Topic: What is RAWK?

[Z e u s]

Bollocks, why not? You really telling me you can't smile at your custom title? Most people think its an honour to have been recognised by the staff. And after all, you're the king of the Gods, where's your humour?

Fair enough, if that is how it is meant.

[Trada]

We are discussing that right now but again we don't want the site to be elitist and exclusive. We're one of the very few sites that let anyone on. I should know, I was let in.

Maybe it could work like the Match Day Commentary thread where if anyone wants to add something to the thread they PM something to the people allowed to post on that thread.

Good ideal if it's on 2 or 3 threads and doesn't become the norm.

[Red Genius]

@ Hinsey

I think a lot of the disconnect between perceptions of the moderation within this site is partially to do with the disconnect between members and the moderation team, i feel that is partially due to the lack of interaction in a discussion based nature between everybody, i appreciate a lot of your time are consumed 'policing' the site, but i feel better interaction and contributions to topics would put a lot of those perceptions to bed, after all it's a shame as i'm certain you guys also have interesting points to share!

[Hinesy]

Fair enough, if that is how it is meant.

Always.

[Hinesy]

@ Hinsey

I think a lot of the disconnect between perceptions of the moderation within this site is partially to do with the disconnect between members and the moderation team, i feel that is partially due to the lack of interaction in a discussion based nature between everybody, i appreciate a lot of your time are consumed 'policing' the site, but i feel better interaction and contributions to topics would put a lot of those perceptions to bed, after all it's a shame as i'm certain you guys also have interesting points to share!

i think that's an excellent point. I know I speak for several of us when I say we hardly ever post these days, cos we're pretty busy poking our noses in and out of threads. That said, several mods do participate in threads, usually off topic ones and your point is partly why I wanted to start the Round Table threads myself, as a way of ensuring I wrote as well as modded. But yep, that's hard.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

@ Hinsey

I think a lot of the disconnect between perceptions of the moderation within this site is partially to do with the disconnect between members and the moderation team, i feel that is partially due to the lack of interaction in a discussion based nature between everybody, i appreciate a lot of your time are consumed 'policing' the site, but i feel better interaction and contributions to topics would put a lot of those perceptions to bed, after all it's a shame as i'm certain you guys also have interesting points to share!

That's a fair comment and hopefully something we will try to address.  It does definitely seem to be the case that it is easy to get sucked into spending all your time moderating rather than posting. Which is a shame as most moderators get chosen based on their record as a poster. 

[John C]

That is definitely the sort of thing that we are hoping to encourage with the new emphasis on encouraging good writing mate.

Can I ask to what extent you're thinking in respect to the "good writing" VdM. On a forum like this some of the discussions from yorky, Degs, Roy, FS and a few others like HBHR are superb - there really are so many to mention (I'd include yourself in there but you may have already implemented the ban for sucking up to a mod idea), the contributions from those posters are bonuses to life among mostly good Reds, many of whom simply have passion rather than a writing talent. Are you trying to make much better writing the norm rather than a bonus? RAWK wouldn't resemble what it is today would it? Is there a staff room opinion that its become too popular and has grown too much?

Personally I think RAWK is just brilliant, the only thing that annoys me is posters who start a thread when there's already one and that's usually dealt with swiftly. I do think it is a tiny bit cliquey though.

This might sound a bit crazy but you know what RAWK does, and I learnt this very early after joining - it teaches good citizenship - it really does. It should be recognised and you should all be proud for the high standards maintained. Being told to "fuck off" by more established posters in your first year or so use to go unpunished I think (and I don't mean John_Mac), its changed for the better now.

I'd be interested if your looking at the quality of posts & posters or just encouraging more quality threads like you use to have with the *.

[Hinesy]

John, we're in the process of selecting a new set of RAWK 'Voices' if you like, and they will have an arena in which to write and post the material you talk about mate.

[exiledintheUSA]

Has any consideration ever been given to having 'watchers' - a few members that are frequently knocking about that can assist in moderation without actually being a moderator?  Many times, usually when I'm on in the US, through the quiet hours in the UK, threads go haywire and seemingly begin to run out of control, often assisted by booze or the strains of a hard days graft.  Maybe with a little assistance from a few others the threads could be better 'policed' for want of a better word, moderation of any internet site seems like a thankless task and one that should not be taken on lightly and you should all be saluted for your work.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Has any consideration ever been given to having 'watchers' - a few members that are frequently knocking about that can assist in moderation without actually being a moderator?  Many times, usually when I'm on in the US, through the quiet hours in the UK, threads go haywire and seemingly begin to run out of control, often assisted by booze or the strains of a hard days graft.  Maybe with a little assistance from a few others the threads could be better 'policed' for want of a better word, moderation of any internet site seems like a thankless task and one that should not be taken on lightly and you should all be saluted for your work.

Mate, you are all "watchers".  Reports to Mod have fallen by 50% since we promoted SP to the staff room.  If something is going haywire then feel free to report it.  Chances are we may take a few hours to get around to yours unless we're suffering insomnia, but they will get looked at eventually

[Big Red Richie]

Yeah. But who watches the watchers. 



Actually I was thinking something similare whils reading through this thread earlier.

It's almost like a sherriff having deputies, to do the watching in his stead, whilst the sherriff has some down time, yet, the deputies do not have full moderating powers, just limited powers. (and no power of arrest or execution  )

[Keith Lard]

Firstly I think the mods do a very good job on this site and generally helps forum members to save themselves from themselves.

I think sometimes there has to be an acceptance that 90% of people that come to a discussion forum are more interested in discussion and making 1 to 2 paragraph posts as opposed to the 10% that genuinely write quality pieces.

It can sometimes be a harsh environment for newbies and perceived as being a bit cliquey. Once you understand the site better, however, you realise that the perceived harshness is necessary in order to maintain a level of quality and dignity to the site.

[John C]

Bollocks, why not? You really telling me you can't smile at your custom title? Most people think its an honour to have been recognised by the staff. And after all, you're the king of the Gods, where's your humour?

Easy for you to say, you're not the one that people look upon as having sexual fetishes 

[John C]

John, we're in the process of selecting a new set of RAWK 'Voices' if you like, and they will have an arena in which to write and post the material you talk about mate.

That sounds interesting, it was clear from VdM's earlier post that something is going to change.

[Camarero25]

John, we're in the process of selecting a new set of RAWK 'Voices' if you like, and they will have an arena in which to write and post the material you talk about mate.

The thing I'd worry about there is that the best posters will all be in those threads, meaning the quality of other threads on the main board could deteriorate. Having said that, you really could get some top quality discussions without all the shite in between by doing it that way. It's a difficult one.

[Macphisto80]

good post VDM.

As i see it, there are a lot of great comments added to most of the threads, but they do indeed get swamped amongst the clutter. People quote great posts & applaud them, but 3-4 pages later and they disappear. Royhendo does do a decent job of copying these posts that he does find an posts them into his own thread. But i guess he will miss a lot, i mean he can't read everything. But it's great to see Roy get this position, he will make a quality editor.

Stealing an idea from social media, could we vote up quality posts?
I'm not sure how that would affect the post, but perhaps they could be moved to the beginning of the thread, or that with enough votes are displayed a different colour. maybe the thread themselves can be promoted with enough thumbs up.

I guess we are limited by plugins to make a technical change. But i would love to see the many quality posts more visible.

I suppose rubbish knee jerk posts can be voted down, and posting privileged reduced.

That's a great idea. I'm not sure how it could be done, but perhaps something along the lines of having a vote up or down system like Youtube has with the option to click to view the top voted posts at the start of the thread. Obviously a bit of work involving HTML and all that. Maybe you'd still get shite comments being voted positively, or people being cocks and just trolling by voted negatively? Still a decent idea and would make topics a lot more interesting.

[Mr Dilkington]

I have written a few bits and bobs for the website in the past, and whilst I certainly wouldn't consider myself to be a good writer, I enjoy doing it, and if one person out of 100 or whatever that reads it enjoys it then it's worth it for me.

Now I kinda lack the motivation though. It seems as though people can't be arsed reading long posts any more. Look at the new kit thread for example. It's just pages and pages of speculative nonsense. Much much better writers than myself have written brilliant pieces that have hardly been looked at or debated, and it's a bloody shame.

This place used to encourage thought provoking posts, but now it's just turned into a place for people to come and stamp their feet. (I don't actually think that's a problem created by the mods though, or one easily solved.) At the end of the day, there are more idiots in the World than there are thoughtful, patient people who are willing to take time to absorb 
others points of view and at the same time gets theirs across.

[Red Genius]

The thing I'd worry about there is that the best posters will all be in those threads, meaning the quality of other threads on the main board could deteriorate. Having said that, you really could get some top quality discussions without all the shite in between by doing it that way. It's a difficult one.

I wouldn't worry about that mate, it will set a bench mark of what great posts and topics that can be discussed on this site and help maintain a certain level of great discussion which should hopefully inspire others to contribute more thoughtfully.

[John C]

The thing I'd worry about there is that the best posters will all be in those threads, meaning the quality of other threads on the main board could deteriorate. Having said that, you really could get some top quality discussions without all the shite in between by doing it that way. It's a difficult one.

That's an excellent point mate, unless of course we can view but not contaminate the threads  
It reminds me of another point I meant to mention - RAWK also helps people improve their English and grammar.

[Mohammad Shahrul]

Dude, from all of the Liverpool forum existed on the Earth surface, RAWK is the best
one... In other Liverpool forum site (no need to name it here), I simply got banned
because I was asking the meaning of English wording / hint / joke / Scouse bashing
in the "un-serious" topic... Sure I ask because Im not Scouser and I couldnt
understand the joke, plus English is my second language and I got C+ in my grammar
even until now I hate my lazy grammar teacher. What the hell is that... I dont want
to go to that site anymore. Here, I can see a lot of good Scousers, welcoming Scousers
and aaalll of the good people with the weird people. Here in RAWK, it
just feels good with a Harry Potter and Wizard of Oz atmosphere that I can even
breath in RAWK oxygen...

Love, RAWK.
Forever Liverpool.

[Camarero25]

That's an excellent point mate, unless of course we can view but not contaminate the threads  
It reminds me of another point I meant to mention - RAWK also helps people improve their English and grammar.

No I'm sure we'll be able to view the threads, and they'll be great. It could mean that the actual discussion idiots like me can have with those top posters will be reduced though. I think that's probably a good thing as the discussion will be more streamlined and of a higher quality overall, but I'm not entirely sure.

[the 92A]

I have written a few bits and bobs for the website in the past, and whilst I certainly wouldn't consider myself to be a good writer, I enjoy doing it, and if one person out of 100 or whatever that reads it enjoys it then it's worth it for me.

Now I kinda lack the motivation though. It seems as though people can't be arsed reading long posts any more. Look at the new kit thread for example. It's just pages and pages of speculative nonsense. Much much better writers than myself have written brilliant pieces that have hardly been looked at or debated, and it's a bloody shame.

This place used to encourage thought provoking posts, but now it's just turned into a place for people to come and stamp their feet. (I don't actually think that's a problem created by the mods though, or one easily solved.) At the end of the day, there are more idiots in the World than there are thoughtful, patient people who are willing to take time to absorb 
others points of view and at the same time gets theirs across.

This is exactly what we want to encourage, people like yourself to take the time to post thought provoking posts. It's because posters like yourself are losing the motivation that we are looking for ways to encourage you to write posts that don't get lost amongst the speculative nonsense.

[macca888]

Mate, you are all "watchers".  Reports to Mod have fallen by 50% since we promoted SP to the staff room.  If something is going haywire then feel free to report it.  Chances are we may take a few hours to get around to yours unless we're suffering insomnia, but they will get looked at eventually.

Don't believe a fucking word any of them say. I pressed the Report To Moderator button once, and the outside of our house looked like the fucking SAS storming the Libyan Embassy. Gas canisters flying through the window, flash bombs, semi automatic gunfire, then Pheeny kicked the fucking door down looking like a cross between Lewis Collins and the Milk Tray man. For the love of God, don't do it.


Something else I was thinking about was, do you remember on the main board when we had the starred topics? I thought they were brilliant. I can't remember the rules exactly, but it was along the lines of every post had to be a good few lines long. It made everybody think about what they were posting either to give their differing opinions or to agree with a post they were responding to. The threads moved much slower and there was none of the smiley face/this/thumps up type responses (of which I'm as guilty as anyone of doing!) It might be an idea to reintroduce them.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

This is exactly what we want to encourage, people like yourself to take the time to post thought provoking posts. It's because posters like yourself are losing the motivation that we are looking for ways to encourage you to write posts that don't get lost amongst the speculative nonsense.

Exactly. And fear not, all the posts will eventually be open for everyone to discuss and contribute to. We're not trying to build ivory towers or ghettos.

[iamrobk]

Its interesting that I think there are certain perceptions of RAWK.
1. We don't allow dissent from some sort of official rosy view.
2. We ban those who do go against the grain.
3. We get over protective and lock and ban wantonly.
4. We react badly to abuse elsewhere on other social networking sites.

My thoughts are:
1. That has always been wrong. What we've never allowed is mindless abuse, calling for manager's and player's P45's and insults. Also we're Liverpool fans for fuck sake, we should have little understanding and dignity about our club. Many posters seem to think they know better than highly paid professionals when clearly its bollocks. Take the FA Cup starting team. No Carroll, Henderson in the middle and Suarez up front with Gerrard. What every pundit said we should do. Then Kenny gets taken to task for not playing Andy earlier etc etc. He can't win. Sorry, went on a bit there..

2. Again not true. Many people talk about Dr M being banned as if he was banned for holding opposing views to some official line. Well that's not the case at all. Why do you think we have so many hassles in threads? Cos of people arguing against each other. If the site was merely a one track site it wouldn't be like that at all.

3. Each mod has their way of moderating and we may be guilty of locking first, thinking after and we're in constant talk about the best way to moderate but its not the end of the world and secondly we do discuss bans and rescind them if we think its too much. But I can't recall anyone being banned totally unfairly in all my years here.

4. Persistent and consistent pisstaking of the site is hardly likely to make you welcome on here is it? We're a robust site that endures mockery in many corners and frankly 99% of the time don't even know its there never mind be bothered about it. But you can hardly expect to be welcomed with open arms on here if you spend the rest of your time rubbishing it and everything on it.

I mostly agree with what you're saying here (mostly in regards to the banning - I don't think there's a big problem there), but I really do think the first perception is pretty true in practice, at least to me.  I don't think there's any real favoritism from the mods or anything, but to be honest I think the problem exists, and I think it hurts discussion because it eventually leads to one side getting pissed off that the other even exists, which is what leads to bannings and shitposts.  Then inevitably a thread will get locked and/or posts get deleted.  I think part of the problem is that generally player threads get locked when people are just posting about how much Player X sucks, and yeah, there is no real discussion going on, but it's not helping the perception (and in fact, that's whats making the perception).  I wish I could articulate my point better here, but I can't really think of the right way to phrase what I want to say.  Maybe this makes sense though.

Also, in general, I'm in favor of less strict moderation.  One thing is with the 'transfer threads.'  Whether we like it or not, these things are happening 365 days a year, and I think it's a bit unfair that we can't have a thread to discuss rumors, or even facts (like games Kenny or whoever are seen watching).  I think the summer transfer forum is well moderated in general though, FWIW, and like the policies there.

[Camarero25]

Exactly. And fear not, all the posts will eventually be open for everyone to discuss and contribute to. We're not trying to build ivory towers or ghettos.

Cracking idea then. 

[Jake]

How about a bans forum, that only mods can post in but we can all read, which says who gets banned and what for, this would make things clear about what is right/what is wrong (or what is funny if its a comedy ban)

They aren't up for discussion, as only mods post in the banned forum. Just informative.

Any opinions?

[Hinesy]

Personally I think the banning of a poster is a last resort and one that isn't up for public discussion nor freak show mockery. I just don't think there's any point opening a thread on why or who has been banned either for the amusement of the membership which is debasing nor for public discussion.

[idontknow]

RAWK is superb. That is my default position.
There are lots of valid criticisms here, such as great posts being lost, lots of one-liners, but to weed those out takes a lot of work, and must surely complicate the technicalities of keeping the site going, as well as giving the mods even more work.
This site works superbly on phones, laptops, desktops - some RAWKites are reading it on something the size of their palm, others - I suspect  - on something the size of their house, and it works for both. That has to be kept.
As for one-liners, very often I read a huge long post, especially in the football analysis pieces, or the financials, and to be honest I barely understand any of it, or more accurately, I have no idea how someone can be so articulate, and I just want to say thankyou. I've been educated, I can't share it back, but I want to say thanks as quick as I can.
Match threads, often the same, I just want to give some support. I've got no idea what the team should be, but I want to show support.
So delete all those short replies afterwards, but I don't see how it can be done without overcomplicating things and ruining the cross-platform accessibility.
I agree with having a read-only thread of the some of the best posters, but I'm not sure it would work well in practice. Some of the best posters may have their own reasons for not wanting that.
RAWK, to me, is brilliant, and I read it for a long time before bumping into an open for membership era. Any alterations should aim for the same simplicity of use that it currently has, and take full regard of the work the mods have to do already without giving them more difficulties.

[Lenin.]

I dont take a blind bit of notice to what anyone else says on this so called ''rawk'. My opinion is the only one that matters. End of.

[Jake]

Personally I think the banning of a poster is a last resort and one that isn't up for public discussion nor freak show mockery. I just don't think there's any point opening a thread on why or who has been banned either for the amusement of the membership which is debasing nor for public discussion.

I thought it'd have more of an "ooh-er I better not do that then" effect on someone reading it if the post was something along the lines of "J-Mc - 2 days for not getting the kit mock up 100% correct" but obviously a real offence.

Anyway cheers for the feedback 

[soxfan]

Looking at the feedback threads after the cup final there are perhaps some newer users who don't really understand how RAWK works.

I respectfully would say that it's because you are confusing them every day. It's not the newbies' fault.

I guess the post the triggered this explanation was a sarcastic "What do you think this is, a discussion forum?"
Well it clearly is a discussion forum but that is only part of the story. It should be a place to read good writing about Liverpool FC, it should encourage good writers to submit articles knowing that they will be read and they'll get intelligent feedback and encouragement. I am hugely proud of the lads who have cut their teeth on here and gone on to make a living writing about LFC.

In order to try and facilitate that then part of our role as moderators is editorial, sorting the wheat from the chaff. It is the reason that threads get locked or merged. 

I think you're trying to do the impossible. To use an analogy, you are trying to build a 200 MPH Ferrari that has an attachment that can plow snow off a mountain road. You need to choose one or the other, or build separate "garages" -- a section for "regular" forum discussion and another for "elite" writing.

The Plow: The average sports forum user wants to read about their peers' opinions on yesterday's match, their favorite and least-favorite players, the manager, opponents, transfers and so on.  They want moderators who will let things flow pretty freely, so long as the truly annoying 3% of trolls and idiots are reprimanded or banned. They accept that there will be some emotional posts after losses, some not-so-intelligent posts, etc. but accept that as part of the deal. They want to share banter as they would at a friend's home or the pub. If supporters don't think Kenny is doing a good job, they want to be able to discuss that or some other emotional flashpoint.  Every football fan in the world is speculating about transfers right now, but no, we can't have that on RAWK unless you fill out a form in triplicate, have it stamped by the Queen, and approved unanimously by the Supreme Court of RAWK on the first full moon of the month -- I'm exaggerating but most posters here get my point. RAWK locks threads in an instant and denies the very banter that 80% of site visitors want. There are many excellent sports forums that do not have the heavy lockdown hammer of RAWK, and yes, they are every bit as good as RAWK. This is a FORUM not a 3rd Level Poetry course at a university....which leads me to...

The Ferrari: Have a subforum that encourages elite-level writing. I know, I know, you already sorta kinda have that. But REALLY separate the "plow" forum from the "Ferrari" writing. Have one "Ferrari" subforum that is heavily moderated (a bit more heavily moderated than the main forum now). Let RAWK's best writers flourish there. If someone keeps posting in this subforum but continually fails to meet the higher standard, suspend their posting privileges to this subforum while allowing them to keep posting in the "plow" subforum. Moderators should encourage the forum's better writers to use the "Ferrari" subforum while simultaneously loosening the grip a bit on the current main forum. Give the forum's best writers special avatar badges as rewards for their ever-increasing great work in their subforum.

What are your bugbears with our moderation? How can we ensure that the cream floats to the top? What are we doing now that is stopping that happening. Fire away.

Again, stop trying to Frankenstein two forums into one. Build separate subforums and make them very distinct. If you don't, you'll continue to confuse newbies, and continue to frustrate the "average" posters with your constant thread-locking, and continue to frustrate your most articulate posters by having their efforts buried in amongst "lesser" posts.

Good luck. 

[Red Reign]

I respectfully would say that it's because you are confusing them every day. It's not the newbies' fault.I think you're trying to do the impossible. To use an analogy, you are trying to build a 200 MPH Ferrari that has an attachment that can plow snow off a mountain road. You need to choose one or the other, or build separate "garages" -- a section for "regular" forum discussion and another for "elite" writing.

The Plow: The average sports forum user wants to read about their peers' opinions on yesterday's match, their favorite and least-favorite players, the manager, opponents, transfers and so on.  They want moderators who will let things flow pretty freely, so long as the truly annoying 3% of trolls and idiots are reprimanded or banned. They accept that there will be some emotional posts after losses, some not-so-intelligent posts, etc. but accept that as part of the deal. They want to share banter as they would at a friend's home or the pub. If supporters don't think Kenny is doing a good job, they want to be able to discuss that or some other emotional flashpoint.  Every football fan in the world is speculating about transfers right now, but no, we can't have that on RAWK unless you fill out a form in triplicate, have it stamped by the Queen, and approved unanimously by the Supreme Court of RAWK on the first full moon of the month -- I'm exaggerating but most posters here get my point. RAWK locks threads in an instant and denies the very banter that 80% of site visitors want. There are many excellent sports forums that do not have the heavy lockdown hammer of RAWK, and yes, they are every bit as good as RAWK. This is a FORUM not a 3rd Level Poetry course at a university....which leads me to...

The Ferrari: Have a subforum that encourages elite-level writing. I know, I know, you already sorta kinda have that. But REALLY separate the "plow" forum from the "Ferrari" writing. Have one "Ferrari" subforum that is heavily moderated (a bit more heavily moderated than the main forum now). Let RAWK's best writers flourish there. If someone keeps posting in this subforum but continually fails to meet the higher standard, suspend their posting privileges to this subforum while allowing them to keep posting in the "plow" subforum. Moderators should encourage the forum's better writers to use the "Ferrari" subforum while simultaneously loosening the grip a bit on the current main forum. Give the forum's best writers special avatar badges as rewards for their ever-increasing great work in their subforum.
 Again, stop trying to Frankenstein two forums into one. Build separate subforums and make them very distinct. If you don't, you'll continue to confuse newbies, and continue to frustrate the "average" posters with your constant thread-locking, and continue to frustrate your most articulate posters by having their efforts buried in amongst "lesser" posts.

Good luck. 

I second this post.

The effort to keep the forum free of junk is admirable but you have a base of registered posters that encompass the globe. You can't try to mold/steer the conversation; it ends up feeling hollow.

[lorenzo23]

Its rather simple its meant to be discussion board rite?

Well keep it that way, ban the abuse poster leave the rest not sure why this is even so hard to come to conclusion really. No need for the over policing of closing every thread which don't go well with few of the older generation, only come on the site cause it has some very good posters.

I love the well thought out debates and specially the strong ones may it be about the club/style of play/players/managers/transfers etc. Yet seems mostly what you get on sites is people telling you how to support? which seems even worse coming from some mods! I mean some one god banned other week purely cause in his "opinion" (from how i read his quote) thought kenny will be moved up stairs? while the mod took it as he is itk and ban, can only see more of this happening and its sad day when great forum like this is turning in to china. (freedom of speech maybe?) Which personally i don't think is disrespectful as much as its made out to be on here its the lad opinion and long as he not calling Kenny names then he can have that opinion.

That is just one example of something that i hope wont carry on here, guys need to relax at bit and let people discuss good/bad/strong/easy topics.

Also some one has pointed out already mods seem to favor certain poster and let them get away with anything. You can go in thread and 9/10 see small little gangs of each side. Nearly every time mods will side with the ones that is pro Kenny and Players, whats point having forum if you not going talk about the good and the bad?

Then your get the shit you not a true/good fan you don't go matches, show respect and all this stuff etc. Not sure why anyone on this site can sit on high horse and tell anyone how they should support or if they showing enough respect or not cause it don't sit well with others. when it comes from mod just leaves bad taste in mouth your meant to be moderating  that sort of shit yet,not contributing to it.

[harleydanger]

I think everyone's opinion (apart from mine) should be heavily edited to agree with the right opinion (mine) and any user continually posting an opinion that is wrong (not mine) should be banned.

[lorenzo23]

I respectfully would say that it's because you are confusing them every day. It's not the newbies' fault.I think you're trying to do the impossible. To use an analogy, you are trying to build a 200 MPH Ferrari that has an attachment that can plow snow off a mountain road. You need to choose one or the other, or build separate "garages" -- a section for "regular" forum discussion and another for "elite" writing.

The Plow: The average sports forum user wants to read about their peers' opinions on yesterday's match, their favorite and least-favorite players, the manager, opponents, transfers and so on.  They want moderators who will let things flow pretty freely, so long as the truly annoying 3% of trolls and idiots are reprimanded or banned. They accept that there will be some emotional posts after losses, some not-so-intelligent posts, etc. but accept that as part of the deal. They want to share banter as they would at a friend's home or the pub. If supporters don't think Kenny is doing a good job, they want to be able to discuss that or some other emotional flashpoint.  Every football fan in the world is speculating about transfers right now, but no, we can't have that on RAWK unless you fill out a form in triplicate, have it stamped by the Queen, and approved unanimously by the Supreme Court of RAWK on the first full moon of the month -- I'm exaggerating but most posters here get my point. RAWK locks threads in an instant and denies the very banter that 80% of site visitors want. There are many excellent sports forums that do not have the heavy lockdown hammer of RAWK, and yes, they are every bit as good as RAWK. This is a FORUM not a 3rd Level Poetry course at a university....which leads me to...

The Ferrari: Have a subforum that encourages elite-level writing. I know, I know, you already sorta kinda have that. But REALLY separate the "plow" forum from the "Ferrari" writing. Have one "Ferrari" subforum that is heavily moderated (a bit more heavily moderated than the main forum now). Let RAWK's best writers flourish there. If someone keeps posting in this subforum but continually fails to meet the higher standard, suspend their posting privileges to this subforum while allowing them to keep posting in the "plow" subforum. Moderators should encourage the forum's better writers to use the "Ferrari" subforum while simultaneously loosening the grip a bit on the current main forum. Give the forum's best writers special avatar badges as rewards for their ever-increasing great work in their subforum.
 Again, stop trying to Frankenstein two forums into one. Build separate subforums and make them very distinct. If you don't, you'll continue to confuse newbies, and continue to frustrate the "average" posters with your constant thread-locking, and continue to frustrate your most articulate posters by having their efforts buried in amongst "lesser" posts.

Good luck. 

I agree with everything he said, think template of this and bit more fair moderating will help.

[harleydanger]

but also, from my experience, letting a forum grow organically is the only way a forum is sustainable, but i'm not sure this would be the case here with the melodramatic undercurrent threatening to sweep all intelligence before it

[shelovesyou]

I got banned a few days ago for posting in a thread, my comment was a tad crude but I had not read the entire thread, where in it was a post from a mod who warned about being crude or silly.

So my point is, if you havent read the warning, how are you meant to know about it ?


BTW, I love this place, its the first place I come most days, Infact i spend too much time here. But fair play to those who make it happen.

[Red Reign]

I got banned a few days ago for posting in a thread, my comment was a tad crude but I had not read the entire thread, where in it was a post from a mod who warned about being crude or silly.

So my point is, if you havent read the warning, how are you meant to know about it ?


BTW, I love this place, its the first place I come most days, Infact i spend too much time here. But fair play to those who make it happen.

Well, just read every post before posting. All 40 pages worth. 

[Kashinoda]

Not really chipping in with any insight here, but people who insult players, members of the club or other posters should receive an instant suspension. It happens far too fucking often, especially recently.

'Downing is fucking shit, get rid'

Should be 'Downing isn't performing near the level we'd expect, if he isn't to improve then perhaps we should look at brining someone else in.'