Topic: Match Preview: EFL Cup Leicester v Liverpool FC @ the King Power 19/9/17 7.45

[Nessy76]

Would like to have seen Markovic get a run out tonight but am not holding my breath. Really don't understand LFC's' stance on him, he cost £20m, probably at least another £10m in wages over the life of his contract so £30m all in but we don't either sell him or play him in cup games. At least if we gave him some time in the league cup, it would be a shop window for the January transfer window. Personally I rate him and am still hoping he may come good for us one day but I know I am in a small minority on RAWK.  Anyway, I would have thought that the first round of a completion we don't care that much about would be an ideal time to play him.

What's so hard to understand? Nobody wanted to buy him off us for what we wanted for him. Why does everything have to be some great mystery?

[Nessy76]

Yeah, being able to offer huge petro-dollar contracts or CL football is one thing but what really gets the players and super agents going is a League Cup victory.

Deliberately setting out to lose games, that's what players look for in a club, right?

[peachybum]

Deliberately setting out to lose games, that's what players look for in a club, right?

Who has ever done that?

[Nessy76]

Who has ever done that?

It's what some here are calling for.

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

It's what some here are calling for.

Staggering, isn't it. Do people not see how winning a trophy will increase the confidence of the squad and take any pressure off the manager.

[Nessy76]

Staggering, isn't it. Do people not see how winning a trophy will increase the confidence of the squad and take any pressure off the manager.

Fair bet that if we do go out of this tonight, the exact same crowd will be using it as a stick to beat him with later in the season.

[JackWard33]

Surely winning a trophy/some trophies is the main aim of being a football club  . At least that's what I've been led to believe over the decades. Maybe I've been misled somewhere along the line.

The main aim of this specific football club is not to win the League Cup no.
That's somewhere around 6th or 7th in our list of aims

If the aim of the club was to win trophies regardless of standing, cost or reward we should just enter more competitions including every preseason competition with a trophy going.

We can all at least accept that's its a nuanced debate can't we rather than a black and white one?
(having said that if it was up to me I wouldn't enter the crappy anachronism of a tournament in the first place so I'm not the best person to discuss it..... wait can we not enter it or is it compulsory?... its probably compulsory right - or there'd be 6 teams not in it)

[ryatnalkar]

If we were off a flyer in the league and beat Sevilla by a few goals and got a draw at City, yes, we could choose to ignore this game a bit and only play youngsters. However, if we lose this, media will be cranking up pressure for our next 3 games which are all away.

IMO Nothing in football is about next 6 months or a year or anything. Its the last 2 games and the next 2 games. And based off of last 2 games, we really need to get a win here.

[JackWard33]

Deliberately setting out to lose games, that's what players look for in a club, right?

Whose advocating that seriously?

I'd happily win it. Just not with our first team players involved.
And... even though I'd rather the competition didn't exist - it does and LFC will be playing so I'll still be going mental at the TV tonight and hoping we win.

[epsomred]

What's so hard to understand? Nobody wanted to buy him off us for what we wanted for him. Why does everything have to be some great mystery?

I dont understand why we spend £30m on a player (fee plus wages) but then don't play him even in mickey mouse competitions like tonight. If you have some better insight into what the club are doing then please explain as I am really not getting it. Not trying to be difficult.

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

The main aim of this specific football club is not to win the League Cup no.
That's somewhere around 6th or 7th in our list of aims

6th or 7th?

I'll try and guess: 1st PL
                            2nd Cl
                            3rd top 4
                            4th FA cup
                            ?
                            ?
                            7th League cup

No idea what 5 and 6 may be 

[lamonti]

Surely winning a trophy/some trophies is the main aim of being a football club  . At least that's what I've been led to believe over the decades. Maybe I've been misled somewhere along the line.

Great, so we've already won the Premier League Asia Trophy. A successful season.

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

Great, so we've already won the Premier League Asia Trophy. A successful season.

   Proper trophies

[Nessy76]

Whose advocating that seriously?

I'd happily win it. Just not with our first team players involved.
And... even though I'd rather the competition didn't exist - it does and LFC will be playing so I'll still be going mental at the TV tonight and hoping we win.

RayK did a few pages back. And it's clear from the general tone of several posters that they are at least happy to give the impression they want us to lose, even if they don't say it out loud (presumably so they can still bitch about it if and when...)

I dont understand why we spend £30m on a player (fee plus wages) but then don't play him even in mickey mouse competitions like tonight. If you have some better insight into what the club are doing then please explain as I am really not getting it. Not trying to be difficult.

Of course you don't understand that, because that's not what happened, as you well know.
I don't understand why when I go through a door my left bollock swells to the size of a ford cortina. The explanation is much the same: It doesn't.
Making up stupid shit and then saying you don't understand it is pointless behaviour, do us a favour and pack it in, will you?

[Jetmir M.]

I dont understand why we spend £30m on a player (fee plus wages) but then don't play him even in mickey mouse competitions like tonight. If you have some better insight into what the club are doing then please explain as I am really not getting it. Not trying to be difficult.

The manager, who had fuck all to do with signing him does not need him, he is not into his plans. What's there not to get? The club tried to move him on, but no one wanted him for the price quoted.

Just because we paid a lot of money for him doesn't make him a good player. He has done fuck all ever since the move, including loan spells to lesser clubs. He should be nowhere near our matchday squad.

[Nick110581]

We exist to win trophies. The end.

[Djozer]

Whose advocating that seriously?

I'd happily win it. Just not with our first team players involved.
And... even though I'd rather the competition didn't exist - it does and LFC will be playing so I'll still be going mental at the TV tonight and hoping we win.

This pretty much describes exactly how I feel about the competition. It'd be great to win it, but I'd rather play reserves and fringe players if it would increase our chances at the league, which is the competition I feel we should prioritise even if we're unlikely to win it. Obviously any silverware would be great - it's been a while - but I'm not so sure it automatically creates a "winning mentality." Arsenal have won three FA cups in four years and it doesn't appear to have helped them too much, although they may be an outlier here.

I'd love it if we beat Leicester just as I love it when we win any game, but if we lose tonight I'll not be whinging and crying into my hot chocolate. Probably.

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

Arsenal have won three FA cups in four years and it doesn't appear to have helped them too much, although they may be an outlier here.

Except for the fact that they've won 3 trophies in four years. 

[peachybum]

It's what some here are calling for.

I want us to only use our squad players and U23's. But i want them to also win. It's a great development opportunity.

[epsomred]

RayK did a few pages back. And it's clear from the general tone of several posters that they are at least happy to give the impression they want us to lose, even if they don't say it out loud (presumably so they can still bitch about it if and when...)

Of course you don't understand that, because that's not what happened, as you well know.
I don't understand why when I go through a door my left bollock swells to the size of a ford cortina. The explanation is much the same: It doesn't.
Making up stupid shit and then saying you don't understand it is pointless behaviour, do us a favour and pack it in, will you?

Which bit is made up ? We paid £20m for him, he has a 4 year contract worth at least £2m - £3m per year and he's back on the payroll  so thats £30m plus of the club's money pissed away on a player we never play even in mickey mouse competitions like tonight. 

[Zebs]

6th or 7th?

I'll try and guess: 1st PL
                            2nd Cl
                            3rd top 4
                            4th FA cup
                            ?
                            ?
                            7th League cup

No idea what 5 and 6 may be 

Don't forget the draw at home to West Brom trophy.

[Samie]

The fuck you in the Liverpool v Leicester League Cup match thread of all places?

[Djozer]

Except for the fact that they've won 3 trophies in four years. 

Ha! Good point.

I meant in a more holistic sense though - their best players don't want to be there, the relationship between the fans and a legendary manager is near-toxic and I'm not seeing any evidence that these cups have created this "winning mentality" that I hear so much about. Personally I'm happier with where our club is at the minute than theirs (in a general sense - I'm not talking about league position though that too, I suppose) though I can't deny that I'd have loved us to win a few more cups recently than we have.

[Filler.]

Deja vu this thread. Pretty sure the same thing was getting said last year... and in 2015... and in 2014... 2013... 2012... 2011... 2010... 2009... 2008... 2007... 2006... 2005... 2004... 2003... 2002... 2001... 2000... 1999... I mean I could go on...

[JackWard33]

6th or 7th?

I'll try and guess: 1st PL
                            2nd Cl
                            3rd top 4
                            4th FA cup
                            ?
                            ?
                            7th League cup

No idea what 5 and 6 may be 

I'd guess the aims of the club are something like...


1) Win the league

Gap

2) Win the champions league
3) finish in the top 4

Gap

4) Keep our existing standout players and recruit new ones to make 1-3 more likely on a regular basis
5)Maximise club revenues to make 1-3 more likely on a regular basis

 Gap

6) Win the FA cup
7) Win the League cup


Most fans might have 4 and 5 below 6 and 7 but they're probably more important in terms of the standing and success of the club as a whole over the years to come.

I wouldn't do it but you could make the priority of the club to win trophies of any kind. in which case you'd do things differently.

[Nessy76]

Which bit is made up ? We paid £20m for him, he has a 4 year contract worth at least £2m - £3m per year and he's back on the payroll  so thats £30m plus of the club's money pissed away on a player we never play even in mickey mouse competitions like tonight.

So you know his transfer fee and wages, but not the name of the manager who signed him or the fact that man is no longer at the club? Bore off.

[Fromola]

Going into the season I wanted us to go straight out of this because we haven't got the strongest squad and even without Europe a run in this cost us last season with those two semi final games against Southampton. It's a competition that's only worthwhile for a top club if you win it (like the Europa League and even FA Cup these days).

Now though our inertia/naivety in the market has made any hopes of the title distinctly remote and a CL win even less plausible given our defending and lack of control in midfield. Therefore I hope we go for this because I want us to win something.

[alvaro]

The problem with the League Cup is that for some reason Klopp likes to play with a really strong XI in the semifinals when we would be much better off if we gave the fringe players a shot over those 2 legs.

[Fromola]

The problem with the League Cup is that for some reason Klopp likes to play with a really strong XI in the semifinals when we would be much better off if we gave the fringe players a shot over those 2 legs.

And those semi finals come just after the ridiculous Christmas period where the first team have been flogged to death and are physically shot. Especially when we haven't rotated.

[sms1986]

Especially when we haven't rotated.

Which we're doing this season.

[StrawberryFieldsForever]

Any early team news?

[sms1986]

Any early team news?

Coutinho will be starting, I think Ward is as well. So are Grujic and AOC.

"What we already know is that Marko Grujic and Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain are set to start the tie, as is Danny Ward - for his first Reds appearance since May 2016.

Dejan Lovren is expected to be fit after a back complaint last weekend, Jon Flanagan will be part of the squad at a minimum and Danny Ings could be involved having not featured for the U23s last night."

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/match/2017-18/first-team/leicester-city-v-liverpool-league-cup-match-blog

[Samie]

Ahead of the game tonight, some good news. 

Solanke and Gomez shortlisted for European Golden Boy Award: http://lfc.tv/AwBU

[sms1986]

Ahead of the game tonight, some good news. 

Solanke and Gomez shortlisted for European Golden Boy Award: http://lfc.tv/AwBU

Very well deserved nominations for those two.

[Fromola]

Which we're doing this season.

Not really. Out of the midfield and attack Wijnaldum, Henderson, Can, Salah and Mane have all started 7 games this season (out of 8. Firmino 8 out of 8. 

[StrawberryFieldsForever]

Coutinho will be starting, I think Ward is as well. So are Grujic and AOC.

"What we already know is that Marko Grujic and Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain are set to start the tie, as is Danny Ward - for his first Reds appearance since May 2016.

Dejan Lovren is expected to be fit after a back complaint last weekend, Jon Flanagan will be part of the squad at a minimum and Danny Ings could be involved having not featured for the U23s last night."

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/match/2017-18/first-team/leicester-city-v-liverpool-league-cup-match-blog

Cheers 👍

[sms1986]

[sms1986]

Hopefully we'll see an impressive display from that team, especially from the younger players.

[StrawberryFieldsForever]

Hmm...interesting choice that with Henderson back.

[SerbianScouser]

Woodburn really should have started this one.