Topic: Do you support the strikes?

[Kenny's Jacket]

It seems like a good solution. Even with your caveat about letting wages keep pace with it. Essentially inflate away our debt.
There must be something wrong with that though.

A conservative government isnt going to decrease the value of  Assets.

[TepidT2O]

It seems like a good solution. Even with your caveat about letting wages keep pace with it. Essentially inflate away our debt.
There must be something wrong with that though. I assume it will be an impact on exchange rates and the cost of importing things.

See Zimbabwe for details of what it might look like

[Yorkykopite]

Why cant I be annoyed at a Journalist asking a question in a way that, by your admission will cause division and lowering of support from some Remainers to working people.

The question does not "cause" division. The division is already there. I fail to see why you can't grasp that.

[PaulF]

See Zimbabwe for details of what it might look like

Good point. I think some South American countries had inflation at 1000% +. Wheelbarrows full of cash to buy a pint of milk.
I don't like to fill up at the fuel pumps right now as it seems like you need a mortgage, but the flip side is it's going to be cheaper than topping up next week.

A conservative government isnt going to decrease the value of  Assets.

Very good point. And probably any financially responsible government will keep an eye on that side.  Inflating away 5-10% of Covid related debt. Is that prudent? (Finger in the air calcs)

[Nobby Reserve]

See Zimbabwe for details of what it might look like

There's no comparison in terms of the contributing factors. You might have made reference to Weimar Germany.

Mugabe had massive international debts that he couldn't service due to agricultural collapse (caused by brutally evicting farmers from their lands and handing them to party apparatchiks with no clue about farming) so 'printed' money, which created an inflationary spiral, then the politically-controlled Zimbabwe central bank responded to by 'printing' more currency. Pure economic illiteracy (but they were likely ordered to by Mugabe)

The inflation in the UK (and other Western nations) is due to specific, external and temporary inflationary pressures.

However, the response to this has the potential to prolong inflationary pressure - and one of those responses is to keep raising interest rates (but countries have little choice when some countries seek to gain a brief boost to currency value by raising theirs, a boost that is immediately lost when other countries follow suit)

[Nobby Reserve]

A conservative government isnt going to decrease the value of  Assets.

Yup.

And the BoE (and the Fed, ECB, etc) wouldn't watch it happen. They're not exactly redistributionist lefties...

[ShakaHislop]

David Lammy takes most hardline Labour stance yet against rail strikes.

Shadow foreign sec tells me: ‘I don’t support strikes… It hurts working people… This is not a moment for posturing, standing on picket lines’

Key Q: do his remarks represent toughening LOTO stance?

Labour chief whip will tomorrow speak to frontbenchers who joined picket lines last week, says Lammy.

He says Lab leadership gave a ‘v clear msg’ not to do so, so he’s ‘surprised that colleagues have found it confusing’ & ‘found themselves on the wrong end of that’

But Lammy wouldn’t say if frontbenchers who defied edict not to join picket lines shd be sacked, & if Starmer’s authority is shot otherwise.

https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1541002372381642752

[TepidT2O]

There's no comparison in terms of the contributing factors. You might have made reference to Weimar Germany.

Mugabe had massive international debts that he couldn't service due to agricultural collapse (caused by brutally evicting farmers from their lands and handing them to party apparatchiks with no clue about farming) so 'printed' money, which created an inflationary spiral, then the politically-controlled Zimbabwe central bank responded to by 'printing' more currency. Pure economic illiteracy (but they were likely ordered to by Mugabe)

The inflation in the UK (and other Western nations) is due to specific, external and temporary inflationary pressures.

However, the response to this has the potential to prolong inflationary pressure - and one of those responses is to keep raising interest rates (but countries have little choice when some countries seek to gain a brief boost to currency value by raising theirs, a boost that is immediately lost when other countries follow suit)

I was going to mention Weimar gernany… but decided it was best not to go full nazi.

Short term inflationary pressures?  They a,ways start off that way, but then they become self fulfilling.  What you are proposing would guarantee they were self fulfilling …

[killer-heels]

https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1541002372381642752

Lammy is chatting shite.

[Kenny's Jacket]

Lammy is chatting shite.

Hes been a fucking disaster. Hes just advocated for tactical voting a la, Wakefield and Tiverton, then he contradicted himself saying people dont want politicians to rig elections.

He thinks striking is not a negotiating tactic and seems to think Workers uniting against fire and re-hire are wrong.

Hes a twat.

[Wild Romany Boy]

Hes been a fucking disaster. Hes just advocated for tactical voting a la, Wakefield and Tiverton, then he contradicted himself saying people dont want politicians to rig elections.

He thinks striking is not a negotiating tactic and seems to think Workers uniting against fire and re-hire are wrong.

Hes a twat.

He has his talents but...Lammy has messed the bed there and the frontbench will have to have a word in his ear.

[Fromola]

He has his talents but...Lammy has messed the bed there and the frontbench will have to have a word in his ear.

Who? Bunch of nonentities.

[gazzalfc]

The labour party. Never missing an opportunity to miss an opportunity

[Nobby Reserve]

Hes been a fucking disaster. Hes just advocated for tactical voting a la, Wakefield and Tiverton, then he contradicted himself saying people dont want politicians to rig elections.

He thinks striking is not a negotiating tactic and seems to think Workers uniting against fire and re-hire are wrong.

Hes a twat.

I think Lammy is at Liz Truss levels of dim.

[Nobby Reserve]

I was going to mention Weimar gernany… but decided it was best not to go full nazi.

Short term inflationary pressures?  They a,ways start off that way, but then they become self fulfilling.  What you are proposing would guarantee they were self fulfilling …

The 'cure' in this particular set of circumstances (Monetarist doctrine calls for raising interest rates) actually contributes to the problem.

What action do you think should be taken?

[killer-heels]

I think Lammy is at Liz Truss levels of dim.

He made Brexit his own soap box, constantly shouting his arguments across. Type of guy you have to pretend you dont know when you are sat next to him in the commons.

[TepidT2O]

The 'cure' in this particular set of circumstances (Monetarist doctrine calls for raising interest rates) actually contributes to the problem.

What action do you think should be taken?

Raising interest rates takes money out of the economy…. So that helps with inflation…yes, that hurts, I get that… the argument is that the pain is far less than continual inflation .

But also, inflation weakens your currency making imports more expensive. High interest rates encourages people to invest in your currency strengthening it and reducing inflation.

[Linudden]

I know full well what an abusive twat as a boss is like so go ahead and strike all you like and good luck to them

[PaulF]

Raising interest rates takes money out of the economy…. So that helps with inflation…yes, that hurts, I get that… the argument is that the pain is far less than continual inflation .

But also, inflation weakens your currency making imports more expensive. High interest rates encourages people to invest in your currency strengthening it and reducing inflation.

Is it more to do with signalling? The Boe can't 'alllow' the inflation. And although they know they can't do much about the external costs , they can 'encourage' wage restraint by signalling that if wages are allowed to become the cause of extended inflation then it's in arms race of inflation and I test rates , and that everybody better simmer down, accept the shite situation for now rather than make it worse?

Fwiw , I expect the pain of the war to cause the likes of Boris to start suggesting to the Ukrainians that they accept some loss of territory so we can get oil and wheat flowing again.

[Red-Soldier]

Is it more to do with signalling? The Boe can't 'alllow' the inflation. And although they know they can't do much about the external costs , they can 'encourage' wage restraint by signalling that if wages are allowed to become the cause of extended inflation then it's in arms race of inflation and I test rates , and that everybody better simmer down, accept the shite situation for now rather than make it worse?

Fwiw , I expect the pain of the war to cause the likes of Boris to start suggesting to the Ukrainians that they accept some loss of territory so we can get oil and wheat flowing again.

So, it's OK for CEOs to "reward" themselves with huge pay increases and many corporations to make huge profits during the past two years, but it's not OK for normal workers to ask for pay increases.........?

Current inflation has been caused by Covid, the Ukraine War, Brexit and top earners.

Raising interest rates will only push more people/small businesses to the brink, and wont have any impacts on general inflation whatsoever.

[killer-heels]

12 years under the Tories and we have had to put up with Austerity, falling living standards, food bank increase, reduction in public and health services and now rampant inflation which has killed peoples wallet. If they raise interest rates then that will further destroy peoples spending power.

Forget Brexit politics, forget shite that they say, forget social justice issues, forget the corruption. None of that matters compared to the first paragraph and if that doesn't get rid of the Tories next time out then nothing will.

[Nobby Reserve]

Raising interest rates takes money out of the economy…. So that helps with inflation…yes, that hurts, I get that… the argument is that the pain is far less than continual inflation .

But also, inflation weakens your currency making imports more expensive. High interest rates encourages people to invest in your currency strengthening it and reducing inflation.

'Taking money out of the economy' only acts as a deflationary measure when the cause of inflation is of the 'demand-pull' kind. This isn't a demand-led inflationary pressure.

Higher interest rates do attract external investment (over investing in other countries), which creates a heightened demand for the currency, increasing its value which, as you say, makes imports less expensive, so lowering inflation. However, as I've been at pains to explain, that only works when a country raises interest rates in isolation. When a country raises interest rates and other countries follow suit, the initial, brief uplift in currency value evaporates almost immediately. And this is what is happening. You're back to square one, but with higher interest rates and added costs onto businesses (who in turn pass this increased costs onto consumers, creating its own inflationary pressure)

The core drivers of this inflationary spike are, on the face of it, temporary.

Supply-chain disruption caused by Covid is slowly working through (although some sectors are taking loger to normalise - eg, semiconductors)
Fuel cost surges have been driven by Russia's actions (initially strangling gas supply to Europe in Q3/21 then invading Ukraine), and you'd hope this wouldn't drag on that much longer. But we've had the surge, and prices won't keep increasing (even if they remain high but stable, the inflation factor disipates)
Food price increases, again mostly leading on from the invasion of Ukraine

The fly in the ointment is that workers are justifiably demanding pay rises commensurate with inflation rates. This acts as a further inflationary pressure, although most usually a decreasing one.

[PaulF]

'Taking money out of the economy' only acts as a deflationary measure when the cause of inflation is of the 'demand-pull' kind. This isn't a demand-led inflationary pressure.

Higher interest rates do attract external investment (over investing in other countries), which creates a heightened demand for the currency, increasing its value which, as you say, makes imports less expensive, so lowering inflation. However, as I've been at pains to explain, that only works when a country raises interest rates in isolation. When a country raises interest rates and other countries follow suit, the initial, brief uplift in currency value evaporates almost immediately. And this is what is happening. You're back to square one, but with higher interest rates and added costs onto businesses (who in turn pass this increased costs onto consumers, creating its own inflationary pressure)

The core drivers of this inflationary spike are, on the face of it, temporary.

Supply-chain disruption caused by Covid is slowly working through (although some sectors are taking loger to normalise - eg, semiconductors)
Fuel cost surges have been driven by Russia's actions (initially strangling gas supply to Europe in Q3/21 then invading Ukraine), and you'd hope this wouldn't drag on that much longer. But we've had the surge, and prices won't keep increasing (even if they remain high but stable, the inflation factor disipates)
Food price increases, again mostly leading on from the invasion of Ukraine

The fly in the ointment is that workers are justifiably demanding pay rises commensurate with inflation rates. This acts as a further inflationary pressure, although most usually a decreasing one.

Ultimately, it needs international agreement to not raise interest rates. Otherwise, by not doing so , a country risks being left behind.
There's no easy solution for sure.
I'm hating saying it, but thanks to the war and other factors, our standard of living has fallen.  Wage rises aren't the answer.  A rebalancing where CEOs aren't getting millions extra WOULD help . God I'm a socialist now. 
Have to bear in mind a CEO pay rise is probably mostly taxed at a fairly substantial rate , more than we'd see from spreading that money over the lowest paid.  Not to say the lowest paid don't need\ deserve it more. 

[oldfordie]

Ultimately, it needs international agreement to not raise interest rates. Otherwise, by not doing so , a country risks being left behind.
There's no easy solution for sure.
I'm hating saying it, but thanks to the war and other factors, our standard of living has fallen.  Wage rises aren't the answer.  A rebalancing where CEOs aren't getting millions extra WOULD help . God I'm a socialist now. 
Have to bear in mind a CEO pay rise is probably mostly taxed at a fairly substantial rate , more than we'd see from spreading that money over the lowest paid.  Not to say the lowest paid don't need\ deserve it more.

The Torys have brought all the wage demands upon themselves.
I understand why you think wage rises aren't the answer but the Torys have spent years denying what everyone knew, the value of workers wages have dropped.
The last time this situation arose a Labour government had the co-operation of the unions and the workers, they agreed to limit wages to 5% for at least 3 yrs until the government went back to the well once too often, people had enough by then, they couldn't pay the bills. the Torys have no chance of gaining any co-operation from the unions, these wages demands are happening within months of inflation kicking in. this is the question I think people should consider, why is everyone banging in for all these high wage demands so quickly when in the past the unions and workers co-operated with the government to fight inflation.
The Tory government have spent the last 12 yrs spinning and denying what we all knew was true without ever trying to fix those problems. the unions quick reaction to demand higher wages is more about the high inflation effects being the final straw.
This Tory government have zero chance of receiving the co-operation past governments have received, all down to years of fobbing off genuine grievances caused by their incompetence and extreme right wing ideology with spin.

[thaddeus]

Barristers walk out of courts in strike over pay

Barristers are on strike across England and Wales in a long-running dispute over pay and conditions.

Eight out of 10 cases at London's Old Bailey were disrupted by the walkout, barristers outside the court said.

Damn those bloody militant... barristers?!

A lot of chickens coming home to roost for this government.  The cutting of legal aid in 2018 (?) was another policy based on ideology rather than any pragmatic reasoning.  It also hit those people unable to fund their own legal expenses - i.e. most people - the hardest.  Richard Burgon was clear at the time that Labour would reverse the policy so hopefully Labour will get behind this strike.

[Machae]

Richard Burgon was clear at the time that Labour would reverse the policy so hopefully Labour will get behind this strike.

I don't really know what Starmer stands for, anything to pander to the right wing loonies

[PaulF]

Damn those bloody militant... barristers?!

A lot of chickens coming home to roost for this government.  The cutting of legal aid in 2018 (?) was another policy based on ideology rather than any pragmatic reasoning.  It also hit those people unable to fund their own legal expenses - i.e. most people - the hardest.  Richard Burgon was clear at the time that Labour would reverse the policy so hopefully Labour will get behind this strike.

I know it's stereotyping, but I want to see some on the picket lines bearing Latin placards.  Nil Payrisum, Nil workum

[Machae]

Post Office staff now talk of strike action

[reddebs]

Post Office staff now talk of strike action

Great stuff.  Bring them all out 💪

[Elmo!]

Post Office staff now talk of strike action

Was it a postal ballot?

[oldfordie]

Was it a postal ballot?

Talking about striking in November when all the votes are in.

[killer-heels]

Post Office staff now talk of strike action

Just Post Office or Royal Mail?

[Machae]

Just Post Office or Royal Mail?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61957004

[PaulF]

Just Post Office or Royal Mail?

I've just skimmed that treeless. No mention of royal mail. Guess they will be out though too soon. They love a good strike.

[ToneLa]

I've just skimmed that treeless. No mention of royal mail. Guess they will be out though too soon. They love a good strike.

Last week on Sky News:

A union representing 115,000 postal workers at Royal Mail is giving formal notice of a ballot that could lead to strikes in a bitter row over pay and jobs.

As rail and Tube workers staged the biggest national rail strike for 33 years on Tuesday, the Communication Workers Union (CWU) added to the combative mood by saying it was preparing a vote after rejecting the company's pay award offer.

Its deputy general secretary, Terry Pullinger, said in a video posted on Twitter: "Today we will be serving a notice on Royal Mail Group over a pay claim, our claim for an inflation-based no strings pay award.

"The company has imposed 2% pay award, miles away from where inflation is, totally inadequate."

[PaulF]

Is there any index linking in the price of stamps?

[Machae]

Wait till the RAWK mods go on strike

[Nobby Reserve]

Wait till the RAWK mods go on strike

Party time!!

[RF]

[/quote

I've just skimmed that treeless. No mention of royal mail. Guess they will be out though too soon. They love a good strike.

Nobody loves or wants to strike. FWIW they will likely be holding a 2nd ballot in a few weeks regarding shocking proposed changes to terms and conditions which could even be shoved through Adsa style . If you knew the ins and outs of it all you might be a bit more on their sympathetical .

[shy_talk]

Rail strikes support for? oh yes!
BA threatening
Royal mail threatening
Now GP's threatening

Three meals away from chaos...