Topic: Liverpool Financial Overview

[CraigDS]

Shouldn’t be the Main Stand. That opened in Sept 2016 and when I went (to one of the test events) it wasn’t that far away from being fully finished and what wasn’t completed was done so before The start of June 17 which is when these accounts started.

It’s likely the store, Kop bar, and training ground planning.

[Peabee]

Paying for the start of the new training ground?  Would depend when that started and went into the books.

Yeah, I think they budgeted £200m for the MS, store, training ground.

[roots99]

Yeah, I think they budgeted £200m for the MS, store, training ground.

That's the thing though, capex was basically negligible before the main stand, rose to £112 and £164m for a few years during construction, yet now is £180m after its completion. The consensus in the media is that Kirby is a £50-60m project. 

Not really worried about it, just seems odd.

[RooiBefok]

What's up with the increase in capital expenditure? I thought after the completion of the main stand it would drop a bit yet it has gone up 31% to £180m. The shop, the reworking of the disabled seating and the training ground must be factored in, but that's quite an increase.

Capital Expenditure has not increased by 31%.

FSG’s Cumulative Source of Funds (Cash) Generated and Expensed as at 31 May 2018 amounts to ₤577,8; of which 31% or ₤180,5 was spent on Capital Expenditure.

Capital Expenditure increases on last year were;
Stands, Fixtures, Fittings and Equipment at ₤13,164
Motor Vehicles at ₤136
Assets Under Construction at ₤2,495

A total increase of approximately 9,5%

[royhendo]

Swiss Ramble: https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/1097414490587570176

[TepidT2O]

Swiss Ramble: https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/1097414490587570176

Utterly fascinating as always

[ChaChaMooMoo]

Swiss Ramble: https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/1097414490587570176

From the tweet chain, What does this mean?

... mainly (unsuccessful) stadium development expenses £61m....?

[Uncle Ronnie]

From the tweet chain, What does this mean?

... mainly (unsuccessful) stadium development expenses £61m....?

Hicks & Gillette stadium I think? They took on the costs of that when they bought the club

[CraigDS]

Yeah it’s the H&G design. They do to write off the costs of this as losses.

[DonkeyWan]

Who knew about this little nugget?

"Champions League revenue is 54% higher in 2018/19, though a new UEFA coefficient payment (based on performances over 10 years) will benefit traditional big clubs like Real Madrid and Barcelona at the expense of clubs from countries with large TV pools, i.e. England and Italy."



What a barrel of filth.

[BaZ87]

From the tweet chain, What does this mean?

... mainly (unsuccessful) stadium development expenses £61m....?

Simply put, stadium development costs (much like when signing players) aren't expenses on the profit and loss account - you're investing in an asset and what you record is the depreciation of that asset. So in this instance, as soon as the plans to build a new stadium were scrapped all the costs related to the previous plans were recorded on the accounts for that year. Obviously this is just a paper cost rather than an actual cash cost with the cash being spent years previous.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

We're back in the US this summer again, no tour in Asia this year

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-summer-tour-2019-pre-15859273

[Chakan]

We're back in the US this summer again, no tour in Asia this year

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-summer-tour-2019-pre-15859273

No Charlotte?!! Argh, come to the East coast and not here. Sad.

[Too early for flapjacks?]

I wonder if we might go to Asia for a game or two immediately after the season is over. Bit difficult if we're in the CL final but if we don't make it to the latter stages it would be straight forward enough to arrange and still give the players plenty of the time off before pre-season in July.  Last PL game of the season on Sunday 12th May, 2 friendlies in Asia the week after, and then 6 weeks before pre-season.

[Brian Blessed]

I wonder if we might go to Asia for a game or two immediately after the season is over. Bit difficult if we're in the CL final but if we don't make it to the latter stages it would be straight forward enough to arrange and still give the players plenty of the time off before pre-season in July.  Last PL game of the season on Sunday 12th May, 2 friendlies in Asia the week after, and then 6 weeks before pre-season.

I hope not, they need a rest. Plus CAF is on this summer.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I wonder if we might go to Asia for a game or two immediately after the season is over. Bit difficult if we're in the CL final but if we don't make it to the latter stages it would be straight forward enough to arrange and still give the players plenty of the time off before pre-season in July.  Last PL game of the season on Sunday 12th May, 2 friendlies in Asia the week after, and then 6 weeks before pre-season.

We aren't going to Asia at any point this coming year. Other than the legends game which was mentioned in the article. Especially with AFCON, Copa America and other international fixtures in Europe, we'll have several players already exhausted

[Too early for flapjacks?]

Aren't we due the financials for last season soon? Any estimates on turnover?

[Thepooloflife]

Aren't we due the financials for last season soon? Any estimates on turnover?

Already out - £533m according to Deloitte for 18/19 season.....puts us 7th in money league - but only £5m behind City in 6th.

[CraigDS]

Already out - £533m according to Deloitte for 18/19 season.....

They aren't the full results.

[Thepooloflife]

They aren't the full results.

I realise that - he was asking about turnover, which Deloitte have supplied, which I presume is somewhere near accurate.

[Profits on Target]

Hey Reds!

I recently created a financial dashboard of the club's finances from 2016 to 2019 if anyone is interested in taking a look at how the club is doing financially. I've looked at the club's:

Revenues

Profitability

Expenses

Balance Sheet

Cash Flows

KPIs

See the attached link and get in touch with any comments or questions: https://profitsontarget.com/liverpool-financial-overview

[newterp]

Profits on Target 

love the name

[Samie]

Do you think you can hang with Craig and Al?

[Profits on Target]

Profits on Target 

love the name

Haha cheers!

[Dynasty]

Thanks for that good stuff.  So when are we buying Mbappe? 

[CraigDS]

Do you think you can hang with Craig and Al?

Let's give him a while before he can hang with the cool kids at the back of the bus. For now he can stay downstairs with you and Rebel.

[CraigDS]

Snip

I was prob a bit harsh saying you'd have to sit with Samie, this is actually a good resource to have at your finger tips rather than having to fish them out every time.

So thanks for that, you can now sit with Nick if you can fit on the seat with him.

[Samie]

I'm not even on the bus mate. 

[Paul1611]

Hey Reds!

I recently created a financial dashboard of the club's finances from 2016 to 2019 if anyone is interested in taking a look at how the club is doing financially. I've looked at the club's:

Revenues

Profitability

Expenses

Balance Sheet

Cash Flows

KPIs

See the attached link and get in touch with any comments or questions: https://profitsontarget.com/liverpool-financial-overview

Looks great!  All going in the right direction.  Is it possible to make a guess at how much the COVID19 crisis might affect financials?  Are we in a better spot to deal with it than others?

[CraigDS]

Is it possible to make a guess at how much the COVID19 crisis might affect financials?  Are we in a better spot to deal with it than others?

Next to impossible to know as we really don't know how individual sponsors will handle it both for us and for other clubs, plus the fallout from the TV money is yet to be solved (I think).

We've a big social following so it's entirely possible sponsors have been happy with the coverage we've given during the break and then what they'll get now games are back on (especially with us being champions) and we won't miss out on too much we'd have been due.

We've normally had less cash to hand than other clubs so less to fall back on, but then we've less debt than most too so plenty of scope there too.

[Profits on Target]

I'm not even on the bus mate. 

Hahaha I have no idea what you're all on about! 

[Profits on Target]

I was prob a bit harsh saying you'd have to sit with Samie, this is actually a good resource to have at your finger tips rather than having to fish them out every time.

So thanks for that, you can now sit with Nick if you can fit on the seat with him.

Cheers and thanks! 

[Profits on Target]

Thanks for that good stuff.  So when are we buying Mbappe? 

Haha now you're asking the wrong guy! 

[Profits on Target]

Next to impossible to know as we really don't know how individual sponsors will handle it both for us and for other clubs, plus the fallout from the TV money is yet to be solved (I think).

We've a big social following so it's entirely possible sponsors have been happy with the coverage we've given during the break and then what they'll get now games are back on (especially with us being champions) and we won't miss out on too much we'd have been due.

We've normally had less cash to hand than other clubs so less to fall back on, but then we've less debt than most too so plenty of scope there too.

This is pretty much spot on. I'd like to try and forecast the impact but forecasts are pretty much guesswork so you can end up looking quite silly.

[Rory Fitzgerald]

An overview of how the clubs revenues and cash flows have grown significantly but re-invested in wages and transfers.

Gives an idea of how we can cope without Match day revenue during COVID but also that large transfers are hard especially if it leads to senior players looking for parity with wages which we couldn’t afford.

[Mister Flip Flop]

Can't see us signing anyone for any sort of fee over say 30m these next few weeks to be honest. The Werner situation was testament to that. To many unknowns at present and personally i think it's highly unlikely we'll see crowds back at grounds next season either.

Thankfully we have great owners and a manager who we all trust.

[number 168]

Can't see us signing anyone for any sort of fee over say 30m these next few weeks to be honest. The Werner situation was testament to that. To many unknowns at present and personally i think it's highly unlikely we'll see crowds back at grounds next season either.

Thankfully we have great owners and a manager who we all trust.

I agree with all of that however if crowds don't come back sometime next season, yes we can cope but others might not. I wonder what the risk is of some Premier League clubs folding?

[bornandbRED]

Assuming that table is accurately compiled, that makes for very impressive viewing, and is the result of a decade’s worth of excellent operation. If we were listed on a stock market, it would read like a dream for shareholders.

Easy to see the impact of Covid considering match day income makes up for 15% of our total revenue. That’ll be a far bigger percentage for smaller clubs.

However, steep equity growth since 2017 highlights our ever increasing financial power. It’s clear we’re capable of making big (£50m+) capital outlays if we so wish, and are generally much, much more competitive in the transfer market than even 5 years ago.

Chuck in that we’ve consistently remained at around 50% wage to revenue ratio and the fact this will be reduced substantially by Clyne/Lallana/Lovren off the wage bill, and it almost makes me think perhaps we weren’t as hot as we all thought on Werner. That or the uncertainty over restart/rebates/competitons going ahead next season was too much at the time.

[killer-heels]

Assuming that table is accurately compiled, that makes for very impressive viewing, and is the result of a decade’s worth of excellent operation. If we were listed on a stock market, it would read like a dream for shareholders.

Easy to see the impact of Covid considering match day income makes up for 15% of our total revenue. That’ll be a far bigger percentage for smaller clubs.

However, steep equity growth since 2017 highlights our ever increasing financial power. It’s clear we’re capable of making big (£50m+) capital outlays if we so wish, and are generally much, much more competitive in the transfer market than even 5 years ago.

Chuck in that we’ve consistently remained at around 50% wage to revenue ratio and the fact this will be reduced substantially by Clyne/Lallana/Lovren off the wage bill, and it almost makes me think perhaps we weren’t as hot as we all thought on Werner. That or the uncertainty over restart/rebates/competitons going ahead next season was too much at the time.

Have we been 50% wages to turnover? I am sure i saw a few points it was at the high 60’s.

[bornandbRED]

Have we been 50% wages to turnover? I am sure i saw a few points it was at the high 60’s.

Over the last 5 years:

2015 - 48.8%
2016 - 61.2%
2017 - 51%
2018 - 51%
2019 - 52%

Assuming Lovren/Lallana/Clyne was £10m wages (was probably more), this year’s departures drop that under 50%. Lower revenue due to decreased match day income will spike the ratio in the next financial year - but temporarily before crowds return. We have good room to manoeuvre.