Topic: A time to reflect honestly or nothing to worry about ?

[ianburns252]

I hope Klopp and the players don't think like this. To beat city we need to win every game and take losing any points as an insult. Nearly after any draw or loss people say "city will drop points to". They've just won 4/5 titles.

I've not articulated myself very well here.

My point was to those moaning about not beating any of the top 4 that, on paper, it doesn't actually matter due to all games being worth 3 points whether it is City or if it is Fulham.

My next point was that if we beat all of those teams outside the top 5 then we are on 90 points which in a normal league without City wins it by a mile.

I am not in any way talking about not worrying about dropping points or being satisfied with draws - we obviously go out to win every damn game.

[Keith Lard]

Nothing to worry about.

We are a very well run club with the best manager and backroom staff in the world, and a brilliant squad. If we lose some players then look forward to the next stage of our evolution.

Be in it for the journey and don't take it all too seriously. These are golden times and you've got to enjoy it.

[RedG13]

Because that’s my opinion.

Saying that we just had what was almost the perfect footballing season, after renewing contracts for the bulk of the squad, and renewing the contract for the best manager in world football. As half filled cups go that’s pretty good for me. It’s like I’m reliving my childhood, just with a load of oil money for our competitors.

We have to rebuild - we are rebuilding. And we’re doing it the only way we can.

And It basically how to replace 1 or 2 World Class forwards overall and maybe an add in the MF.
Slowly Phasing in and phasing out older players. Not a huge changes every season. Mane leaving with a replacement this summer and replacement next summer for Salah with Firmino already moved to a role player is good a way too do. Diaz/Jota as part of the front 3 for the next 3-5 Season already is good planning.
It sad when legends leave but having a plan on how to do with small changes is good.

[Ghost Town]

Nothing to worry about.

We are a very well run club with the best manager and backroom staff in the world, and a brilliant squad. If we lose some players then look forward to the next stage of our evolution.

Be in it for the journey and don't take it all too seriously. These are golden times and you've got to enjoy it.

Yep.

It's all good. Every change point is an opportunity for growth and improvement. Can't wait to see what the future has in store. Can't wait to live another journey, regardless of the destination.

[mrantarctica]

The poor planning is the 4 or 5 players all playing in a similar position. Origi is going on a free this season and we have Salah,  Mane, Firmino, Keita and Ox being free able to sign for someone else in January. That is 4 forwards and two attacking mids all potentially becoming free agents within 12 months.

I suspect these things are a matter of rolling transition/evolution though. When they signed Salah and Mane to those contracts, they would not have known that they would hold out to the end of their contracts, or want a different challenge. Similarly, it's not that they haven't been trying to get them to renew their contracts either. Sometimes these things just work out this way, I'm not sure its necessarily ALL due to bad planning. Some people renewed their contracts in the last 12 months, and their contracts were likely to end at the same time as well. That's just what happens. Perhaps we expected some players to renew more easily than they have.

In the end, the most important thing is that we replace the outgoing players with players who will push for a place in the first team, and in doing so they provide real depth - not just players to pad the squad up. I suspect for us, that will be a right back, midfielder and a forward. That, alongside a stock of hungry younger players looking to make their mark and that provides us enough cover. If we can renew the integral members of the squad at the same time then so be it, but the nature of football contracts are always going to be that a number of contracts are up at a similar time. That is unavoidable.

[kj999]

Mental.

Any season in which you post 90+ points and don't win the league, you don't lose, someone else wins it.
'Costly draws'? Everyone drops points somewhere.

I hope the sort of attitude about 'failing' is not indicative of how our fans views are turning. That sort of self entitlement and regarding what are astounding levels of play as 'normal' where everything else is 'not good enough' or even 'a disgrace' can fuck right off.

It's this sort of shit that has me on the verge of walking away from football.

Completely agree.
Some of our fanbase are becoming ridiculous.

We just had one of our greatest seasons ever. We just became the closest team ever to win the bloody lot.
We have the best manager in the world.

Why is the thread title even 'a time to reflect 'honestly' OR nothing to worry about'? As if to suggest those who are 'honest' are the knicker wetting , glass half empty fannies, and those who espouse 'nothing to worry about' are not being honest with themselves?

I fear a few draws early on will have people screaming KLOPP OUT and anything that is not 100% perfect will have self-entitled dickheads all over twitter questioning the club, the boss and the players.

It's insane the levels that are now not acceptable.
But for literally 2 or 3 things going the other way, we'd have won the quadruple. To say we 'lost' or 'threw away' anything is fucking ridiculous.

[west_london_red]

Reflect but do not worry is my answer. We got a lot right, a lot more then we got wrong, there’s room for improvement in some small areas, some contracts that need to be sorted, some players to be phased out and some new ones to be signed, but that’s something the club should be doing and no doubt does every season had we won the PL and CL or been runners up in both. Neither of those results should impact what we do over the Summer and beyond.

[Hazell]

Mental.

Any season in which you post 90+ points and don't win the league, you don't lose, someone else wins it.
'Costly draws'? Everyone drops points somewhere.

I hope the sort of attitude about 'failing' is not indicative of how our fans views are turning. That sort of self entitlement and regarding what are astounding levels of play as 'normal' where everything else is 'not good enough' or even 'a disgrace' can fuck right off.

It's this sort of shit that has me on the verge of walking away from football.

Nothing to worry about.

We are a very well run club with the best manager and backroom staff in the world, and a brilliant squad. If we lose some players then look forward to the next stage of our evolution.

Be in it for the journey and don't take it all too seriously. These are golden times and you've got to enjoy it.

Nice one both. Can't wait for the new season to start. I wouldn't change these times for anything.

[TSC]

I've not articulated myself very well here.

My point was to those moaning about not beating any of the top 4 that, on paper, it doesn't actually matter due to all games being worth 3 points whether it is City or if it is Fulham.

The difference re games v the rivals for top spot is that these are effectively ‘6 pointers’.  A victory gains 3 points and deprives the rival team of 3 points.  Of course that’s true of any other team but obviously is more significant against a rival for top spot.

[MonsLibpool]

The difference re games v the rivals for top spot is that these are effectively ‘6 pointers’.  A victory gains 3 points and deprives the rival team of 3 points.  Of course that’s true of any other team but obviously is more significant against a rival for top spot.

Theiretically, you don't have to beat them. If you avoid defeat and beat the other teams, that's enough.

[JPedro]

My two bobs

1. Its a new area in the Premier League, to win you need to have seasons that is close to perfect. Oil money doping or Oligarch money or what not, the result is, to win you need to be perfect basically.
I wonder if it is possible to compete in the long run, if things stays this way, without that kind of money backing. If this is healthy for football or not, no idea, but personal feeling it will change the fan base from the rabid die hards (in the positive sense) we have today to a more corporate "franchise" type of fan ie money bags market segmentation fans.

2. Liverpool is in a transition and that is hard for any club and it is always painful and most likely not as smooth as a fan want. Could it have been handle better by Liverpool now? Sure, but also worse, but it can always be better unless it's perfect. Look at other clubs, it's not much better there. Albeit it helps if you have unlimited credit on your credit cards.... As Prince once said, money won't buy you happiness, but it will pay for the search.

Personally I think it was not bad planning that ended up with the 3 main forwards having their contracts expire at the same time. I think it was intended based on playing it safe and not knowing if they would have a steeper decline at around 30. Their contracts expire at 31/32, if the waterfall point of 30 hits, then we only got a year ish before releasing them. If they look to be at the level we need for a few more years, we could extend. Probably based on lot of internal data crunching by the data wizards in Liverpool.
Of course COVID threw a spanner in the works, but we have a year in getting more players and probably have list of targets. And we have been adding talent from the top shelf from the rack marked  young players with a high level of potential, ref Diaz, Jota, Elliot, Carvalho, Konate etc. Which seems to be the current Liverpool Moneyball modus operandi.

[Eeyore]

I suspect these things are a matter of rolling transition/evolution though. When they signed Salah and Mane to those contracts, they would not have known that they would hold out to the end of their contracts, or want a different challenge. Similarly, it's not that they haven't been trying to get them to renew their contracts either. Sometimes these things just work out this way, I'm not sure its necessarily ALL due to bad planning. Some people renewed their contracts in the last 12 months, and their contracts were likely to end at the same time as well. That's just what happens. Perhaps we expected some players to renew more easily than they have.

In the end, the most important thing is that we replace the outgoing players with players who will push for a place in the first team, and in doing so they provide real depth - not just players to pad the squad up. I suspect for us, that will be a right back, midfielder and a forward. That, alongside a stock of hungry younger players looking to make their mark and that provides us enough cover. If we can renew the integral members of the squad at the same time then so be it, but the nature of football contracts are always going to be that a number of contracts are up at a similar time. That is unavoidable.

The problem though is that when you have a lot of players in the same position all with contracts expiring at the same time is that you weaken your bargaining position whilst strengthening the hand of the agents you are dealing with.

[Oskar]

Nothing to worry about IMO.

There was always going to be a refresh of the squad, the only question for me was how much of it Klopp would oversee. That he's agreed to stay for four more seasons beyond this one makes me confident that that refresh is in the safest of hands and that we'll continue to challenge for trophies while it takes place.

If players like Salah and Mane want to move on, we'll replace them. We have an outstanding recruitment team so, as much as it will be a big challenge to replace players of their quality, I have complete confidence that we'll get those big decisions right and continue to challenge on all fronts as we've done this season.

[JPedro]

The problem though is that when you have a lot of players in the same position all with contracts expiring at the same time is that you weaken your bargaining position whilst strengthening the hand of the agents you are dealing with.

At the same time, that might have been part of the equation when they decided to extend each of those players contract until the same summer. It's pretty unlikely that they woke up now and wow shit, all these contracts ends at the same time. Especially looking at when they first signed, how long they extended for etc.

[killer-heels]

At the same time, that might have been part of the equation when they decided to extend each of those players contract until the same summer. It's pretty unlikely that they woke up now and wow shit, all these contracts ends at the same time. Especially looking at when they first signed, how long they extended for etc.

Probably. There could be scenarios that we didnt account for. We didnt agree a contract with Mane last season and maybe we thought his level had permanently declined. Instead his level really jumped again with January which means when it comes to a contract, we are very much on the back foot.

[Eeyore]

Probably. There could be scenarios that we didnt account for. We didnt agree a contract with Mane last season and maybe we thought his level had permanently declined. Instead his level really jumped again with January which means when it comes to a contract, we are very much on the back foot.

I think the elephant in the room is that without a backlash from the fans, we would now be in a European Super League with far stricter cost controls.

This is what Agnelli was angling for.

Agnelli, who is also the chairman of Juventus, raised the possibility of reforms to the transfer market to create a more competitive balance in European football.

“The moment is fertile to think of greater solutions,” he said. “We should be looking at a wide range of reforms.

“We could think of a double path transfer system, where clubs qualifying for specific tiers of international competition wouldn’t be allowed to buy each other’s players.

“That would improve the indirect solidarity to other clubs and mean no triple-figure transfers amongst Champions League participating clubs. These are elements we are discussing.”

Translate that to the European Super league and I think it is highly likely that the Club anticipated having a far stronger hand in transfer negotiations.

[killer-heels]

I think the elephant in the room is that without a backlash from the fans, we would now be in a European Super League with far stricter cost controls.

This is what Agnelli was angling for.

Agnelli, who is also the chairman of Juventus, raised the possibility of reforms to the transfer market to create a more competitive balance in European football.

“The moment is fertile to think of greater solutions,” he said. “We should be looking at a wide range of reforms.

“We could think of a double path transfer system, where clubs qualifying for specific tiers of international competition wouldn’t be allowed to buy each other’s players.

“That would improve the indirect solidarity to other clubs and mean no triple-figure transfers amongst Champions League participating clubs. These are elements we are discussing.”

Translate that to the European Super league and I think it is highly likely that the Club anticipated having a far stronger hand in transfer negotiations.

Not sure I buy that for Mane though. The ESL was dead by the end of the season and whilst Mane had a good few games at the end, we could have changed tact and signed him up when he was in the poorest stretch of form for us.

Thats unless we anticipated him to never get back to that top level. Maybe we also didnt expect Salah to really hit the heights again either.

We are clearly good at this thing but it could just be Mane and Salah surprised us and in these two examples, we got caught on the hop.

[Garnier]

1. I usually get the impression that when finals are contested by evenly matched teams, the one who's more defensively oriented and takes fewer risks going forward in the match tends to win. Finals are usually cagey affairs, that's a given, but we do seem to approach most of them with a lot of will to take risks, because that's who we are and that's what Klopp & staff have worked on all these years, we are an offensive team and to attack well sometimes you need to commit numbers. Do i think sometimes we should cool down and let the other team hustle out while we counter? Definitely, and we're more than capable at that, but i'm just some guy.

2. Real Madrid are a top team and against top teams it's never a guarantee that we'll create chances at will. The midfielders did their role well in the latest final, we played a good game, that said, it's well established that Hendo isn't a player like Stevie, he's not a battering ram who'll force the issue. Could we do with a guy like Kevin De Bruyne? Sure, any team in the world would, but we played fine vs Real Madrid. They  just weren't willing to take as many risks as we did going forward whereas we did.

3. Mané's LW contributions have already been effectively recreated with Jota and Diaz. You can't replace man-for-man a guy like Sadio but his contributions can be recreated and i believe that's what we did. But with Div and Sadio going it's imperative that at least one player comes on and i have full confidence that Klopp & staff will get the replacement right. It looks a tough market this summer seeing as i don't fancy the likes of Darwin Nunez, Nkunku, Osihmen or Jonathan David to adequately replace the #9 role Mané played lately. Mo's had a rough second half of the season but that's probably due to the workload he's been carrying after AFCOn plus a change in role after Sadio became the #9.


4. Some teams can buy dross for a hundred million pounds and then add up another seventy million pounds signing just because they feel like it. We can't afford to do it, which is why we play the waiting game a lot of the time. We spend money, but that we do with caution.
 
I think it's entirely possible that in the current market we can't find an adequate player to play the false nine for us once Sadio's very likely gone (with Bobby now clearly becoming a rotational option) and settle for waiting for the right player to become available (like we did with Konaté). I don't rate these names i'm seeing. Nunez, Nkunku, David, Osimhen, Abraham, Scamacca, Dembele, that diminutive Ajax winder the list goes on.

Two guys i do rate are Bowen and Raphinha, although i can't see them being content with being Salah's 2nd option. Bowen can play as a striker as well i believe. Who knows. Trust Jurgen really.

Any chance Martinelli becomes available he's wildly entertaining

[Black Bull Nova]

I do think this a time for transition, not wholesale but significant. Our future does not lie in the hands of Salah, Firmino and Mane as it did two years ago and Milner, Origi and Oxlade Chamberlain are moving towards the door or at least the margins after losing Gini last year. Bringing in Diaz early and Carvalho is just the start I suspect, Jurgen will want to move people up the order and have a team that will see out the next four years but also be fit to handover. That's the way Jurgen is, especially with this club.

[Ghost Town]

^^ Agreed. And it's exciting. Change is not necessarily bad, not when you have Klopp as architect of the change. We may lose some extraordinary players; but the man who lifted them to that level will still be here to work his magic again on new recruits.

I can't overstate how exciting it is!

[UntouchableLuis]

I do think we are worryingly short in midfield long term. Other than Fabinho I don't know who will be in the starting midfield in 2 seasons time. Hendo and Thiago will inevitably not be able to start all the time. Keita may well move on if we get a good fee. Unsure if Curtis has it in him yet to cement a place.

Still never really replaced Gini either.

Defensively I think we are set for the future and Diaz and Jota have many years left along with Elliot and Carvalho in an attaking sense.

[Bergersrightwingviews]

We're competing against an opponent that has broken all rules to financially fund a period of dominance the league has never seen before.

This. Losing to Madrid in a CL final is one of them. Okay that game 100 times and we probably win close to 50 times and lose close to 50 times.

The only reason we are not English champions this season and the other seasons we have finished second to City is because they are cheating off the pitch. City have a wonderful side. The best in the country but they have Chester to assemble that side and nobody is doing anything about it. I expect the PL investigation to quietly go away when they think nobody is paying attention. Possibly during the World Cup.

[ianburns252]

The difference re games v the rivals for top spot is that these are effectively ‘6 pointers’.  A victory gains 3 points and deprives the rival team of 3 points.  Of course that’s true of any other team but obviously is more significant against a rival for top spot.

Agreed 100% - my core point was simply that people complaining over us not having registered a win against another top 4 team were focusing on the wrong issue, and making the point that we used to win the "Top 4 league" but fail to get the points needed against the so called easier teams.

I'm not looking at things from a sporting point of view, or how I would think Klopp sets up the team/discusses things himself, just that the complaints about what has been an unreal season are misguided.

[Ghost Town]

Completely agree.
Some of our fanbase are becoming ridiculous.

We just had one of our greatest seasons ever. We just became the closest team ever to win the bloody lot.
We have the best manager in the world.

Why is the thread title even 'a time to reflect 'honestly' OR nothing to worry about'? As if to suggest those who are 'honest' are the knicker wetting , glass half empty fannies, and those who espouse 'nothing to worry about' are not being honest with themselves?

I fear a few draws early on will have people screaming KLOPP OUT and anything that is not 100% perfect will have self-entitled dickheads all over twitter questioning the club, the boss and the players.

It's insane the levels that are now not acceptable.
But for literally 2 or 3 things going the other way, we'd have won the quadruple. To say we 'lost' or 'threw away' anything is fucking ridiculous.

[reddebs]

Just want all the summer in and out bollocks to be over and get started on next season.

[roym]

I've been watching LFC all my life, but I'm not really clever enough to offer anything with depth on this. However, I do think we are entering something of a transitional period due to age of certain players. When I say transitional, I don't mean a period of slight decline as we rebuild, I just mean maybe some old guard moving on and new blood coming in.

I remember many of us having trepidation when we lost Kevin Keegan, but we then recruited Kenny Dalglish. Personally, I have faith in this manager and his staff. They've proved they know what they are doing. As a club, we've remodelled winning sides numerous times and actually improved them. I believe we can and will do so again with Klopp.

Regarding finals, as much as we'd all love an easy 3-0 victory in 90 minutes, it's wise to remember that at this level the margins are incredibly tight. In three finals this season we won two and only conceded one goal, so it sounds different when put that way.

Does it really matter if Alisson was MotM in the final against Spurs? Madrid's 'keeper was MotM on Saturday against us, and we were the better side. Do we think Madrid care about that? I'm sure they don't.

I think there will always be areas we can improve, but nothing will never be perfect. I mean look at Abu Dhabi. Every conceivable advantage given to them on a plate, yet they still only scraped the league by a point, and they didn't make the final of any of the three cup competitions they were in. We reached all three. We are more than the sum of our parts, Abu Dhabi are less.

I'm not worried. I think the players we bring in might not be ready made elite stars, but I believe they will be made of the correct stuff for us and our needs. I think Klopp will make sure of that.

Anyway, that just my ramblings on this. Not very insightful, but just how I see it really.

i cant really add to this coz its the whole truth in my view. for the first time am relaxed in a transfer window coz first we have Klopp to manage it.. and second.. there is no other top level team that really has a pull. you either have the state sponsored teams, or the traditional big teams none of which have a really compelling story for a really strong Diaz or Fabinho-like player. i don't think any of our front three is leaving...their only real chance of silverware is with us: none of Real Madrid/Bayern/Manchester City/Barca have any trajectory as we speak.  things may change with a transfer widow, but...but if they do... i'd rather trust in Klopp's vision for the next 4 years. PLAYERS COME AND GO BUT LFC REMAINS. and if its a bet on Klopp's ability to deliver trophies, i'll take that bet any time regardless of player

[Black Bull Nova]

i cant really add to this coz its the whole truth in my view. for the first time am relaxed in a transfer window coz first we have Klopp to manage it.. and second.. there is no other top level team that really has a pull. you either have the state sponsored teams, or the traditional big teams none of which have a really compelling story for a really strong Diaz or Fabinho-like player. i don't think any of our front three is leaving...their only real chance of silverware is with us: none of Real Madrid/Bayern/Manchester City/Barca have any trajectory as we speak.  things may change with a transfer widow, but...but if they do... i'd rather trust in Klopp's vision for the next 4 years. PLAYERS COME AND GO BUT LFC REMAINS. and if its a bet on Klopp's ability to deliver trophies, i'll take that bet any time regardless of player

It's not just about pull, Klopp brings in players that want to play for us and keeps those that do and are food good enough, it's not really about the money, it's about their desire and commitment. That's why we have been good, the minute a player loses the desire, its over, furthermore, we will not be looking round for big money purchases, just the right type of player in terms of ability, attitude and personality. Jurgen will do the rest.


yes, g is next to f


If we do the Grimsby fish game then we have Sadio Marzipan, Luis Cheesiaz and Virgil Van Dip

[Ghost Town]

It's not just about pull, Klopp brings in players that want to play for us and keeps those that do and are food enough,

Yep like Mo Salad, Tea-ago and Naby Cater

[afc tukrish]

It's not just about pull, Klopp brings in players that want to play for us and keeps those that do and are food enough...

Feast of talents, as it were...

[newterp]

Yep like Mo Salad, Tea-ago and Naby Cater

Feast of talents, as it were...

Oh god...here comes the buffet of puns.

[bloke]

Oh god...here comes the buffet of puns.

I hope it's all you Kon-ate.

[Notfromaroundhere]

Last season I truly believed that we were in trouble . Our first front 3 were approaching 30, back 3 had long term injuries and we had a poor season . But we bounced back and came close to unprecedented levels of success .

So are the bits below somewhat the product of a disappointed mind following events in the last 8 days or things requiring a deep level of reflection ?

1. Despite having won everything under klopp , we have only won one final in 90 minutes against a poor spurs in a match where Allison was MoM.

2. Our midfield in both finals we lost against Madrid lacked creativity . Is this an area we need to strengthen given age profiles , inconsistency issues , potential ceilings in terms of ability and injury proneness ?

3. Diaz and Jota have polar opposite strengths and areas they need to work on . With Mane possibly leaving and Salah’s recent form do we again need to look at seriously strengthening here ?

4. Are we likely to spend the amounts we need to ? Elite number 10s and 9s don’t come cheaply . The next 4 seasons whilst klopp is with us and United are so far off challenging present a potentially golden opportunity to at least equal the 20 league titles . With city getting 2 excellent strikers we need to keep our level since January going and hit the ground running .

Your thoughts welcome .

1. Depends on your perspective. For me it's about being competitive. If we stop getting to semi finals and finals, maybe it could be a thing. But even then I think it's often about circumstances and margins. City haven't won the big one yet and only been to one final, but does that mean there's cause for concern for them? I would say no, the big picture looks great, and to me it's the same with Liverpool. Stay competitive, see if you can take the chance when you get in position. In a one off game against good opposition, things happen. So I struggle to see how this can be a cause for concern.

2. Our interest in Tchouameni says we're definitely looking to strengthen, and also are prepared to go big for the right player. I think a midfield addition this post season was always on the cards, given the age of our normal big game midfield. And I think the profile of player is expected as well, the sort of physical 6/8 hybrid who could be part of the backbone of the midfield for years to come. I would expect the club to do something else here if he goes to Madrid, even though there's always the chance he's the one midfielder they've singled out this window - and the next guy they have their eyes on isn't available this window.

Now, the point about creativity (in the form of an individual player), in the context of how Klopp fundamentally sets up the midfield and the interest in Tchouameni, I'm thinking it's not a huge priority. I think the latter is maybe a bigger indication than the former. I think our challenge in midfield is about getting through the middle third when Thiago isn't playing, and also about physicality at times.

3. Mane leaving would mean the club will look to get someone in, I think that's pretty clear. Beyond that I don't see a great need for attacking additions, with Carvalho already in.

4. Again referring the Tchouameni example, our interest there says we're willing to go big for the right player. But does that mean we have to do the same when looking for the Mane replacement? I don't think so, I think it's likely they find the right guy without going too crazy with the fee. We don't even need him to come in as a clear starter in my view. We could start next season with familiar faces up front and introduce the new guy from the bench. Depending on the player, of course. So yes, I think the club will spend what they deem necessary to get what they want. I doubt it will be a £100m move for Darwin Nunez, but I also doubt they go into the new season feeling they need more without trying to fix it.

[Mighty_Red]

The only time I had concerns was at the start of the season and around midway. Most were around how we would recover from last seasons collapse and squad depth and how we replace the front 3.

What this season has told us is that we are very much still alive, and the capture of Diaz (and Konate) showed we are actively looking at renewing the team.

I'm really not bothered about the guys out of contract in 2023. I'd rather have them at the club than sell them too early with no replacement bedded in. Could you imagine the pelters FSG would get by selling Mo and Sadio in 2021 because they hadn't signed contracts?

As others have said, the most important guy is going to be here, so let's not cry about issues that may be resolved by the transfer market of the training pitch.

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

 nothing to worry about - it's only football after all

[cormorant]

Would love to have an insight into Klopp and his staff's thoughts into the potential scenario of losing both Mane and Salah. No doubt, it'd represent a huge loss but what would they see in terms of an opportunity?

Say for example, they both go and we sign Nunez. All extremely hypothetical but could mix it up in terms of changing our attacking style. Seen it before with evolving from the initial attacking press that Klopp first introduced, moving to a much more controlled approach as the squad changed. Similar could be said for the introduction of the high defensive line (although VAR had a lot to do with that and trying to take advantage of it).

Interesting times, but definitely not downbeat here. Change = opportunity.

[SouthDerryLaggo]

Took some time off here and off football in general after Paris. Well I watched some international football and it reminded me how good a team we are compared to national teams. Im refreshed and confident again to go after those city bastards. Nunez looks like signing and a full pre season for Diaz to settle in. Carvalho and Elliot will hopefully have big parts to play. Glad salah will get a break during the World Cup and hopefully it means he will be all guns blazing for the full season this time. What a time to be a red

[RedForeverTT]

Took some time off here and off football in general after Paris. Well I watched some international football and it reminded me how good a team we are compared to national teams. Im refreshed and confident again to go after those city bastards. Nunez looks like signing and a full pre season for Diaz to settle in. Carvalho and Elliot will hopefully have big parts to play. Glad salah will get a break during the World Cup and hopefully it means he will be all guns blazing for the full season this time. What a time to be a red

Like you I took a long time off from football but also football news and forum. I didn’t want to see any other football competition where Liverpool doesn’t play.

Whatever happens this summer it is an opportunity to refresh the club. We are a well run club so any decision we make are not going to be catastrophic. I always get a feeling that our team was running on fumes in our final 10 games. We have somehow lost a certain spark and relied on our strong physique and mentality to push through.

If making personnel changes means we can bring that spark back to our games then let’s do that.

[mrantarctica]

Like you I took a long time off from football but also football news and forum. I didn’t want to see any other football competition where Liverpool doesn’t play.

Whatever happens this summer it is an opportunity to refresh the club. We are a well run club so any decision we make are not going to be catastrophic. I always get a feeling that our team was running on fumes in our final 10 games. We have somehow lost a certain spark and relied on our strong physique and mentality to push through.

If making personnel changes means we can bring that spark back to our games then let’s do that.

Not just new personnel either, though I am sure we will make a signing here or there. I think we really fatigued toward the end of the season, and I wonder if we can utilise the wider squad more next season. 

Looking at a list of some of the squad who played less than 30 games contains Ox, Ibou, Curtis, Tsimikas, Diaz, Minamino, Gomez, Origi, and Elliot among others. That's a full 20-25 game difference in how much those players featured vs the likes of Hendo, Jota, VVD, Salah, Mane, Fabinho, Trent and Robbo. Surely there is a way we can utilise the full squad such that some of the key players just play a few games less to stay that much fresher for the key games, and some of the fringe players contribute a little more.

When we went into the CL final, players like Benzema, Valverde, Kroos, Modric, Casemiro, Carvajal and others had about 5-10 games less in their legs than many of our players. If you also consider that these 10 games were Cup finals which went to penalties, really tough EPL games as well as taking the EPL to the final day, naturally this could explain for a bit of that loss of fatigue and sharpness. If we want to challenge on multiple fronts and be successful, we need to maintain our ridiculous standards, but also find a way to deliver our key players to those key games at the end of the season with a little bit of freshness and sharpness still left in their legs as well as the obvious goal of minimising injuries from fatigue and a lack of recovery time. It'll be all the more important next season with the World Cup happening, that we'll need to rely on a few of the fringe players not travelling to step up. 

[nerdster4]

If we don’t sign a midfielder (would like a mason mount type player personally ) I am hoping that carvalho, Jones or Elliott go up that required level . Fabinho/Thiago/hendo/Keita will have plenty of matches where they won’t be available or complete the 90 minutes and if we want to be competing in all competitions we will need to not drop a level when we use our wider squad

[lamonti]

I think we can all come to the conclusion that unless Liverpool win every game and every trophy they're in next season that they've planned badly. Why did they not simply plan to win every game?