that case, we are in a circular situation.

[FowlerLegend]

We don't cook our books, and most of our ready money goes into wages.

Also, in that case, how were FSG able to lend us £100m during the pandemic?
How has the money from the Redbird investment been (according to the Echo) used to wipe out our debts so we can go back to pretty much business as usual". If the owners basically cannot pump money in to affect transfers etc then how can they be doing that? Because its debt related?

[Sangria]

How about gifting the stadium money for the main stand and Anfield Road end. Not having £160m to payback would help somewhat I would imagine or is that not possible either?
I think what you are basically trying to say that it isn't that City and Chelsea have more committed owners, it's just that they cook the books to invest as there is no legit way our owners can put in more money as it needs to come from commercial revenues?
In that case, we are in a circular situation.

Infrastructure does not count towards FFP.

[Suareznumber7]

Bloody hell. Is concrete evidence necessary now for discussing future plans? Can I hold you to your own standard of discussion?

Unless they are really pushing for a move, selling our best players at their peak is an insane transfer strategy. 

[deFacto please, you bastards]

For years our lot have been whinging about losing our best players at their peak.


Now they want our best players to be sold, players who aren't trying to move away from the club

Lunacy.


Anyway, glad Hakimi is going to PSG and not Chelsea. Fabulous young player

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Not all our players may see us as the pinnacle of their career. Real and Barca have been more glamorous clubs to many, including even some of our academy players in the past (eg. McManaman, Owen). We shouldn't see this as a negative.

It also helped that we weren't competitive for major trophies consistently.

[rafathegaffa83]

Brighton have sold Davy Propper back to PSV. The fee might be as low as €2m in achievable bonuses according to some reports. Brighton paid £10m+ for him four years ago and allegedly wanted a similar fee

[FowlerLegend]

Infrastructure does not count towards FFP.

Yes, but it counts significantly towards the costs of running the club and so inadvertedly impacts our transfer budget et al.
In 2019 we were told by Pearce (and others) that we were quiet because the players we wanted- like Sancho - were not available. We were effectively saving our money for a rainy day.
Then the pandemic hit and Paul Gorst was saying that the noises consistently from the club was that the Redbird deal was to allow the club to act at pre-pandemic levels.
If that is the case then we may well do a lot more than is being suggested and too be frank we need to!

[BarryCrocker]

Manchester United have indicated to Borussia Dortmund that they are prepared to raise their offer for Jadon Sancho to £73m (€85m) as they close in on the signing of the England forward.

Negotiations with Dortmund have been ongoing for several weeks after United refused to match the German club’s valuation last summer, with the 21-year-old former Manchester City player thought to be available for £77.5m (€90m). But with Sancho already having agreed personal terms on a five-year deal worth about £350,000 a week, it is understood that United’s latest offer could tempt Dortmund into doing business for a player who has two years left on his contract.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jun/23/manchester-united-increase-offer-for-jadon-sancho-to-73m

[killer-heels]

Manchester United have indicated to Borussia Dortmund that they are prepared to raise their offer for Jadon Sancho to £73m (€85m) as they close in on the signing of the England forward.

Negotiations with Dortmund have been ongoing for several weeks after United refused to match the German club’s valuation last summer, with the 21-year-old former Manchester City player thought to be available for £77.5m (€90m). But with Sancho already having agreed personal terms on a five-year deal worth about £350,000 a week, it is understood that United’s latest offer could tempt Dortmund into doing business for a player who has two years left on his contract.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jun/23/manchester-united-increase-offer-for-jadon-sancho-to-73m

Imagine how much Mbappe is going to be on when signs for another side. Could be £500k a week!

[Sangria]

Imagine how much Mbappe is going to be on when signs for another side. Could be £500k a week!

At least we won't see MacRed talk about Mbappe or any other player again without definite concrete sources. That's assuming he applies the same standards to himself that he demands from others.

[killer-heels]

At least we won't see MacRed talk about Mbappe or any other player again without definite concrete sources. That's assuming he applies the same standards to himself that he demands from others.

Is Mbappe choosing LFC on Fifa not make it a credible link?

[Jono69]

Imagine how much Mbappe is going to be on when signs for another side. Could be £500k a week!

Was talking about this the other day and i reckon it will be close to a million a week

Presuming he leaves on a free next summer and signs a five year deal then that's 260 million over his next contract and considering his next club will have no transfer fee then it's plausible as i would imagine you would be parting with the best part of 200 million even before wages if you were buying him

[killer-heels]

Was talking about this the other day and i reckon it will be close to a million a week

Presuming he leaves on a free next summer and signs a five year deal then that's 260 million over his next contract and considering his next club will have no transfer fee then it's plausible as i would imagine you would be parting with the best part of 200 million even before wages if you were buying him

Not sure he will get quite that much but can imagine he will get anywhere between 50-100m as a signing on fee. That means any club that takes him on will have to have him as pretty much the main player and will end up almost with a Messi type situation.

[Sheer Magnetism]

For years our lot have been whinging about losing our best players at their peak.


Now they want our best players to be sold, players who aren't trying to move away from the club

Lunacy.

There's a huge difference between selling a player at the start of their peak and selling them at the end of their peak. Or maybe you'd have preferred to keep Torres for another few years instead of selling him for a packet and using the money to buy a 24-year old Luis Suarez.

[rafathegaffa83]

The Athletic had an interesting piece talking to agents and players re: the current lack of transfer activity. Essentially, the current lack of movement is down to

1. The managerial merry-go-round and some clubs not having managers in place. This has surprisingly perhaps had the biggest impact. Clubs have vastly underestimated the amount of time it will take to secure replacement managers. This has produced a logjam of frozen deals with many players feeling messed around

2. Deals sanctioned before a new manager arrives are being paused or iced. At clubs without a strong DoF in place, six months of planning can go out the window when a manager leaves. This also impacts fringe and young players who may have been told by the manager how they fit for the following season, but now are in limbo until they can speak to the new manager

Interestingly, the article claims that Rui Patricio was supposed to leave Wolves for Roma. That might not happen now, but any move is complicated by the fact one player earmarked to replace him (Sam Johnstone) plays for a club still without a manager/DoF (WBA).

Similarly, the situation at Palace sounds like a recipe for disaster with loads of players on expired contracts being told that a decision would be made on any renewal offers once Hodgson was replaced. The players were told that would happen in 2 weeks. It took about six weeks for Hodgson to be replaced. Palace made an exception by offering Benteke a new deal which sounds like it was driven by the panic of needing to splurge on a replacement at short notice

3. COVID has killed off the mid-tier market this summer.

https://theathletic.com/2664265/2021/06/24/no-manager-no-transfers-how-the-stalled-merry-go-round-is-causing-havoc-in-the-market?

[Jookie]

The only reasons we should consider selling 1 of our star players are (a) they are desperate to leave and/or won’t sign a new contract,(b) we think we can sell that player and buy someone better, or (c) we are very confident their performances are about to fall off a cliff and they won’t be worth the wages we pay them.

We shouldn’t be selling any of the likes of Mane, VvD, Salah, etc unless some of the above reasons are in play. At the moment I’m not sure if any of those things apply to our players. Might be different in 12-24 months

[PeterTheRed ...]

Manchester United have indicated to Borussia Dortmund that they are prepared to raise their offer for Jadon Sancho to £73m (€85m) as they close in on the signing of the England forward.

Negotiations with Dortmund have been ongoing for several weeks after United refused to match the German club’s valuation last summer, with the 21-year-old former Manchester City player thought to be available for £77.5m (€90m). But with Sancho already having agreed personal terms on a five-year deal worth about £350,000 a week, it is understood that United’s latest offer could tempt Dortmund into doing business for a player who has two years left on his contract.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jun/23/manchester-united-increase-offer-for-jadon-sancho-to-73m

So, Sancho will be on £350,000 per week, as expected. Add to that the transfer fee of £80+ million and the agent fee, and he will actually cost more than Mbappe next summer 

[CraigDS]

So, Sancho will be on £350,000 per week, as expected. Add to that the transfer fee of £80+ million and the agent fee, and he will actually cost more than Mbappe next summer 

What are Mbappes wage demands? Signing on fee demands?

I assume you’re his agent so will waive your agent fee though which is good.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

There's a huge difference between selling a player at the start of their peak and selling them at the end of their peak. Or maybe you'd have preferred to keep Torres for another few years instead of selling him for a packet and using the money to buy a 24-year old Luis Suarez.

yes because clearly the likes of Salah has had injury problems like Torres has had, and had a drop off in performances.

Not to mention that Torres wanted to move away from the club.

So identical situations

[killer-heels]

So, Sancho will be on £350,000 per week, as expected. Add to that the transfer fee of £80+ million and the agent fee, and he will actually cost more than Mbappe next summer 

I am pretty confident Mbappe will be on more than £350k a week, will get a signing fee of not far off £80m, and his agent will probably get more as well.

Also, Mbappe will have a far greater impact on the wage budget of a side.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

There's a huge difference between selling a player at the start of their peak and selling them at the end of their peak. Or maybe you'd have preferred to keep Torres for another few years instead of selling him for a packet and using the money to buy a 24-year old Luis Suarez.

The problem though is that you never know when a player is at the end of their peak. You could keep someone thinking they have years left at the top only for them to fall off a cliff, or you could sell someone thinking they're past it only for them to improve.

We got very lucky with Torres, and we were buying Luis Suarez anyway so not how that is relevant.

[Barefoot Doctor]

The Athletic had an interesting piece talking to agents and players re: the current lack of transfer activity. Essentially, the current lack of movement is down to

1. The managerial merry-go-round and some clubs not having managers in place. This has surprisingly perhaps had the biggest impact. Clubs have vastly underestimated the amount of time it will take to secure replacement managers. This has produced a logjam of frozen deals with many players feeling messed around

2. Deals sanctioned before a new manager arrives are being paused or iced. At clubs without a strong DoF in place, six months of planning can go out the window when a manager leaves. This also impacts fringe and young players who may have been told by the manager how they fit for the following season, but now are in limbo until they can speak to the new manager

Interestingly, the article claims that Rui Patricio was supposed to leave Wolves for Roma. That might not happen now, but any move is complicated by the fact one player earmarked to replace him (Sam Johnstone) plays for a club still without a manager/DoF (WBA).

Similarly, the situation at Palace sounds like a recipe for disaster with loads of players on expired contracts being told that a decision would be made on any renewal offers once Hodgson was replaced. The players were told that would happen in 2 weeks. It took about six weeks for Hodgson to be replaced. Palace made an exception by offering Benteke a new deal which sounds like it was driven by the panic of needing to splurge on a replacement at short notice

3. COVID has killed off the mid-tier market this summer.

https://theathletic.com/2664265/2021/06/24/no-manager-no-transfers-how-the-stalled-merry-go-round-is-causing-havoc-in-the-market?

Read that one. They mentioned a transfer to Spurs which is on hold until the new boss is appointed. Could be wrong, but I assumed it was the Marcus Thuram deal, which was apparently agreed but has now gone quiet.

[MD1990]

So, Sancho will be on £350,000 per week, as expected. Add to that the transfer fee of £80+ million and the agent fee, and he will actually cost more than Mbappe next summer 

you must be the happiest Liverpool fan in the world to see Sancho join Man Utd.

What does it matter about Mbappe costing less if that happens.
Not like we will pay the wages it would take to get Mbappe.

[killer-heels]

you must be the happiest Liverpool fan in the world to see Sancho join Man Utd.

What does it matter about Mbappe costing less if that happens.
Not like we will pay the wages it would take to get Mbappe.

The thing about the Mbappe wages is that it will skew the wages of the entire club whoever he signs for. If you have had a relatively successful side then any decent agent of a top, performing player isn't going to be happy that over the lifetime of a contract that Mbappe will earn maybe double what your client will earn.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

The problem though is that you never know when a player is at the end of their peak. You could keep someone thinking they have years left at the top only for them to fall off a cliff, or you could sell someone thinking they're past it only for them to improve.

We got very lucky with Torres, and we were buying Luis Suarez anyway so not how that is relevant.

It's also missing the point. Torres wanted to leave, Torres was also continuously struggling with injuries for 2 years prior to his move. None of those things can be applied to Salah for instance.

People have been wanting to sell him since his first season here, it's one of the most baffling things I've seen within our lot.

[Nobby Reserve]

Unless they are really pushing for a move, selling our best players at their peak is an insane transfer strategy.

The key is to sell as close to "past the peak and the beginning of the decline, but before transfer value begins to similarly decline" as you can.

Players don't continue forever, and we don't have owners with long arms. So how do we fund the replacements for Mane, Salah & Firmino, who are all approaching 30?

[rafathegaffa83]

Read that one. They mentioned a transfer to Spurs which is on hold until the new boss is appointed. Could be wrong, but I assumed it was the Marcus Thuram deal, which was apparently agreed but has now gone quiet.

I also thought it might have been Thuram or maybe Nico Gonzalez. Then again it might have been hypothetical

[deFacto please, you bastards]

The key is to sell as close to "past the peak and the beginning of the decline, but before transfer value begins to similarly decline" as you can.

Players don't continue forever, and we don't have owners with long arms. So how do we fund the replacements for Mane, Salah & Firmino, who are all approaching 30?

You sell those who aren't performing to the level they used to.

[Nobby Reserve]

You sell those who aren't performing to the level they used to.

Ideally you sell on the cusp of that.

[Suareznumber7]

The key is to sell as close to "past the peak and the beginning of the decline, but before transfer value begins to similarly decline" as you can.

Players don't continue forever, and we don't have owners with long arms. So how do we fund the replacements for Mane, Salah & Firmino, who are all approaching 30?

That's not what he was saying though.  He was saying we should sell a player who is at their peak every 2/3 years so we can buy younger players. 

Just an insane transfer strategy. 

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

You sell those who aren't performing to the level they used to.

How were Mane's and Bobby's form this season?

I don't know why suggesting some of our front 3 might be sold this summer is getting posters harangued, this season showed that our forward line is in dire need of fresh impetus. To get the standard we would need to provide genuine competition, selling one of the front 3 is surely an option we are considering. Even if their form improves (and the return of our defence might help with that), they're not spring chickens anymore.

[MD1990]

The thing about the Mbappe wages is that it will skew the wages of the entire club whoever he signs for. If you have had a relatively successful side then any decent agent of a top, performing player isn't going to be happy that over the lifetime of a contract that Mbappe will earn maybe double what your client will earn.

I do think Real would be a bad move for Mbappe.
Marca are saying though they want Haaland instead now so who know what will happen.

But Real are gong to waste a huge budget on a new forward.

While the rest of their team is aging & the young players they have not performed as hoped. (Vinicius,Odrizola,Rodrygo,Asensio).
They have Alaba who is on a decline as a player imo on a huge contract.

Varane possibly leaving,Ramos gone. Modric 35,Kroos in his 30s. Casemeiro 29. Its an aging squad but most the money will on a big name forward. A host of unwanted players Isco,Odrioziola,Bale,Hazard,Marcelo,Jovic,Reiner,Brahim Diaz on the wage bill

Real have wasted so much money in the last few years its why Perez so badly wants the SL. They are not in a good position at all atm.