Author Topic: Coutinho (Read 292348 times)

He's been good but nowhere near good enough to be considered the best player this season. He's still too inconsistent, although I think he's been steadily improving in this regard since he arrived. Right now, he should be aspiring to play at the sort of level Hazard has been at - Lil Phil is more than capable of it, and once he does, he'll be a real contender for this award.

Le_Mot_Juste · « **Reply #46 on:** April 11, 2015, 03:42:16 am »

Premier League's been a bit shite this year in general. I guess Diego Costa or Hazard will win it, but neither have come CLOSE to Suarez of last year, or Bale of the year before.

Although he's a sensational little player, I don't think Coutinho deserves to win it either.
Argument for De Gea - Without him, their absolutely dross football for 99% of the season would've let us into the top 4.
Good argument for Harry Kane

Coutinho's definitely in team of the year though.

Costa Kane
Sanchez Coutinho Matic Hazard
Clichy Fonte Terry Clyne
De Gea

killer-heels · « **Reply #47 on:** April 11, 2015, 07:27:00 am »

No way. He might have been our best player which is a damning indictment to how shit we have been.

wordroam · « **Reply #48 on:** April 11, 2015, 12:26:33 pm »

Quote from: killer_heels on April 11, 2015, 07:27:00 am

No way. He might have been our best player which is a damning indictment to how shit we have been.

Oh come on - we've had a miserable couple of weeks but a fantastic run since Christmas.

I have to admit when I OP'd it was a 'really?!' type question but both the more I think about it and a bit of the contrarian in me finds plenty to admire in Coutinho and not a lot to criticise.

Saw him at Wembley playing for Brazil recently and he did sort of do the 'go missing' thing for spells.

But during that game I started to change my mind.

It was almost as if what was missing was brains in the Brazilian team and he was simply waiting for the team to get a grip. Can't help thinking that maybe whats happened with us this season. He thrived when he's had an intelligent* team around him. Some of the most amazing passes he made last season depended on ridiculous but intelligent expectations from team-mates.

edit: * and by intelligence I mean individually sneaky bastards like Suarez, but also the team as a whole.

aoaaron · « **Reply #49 on:** April 11, 2015, 01:01:24 pm »

Coutinho's start to the season was really poor.

However he's shown the talent he has since Christmas. Could easily be PFA player of the year next year. I'm surprised more clubs aren't circling around him.

Coolie High · « **Reply #50 on:** April 11, 2015, 01:02:26 pm »

Quote from: Severely on April 11, 2015, 03:10:38 am

He's been good but nowhere near good enough to be considered the best player this season. He's still too inconsistent, although I think he's been steadily improving in this regard since he arrived. Right now, he should be aspiring to play at the sort of level Hazard has been at - Lil Phil is more than capable of it, and once he does, he'll be a real contender for this award.

I think he has been a bit inconsistent'

But the whole inconsistent tag does grate me a bit.

Because players who have bad spells in a season are described as inconsistent, when only a select few players can claim to have seasons where they're good from day one to the end.

The likes fo Costa, Fabregas, Aguero, Toure, Sanchez have all had parts in the season where they're form falls short a bit, really no different from Coutionho apart from the fact the rest have other great players in their team who could keep up their standards and ensure their team win points, when Coutinho plays bad, normally Sturridge isn't playing at all, and Sterling is the only other player who could carry the attacking burden.

Solomon Grundy · « **Reply #51 on:** April 11, 2015, 01:08:36 pm »

No chance. Still far too inconsistent as others have already said. I think he needs to be surrounded by better players for him to take it to the next level.

rob1408 · « **Reply #52 on:** April 11, 2015, 01:10:32 pm »

I'd be surprised if he got more than three or four votes. I think he's been our second best player after Skrtel.

jooneyisdagod · « **Reply #53 on:** April 11, 2015, 01:13:13 pm »

He's a player of the year level talent that is still inconsistent at the moment. Think he's our best player after Sturridge though but there are signs for me that he might soon be our best player bar none. He's starting to add consistent goal scoring and his general shooting has improved a fair bit. He just needs to start getting in the box past the striker a bit more and I think he's going to start scoring even more. I get the feeling he's due a breakout season. Hopefully, we can actually make the most of that.

Pidalow · « **Reply #54 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:13:56 pm »

Starting to think Coutinho is our best and most important player.

edge · « **Reply #55 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:22:02 pm »

Reckon De Gea is responsible for the most points won(or, rather, not dropped) by a single player in the entire league. Wondering anyone will consider that.

elpistolero7 · « **Reply #56 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:22:18 pm »

Quote from: Pidalow on April 13, 2015, 10:13:56 pm

Starting to think Coutinho is our best and most important player.

Easily. Sterling and him are the future of this side, 2 players who, if all goes well, will be world class in a couple years time. We currently have 0 world class players, and its why we're sat in fifth.

sinnermichael · « **Reply #57 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:41:56 pm »

https://vine.co/v/OFqeKppgr6L

Kopenhagen · « **Reply #58 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:45:44 pm »

Obviously I'm biased, but I don't there's a better player to watch in the league when in form.

edge · « **Reply #59 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:56:28 pm »

Quote from: Kopenhagen on April 13, 2015, 10:45:44 pm

Obviously I'm biased, but I don't there's a better player to watch in the league when in form.

Sort of agree, but Aguero and Di Maria will probably want a word about that..

Kopenhagen · « **Reply #60 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:57:29 pm »

Quote from: edge on April 13, 2015, 10:56:28 pm

Sort of agree, but Aguero and Di Maria will probably want a word about that..

I enjoy watching Phil more.

edge · « **Reply #61 on:** April 13, 2015, 10:58:01 pm »

Quote from: Kopenhagen on April 13, 2015, 10:57:29 pm

I enjoy watching Phil more.

Same here, just for the sake of argument

Dan6times · « **Reply #62 on:** April 13, 2015, 11:04:55 pm »

Missed the entire game after that back heel, just watched it on loop again and again 😵

Zephyr · « **Reply #63 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:04:34 am »

Definitely. When our Phil is in form he performs the sort of sorcery that Gandelf would marvel at.

Quote from: Kopenhagen on April 13, 2015, 10:45:44 pm

Obviously I'm biased, but I don't there's a better player to watch in the league when in form.

istvan kozma · « **Reply #64 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:37:28 am »

Quote from: edge on April 13, 2015, 10:56:28 pm

Sort of agree, but Aguero and Di Maria will probably want a word about that..

Dree · « **Reply #65 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:39:13 am »

Nowhere near the output or work rate of Hazard, but definitely has the talent. The first 30 were a joy to watch.

JackWard33 · « **Reply #66 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:56:32 am »

Love watching him he's a gem

I may get destroyed for this but does anyone slightly worry about his final third decision making?
It's not like he doesn't have end product - he does - but he also doesn't produce the numbers he could given how much of the ball he gets in the final third.
Maybe it'll improve with time or with better players in front of him but he often seems to delay a simple ball and hold it and still shoots with players in front of him (of course he hit 3 of these recently so it's a harder case to make!!)
His numbers have picked up a lot in the last month or two but until then he wasn't producing the key pass numbers you'd expect him to.

I'd still like to see him play in midfield in a 3 - no idea how effective he'd be but he seems to pass better coming from deep and he'd regain the ball well I think.....

Anyway I'd be interested to know what others think of his final third decision making - he's so good I hope he can get this part of his game to the same level

The Infamous_LFC · « **Reply #67 on:** April 14, 2015, 01:20:07 am »

His dribbling today was amazing. What a honour to have such a footballer playing for us.

I thought Suarez was talented but Coutinho is arguably a way more natural footballer isn't he?

rickardinho1 · « **Reply #68 on:** April 14, 2015, 03:56:36 am »

Quote from: KiNki on April 11, 2015, 02:33:36 am

Less of this

I see PoP has let himself go there a bit over the winter!

rickardinho1 · « **Reply #69 on:** April 14, 2015, 03:59:50 am »

Quote from: JackWard33 on April 14, 2015, 12:56:32 am

Love watching him he's a gem

I may get destroyed for this but does anyone slightly worry about his final third decision making?
It's not like he doesn't have end product - he does - but he also doesn't produce the numbers he could given how much of the ball he gets in the final third.
Maybe it'll improve with time or with better players in front of him but he often seems to delay a simple ball and hold it and still shoots with players in front of him (of course he hit 3 of these recently so it's a harder case to make!!)
His numbers have picked up a lot in the last month or two but until then he wasn't producing the key pass numbers you'd expect him to.

I'd still like to see him play in midfield in a 3 - no idea how effective he'd be but he seems to pass better coming from deep and he'd regain the ball well I think.....

Anyway I'd be interested to know what others think of his final third decision making - he's so good I hope he can get this part of his game to the same level

I find that he's often second guessing himself with the pass/shoot decisions since there's no on-form striker to pass to. If there was a Suarez there that decision would be much easier for him.

Watching the all-touches video of him vs Newcastle is a delight though, so many crisp passes in the space where I as a fan am willing him to pass it (and often times even passes I don't even see myself!). His goals will come I'm sure.

PhaseOfPlay · « **Reply #70 on:** April 14, 2015, 04:20:23 am »

Quote from: rickardinho1 on April 14, 2015, 03:59:50 am

I find that he's often second guessing himself with the pass/shoot decisions since there's no on-form striker to pass to. If there was a Suarez there that decision would be much easier for him.

Watching the all-touches video of him vs Newcastle is a delight though, so many crisp passes in the space where I as a fan am willing him to pass it (and often times even passes I don't even see myself!). His goals will come I'm sure.

That's why you were a goalkeeper

Coutinho is magic though. I think in the next two years his goal rate will go up.

jooneyisdagod · « **Reply #71 on:** April 14, 2015, 06:20:13 am »

Quote from: PhaseOfPlay on April 14, 2015, 04:20:23 am

That's why you were a goalkeeper

Coutinho is magic though. I think in the next two years his goal rate will go up.

His shooting has definitely improved. It's a weapon now from the inside left hand channel and teams are shitting themselves when he gets the ball there because they see that he can create a yard and smash one in. But more and more, he's starting to get into advanced positions from where he may be able to finish off moves created by others. I agree with you, I see a spike in his goal scoring record coming and dare I say it, I called it a few months ago when his shots seemed to be getting closer to the goal all of a sudden.

sminp · « **Reply #72 on:** April 14, 2015, 11:19:59 am »

Voted for him as our player of the year and Can for young player

Dubred · « **Reply #73 on:** April 14, 2015, 11:29:12 am »

Magical player.

He's getting better and better.

killer-heels · « **Reply #74 on:** April 14, 2015, 11:32:09 am »

Played well, but is made to look shitter due to the inability for anyone to score.

Coolie High · « **Reply #75 on:** April 14, 2015, 11:45:40 am »

Quote from: killer_heels on April 14, 2015, 11:32:09 am

Played well, but is made to look shitter due to the inability for anyone to score.

He can still be world class without scoring loads in a season, this era is a bit obsessed with goals assists etc i must say.

killer-heels · « **Reply #76 on:** April 14, 2015, 11:51:47 am »

Quote from: Coolie High on April 14, 2015, 11:45:40 am

He can still be world class without scoring loads in a season, this era is a bit obsessed with goals assists etc i must say.

Its a bit pointless though if the rest of the side, and him, are not converting it to goals.

Its great for the likes of Iniesta, when that sort of play helps the side. But when you are not scoring, it grates.

Coolie High · « **Reply #77 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:21:17 pm »

Quote from: killer_heels on April 14, 2015, 11:51:47 am

Its a bit pointless though if the rest of the side, and him, are not converting it to goals.

Its great for the likes of Iniesta, when that sort of play helps the side. But when you are not scoring, it grates.

Surround him with goalscorers and it starts to grate less as you implied.

Goals is a bonus, but other parts of his game are so good, that like Iniesta he could easily become a world class player without being a goal threat.

Especially since he like Iniesta again has a penchant to score important goals, i think its fast becoming an obsolete point anyways as goals is something he is certainly adding to his game, just a bit of a pet peeve of mine that people can't seem to enjoy players anymore without instantly looking towards their goals and assist stats.

killer-heels · « **Reply #78 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:25:33 pm »

Quote from: Coolie High on April 14, 2015, 12:21:17 pm

Surround him with goalscorers and it starts to grate less as you implied.

Goals is a bonus, but other parts of his game are so good, that like Iniesta he could easily become a world class player without being a goal threat.

Especially since he like Iniesta again has a penchant to score important goals, i think its fast becoming an obsolete point anyways as goals is something he is certainly adding to his game, just a bit of a pet peeve of mine that people can't seem to enjoy players anymore without instantly looking towards their goals and assist stats.

I am not fussed about assist stat's. Henderson's stats look great but I wouldn't have him in many, if any of the top sides in this league. But my point was that Coutinho is made to look shitter due to our lack of goals. He and his play will never really be fully appreciated until our team is regularly scoring because the stuff he does and the space he creates is only really looked at as productive if we actually score.

Coolie High · « **Reply #79 on:** April 14, 2015, 12:29:46 pm »

Quote from: killer_heels on April 14, 2015, 12:25:33 pm

I am not fussed about assist stat's. Henderson's stats look great but I wouldn't have him in many, if any of the top sides in this league. But my point was that Coutinho is made to look shitter due to our lack of goals. He and his play will never really be fully appreciated until our team is regularly scoring because the stuff he does and the space he creates is only really looked at as productive if we actually score.

Ok i get your point and agree.