Topic: Labour Thread * No Gaza *

[Kenny's Jacket]

think it's fair to say that you might be being unfair to the poster who pointed out that the weirdos circulating that video in a coordinated way might have had ulterior motives - as it happens, they did. slurring the Labour party and whipping up hatred and threats against a teacher out canvassing - fucking scumbags

think it's worth sharing details about the false claim (see article below), and the consequences of it for the poor woman - who was out trying to get the midlands a Labour mayor - if only as a reminder that you shouldn't take everything you read on social media. especially within a little bubble of people affirming one another unquestioningly, like those Newham numpties

Teacher's 'life blown apart' in onslaught of hate as false racism claim goes viral
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/teachers-life-blown-apart-onslaught-29128108

By the way, that fucking prick Yakoob (the one who thinks violence against women is funny) has left this on his social media after doxxing her and the school she works at, to whip up threats and disruption. Prick shouldn't be near any democratic positions.

Im very pleased the video is fake and given the 'leaking' of the alleged persons name Id like to see them face consequences. Yakoob too. However the RAWK poster wasn't concerned  it was fake, his concern was that it came from a source outside Birmingham and why are they getting involved if they're not from Birmingham

Being more concerned with who exposes racism than the racism itself isn't cool.

I noticed you rightly condemned it. 

[Lisan Al Gaib]

Im very pleased the video is fake and given the 'leaking' of the alleged persons name Id like to see them face consequences. Yakoob too. However the RAWK poster wasn't concerned  it was fake, his concern was that it came from a source outside Birmingham and why are they getting involved if they're not from Birmingham

Being more concerned with who exposes racism than the racism itself isn't cool.

I noticed you rightly condemned it.

People were concerned by the ulterior motives of the person who posted the video and were ultimately proved right with the video being manipulated to slur the person canvassing and the Labour party as well. There's no exposure of racism where racism doesn't occur.

[Sangria]

My history teacher was adamant on the necessity of examining sources whenever evidence was presented, and not to accept the message just because it accorded with what I already think. I've been accused of being a revisionist on here because I questioned established thinking, because of that.

[kopite77]

Natalie Elphick has defected to Labour, that is definitely not a good look, she is more suited to Britain First or the BNP!

[Clint Eastwood]

That fucking idiot is absolutely not welcome. Big blow for Labour.

[Kenny's Jacket]

People were concerned by the ulterior motives of the person who posted the video and were ultimately proved right with the video being manipulated to slur the person canvassing and the Labour party as well. There's no exposure of racism where racism doesn't occur.

The validity of the video wasnt questioned.,

[Lisan Al Gaib]

Natalie Elphick has defected to Labour, that is definitely not a good look, she is more suited to Britain First or the BNP!

She's not standing at the next election so I can only assume she's been accepted to cause maximum embarrassment to the government. Anything else would be obscene.

The validity of the video wasnt questioned.,

Yet here you are still criticising people for something that didn't actually happen...

[Libertine]

That fucking idiot is absolutely not welcome. Big blow for Labour.

MP defects from the Tories saying Sunak can't be trusted to control the border and that's a "big blow" to Labour? Seriously?

It's not like she's going to be in the shadow cabinet. It's yet another setback for the Tories. Take the win.

[cornishscouser92]

Mike Tapp is the candidate for Dover in the next election. She is standing down.

[Lisan Al Gaib]

MP defects from the Tories saying Sunak can't be trusted to control the border and that's a "big blow" to Labour? Seriously?

It's not like she's going to be in the shadow cabinet. It's yet another setback for the Tories. Take the win.

The optics aren't right. I get why they've done it but they can't just be taking in any old Tory. She's not centre ground politician she's a far right Brexit zealot who basically blackmailed the Tories into giving her the seat after her husband had to give it up because he was jailed for sexually assaulting two women

[Kenny's Jacket]

Yet here you are still criticising people for something that didn't actually happen...

Thats completely inaccurate.

[classycarra]

The validity of the video wasnt questioned.,

It was mate, and I know for a fact I said that I said couldn't hear what was said (and wasn't sure if the audio was untampered with).

Either way, what's your goal? Trying to hold someone to account for not making a statement (via RAWK post) to condemn a person allegedly making a racist slur (which didn't actually occur)?

Not to mention, the absence of condemnation doesn't mean someone is in favour of the thing that wasn't condemned

[killer-heels]

She is a bellend.

[cornishscouser92]

Labour have confirmed Mike Tapp will be the candidate for Dover in the election and Elphicke is standing down. Just amusing more than anything...

[Kenny's Jacket]

It was mate, and I know for a fact I said that I said couldn't hear what was said (and wasn't sure if the audio was untampered with).

Either way, what's your goal? Trying to hold someone to account for not making a statement (via RAWK post) to condemn a person allegedly making a racist slur (which didn't actually occur)?

Not to mention, the absence of condemnation doesn't mean someone is in favour of the thing that wasn't condemned

I called someone out for caring more about the location of the twitter poster than the racism that he didnt know wasn't real.

Its validity in the post wasn't questioned, but now the fact its fake has given him wiggle room, wiggle room that didnt exist before the fake was exposed.

Ive explained my point and cant add any more to it.

[filopastry]

Someone pointed out she is more of a "mixed blessing" than many defectors and I think that is fair.

But given she isn't running again, I think its probably a net benefit to Labour, very embarrassing to the govt.

[Red-Soldier]

I guess the party is a broad church.

[Lusty]

It does make you wonder where the line is for defections and what you'd have to do for the party to refuse one.

[jillc]

I am glad this video has been proven as false, I just feel for the person concerned.

[hide5seek]

Wikipedia

Natalie Cecilia Elphicke OBE (née Ross; born 5 November 1970) is a former finance lawyer and a British Labour politician

[hide5seek]

A finance lawyer (she'll be loaded) joins Labour. Not a good look for the Tory party. It says if she can join/vote Labour anyone can.

[TepidT2O]

I guess the party is a broad church.

I  no y for the next few months. We’re not taking a long term labour MP here. Pros and cons, but the pros out way the cons here. Stuff the Tories again is the thing

[RedDeadRejection]

Yeah, certainly one of those hold your nose for the greater good moments.

[LuverlyRita]

She is a bellend.

Isn't she the stupid idiot who attended the protests about the P&O sackings and started joining in the chanting before realising that some of it was aimed at her 

Don't know what Starmer is thinking 

[LuverlyRita]

She's not standing at the next election so I can only assume she's been accepted to cause maximum embarrassment to the government. Anything else would be obscene.

I think this government is beyond embarrassment.

[thaddeus]

Isn't she the stupid idiot who attended the protests about the P&O sackings and started joining in the chanting before realising that some of it was aimed at her 

Don't know what Starmer is thinking 

That's my abiding memory of her.  She's an opportunist that jumped on the career of her ex husband to become an MP and is now switching sides as it's obvious the Tories will lose.

She has zero Labour values.

Only positive is that it's another slap in the face for Sunak.

[Lisan Al Gaib]

Isn't she the stupid idiot who attended the protests about the P&O sackings and started joining in the chanting before realising that some of it was aimed at her 

Don't know what Starmer is thinking 

Yep that's her!

We know what he's thinking and its maximum embarrassment to the government whilst getting a Tory to tell everyone that the Tories can't be trusted and that you can trust Labour. The pros may outweight the cons here but I'm not sure by how much. It says Labour will do anything to gain power and not about it being for the good of the country, it doesn't shake off the Tory with a red rosette image some people have and could sway some who were on the edge of it, its also letting someone so vile into the party that doesn't necessarily represent good change. I just think there should be a line for which Tories they should be allowing to defect to them.

[LuverlyRita]

The optics aren't right. I get why they've done it but they can't just be taking in any old Tory. She's not centre ground politician she's a far right Brexit zealot who basically blackmailed the Tories into giving her the seat after her husband had to give it up because he was jailed for sexually assaulting two women

I think she also publicly taunted the victims of her husband. She's utterly appalling and should have no place in the Labour party.

[jillc]

Surely we can turn her down, I don't really see what we gain by this considering her past behaviour.

[LuverlyRita]

Only positive is that it's another slap in the face for Sunak.

Not great PR for Starmer though is it?

[Elmo!]

Not great PR for Starmer though is it?

Starmer's not a fan of PR anyway.

[oldfordie]

Natalie Elphick has defected to Labour, that is definitely not a good look, she is more suited to Britain First or the BNP!

It's not a good look but it's politics.
What happens if Labour turns away any Tory who say they now support Labour.
The Torys will jump on it and say Labour think anyone who supported the Torys in the past is vile, Labour say your not welcome. they will make a big thing of it, they are very quiet now.
Crazy situation though, she can sit on the backbenches with Labour MPs but I assume she won't be allowed to join the Labour party for at least a year, well after the election so she can't stand as a Labour MP anyway.
I think she just wants to go on the record of not being a part of this disgusting government, good luck with that.

[thaddeus]

Not great PR for Starmer though is it?

It might be as the general public probably don't know much about her.

The elected prime minister was ousted in a coup led by the unelected Rishi Sunak. Under Rishi Sunak, the Conservatives have become a byword for incompetence and division.

The centre ground has been abandoned and key pledges of the 2019 manifesto have been ditched. Meanwhile the Labour Party has changed out of all recognition.

Comments that portray Elphicke as a centrist, condemn the Tories for abandoning manifesto pledges and praise Labour.

For anyone that knows about her or makes the effort to read about her then it's an ugly moment for Labour.

[stewil007]

For anyone that knows about her or makes the effort to read about her then it's an ugly moment for Labour.

So, thats 95% that its ok for then, outside of twitter and those who go searching for their news, its probably a calculated risk, in the same way as courting certain tabloids etc

[LuverlyRita]

It's not a good look but it's politics.
What happens if Labour turns away any Tory who say they now support Labour.
The Torys will jump on it and say Labour think anyone who supported the Torys in the past is vile, Labour say your not welcome. they will make a big thing of it, they are very quiet now.

But as Lusty says, where do you draw the line? Starmer has purged a lot of people from the Labour party for not towing his line and yet he welcomes  her. She's attacked victims of her husband, she's anti-immigration and she even had a go at Marcus Rashford's campaign to feed kids.
What next - Liz Truss?

[Circa1892]

So - I don't like this movement and actually think there's very few Tory MPs I rate less than her. I'm far from the "all Tories are evil bastards" camp (although far more are now than there used to be) - she definitely is one though.

But. I guess difficult technically to stop? Effectively she's joined the Labour Party - and is an elected MP.

Although I guess she has to be given the whip...

Net it's a bit meh - but I feel like Labour don't need it at the moment?

[Circa1892]

But as Lusty says, where do you draw the line? Starmer has purged a lot of people from the Labour party for not towing his line and yet he welcomes  her. She's attacked victims of her husband, she's anti-immigration and she even had a go at Marcus Rashford's campaign to feed kids.
What next - Liz Truss?

I don't think Liz Truss is as bad as her.

[oldfordie]

But as Lusty says, where do you draw the line? Starmer has purged a lot of people from the Labour party for not towing his line and yet he welcomes  her. She's attacked victims of her husband, she's anti-immigration and she even had a go at Marcus Rashford's campaign to feed kids.
What next - Liz Truss?

I honestly understand how you feel, am not happy with it and Labour can't stay silent about it either but the need to show all ex Tory voters won't be turned away from Labour must be at the back of the minds of the Labour leadership.
Theres also the possibility of this causing a collapse of the government, more jumping ship to save face. I believe theres a crisis meeting with Sunak and Tory MPs right now.

[LuverlyRita]

I honestly understand how you feel, am not happy with it and Labour can't stay silent about it either but the need to show all ex Tory voters won't be turned away from Labour must be at the back of the minds of the Labour leadership.
Theres also the possibility of this causing a collapse of the government, more jumping ship to save face. I believe theres a crisis meeting with Sunak and Tory MPs right now.

Great response from Count Binface on Twitter

"Natalie Elphicke tried defecting to me first but I said no. I’m taking the trash out, not in. #PMQs"

https://xcancel.com/CountBinface/status/1788171554104250494

[jillc]

I don't think Liz Truss is as bad as her.

You ate giving too much credit to Truss.