Author Topic: Newcastle - RIP Jamal Khashoggi; Free Salma al-Shehab  (Read 1916587 times)

Offline bird_lfc

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13920 on: July 2, 2019, 10:25:50 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48831519 - his move to China is confirmed. It's an unlikely move for him, but good luck Rafa!

I wonder if we get an individual Rafa thread in the former players forum now so we can pretend to stop giving a shit about Newcastle

Offline Keita Success

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13921 on: July 2, 2019, 10:29:21 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48831519 - his move to China is confirmed. It's an unlikely move for him, but good luck Rafa!
I love Rafa, but you can't cite footballing reasons as why you leave a club, then go to China.

Offline Indomitable_Carp

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13922 on: July 2, 2019, 12:15:21 pm »
The problem with Chinese football is that it's a basket case awash with mercenaries. The general public is fairly apathetic to it, while most owners either use it to enhance political influence or as a marketing tool for their corporate interests. No high profile manager has been able to come to China and enhance his reputation (Magath, Scolari, Pellegrini, AVB). The money's about the only thing going for it, which attracts a certain personality understandably. I guess I was too deluded to contemplate that Rafa could be in that category. Nothing wrong with it, of course, but it does banish naive idealism.

I don't buy Rafa needed time away from Europe, he's 59 and should be in the prime of his career. Furthermore, it makes a mockery of the idea of him wanting to live close to his daughters. There's likely to be a vacancy at Derby in a few weeks, which he could have jumped at if he wanted. No, this smacks of a person who is conflicted about his professional objectives.

Okay no one is going to scoff at £12 million. But to say it is the only thing about working in China doesn't really ring true either. Maybe he fancies the idea of living in one of the worlds largest and most fascinating countries for a couple of years? That's not to be scoffed at either.

Of course in football terms it is not a good move. But it's not like he's going there to die.


« Last Edit: July 2, 2019, 12:17:21 pm by Indomitable_Carp »

Offline Paully

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13923 on: July 2, 2019, 12:35:06 pm »
Mike Ashley - c*nt


Rafa Benítez: I lost trust at Newcastle. If those in charge had my ambition, I would still be there

Rafa Benítez tells George Caulkin that he is leaving Newcastle United to manage in China because the owner Mike Ashley’s desire to keep him had waned.


He is not a demonstrative person, but there is a moment — just a moment — when his eyes mist and his voice cracks. It is time to say farewell and it is not easy after three years of adoration and toil, of pushing a dysfunctional club to be better. Rafa Benítez cannot push any more, not against the immovable object that is Mike Ashley’s Newcastle United and so he has to go, but this was never what he wanted.

Before too long, he will be analysing and explaining again, but this man of obsessional detail is also flesh. He hurts. A couple of messages from Newcastle supporters are read out to him, explaining how he made them “feel part of something good for the first time in ages”, that his being at St James’ Park meant “all hope wasn’t lost”. He winces. There is a little cough. “Very emotional,” he says.

Benítez, 59, will forever be associated with Liverpool, but a manager who hoarded trophies at Anfield, Valencia, Inter Milan, Chelsea and Napoli, felt a ferocious, yearning love at Newcastle. He could not keep a fractured team in the Premier League following his appointment in March 2016, but he hauled them back as champions and then, with limited resources, kept them there twice. He was worshipped for it.

Leaving is a wrench. “I’m sad,” he says, “because Newcastle has been my home. If Liverpool is where my family live, then Newcastle will always be my other home. You can sell a house, but you can never sell home. To have that connection with a city and fans, it’s strange and difficult to lose that. I feel like an honorary Geordie now.”

Benítez’s contract at Newcastle, for so long such a source of angst, expired last night; his reluctant departure has sparked a guttural howl from fans. By now he will be in the Far East, where he is set to join Dalian Yifang of the Chinese Super League, which just goes to show how quickly football can pivot. In transit, he spoke to The Times for his only interview.

It still feels extraordinary that Benítez, who had last been seen at Real Madrid, turned up at Newcastle. Amid the permafrost of Ashley’s ownership — calamitous miscalculations, limited ambition — the Spaniard arrived talking stature and possibility, persuading a disillusioned fanbase to believe again, to think differently about their club. His recommitment to them following relegation forged an unbreakable bond.

On the day their demotion was confirmed, St James’ was alive with optimism; Newcastle thrashed Tottenham Hotspur 5-1 and Benítez was implored to stay. “That atmosphere . . . I will always remember it,” he says. “That was a key point in my decision. Everything we shared has been fantastic. I have to praise the amazing players who grew and fought with us, the brilliant staff, everyone involved.

“In your career, you come to understand that football is a business, so you have to be professional, but sometimes it’s about the relationship with fans. I was lucky to have that in Valencia and Tenerife, in Napoli and Liverpool, and Newcastle was the same. In our bad runs, it meant I could stay calm and do my job. They were behind us. It is difficult to say goodbye, to say goodbye to that feeling.

“I have just a . . . not regret, but a little bit of disappointment that I couldn’t go higher. I’m really pleased with what we did with the resources we had, with all the things around — everybody knows it’s not easy — but I’m just disappointed we couldn’t achieve more, that we couldn’t compete and reach the real potential of this fantastic club.”

More than anything, the P word explains why Benítez came to Newcastle and why he has gone. “What I said from day one is what I still feel — I can see the potential of the team, the club, the city, the fans,” he says. “You cannot go away from home and take 9,000 fans without that potential. It means there’s something big there, something really important, as long as you manage it properly.

“I wanted to stay, 100 per cent. I wanted to develop a project, to be competitive, to compete in the cups and to be as close as possible to the top of the league, but you have to have the tools. If you don’t, then you suffer, because you’re at the bottom of the table, every point is massive and you know that a mistake could mean relegation. That would be a disaster for the whole city.

“That responsibility, the fact we were suffering in every game just to get a draw, is something I couldn’t manage for another three years. I couldn’t stay there just to be bottom. It wasn’t my idea when I went to Newcastle. The idea was the top ten, top eight and then maybe try for Europe later on. If the people at the top of the club had the same ideas, I would still be there.”

Benítez is not bitter. He does not want a war with Ashley or Lee Charnley, Newcastle’s managing director. “If I start talking about every problem we had, then it will be wasting energy,” he says. “It is not a time to criticise, but a time to analyse.” Yet some clarification is needed, if only to address the saddest thing at all; how Benítez can be leaving when nobody wished it (or so they say).

When Benítez was appointed, the club’s unofficial mantra was “what Rafa wants, Rafa gets”, but from his first January transfer window, when the manager pressed for a signing to help ensure promotion, he encountered roadblocks. Each trading period provoked spikes of tension, but not because he was asking for a fortune; when he wanted action, he met delay and obfuscation. It was exhausting.

“People talk about power, money and control, but it wasn’t about that,” he says. “It was about doing things right. At Newcastle, we didn’t have the money the top sides had, so the first or second choice targets were really important because the third or fourth ones would be worse and worse and then you lose something. You work so hard to prepare for your signings and then you have to move quickly to get them. Sometimes we weren’t doing that.”

Benítez reaches back into his own past. “When I was at Napoli, Juventus were winning everything, but we won two trophies,” he says. “Why? The resources we had meant we could compete and the relationship with the technical director, the chairman, the financial director was good. We won the Italian Cup and the Italian Super Cup and made a lot of money in the market. If you have this confidence, belief and trust, then normally you will be successful.”

So trust had gone at Newcastle? “Yes,” he says. “We didn’t have that, so I had to choose.” Does he believe that Ashley and Charnley were eager for him to carry on? “Obviously, I had the feeling they were really pleased for me to stay at the beginning, but later on, when we had different views in terms of how to move forward, I couldn’t see this support,” he says. “I couldn’t see this clear desire I could feel at the beginning.”

The club would claim otherwise. In their statement last Monday, Newcastle said they “worked hard to extend Rafa’s contract over a significant period of time”, yet the two sides conversed in different languages. When Charnley made his initial approach, Benítez was fretting about a lack of signings; he was baffled by the timing. As months elapsed, confusion and frustration became entrenched.

The nub of it was about emotional and financial investment. During Ashley’s 12 years, the club’s infrastructure has not been enhanced to a meaningful extent. It was something Benítez thought vital. “When I came to Newcastle, they gave me the plans for the new training ground, I was talking to the architect about changing a few things,” he says, smiling now. “And after three years . . . they painted the walls.

“If you want to attract players, it’s about the facilities, the contract, the city, the way you treat them, the way you treat the agents. If you want to keep them happy, you keep improving. If you want to have a good atmosphere, a real bond, you have to give players the right facilities for when they hang around together. We had that at a lot of clubs. It’s just the way.”

Was Benítez asking too much? Did he demand £100 million to spend this summer, as has been reported? “I didn’t ask for any money,” he says. “I just wanted to know how much [there was]. The club put out some information about the budget being around £50 million plus the money from sales and that was fine. I wasn’t complaining. I knew it was the reality. It was about managing the budget you have — that was the key.

“I knew from day one that you could not compete against the top six, that you cannot spend £100 million every year. But to have a chance, to compete in cup competitions, to be closer to the top, where Newcastle deserve to be, you have to do things really well. The reason I wasn’t happy was because we weren’t competing. We could have done more with the resources we had.”

Even so, at the end of last season, with Newcastle safe again and his contract ticking down, Benítez believed there could still be a satisfactory compromise. He met Ashley and Charnley at the London headquarters of Flannels, one of the owner’s other companies. “I was expecting we would finish the meeting and everything would be done,” he says. “That was my thought. I thought I would be staying.

“Common sense says you’ve been successful on the pitch, you’d reached the target the club wanted which was to stay in the Premier League and the same in terms of business — they’d made a profit. Any owner would surely say, ‘okay, on and off the pitch, you’ve delivered, so this will be an easy conversation’ and then you try to finalise the details. And it was not like that.”

A one-year extension seemed an obvious solution, giving both sides wriggle-room, but when, as requested, he told Newcastle what it would take for him to sign, there was no response (it had been a similar story in the spring). Days went by, momentum drained. When an offer finally came, it was on the same £6 million salary (less than offered in earlier talks), with enhanced bonuses but less control over incoming signings. None of it felt like a club straining to keep him.

With various groups negotiating to buy the club, Newcastle’s takeover saga did not help. “It was a big problem,” Benítez says. “In terms of my decision, I was waiting and I was asking for clarity and, like the fans, we didn’t know. Eventually, you have to decide. I could not continue in the same way, because I couldn’t see how to progress. It had to be clear to me — who was the owner, what would they do — and it wasn’t clear at any time.”

Benítez sent Charnley an email; there would be no deal. The reply, which explained that Newcastle would now pursue other managers, arrived last Monday, moments before the release of the club’s official statement, about which he was given no warning. “I knew I was leaving,” he says. “I had been clear in what I’d said to them. But it was the fact they didn’t say, ‘okay, we understand that and we’re putting out a statement’. It was a simple thing they could have done.”

There has been no further contact from Ashley. “No. But he didn’t do it during the three years anyway,” Benítez says. “I didn’t have a problem with Mike Ashley because he wasn’t around; maybe I met him four or five times.”

Where Benítez excelled was in making an untethered club bind around him. He ventured into the community, donating money and time to charities, often without publicity. He made players better. “We could see how Jamaal Lascelles was coming from a young defender to a proper centre half,” he says. “You could see Paul Dummett doing the same, Isaac Hayden, Ayoze Pérez, all of them growing so much.” Tactically, he drilled them to beat superior teams.

The crushing part of all this is that so much of the club — world-class manager, devoted supporters, willing players — was aligned. It gave fans hope. The thought of what might have been is difficult to bear, but Newcastle’s potential will forever be stunted with Ashley in situ and Benítez cannot wait. He has another plane to catch, another project to obsess over.

There is one more thing; Benítez has accepted an honorary life membership of the Newcastle United Supporters Trust. “Your friends in those messages...” he says. “Newcastle is what they’ve had since they were kids. They must continue to support it. Their commitment, their passion has been so good for me. I tell them ‘thank you very much, you are in my heart’. Hopefully they will be successful and, you never know, maybe we will see each other again in the future.”





Offline Clayton Bigsby

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13924 on: July 2, 2019, 12:48:31 pm »
I love Rafa, but you can't cite footballing reasons as why you leave a club, then go to China.

Yep.

Sorry but Rafa with this move is a capital M

Online CraigDS

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13925 on: July 2, 2019, 12:53:38 pm »
I don’t think you can link the two.

He left as he wasn’t being given the backing and I imagine was fed up being at loggerheads with another club owner. He’s had enough of that I expect.

Not sure you can question that, as he’s clearly going to be backed at the new club and I imagine won’t have the same difficulties he has recently experienced.

I’d also be surprised if he doesn’t have a release clause in case another European job comes up.

Offline El Lobo

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13926 on: July 2, 2019, 12:57:19 pm »
I love Rafa, but you can't cite footballing reasons as why you leave a club, then go to China.

Um....you can
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

Offline Ziltoid

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13927 on: July 2, 2019, 01:29:11 pm »

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13928 on: July 2, 2019, 01:36:27 pm »
I'd like to see people here turn down a £12m salary (probably more!) per year to manage in China for a season or two.

That £24m will secure him and his family for life and he'll then have a another good 5-10 years in him to manage clubs in Europe. He'll always be a wanted manager.

Offline sms1986

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13929 on: July 2, 2019, 01:39:56 pm »
Ooops, Pube Paws has stuck his oar in

https://twitter.com/richardajkeys/status/1145796287339610113

Why do people respond to him on Twitter knowing that he's trying to wind people up? He's an attention-seeker who doesn't care how he looks as long as he gets attention.

Offline Phil M

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13930 on: July 2, 2019, 01:41:30 pm »
It's true to say that if Shankly had told us to invade Poland we'd be queuing up 10 deep all the way from Anfield to the Pier Head.

Offline Ziltoid

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13931 on: July 2, 2019, 01:43:16 pm »
I know, but i do love the replies he gets.

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13932 on: July 2, 2019, 01:59:15 pm »
Ooops, Pube Paws has stuck his oar in

https://twitter.com/richardajkeys/status/1145796287339610113


Quote
ɴᴏᴛᴏʀɪᴏᴜꜱ ꜰᴏʀ ɴᴏᴡᴛ
‏ @LostBoy180
16h16 hours ago
Replying to @richardajkeys

It's in China, Richard. You should visit next year as it's the year of the creepy hairy handed noncey womble.
My cup, it runneth over, I'll never get my fill

Offline bird_lfc

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13933 on: July 2, 2019, 02:38:14 pm »
Why do people respond to him on Twitter knowing that he's trying to wind people up? He's an attention-seeker who doesn't care how he looks as long as he gets attention.

I don’t know but it’s fun to read - some of the replies are gold

Offline sinnermichael

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13934 on: July 2, 2019, 07:52:46 pm »
Sounds like Perez is off to Leicester. The exodus begins.

Offline redgriffin73

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13935 on: July 2, 2019, 08:27:52 pm »


Fucking hell! :lmao

There's some amazing replies to that tweet.
Rafa Benitez: "I'll always keep in my heart the good times I've had here, the strong and loyal support of the fans in the tough times and the love from Liverpool. I have no words to thank you enough for all these years and I am very proud to say that I was your manager. Thank you so much once more and always remember: You'll never walk alone."

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13936 on: July 2, 2019, 08:55:39 pm »
Ooops, Pube Paws has stuck his oar in

https://twitter.com/richardajkeys/status/1145796287339610113
this man lives and works in Qatar?

Sounds like Perez is off to Leicester. The exodus begins.
cant blame them

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13937 on: July 2, 2019, 09:08:12 pm »
I love Rafa, but you can't cite footballing reasons as why you leave a club, then go to China.

Talk about missing the point.

Offline thegoodfella

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13938 on: July 2, 2019, 09:18:14 pm »
Who needs the stress of managing through another relegation dogfight. Good on Rafa to take the money for what is an easier job and somewhat of a vacation.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13939 on: July 3, 2019, 09:31:00 pm »
Those replies are gold,Keys is a seriously disliked man and rightly so.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13940 on: July 3, 2019, 09:51:42 pm »
Why do people respond to him on Twitter knowing that he's trying to wind people up? He's an attention-seeker who doesn't care how he looks as long as he gets attention.

aye, but some of those replies are magic.

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AHA!

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13942 on: July 3, 2019, 10:03:03 pm »
:lmao

https://mobile.twitter.com/jakchap89/status/1145797738531119104

That one got me.
Quote
You should know your way around a chinese you fat thunderbird

 :lmao
If your moral compass is Piers Moron then I ask you to think whether someone who oversaw illegal phone hacking and published fake pictures depicting War Crimes is an appropriate person to look up to. In fact, I'd suggest you're a bit of a c*nt.

Offline princeoftherocks

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13943 on: July 3, 2019, 10:11:57 pm »
Literally crying with all the banter
dios esta buena

Offline Gerry Attrick

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13944 on: July 3, 2019, 10:46:17 pm »
“At least he doesn’t have to shave his hands twice a day”

:lmao :lmao :lmao

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13945 on: July 3, 2019, 11:09:34 pm »
Literally crying with all the banter

Fuck me :lmao
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Offline Skeeve

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitez on his way
« Reply #13946 on: July 4, 2019, 03:42:28 am »
Why do people respond to him on Twitter knowing that he's trying to wind people up? He's an attention-seeker who doesn't care how he looks as long as he gets attention.

Does it really count as being wound up by him if 95% or more of the comments in that thread are mocking his idiocy, hypocrisy or abiding love for Mike Ashley though?  :o

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13947 on: July 4, 2019, 08:50:24 am »
I'd like to see people here turn down a £12m salary (probably more!) per year to manage in China for a season or two.

That £24m will secure him and his family for life and he'll then have a another good 5-10 years in him to manage clubs in Europe. He'll always be a wanted manager.
first line true, second line though,, do you think the Benitez family is short of money?

He was paid well by a number of teams over the years and im sure Real Madrid, Inter and us had to pay him off to sack him
yer ma should have called you Paolo Zico Gerry Socrates HELLRAZOR

Offline Black Bull Nova

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13948 on: July 4, 2019, 08:53:35 pm »
Barcodes will be made up

First
Benitez


Now
Perez, £30m

And I'll bet Ashley has put the price of the club up as well after those removals
aarf, aarf, aarf.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13949 on: July 4, 2019, 09:15:21 pm »
I love Rafa, but you can't cite footballing reasons as why you leave a club, then go to China.

He probably sees China as a job, whereas, same as here, he got the people in Newcastle and wanted to build something for them. It must be soul destroying to have the backing he had and have an owner who is a twat.
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Offline Black Bull Nova

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13950 on: July 4, 2019, 09:35:06 pm »
He probably sees China as a job, whereas, same as here, he got the people in Newcastle and wanted to build something for them. It must be soul destroying to have the backing he had and have an owner who is a twat.

Adventure?
aarf, aarf, aarf.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13951 on: July 5, 2019, 09:29:58 am »
Newcastle can now go back to the championship.
Believer

Offline Phil M

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13952 on: July 5, 2019, 09:55:25 am »
Newcastle can now go back to the championship.

Very glad that we have a great owner. I feel for Newcastle.
It's true to say that if Shankly had told us to invade Poland we'd be queuing up 10 deep all the way from Anfield to the Pier Head.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13953 on: July 7, 2019, 07:01:55 pm »

'Former Newcastle manager Rafa Benitez gets off to perfect start as manager of Dalian Yifang':-

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/former-newcastle-manager-rafa-benitez-16545465

^ love the bit about coaching his daughter's school team, and if he's not coaching his missus would tell him to go away :) Seems they may be in for Rondon too...
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Offline God's Left Peg

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13954 on: July 7, 2019, 08:54:48 pm »
"The socialism I believe in is everybody working for the same goal and everybody having a share in the rewards. That's how I see football, that's how I see life."

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13955 on: July 8, 2019, 04:44:00 am »
He made his mind up in May apparently. I wouldn't turn the money down either but please let's not dress this up as anything but what it is. A cash grab. This Chinese team finished midtable last year so not like he is gonna
add something on his cv

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13956 on: July 8, 2019, 08:11:00 am »
Don't blame him for this particular cash grab

No decent PL teams are looking for a manager right now, and the ones that will be in November will be doing so because their season is a write-off.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13957 on: July 8, 2019, 08:32:25 am »
He made his mind up in May apparently. I wouldn't turn the money down either but please let's not dress this up as anything but what it is. A cash grab. This Chinese team finished midtable last year so not like he is gonna
add something on his cv

It’s a job.

Footballers and managers aren’t the same. Footballers can’t take a year out, go and be a pundit for six months, go and doss in China for megabucks without it hurting their career. Managers can.
If he's being asked to head the ball too frequently - which isn't exactly his specialty - it could affect his ear and cause an infection. Especially if the ball hits him on the ear directly.

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13958 on: July 8, 2019, 08:59:24 am »
Don't blame him for this particular cash grab

No decent PL teams are looking for a manager right now, and the ones that will be in November will be doing so because their season is a write-off.

Nor do I. I'm an accountant by trade and believe you me if somebody offered me triple my wage to go to China for a year or so, I'd be off in a heartbeat. But I'm a mercenary, since start of 2018.

I don't begrudge the payday at all

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Re: General Newcastle United thread - Benitezless
« Reply #13959 on: July 8, 2019, 09:20:28 am »
It's a busman's holiday for Rafa, that's all. After decades of dealing with shit owners this is probably more productive (and profitable) than a sabbatical.

Was this takeover ever really serious? Seems more like it was a con job on Ashley's part to try and get Rafa to sign onto a new deal.  Bit like how Everton would leek stadium "news" around the time season tickets were due.
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