Topic: "Green and Gold, it's O5e from Molde!" - Cornering like a reliant robin..

[CraigDS]

They should sign Chico.

He used to play for them didn’t he?

[El Lobo]

They should sign Chico. He looked like Luis Garcia.

[Uncle Ronnie]

L'equipe saying Pogba could be out for 4 weeks.

I’m starting to wonder if his ankle injury is similar to Coutinho’s back injury.

[Kekule]

L'equipe saying Pogba could be out for 4 weeks.

A chronic bout of can’t-be-arseditis.  Apparently he’s been suffering from it for a couple of years now, but it’s really taken hold since the summer. 

In these severe cases the patient generally needs to move to a warmer climate and/or get given £150,000 a week extra in order to make a return to health.  A full recovery is rarely achieved, though they might have short term improvements for a month in the summer every two years,  but long term the prognosis is usually fairly bleak.

[rob1966]

Finally their poor start makes sense. The new series of X Factor hasn't started yet. Once it's finished in a few months, they'll have found the new stars they need and we'll all be singing a different tune

Simon Cowell and Sharon Osbourne will see them right

See, they can't even get that right. Its been binned this year, instead its a celebrity wanna be famous no marks version, so they'll end up with worse than what they have

[afc tukrish]

See, they can't even get that right. Its been binned this year, instead its a celebrity wanna be famous no marks version, so they'll end up with worse than what they have

Pogba metaphor...

[johnny74]

I didn't follow anything about them this week, any chance they are sacking Ole or they give him time until summer?

Well since they have us coming up they will need the new manager bounce.

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

Genuine question:

How have Man Utd's youth teams been doing recently? Won the FA Youth Cup last few years? U18s? U23s?

There seems to be this overriding consensus that if they put faith in youth now, it'll reap benefits later. This idea that the "Class of 92" is just one group from a long line of famed Utd academy graduates, or that Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, Busquets, Pique, Pedro were only good because they were given the chance in the first team. Excepting the young Beanz, when was the last time these lot brought a world class player through their academy? What makes them so confident Greenwood, Chong, Gomes, etc are going to set the world alight?

[Mozology]

Pogba broken toe rumour, any truth to it, or the usual Utd "injury scare" shite they used to pull with Rooney all the time before a big game.

[mkingdon]

Pogba broken toe rumour, any truth to it, or the usual Utd "injury scare" shite they used to pull with Rooney all the time before a big game.

Christ, I hope he plays. The prospect of our front six taking the ball off him seventeen times in each half as he attempts his third step over and/or rabona just outside his own penalty area......

[classycarra]

Christ, I hope he plays. The prospect of our front six taking the ball off him seventeen times in each half as he attempts his third step over and/or rabona just outside his own penalty area......

I'd rather play Matic or Fred really. I guess it will be Perreira and one of them plus McTominay

[Mozology]

I'd rather play Matic or Fred really.

Exactly, without Pogba they've no creativity whatsoever from midfield.

Would love Martial to miss out as well.

[rob1966]

Genuine question:

How have Man Utd's youth teams been doing recently? Won the FA Youth Cup last few years? U18s? U23s?

There seems to be this overriding consensus that if they put faith in youth now, it'll reap benefits later. This idea that the "Class of 92" is just one group from a long line of famed Utd academy graduates, or that Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, Busquets, Pique, Pedro were only good because they were given the chance in the first team. Excepting the young Beanz, when was the last time these lot brought a world class player through their academy? What makes them so confident Greenwood, Chong, Gomes, etc are going to set the world alight?

Their U23s play in Premier League 2 Division 2 and are second, the u18's are 8th on 9pts, we are 2nd on 16pts

[Bobinhood]

They should sign Chico. He looked like Luis Garcia.

Juanita and Juan
Very clever with Maraca's
they're making their fortunes
selling second hand tobaccos

Juan dances at Chico's
and when the clients are evicted
He empty's the ashtrays
and pockets all that hes collected

[Magix]

Wan-Bissaka for £50 million is a recruitment brainchild? For £15 million maybe. The same £50 million which got them quoted for a similar number when they tried for Longstaff as a result.

[classycarra]

Humble and arrogant is just the best thing. It's basically cognitive dissonance for United's identity going back to the early Ferguson years. It's a way of saying 'yeah I know he comes across arrogant and a bit of a c*nt but honestly when noone else is around and noone's looking he's actually lovely'. So few of their good players come across as remotely humble.

Still, those buzz words explain the Fred signing. Mate has met him and said he's really lovely and they talked for ages about Brazil. Humble - tick. But then he thought he could get away with doping. Arrogant - tick. Who cares about how good he is at the football

[surfer. Fuck you generator.]

Something a bit different...

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/PEwMi4MwULA" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/PEwMi4MwULA</a>

What struck me, watching that, was just how much autonomy the players had to figure things out themselves. What Giggs says in terms of making decisions to find space, the movements to fake one way, then the other, the communication with teammates close by on the type of pass and runs... a lot of these things are instructed these days. Not because coaches are dictators now, it's just that the game is at a higher tactical level, opponents are as fit as they can be, drilled, without that planning you'll get bypassed and choked out of space, the space which was just that bit easier to manufacture back then; you've already seen clashes this season, notably involving Newcastle (where Bruce still seems to adhere to what Giggs was describing in terms of autonomy) where the opponents Brighton, Leicester and Norwich looked like they were playing a different sport.

Ferguson was clearly mostly a manager, with limited input as a coach, going by the description of the game mechanics of his own player here. Worked well for Ferguson obviously when they could have the best players and assistant coaches of that era, both in terms of quality and game understanding. Where the game is now, you could have the best players, but without a top coach in the hot-seat, not merely a manager but a coach, you won't be anywhere near where your structural level dictates you should be imo.

Edit: I actually don't recall Giggs mentioning Ferguson once in the entire 12 minutes of that analysis! At most I may have missed one mention or two, no more.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Something a bit different...

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/PEwMi4MwULA" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/PEwMi4MwULA</a>

What struck me, watching that, was just how much autonomy the players had to figure things out themselves. What Giggs says in terms of making decisions to find space, the movements to fake one way, then the other, the communication with teammates close by on the type of pass and runs... a lot of these things are instructed these days. Not because coaches are dictators now, it's just that the game is at a higher tactical level, opponents are as fit as they can be, drilled, without that planning you'll get bypassed and choked out of space, the space which was just that bit easier to manufacture back then; you've already seen clashes this season, notably involving Newcastle (where Bruce still seems to adhere to what Giggs was describing in terms of autonomy) where the opponents Brighton, Leicester and Norwich looked like they were playing a different sport.

Ferguson was clearly mostly a manager, with limited input as a coach, going by the description of the game mechanics of his own player here. Worked well for Ferguson obviously when they could have the best players and assistant coaches of that era, both in terms of quality and game understanding. Where the game is now, you could have the best players, but without a top coach in the hot-seat, not merely a manager but a coach, you won't be anywhere near where your structural level dictates you should be imo.

Edit: I actually don't recall Giggs mentioning Ferguson once in 11 minutes of that analysis! At most I may have missed one mention or two, no more.

It has to be noted, though, that during the week, United's coaches drilled the United team in the triggers they were supposed to know on the field, constantly and according to Ferguson, to a boring level of repetition. Then on the day of the game, they were left free to make decisions on the field according to how they read the game, which gave them the autonomy they needed to express themselves, while also giving them a structure to fall back on when they needed it.

Rafa and Mourinho were the same, but in different ways - Rafa's entire coaching was about making the players think, while also putting opponent-specific organisation in place during the week, and then making in-game adjustments, but ultimately, the players had to think for themselves. Mourinho drills defensive position into the players, but gives them mostly free reign when they get the ball. On the flip side, someone like Hodgson drills every aspect until it becomes second nature, on both sides of the ball, which takes away the creativity of players and leaves them in schtuck when things go wrong (as we all know bitterly from experience).

[surfer. Fuck you generator.]

It has to be noted, though, that during the week, United's coaches drilled the United team in the triggers they were supposed to know on the field, constantly and according to Ferguson, to a boring level of repetition. Then on the day of the game, they were left free to make decisions on the field according to how they read the game, which gave them the autonomy they needed to express themselves, while also giving them a structure to fall back on when they needed it.

Rafa and Mourinho were the same, but in different ways - Rafa's entire coaching was about making the players think, while also putting opponent-specific organisation in place during the week, and then making in-game adjustments, but ultimately, the players had to think for themselves. Mourinho drills defensive position into the players, but gives them mostly free reign when they get the ball. On the flip side, someone like Hodgson drills every aspect until it becomes second nature, on both sides of the ball, which takes away the creativity of players and leaves them in schtuck when things go wrong (as we all know bitterly from experience).

Yeah Utd's defensive structure under Ferguson in their own part of the pitch was never an issue, so at base they always had that to fall back on. I don't recall there being that much organisation to their pressing higher up the pitch nor passing coordination compared to what even second division teams have now. There was an emphasis on short passing at a good tempo and decisive attacking, which, when done using their top players got them winning.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Yeah Utd's defensive structure under Ferguson in their own part of the pitch was never an issue, so at base they always had that to fall back on. I don't recall there being that much organisation to their pressing higher up the pitch nor passing coordination compared to what even second division teams have now. There was an emphasis on short passing at a good tempo and decisive attacking, which, when done using their top players got them winning.

True stuff. But pressing now, and pressing then, were two different things almost entirely, although based on the same principles. In England at least, true pressing like we see now was considered a major component of direct play, and was almost ignored as a result. The coordinated pressing of Barca and Dortmund brought it back "into the light" tactically, but given that throughout the 90s and 2000s, the epitome of good defending was Italian zonal defence, it's not a surprise that this kind of defending was the most promoted on the coaching courses, and thus the style of defending most used by teams in the EPL. English football has the Germans and Spanish/Catalans to thank for reintroducing a defensive structure that the FA was promoting in the 70s and 80s

[Barneylfc∗]

Denis Law. Backheeled them to division 2

With results that day, they were down regardless of the result against City. They could've won the game but would still have been relegated so Law's goal made no difference.

[beardsleyismessimk1]

With results that day, they were down regardless of the result against City. They could've won the game but would still have been relegated so Law's goal made no difference.

Lets hope jonney Evans goal doesn't matter either

[rob1966]

With results that day, they were down regardless of the result against City. They could've won the game but would still have been relegated so Law's goal made no difference.

Sssshhhh!!!!   Takes the fun away

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/e8HQhV3ujyg" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/e8HQhV3ujyg</a>

[Stussy]

they're gonna get relegated on purpose if we win the league to try and take attention from us

[CHOPPER]

[CHOPPER]

[DaveLFC]

they're gonna get relegated on purpose if we win the league to try and take attention from us

They wouldn't dare.

[redgriffin73]

they're gonna get relegated on purpose if we win the league to try and take attention from us

Oh no, how would we ever cope?!

[FiSh77]

I'm getting the word.............

[PaulF]

Sssshhhh!!!!   Takes the fun away

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/e8HQhV3ujyg" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/e8HQhV3ujyg</a>

Wow, we don't get to see a clip of the goal repeated from 9 different angles and in slow-mo. Good job I have a rewind button.
I hope Bobby's watching. That's the ultimate no-look goal!

[Henry Kissinger]

I'm getting the word.............

Does it begin with n?

[Ziltoid]

I'm getting the word Pogba

[Hazell]

[PaulF]

That's ridiculous. Bournemouth in there but not wolves?

[Medellin]

[beardsleyismessimk1]

Mind games?

[Bobinhood]

That just leaves the door wide open and you can be sure BetFred is on the phone as we speak.

[Son of Spion]

I went for lunch with a friend today. Her husband supports United and she supports Everton.

She wasn't much up for talking football. 

[harleydanger]

L'equipe saying Pogba could be out for 4 weeks.

Jammy fucks, everything goes right for them just as they’re about to play us

[newterp]

That just leaves the door wide open and you can be sure BetFred is on the phone as we speak.

BetFred? Ok - I bet Fred won a lottery to play for ManU.

I bet Fred isn’t even Brazilian.

I bet Fred Flintstone would do better in United’s midfield.

Etc.