Author Topic: NBA Discussion  (Read 610868 times)

Offline TipTopKop

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,101
  • Call Meeeeeee The Splund
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7880 on: March 1, 2021, 01:57:58 am »
I hope I don't jinx it, but the Lakers are absolutely torching the Dubs right now. Wasn't expecting this to be honest.

Offline Doc Red

  • Chills before posting and wishes others had too
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,876
  • The eye cannot see what the mind does not know.
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7881 on: March 1, 2021, 09:55:20 am »
Yup. Just like that, the Knicks are now officially one game over .500. After 35 games.
You're probably thinking, what's the big deal. Plenty of teams have done that, plenty of times, over plenty years. Plenty.

We've only achieved this twice over the last 20 years. That is, only twice in the prior 20 NBA seasons have the Knicks played this many games of a season and been above .500.
And just to clarify, above .500 means having a record that has more wins than losses. We're now 18-17. For only the 3rd time in 20 seasons, Knicks fans are watching their team win more than they lose, sure it's only 1 game difference and they might not maintain, but we'll take it.

We might even sneak into the playoffs as the 4th seed.
I know, getting way over my head here, we've got a tough schedule for the 2nd half of the season, but it's been a fun season watching the Knicks play. They remind me a little of the Van Gundy days when we played without Ewing. Lot of effort, hustle, with a borderline All Star and a cast of talented players. Except, the talent seems mostly young these days bar Rose.

And Step A. Smith can do one, hating on the the squad and Randle (producing numbers that only Larry Bird has done prior!) last season, and now pretending to have supported them. We still remember the whole nonsense with the Randle Knicks uniform.

East looks like it's the top 3 fighting for the top 3 spots, and 10 teams fighting for the last 5 spots. Think there's only 2 games difference between the Knicks in 4th and whomever is in 12th. ;D
The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.
There go my people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.

Offline Doc Red

  • Chills before posting and wishes others had too
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,876
  • The eye cannot see what the mind does not know.
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7882 on: March 1, 2021, 09:57:59 am »
whoever is the Pelicans shooting coach, he is doing a fine job. He made Lonzo look like a sharpshooter and Inhram also shooting over 40% behind the arc.

I've been on the Lonzo bandwagon from day 1, same with his brother.
Actual point guards that enjoy making easy buckets for their teammates.
We need to find a way to get him to the Knicks.
His brother is the real deal as well.
Credit to their parents, fantastic job raising them up, you'd think they were C list players the way they don't present any airs or narcissism on and off the court.
The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.
There go my people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.

Offline ByrdmanLFC

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 407
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7883 on: March 3, 2021, 07:23:28 pm »
Sooo Embiid or Jokic for MVP?

As a Nuggets Fan i am obviously biased as i also watch all of our games (nightshift worker), but for me what Jokic does is just unreal, never seen anything like it and the funny thing is, he is kinda "anti - stat -padding", what i mean by that is, when he sees his teammates going off or the team is extremely far ahead, he just lays back and lets the others get some spotlight.

I always feel if he wanted on any given night he could drop 40-50 and/or 20 assists. I have hardly ever seen someone so dominant and without him i believe the Nuggets would be playing for the Top 5 pick this season.

Offline GreatEx

  • pectations. might be a cunt but isn't a capitalist cunt. Blissfully ignorant.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,317
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7884 on: March 4, 2021, 12:43:55 am »
Nuggets' W/L ratio means Jokic won't win it unless they improve a lot. Embiid's probably the front-runner at this stage. Obviously I'd like a Jazzman to win it, but they're very much a whole > sum of parts side.

Offline Doc Red

  • Chills before posting and wishes others had too
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,876
  • The eye cannot see what the mind does not know.
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7885 on: March 5, 2021, 08:28:53 am »
Has to be Embiid. Such a difference since last season, and makes such a difference on the court on both ends.
I didn't think he had it in him, he's the most dominant big man there is right now, and that's no slight to Jokic who I actually would pick over Embiid if I had to pick one of them.
Come Playoff time though, I'm definitely riding with Jokic.

Nuggets' W/L ratio means Jokic won't win it unless they improve a lot. Embiid's probably the front-runner at this stage. Obviously I'd like a Jazzman to win it, but they're very much a whole > sum of parts side.

Meh, Jazz bore me.
The Jerry Sloan era bored me as well, but having seen this current Jazz style, I'd watch the Sloan era on a daily basis quite happily.
I can't see them beating the Nuggets, Lakers, or Clippers, if they're all heathy. They'll be like the Bucks of the last few seasons, great in the regular season but iffy in the Playoffs. They need another bonafide scorer before they're a threat, in my opinion.

Also, does anyone really support the Jazz? I actually caught myself nodding in agreement with Lebron, did anyone every play with the Jazz on a console/PC game? ;D
The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.
There go my people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7886 on: March 5, 2021, 04:37:30 pm »
.

Perhaps one of the strangest things I've seen in the last 12 months (and that's saying something) is looking at the Eastern Conference table and having to do a double take...is that the Knicks in 4th...? What the hell are they doing up there?! I've been hammering the NBA this year (league pass auto-renewed and couldn't be arsed cancelling) so watched a lot of condensed highlights as well full games where I can. Knicks looking good, and given the play-in tournament format this season it opens up 9 & 10 for a potential play-off spot so they've got the best chance in years of making it into the post-season. Hornets have also been good, two ex-Boston players doing really well in Rozier and Hayward.

I agree with Embiid, he's been a monster and definitely the best player. But even with the Nets roster, Harden has been immense since his move there and if he keeps going he'll no doubt be in the discussion. And although his numbers obviously don't put him anywhere near the MVP discussion, Chris Paul deserves a mention he's been the missing piece for the Suns who are on fire (pun definitely intended). Strange to see a franchise that was basically a nothing franchise potentially en-route to a play-off spot this year.

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7887 on: March 6, 2021, 12:40:54 am »
Blake Griffin has agreed to buyout remainder of his contract with the Pistons. Apparently Nets are front runners, although few other playoff contenders are interested (per Woj).

Offline GreatEx

  • pectations. might be a cunt but isn't a capitalist cunt. Blissfully ignorant.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,317
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7888 on: March 7, 2021, 02:35:15 am »
Has to be Embiid. Such a difference since last season, and makes such a difference on the court on both ends.
I didn't think he had it in him, he's the most dominant big man there is right now, and that's no slight to Jokic who I actually would pick over Embiid if I had to pick one of them.
Come Playoff time though, I'm definitely riding with Jokic.

Meh, Jazz bore me.
The Jerry Sloan era bored me as well, but having seen this current Jazz style, I'd watch the Sloan era on a daily basis quite happily.
I can't see them beating the Nuggets, Lakers, or Clippers, if they're all heathy. They'll be like the Bucks of the last few seasons, great in the regular season but iffy in the Playoffs. They need another bonafide scorer before they're a threat, in my opinion.

Also, does anyone really support the Jazz? I actually caught myself nodding in agreement with Lebron, did anyone every play with the Jazz on a console/PC game? ;D

I find all NBA teams boring since they started jacking up 30-40 threes per game, but in the 90s I loved the Jazz's team first style. Teams that play iso and hero-ball are the snoozefests, imo.

Offline Doc Red

  • Chills before posting and wishes others had too
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,876
  • The eye cannot see what the mind does not know.
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7889 on: March 9, 2021, 08:54:23 pm »

Yup, agree with those points. Though I think the Knicks might sneak into the playoffs either 4th or 5th, as long as Derrick Rose stays available.
Blake Griffin has agreed to buyout remainder of his contract with the Pistons. Apparently Nets are front runners, although few other playoff contenders are interested (per Woj).

Meh, at this stage Blake Griffin is living off his reputation from 2 seasons ago. I can't see how he benefits the Nets , or at least, with so many alternative options, why they felt he would be the right pick. Smells of a "let's bring in a big name and enhance our brand" decision  rather than a tactical one.

I find all NBA teams boring since they started jacking up 30-40 threes per game, but in the 90s I loved the Jazz's team first style. Teams that play iso and hero-ball are the snoozefests, imo.

Yup, Jerry Sloan was Pop before Pop was Pop. Or rather, Pop is Jerry Sloan without having to face Jordan.
They've always played and executed well, sure Malone and especially Stockton, were low key exceptionally dirty players, but the Sloan era from the mid-late 90s to early 2000s was a great lesson in playing the game well. I just never liked them. ;D

Can't explain it. Maybe the uniform, or something deeper I can't explain. Meh. Either way, never supported them except when they played the Jordan Bulls, and even that was difficult to do (and I disliked Jordan and his Bulls) ;)
The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.
There go my people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.

Offline GreatEx

  • pectations. might be a cunt but isn't a capitalist cunt. Blissfully ignorant.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,317
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7890 on: March 11, 2021, 09:19:02 am »
There are legitimate reasons to hate the Jazz, like being from a Mormon state that's as conservative and Republican as they come, that recruits an eyebrow raisingly high proportion of white players (though to be fair, from reading testimonials from the likes of Paul Millsap, it's more often a case of players not wanting to live in a city with almost zero black culture, than any bias from the club) and a fan base that has engaged in dirty tricks like poison pizza. But yeah, they played great team ball during the era I watched.

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7891 on: March 11, 2021, 11:23:09 pm »
Understand some don't like the constant 3's that so many teams these days just hammer, but nostalgia is also a powerful feeling. And there's no debate to be had, the game has evolved.

Meh, at this stage Blake Griffin is living off his reputation from 2 seasons ago. I can't see how he benefits the Nets , or at least, with so many alternative options, why they felt he would be the right pick. Smells of a "let's bring in a big name and enhance our brand" decision  rather than a tactical one.

Apparently he'll act as a small 5 option off the bench. He's been awful this year when he has played, although he's still struggling with an injury. But we'll see how he looks with that ridiculous roster.

Offline PeterTheRed ...

  • Edgelord. Fabrizio Romanovic, Tancredi Palmerovic, Christian Falkovic, Duncan Castlovic, Jan Aage Fjortovic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,247
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7892 on: March 26, 2021, 08:09:52 pm »
Chicago Bulls getting another legit all-star in Nikola Vucevic for Wendell Carter and two first round picks. A masterstroke from Arturas Karnisovas ...

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7893 on: March 26, 2021, 09:34:19 pm »
Vucevic is an excellent addition, still don’t think they’ll make the play-offs but definitely makes them a better side.

Oladipo to the Heat as well, they’ll be a tough team to beat again in the play-offs this year.

And I’m gutted Theis left the Celtics, by no means a world beater but a solid player who always put the effort in. Danny Ainge being his usual ruthless self with regards to cap space. Still though they’re clearly putting their faith in the youngsters like Rob Williams, we’ll see if it pays off.

Offline PeterTheRed ...

  • Edgelord. Fabrizio Romanovic, Tancredi Palmerovic, Christian Falkovic, Duncan Castlovic, Jan Aage Fjortovic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,247
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7894 on: March 27, 2021, 04:46:43 pm »
Vucevic is an excellent addition, still don’t think they’ll make the play-offs but definitely makes them a better side.

Oladipo to the Heat as well, they’ll be a tough team to beat again in the play-offs this year.

And I’m gutted Theis left the Celtics, by no means a world beater but a solid player who always put the effort in. Danny Ainge being his usual ruthless self with regards to cap space. Still though they’re clearly putting their faith in the youngsters like Rob Williams, we’ll see if it pays off.

If Vucevic and LaVine combine well, they will make the play-offs. I expect that Theis will also play a solid role for them, as they were lacking that defensive presence. They are definitely a better balanced team now ...

Offline Lastrador

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 5,942
  • Not Italian
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7895 on: March 27, 2021, 04:54:03 pm »
Vucevic is an excellent addition, still don’t think they’ll make the play-offs but definitely makes them a better side.

Oladipo to the Heat as well, they’ll be a tough team to beat again in the play-offs this year.

And I’m gutted Theis left the Celtics, by no means a world beater but a solid player who always put the effort in. Danny Ainge being his usual ruthless self with regards to cap space. Still though they’re clearly putting their faith in the youngsters like Rob Williams, we’ll see if it pays off.
They were already in the play-in tournament and they have improved massively, Vucevic is a stud and Theis is an excellent role player. They will surely make the play-in at the very least, in a very week east conference (outside of the top tree teams), but it wouldn’t surprise me if they finish anywhere between 4-6th.

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7896 on: March 27, 2021, 07:53:06 pm »
Yeah sorry forgot about the play-in tournament, they'll defo qualify 7-10. Standings I check still has a line drawn under 8th seed.

Offline GreatEx

  • pectations. might be a cunt but isn't a capitalist cunt. Blissfully ignorant.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,317
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7897 on: March 29, 2021, 04:00:53 am »
So Brooklyn sign Blake Griffin and LaMarcus Aldridge, Lakers sign Andre Drummond, Utah signs Matt Thomas... tough gig not being a "big market" team. Ah well, hoping for a Leicester fairytale here...

Online Buggy Eyes Alfredo

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,482
  • ¤Ginger◇Drapes¤
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7898 on: March 29, 2021, 04:35:27 am »

So Brooklyn sign LaMarcus Aldridge...

Wish Portland could of brought him home to his old stomping grounds. Nurkic, Kanter, and Aldridge would of been an interesting trio to watch.

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7899 on: April 13, 2021, 06:55:50 pm »
Jamal Murray out for the season with torn ACL. Watched the game, knew it as soon as i saw him in pain with no contact. It sucks as Denver's season is done imo, theu were my dark horse to come out of the West especially after Gordon trade.

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7900 on: April 13, 2021, 06:56:26 pm »
So Brooklyn sign Blake Griffin and LaMarcus Aldridge, Lakers sign Andre Drummond, Utah signs Matt Thomas... tough gig not being a "big market" team. Ah well, hoping for a Leicester fairytale here...
Kyrie, KD, Harden, Blake, Aldridge..

How much help does Joe Harris need ffs?

Online Gerry Attrick

  • Sancho's dad. Tight-arse, non-jackpot-sharing get :)
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 49,527
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7901 on: April 13, 2021, 07:21:21 pm »
Kyrie, KD, Harden, Blake, Aldridge..

How much help does Joe Harris need ffs?

;D

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7902 on: April 14, 2021, 10:22:08 am »
They asked Wolves star Anthony Edwards about Alex Rodriguez being owner of the Timberwolves.

1 Hey Ant, how do you feel about Alex Rodriguez being the new owner of the Minnesota Timberwolves?

Anthony Edwards: "Who is he? I don't know who that is. I know he's going to be the owner. But I don't know anything about baseball."

 ;D

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7903 on: April 15, 2021, 04:54:34 pm »
Lamarcus Aldridge just announced he is retiring from the NBA. Sorry to hear that as he os a good player and had great years, very nice fella as well. But heart problem is no joke so totally understand.

"Aldridge says he played his last NBA game on April 10 while dealing with an irregular heartbeat: "Though I'm
better now, what I felt with my heart that night was still one of the scariest things I've experienced."

His full satement:

https://twitter.com/shamscharania/status/1382708080262193155?s=21

Offline Doc Red

  • Chills before posting and wishes others had too
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,876
  • The eye cannot see what the mind does not know.
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7904 on: April 22, 2021, 08:38:45 pm »
8 straight wins by the Knicks, longest winning streak for 7 years. Heck, we hadn't even won 5 straight for 4 or so years.
Number 4 spot and home court for now. Below us are the Heat, Pacers, Celtics, and Hawks. Who would have thought we'd still be fighting for homecourt with 12 games left?
And we're doing this inspite of the fact we lost our starting centre for pretty much the whole season, Derrick Rose for 12 games or so, and are coming off almost a decade of being inept.

Tough run of matches coming up to end the season, but we have a chance as long as our defence holds out. And that's the thing about defense vs offense, come playoff time defense always is guaranteed to become better, offense less so. Surprsingly, we have the 4th best 3pt shooting % in the NBA. Still not shooting as much as the top teams, but it's been a fantastic season to watch. Sort of a mixture between the Melo and Amare years, and the Ewing and Gundy years. I'd love to get 4th, but I'd be just as happy being 5th (think we can beat Hawks regardless of the court advantage), and still positive with a 6th spot.

Who woulda thunk it!
The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.
There go my people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7905 on: April 23, 2021, 02:09:20 pm »
.

Really sad end to his career, and to think he'll be retiring without a Championship to his name. I guess that's why he joined the Nets but such is life.

Anyway the Nets aren't even the biggest team in New York these days, so who's to say they'll be winning the finals ;D  Julius Randle surely has to be nailed on for the MIP this year? Still averaging less PPG than at New Orleans but he's been instrumental in some big wins for the Knicks this season. Going to be a tight race for those automatic Play-Off places 4-6 over the coming weeks, Atlanta have picked it up since Nate McMillan took over, although not sure he's the man long-term.

Boston are at last looking like the team they should be, they've finally gone with the youngsters and it's now or never to start performing and they're stepping up. Rob Williams has been a beast, big shoes to fill with the departure of Theis but he's been excellent. 

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7906 on: April 26, 2021, 10:41:30 am »
Wizards have now won 8 in a row (also 10 of last 11) and their remaining games are mostly below .500 teams, they may hurt some contender teams this summer imo.

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7907 on: April 26, 2021, 10:45:09 am »
69 Years of Height Evolution in the NBA [4,379 players analyzed]

https://runrepeat.com/height-evolution-in-the-nba#averages

"We spent 2 months analyzing 24,489 records of 4,379 NBA players during 69 NBA seasons in order to show how the game of basketball evolved through the evolution of players’ height.

Key findings:

The average NBA player has never been shorter over the past 39 seasons.
Point guards are the tallest they’ve ever been in league history. All other positions are the shortest since the 80s.
Only 38% of NBA players today are considered overweight (BMI>25), lowest over the past 15 years.
72% of the league is under 6’9’’ tall (most over the past 40 seasons)
40% of the power forwards’ FG attempts are 3-pointers (first time in NBA history). Centers are getting close to 20% (19.5).
While declining in number, NBA’s big-men are dominating in shooting efficiency and PER, breaking all-time NBA records.
International big-men are one of the most valuable assets for NBA teams - 53% of the NBA’s 7-footers are international players, and 46% of NBA centers are from overseas.

1. Height and weight throughout NBA history

The average NBA height is 6’6’’, which is the lowest over the past 40 years. The last decade was the first in the history of the league where NBA players got shorter than a decade before.

NBA point guards are 6’3’’ tall, tallest they’ve ever been.

All other positions (shooting guards, small forwards, power forwards, and centers) are the shortest since the early 80s.

The average weight in the NBA was growing since the 70s, peaked in the 2010/11 season, and has been declining ever since.

NBA players are the lightest they’ve been in the 21st century. The average weight of an NBA player is 216 lbs.

Similar to height evolution, point guards are the heaviest they’ve ever been. All other positions are getting lighter.

BMI of NBA players is declining over the last few seaons. The average BMI of NBA players is 24.63 and is the lowest since the 2004-05 season.

It’s understandable that NBA players, especially big-men, had to become more agile and lighter in order to adapt to the perimeter-oriented game. This is why NBA centers and power forwards are facing the biggest drop in their BMI.

As a consequence, today we have the smallest share of “overweight” players in the NBA (BMI>25) over the past 15 years. Only 38% of NBA players are overweight according to their BMI.

The ideal concept of the small-ball game is having 5 guys with the same physical attributes and skillset - this is positionless basketball at its peak.

So it’s not strange that 61% of the NBA players are within 6 inches, standing between 6’3’’ and 6’9’’. All other height ranges are in decline.

Also, 72% of the league is under 6’9’’.


2. Shooting evolution through height

Ever since the 60s, players shorter than the league average have been attempting more field goals than taller players. Weighting NBA height by FGA shows exactly this:

On the other hand, over the last couple of decades players taller than league average proved to be more accurate shooters, which can be seen by weighting height by FG%.

Today, the difference between height weighted by FG% and the average NBA height is the biggest in NBA history:

NBA centers are the only players who still spend some time inside the 3-point line. As a consequence, NBA centers have the highest FG% that anyone ever had in the history of the league.

Players taller than 6’9’’ have constantly been increasing their shooting efficiency over the past 20 years. They are the only group that makes more than 50% of their field goal attempts. All other groups are below 45%.

For the first time in NBA history, players from one position have a TS% above 60% - NBA centers. And for the 5th season in a row, all positions are above 50%.

2019/20 season is the first in NBA history where all height ranges TS% average goes over 50%. 7-footers are the first group at 60%-mark.

As NBA big-men started to take more and more 3-pointers, height weighted by 3PA is closest to average NBA height since the introduction of the 3-points line.


While the whole league volumes up 3-point shooting, it’s the NBA big-men who faced the most radical transformation. Over the last decade, power forwards and centers increased the number of 3PA by 167% and 323%, respectively.

The average 7-footer in the NBA attempts 85 3-pointers in a season. This is a 231% increase over 10 years, and 147% increase in 5 years only.

It's the same story with the share of 3-point shots in the total FGA, indicating that taller players increasingly exchange 2-pointers with 3-pointers.

40% of NBA power forwards field goal attempts is beyond the 3-point line, 2.45 times more than in the 2009-10 season, and 124% more than in the 2014-15 season. During the same period, centers 3PA share jumped 5 times.

Even the NBA’s 7-footers are taking at least 20% of their field goal attempts beyond the 3-point line. Players shorter than 6’9’’ are getting close to the 50% mark


3. Game evolution through height

The evolution of the game reflects on the rebounding patterns. Looking at the offensive boards, it’s noticeable that the offensive rebounding is on the decline.

NBA centers are the only player who somewhat maintained the rebounding rate from the last decade. Power forwards, who moved out of the paint, dropped their offensive rebounds average by 45% in 10 years, and are closer to guards than ever before.

It’s not a surprise that only NBA 7-footers increased off rebounding over the past 10 years, while all shorter players are facing decline:

It’s a similar story with defensive rebounds, where things have been more stagnant over the last 30 years. This is understandable as defensive rebounding requires more team effort and cooperation.

Especially in today’s game, where 4 or 5 guys on the court are playing beyond the arc, defensive rebounds are the most evenly distributed between positions since this stat has started recording.

Assist evolution through height tells another interesting story. The results show that taller players facilitate more than ever before, as height weighted by assists got closest to the average NBA height in the last 45 years.

Big-men are the only ones who are significantly increasing their assist rate - centers are assisting 29% more than 10 years ago, and power forwards increased assists by 23% during the same period.

Shooting guards and small forwards are actually assisting less than they did 10 years ago. For the first time in 40 years, NBA big-men assist as much as small forwards.

As a consequence, only players over 6’9’’ are increasing their assist averages.

While NBA big-men are declining in number, they are dominating in efficiency. For the ninth season in a row, height weighted by PER is larger than average NBA height. This hasn’t happened since the 60s and the Russel-Chamberlain era.


NBA centers have the highest PER in the NBA for 7 seasons in a row. This has never happened over the past 60 years. It’s also interesting that the point guards average the highest PER ever.

Players over 7-feet tall are averaging the highest PER in the history of the NBA (17,46), and are leading the league for 6 straight seasons (also the NBA record).


4. Rookie height evolution

Rookies’ data are an interesting tool to examine the league's year-to-year tendencies. The data are much more unstable and fluctuate more on a yearly basis, but they are more precise in explaining the league’s current trend.

The average height of NBA rookies is on a steady decline over the past several seasons.

It’s noticeable that shooting guards and forwards are getting shorter over the past several seasons.

Back to the Table of contents


5. International players’ height evolution

Over the past 30 years, the NBA is increasingly opening up for overseas players. In the 2019-20 season, every 4th NBA player wasn’t American.

International NBA players today are 3% shorter than 20 years ago, and 0.7 inches shorter than 10 years ago.

Breaking down by position, international players evolve along with the league’s tendencies - big-men are getting shorter, point guards are getting taller.

International centers recorded the highest share among NBA centers in the history of the league - 46% of all NBA centers come from overseas.

Similarly, 46% of NBA players taller than 6’9’’ are international players, and foreign 7-footers are accounting for 53% of league total. This data clearly shows that international big-men are still one of the most valuable assets from NBA teams.

Over the years, big men coming from abroad, particularly from Europe, have proved to be more skillful with the ball in their hands. They’re educated to play a team basketball, share the ball and learn to read the game.

This is visible on the charts – since the new millennia, when the centers slowly but surely started getting more involved in the flow of the game, by setting pick&rolls and “migrating” outside of the paint, they needed to develop a new skill set, one that the European centers already possessed. In some way, it was the international big men who made the small-ball revolution possible.



Important Notes

Although the first NBA season was 1946/47, the results displayed in this research are starting from the 1951/52 season, due to the incomplete data for the previous seasons.
The exceptions are 3-point shooting (introduced in 79/80), off/def rebounds, steals, and blocks (started recording from 73/74).
Height evolution vs. footwear evolution
Back in the "old days", when the game was played inside-out, big guys dominated the league. They were the first players to get their signature basketball shoes, starting with now-legendary Chuck Taylor's. The 80s brought a lot of changes to the game, following the arrival of Michael Jordan. Nike basketball shoe division saw in MJ what no other brand could see, and in 1985 the first Air Jordans were born. This was the first major shoe deal signed by an NBA guard, and it changed the shoe industry forever. The last big man to impact the shoe industry was Shaquille O'Neal and his famous Shaq Attack models.

Today, small guys are dominating the league. Steph Curry single-handedly changed the game, and Under Armor didn't want to miss that opportunity. It's the small-guy league now, and signature shoes are driven by stars like James Harden and Kyrie Irving."

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7908 on: April 26, 2021, 11:13:28 am »
Steve Clifford To Miss Several Games After Positive COVID-19 Test, Tyrone Corbin To Coach Magic

Kevin Durant After Scoring 33 Points In Return: 'It's Like Riding A Bike'

Anthony Davis Says He's 'Just Trying To Find A Connection' With Teammates After Return

Kevin Durant, Mike Conley Win Oscar For Best Short Film Category

Steph Curry Calls Draymond Green 'Smartest Basketball Player I've Played With' After 19-Assist Game

Fanbo Zeng Decommits From Gonzaga, Expected To Join G League Ignite

Jamal Murray Undergoes Successful Surgery On Torn ACL

NBA Has Three New Positive COVID-19 Players Since April 14th

Deni Avdija Out For Season With Fractured Ankle

Woj: Zion Williamson, Knicks 'Something To Watch Down The Road'

Mavericks Fire Tony Ronzone

ESPN Moves Paolo Banchero To No. 1 In Latest 2022 NBA Mock Draft

Vanessa Bryant, Kobe Bryant Estate Elect Not To Renew Nike Partnership

2021 NBA Free Agency To Begin On August 2nd

Raptors Sign Yuta Watanabe To Standard NBA Contract

Dwyane Wade Buys Ownership Stake In Jazz

Dwyane Wade Role With Turner Sports Not Expected To Change Following Jazz Announcement

NBA Instructs Teams To Prepare For Impact Of Verdict In Derek Chauvin Trial

Spurs Fined $25K For Violating Player Resting Policy

Steph Curry Calls Current Scoring Run 'Statistically' The Best Of His Career

Dennis Schroder Reportedly Drawing Interest From Knicks This Offseason

Lakers Unable To Visit White House Due To Scheduling Conflicts

Tom Thibodeau On Julius Randle After 44-Point Game: 'He's Our Engine'

Jimmy Butler After Loss To Wolves: 'We Don't Deserve To Win'

Donovan Mitchell To Miss Several Games After MRI Reveals No Structural Damage To Ankle

James Wiseman Undergoes Successful Surgery, Expected To Return Next Season

Nikola Jokic Considered Heavy Favorite To Win MVP In Latest Straw Poll

LaMarcus Aldridge Retires Following Irregular Heartbeat

Gregg Popovich Suggests Scrutinizing Political Donations Of NBA Owners

Knicks, Bulls Considered Top Threats To Sign Lonzo Ball

Offline RedSince86

  • I blame Chris de Burgh
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,457
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7909 on: April 26, 2021, 01:28:59 pm »
Cannot believe my Knicks are 7 games over .500 after 61 games.

As Hodgson famously said, this is Utopia.

"Since its purchase by the sheikh of Abu Dhabi, Manchester City has managed to cheat its way into the top echelon of European football and create a global, immensely profitable football empire, ignoring rules along the way. The club's newfound glory is rooted in lies."

Offline elsewhere

  • Turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think I mean African, so...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 31,749
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7910 on: April 26, 2021, 01:51:21 pm »
Cannot believe my Knicks are 7 games over .500 after 61 games.

As Hodgson famously said, this is Utopia.


People were mocking Randle after shipping out Porzingis but credit where it's due, he's been balling. Thibs also redeeemed himself after failing to do well with the young core in Minnesota, now he has a young team with the Knicks and everyone was expecting them to be tanking but they've done incredibly well.

They do have a brutal schedule in May though, hopefully they won't need to do that play in or whatever tournament it's called before the play off's.

Offline FlashGordon

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 12,727
  • RAWK Cheltenham 2021 Champion Tipster*
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7911 on: May 5, 2021, 08:43:33 pm »
Charles Barkley has fixed his golf swing.

This is not a drill, I repeat, this is not a drill.
So bloody what? If you watch football to be absolutely miserable then go watch cricket.

Offline Doc Red

  • Chills before posting and wishes others had too
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,876
  • The eye cannot see what the mind does not know.
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7912 on: May 15, 2021, 10:09:33 pm »
People were mocking Randle after shipping out Porzingis but credit where it's due, he's been balling. Thibs also redeeemed himself after failing to do well with the young core in Minnesota, now he has a young team with the Knicks and everyone was expecting them to be tanking but they've done incredibly well.

They do have a brutal schedule in May though, hopefully they won't need to do that play in or whatever tournament it's called before the play off's.

Somehow, we're almost an inch away from locking up the 4th seed and a first round matchup against the Hawks. Hawks being a much more favourable matchup than the Heat.
Funny quirk of the rankings, if we win our final game, and the Hawks win theirs, we'd both have the same record. However, because of our head to head record, we'd finish above them. Unless the Heat also finish with the same record as us. If we all finish with the same record, than we'd go from 4th to 6th, Hawks would go 4th, and Heat would go 5th.

"Why?", I hear you asking. Well, because the Hawks have a better head to head record against the Heat, and right now they're both #1 and #2 in their division. So if all three of the Knicks, Heat, and Hawks, have the same record, the team that finishes top of their division gets placed above the other two, which means the Hawks go above the Heat and now the Heat and the Knicks have to determine how they end up ranking. And since the Heat have a better head to head record against the Knicks, they finish above us.

Incredibly strange. Right now, we'll finish above the Hawks if we win our last game, but if the Heat beat the Bucks (their last game is a gimmie against the Pistons) than the Hawks get homecourt and we end up 6th. So the Hawks are also hoping the Heat win. Worst of all, the Heat are playing the Bucks, the team currently in 3rd and without a chance of getting 2nd or going down to 4th. So if the Bucks beat the Heat, they'll end up facing the Heat in the 1st round. Considering they lost to them in the last Playoffs, I wouldn't be at all surprised if they "rested" their top players against the Heat. That would then give them a more favourable matchup against the Knicks.

Meh, goes to show you how every game can have a consequence for the whole season. We dropped a few games that we really should have won (namely against the Lakers, and Wolves), and now they're biting us in the arse.

Having said all that, what a great problem to be having at this stage of the season, as a Knicks fan. Usually, we're discussing our potential lottery picks and possible trades. ;D

Here's hoping the Bucks give it a game and don't fall on their swords.
The child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.
There go my people. I must follow them, for I am their leader.

Offline TipTopKop

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,101
  • Call Meeeeeee The Splund
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7913 on: May 17, 2021, 12:41:34 pm »
I'd like to do some shit stirring, if I may ;D

Steph Curry....  scoring champ, Kerr says "He's never been better", Bron Bron says give him the MVP.....   is he really that good (anymore) though??

He's averaged most points yes, but he has the 2nd highest attempts average and he's not even in the top 50 of the FG%...     same for 3 pointers...     top for made/attempt but 7th in %....     am I missing something here?

Reminds me of when the Lakers were 'The Kobe show' in his last 2 or 3 years of his career, when you couldn't go to the bathroom without his say so, nevermind taking a shot... everything was just going through him, isn't that the same thing here??

Now, to be sure I'm not denying he is a great player, but the whole point scoring champion headlines and MVP shoutouts are a bit way off in my opinion.

Might come back to bite me on the arse now he's facing the Lakers  ;D but still, don't get it...

Offline deFacto please, you bastards

  • Apologies if I haven't responded to every post in every thread yet, I'm trying hard. farKnow.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 35,685
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7914 on: May 17, 2021, 01:00:09 pm »
I'd like to do some shit stirring, if I may ;D

Steph Curry....  scoring champ, Kerr says "He's never been better", Bron Bron says give him the MVP.....   is he really that good (anymore) though??

He's averaged most points yes, but he has the 2nd highest attempts average and he's not even in the top 50 of the FG%...     same for 3 pointers...     top for made/attempt but 7th in %....     am I missing something here?

Reminds me of when the Lakers were 'The Kobe show' in his last 2 or 3 years of his career, when you couldn't go to the bathroom without his say so, nevermind taking a shot... everything was just going through him, isn't that the same thing here??

Now, to be sure I'm not denying he is a great player, but the whole point scoring champion headlines and MVP shoutouts are a bit way off in my opinion.

Might come back to bite me on the arse now he's facing the Lakers  ;D but still, don't get it...

He's playing with minimal talent around him. The only reason they're in the play in, is because of him.  He is their only threat, so it's not like Thompson is on the court and the defenders can't focus on him just soley. They're often sending 3 defenders at him at once, he's playing high minutes in every game and still putting up high numbers.

« Last Edit: May 17, 2021, 01:02:00 pm by deFacto please, you bastards »

Offline TipTopKop

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,101
  • Call Meeeeeee The Splund
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7915 on: May 17, 2021, 01:24:36 pm »
He's playing with minimal talent around him. The only reason they're in the play in, is because of him.  He is their only threat, so it's not like Thompson is on the court and the defenders can't focus on him just soley. They're often sending 3 defenders at him at once, he's playing high minutes in every game and still putting up high numbers.
No doubt about him being isolated without the help as you say, but I just wonder if the two go hand in hand; he's top scorer because he's the one who's attempting to do it all basically, again similar to Kobe in the last few years, it didn't matter who comes out of that time out in the last 5 seconds you knew who was going to be the last person to touch the ball.

Granted, the stats I listed don't factor in who's being double (or even triple) teamed, or game winning shots or clutch intangibles. But I'm still a bit skeptical with the volume of output.

Offline deFacto please, you bastards

  • Apologies if I haven't responded to every post in every thread yet, I'm trying hard. farKnow.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 35,685
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7916 on: May 17, 2021, 01:51:36 pm »
No doubt about him being isolated without the help as you say, but I just wonder if the two go hand in hand; he's top scorer because he's the one who's attempting to do it all basically, again similar to Kobe in the last few years, it didn't matter who comes out of that time out in the last 5 seconds you knew who was going to be the last person to touch the ball.

Granted, the stats I listed don't factor in who's being double (or even triple) teamed, or game winning shots or clutch intangibles. But I'm still a bit skeptical with the volume of output.

Except when Steph shoots the ball from 44 feet, you're not saying it's a bad shot. He's making shots only he can make on a regular basis. If you are skeptical about him scoring so much then look at how much he was scoring when he did have talent around him. It doesn't matter ultimately as he's proven his ability in both scenarios.

Offline RedSince86

  • I blame Chris de Burgh
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,457
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7917 on: May 17, 2021, 02:21:58 pm »
Charles Barkley has fixed his golf swing.

This is not a drill, I repeat, this is not a drill.
That's a shame.  :'(


I have a bet with my other half that the Knicks go further than the Lakers, loser does the school run in the mornings for 4 weeks.
"Since its purchase by the sheikh of Abu Dhabi, Manchester City has managed to cheat its way into the top echelon of European football and create a global, immensely profitable football empire, ignoring rules along the way. The club's newfound glory is rooted in lies."

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7918 on: May 17, 2021, 04:11:14 pm »


Quadruple teamed vs Phoenix last week, don't see that often. He's a monster, and thoroughly deserves the award as has been said he's carried the Dubs to the Play In tournament. Beal has been incredible as well, especially as the Wizards finished in the Play In. But he was playing alongside Westbrook who's also been excellent over the last couple of months, Curry was on his own (at least from a scoring perspective).

Offline TipTopKop

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 8,101
  • Call Meeeeeee The Splund
Re: NBA Discussion
« Reply #7919 on: May 17, 2021, 04:30:57 pm »
I have a bet with my other half that the Knicks go further than the Lakers, loser does the school run in the mornings for 4 weeks.
If LeBron and Davis remain healthy, I'd set your alarm clock mate  ;)

Curry's great, no doubt. MVP's too far a shout for me though. If we go by the do it all by himself barometer then Westbrook should be in the conversation (and I'm no fan of his).