Topic: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *

[Trada]

And our MP's may vote to get involved in the shit storm going on in Syria.

[zero zero]

Now claims that a russian helicopter going to look for the downed jet pilots has also been shot down..

Is this from a recognised news source?

If it's just twitter, can you leave it out please mate

[lfcthekop]

Is this from a recognised news source?

If it's just twitter, can you leave it out please mate

Sky News was just talking about it

[jooneyisdagod]

Take this with a big pinch of salt, but having seen the flight path as released by the Turks, I'm astounded. Any incursion the Russian plane made by some counts would have only lasted a few seconds apparently. I saw one tweet saying something like 8.5 seconds would have been the entire duration of the incursion. I find it extremely hard to believe that the Turks had F-16s buzzing about and ready to attack an incursion that lasted 8.5 seconds. I find a 5-minute incursion hard to believe as well, but if 8.5 seconds as some people are saying is true, then I'm more and more inclined towards this being an attempt to start a conflict of some sort for little diplomatic gains.

[[new username under construction]]

Sky News was just talking about it

So twitter then

[zero zero]

Sky News was just talking about it

Okay. Let me rephrase that as reliable news sources

[MichaelA]

The yanks are using their Turkey puppets to start another conflict. Great.

No. They're not. They're really not.

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

I think the 'sides' are picked for us.

By multinational corporate interests.

This could well be the most true statement in the whole thread.

[MichaelA]

Okay. Let me rephrase that as reliable news sources

Thanks. I've split the thread, reliable news sources only please, thanks

[Weby72.]

On the plus side, our chances of a white Xmas have just improved

[Weby72.]

and it doesn't help with comments like this.

Sorry. Forgot we shouldn't criticise/lampoon/satirise Islamists.

[Pheeny]

Sorry. Forgot we shouldn't criticise/lampoon/satirise Islamists.

Allahu akbar is a religious saying and is used out of context by the "terrorists" so it doesn't help when people use it in the way you did.

[Trada]

The flight plan Turkey released.



People saying the bit of land it crossed is less than 2 miles wide.

[Harinder]

Sorry. Forgot we shouldn't criticise/lampoon/satirise Islamists.

No, we shouldn't be an idiot

Persist with comments like the one that's been removed and see where it gets you

[Weby72.]

Allahu akbar is a religious saying and is used out of context by the "terrorists" so it doesn't help when people use it in the way you did.

I couldn't give a jiggery-fuck what it is. If people take fairy stories too seriously that's their problem. They should, perhaps, grow up.

[BigAl24]

Ah fuck.

[MichaelA]

I couldn't give a jiggery-fuck what it is.

I'm politely asking you to cease posting in the thread, unless you have something civil and sensible to say. Thanks.

[Pheeny]

I couldn't give a jiggery-fuck what it is. If people take fairy stories too seriously that's their problem. They should, perhaps, grow up.

Not going to get into a ding dong with you as the mods have enough work as it is...

[harryc]

Turks dropping a major clanger as you can make out the way they quickly convened a NATO summit rather than contacting the Russians.

[Weby72.]

I'm politely asking you to cease posting in the thread, unless you have something civil and sensible to say. Thanks.

OK, agreed

[Gerry Attrick]

What's likely to come from this? 

[Pheeny]

What's likely to come from this? 

To be honest there will be lots of diplomatic chest beating but that will probably be all.

Well that's what happened in the past...

[Gerry Attrick]

To be honest there will be lots of diplomatic chest beating but that will probably be all.

Well that's what happened in the past...

Let's hope that's all that does happen!

[Pheeny]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air-to-air_combat_losses_between_the_USSR_and_US

[Jake]

Now claims that a russian helicopter going to look for the downed jet pilots has also been shot down..

Claims by?

The world is so fucked up. Ending lives because your precious sky gets touched by a plane, ending lives because someone prays to a magic man in a different shaped big fancy castle to you. We may as well all just go live underground now before the nukes come.

[Pheeny]

We may as well all just go live underground now before the nukes come.

Can I take my bikes with me though?

[lfcthekop]

Claims by?

The world is so fucked up. Ending lives because your precious sky gets touched by a plane, ending lives because someone prays to a magic man in a different shaped big fancy castle to you. We may as well all just go live underground now before the nukes come.

sorry, it was just sky news talking shite... my apolagies.

[El_Pistolero]

So twitter then

Some twitterers are pretty reliable regarding Syria. Talk of two hinds and special forces in the area looking for the jet and the pilots. Its hardly a stretch to imagine that it is happening either.

Turkey fucked up.

[Cruiser]

Harsh words from Putin. Don't blame him to be honest.

“This incident stands out against the usual fight against terrorism. Our troops are fighting heroically against terrorists, risking their lives. But the loss we suffered today came from a stab in the back delivered by accomplices of the terrorists,”

 "We will analyse everything in detail and today's tragic events will have significant consequences including for relations between Russia and Turkey."

"Instead of contacting us, Turkey went to its partners in Nato to discuss this incident. As if it was us who downed a Turkish plane, and not vice versa. What? They want to make Nato serve IS?"

[Mouth]

Fact is, as daft a concept as it might be, to shoot it down when it only slightly strayed, its not. If it has been happening repeatedly you cant let it carry on. The thing is, particularly when its Russia, you cant let them take an inch.
There is no way to know that the next time a plane strays its actually strayed, it could be on a bombing mission to your capital, you have to draw a line.

Russia have probably been taking the piss and did it one too many times.

[[new username under construction]]

Some twitterers are pretty reliable regarding Syria. Talk of two hinds and special forces in the area looking for the jet and the pilots. Its hardly a stretch to imagine that it is happening either.

Turkey fucked up.

No, true but more a view on the wonderful Sky News

[Billy1561]

Now claims that a russian helicopter going to look for the downed jet pilots has also been shot down..

Also on the beeb a while ago...


In another development, there are reports that a Russian military helicopter was forced to make an emergency landing after coming under fire from Syrian rebels. According to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, the aircraft managed to reach nearby government-held territory in the north-eastern Latakia region.

[JLStretton]

Another day, another shit storm going down.  I suspect we will never get to know the full facts as we hardly do, we just get to pick who to believe with the shite we get fed, a lot of people will just believe Turkeys side regardless of what Russia say, because well it's Russia.

[HighSix]

Its a pretty stupid move from Turkey with the rumours of their dealings with IS & so close to the attacks in France. Russia must be delighted with the PR opportunities & ability now to add more pressure... who can blame them. 

[Weby72.]

Meanwhile, in the UK Parliament, arch-weasel Phillip Hammond avoids answering an extremely pertinent question by constructing an embarrassingly ridiculous strawman:

Do you regard Turkey as a reliable ally in the battle against Isil? When you consider that not only today that they’ve shot down a Russian jet - who are also trying to fight Isil - they’re buying oil from Isil in order to prop them up, they’re bombing the Kurds who are also fighting Isil.

see old habits die hard and you remain an apologist for Russian actions. On the question of Turkey, Turkey is an important NATO ally.

“It holds the key to a number of really very important questions, both in relation to the battle against Isil but also in relation to the migration challenge that Europe faces, and it will remain a very important partner for this country and for the European Union

["21C or 70F?" SchizoidWeatherMan!]

Fact is, as daft a concept as it might be, to shoot it down when it only slightly strayed, its not. If it has been happening repeatedly you cant let it carry on. The thing is, particularly when its Russia, you cant let them take an inch.
There is no way to know that the next time a plane strays its actually strayed, it could be on a bombing mission to your capital, you have to draw a line.

Russia have probably been taking the piss and did it one too many times.

And you know this how? Through your impeccable deduction skills?You have no ideaabout about what transpired so help the thread by not posting idle and baseless speculation.

[Broad Spectrum]

You can't deny that they've been asking for it though. They've repeatedly violated the air space of NATO members without any form of retaliation in recent years. UK, Sweden, France have all released statements in recent years regarding Russian jets violating national air space. View it how you will, but as a repeat offender that can be seen as an act of aggression.

[Zeb]

And you know this how? Through your impeccable deduction skills?You have no ideaabout about what transpired so help the thread by not posting idle and baseless speculation.

As my post said, which is now the OP, Russia were warned about entering Turkish airspace last month. For an example elsewhere of twitchy trigger fingers, a Syrian plane got 800m into Israeli airspace over the Golan Heights and was shot down. The Russian ambassador to Turkey was called in last on the 19th to have it spelled out that they couldn't expect to keep entering Turkish airspace on the way back from bombing Turkish, erm, proxies. Not saying they're right or wrong to go ahead and shoot down the plane, but the Russians had been warned to stay clear very explicitly.

[cdav]

Fact is, as daft a concept as it might be, to shoot it down when it only slightly strayed, its not. If it has been happening repeatedly you cant let it carry on. The thing is, particularly when its Russia, you cant let them take an inch.
There is no way to know that the next time a plane strays its actually strayed, it could be on a bombing mission to your capital, you have to draw a line.

Russia have probably been taking the piss and did it one too many times.

Kind of agree with you Mouth, it doesn't matter whether it was 1 or 20 miles inside Turkish airspace- the point is the aircraft (supposedly) was after being warned to turn back. Legally they are entitled to defend their borders against armed incursions by warplanes, have issued repeated warnings and published their rules of engagement. Now, it would have been far more preferable if they could have de-escalated this by escorting the Russian jet from their airspace- but can't understand everyone blaming Turkey for this incident? Surely if you are bombing in Syria, the Russian jets could just stay over Syrian airspace?

[BeautifulGame91]

Its pretty clear for some time Turkey has been a accomplice of ISIS despite supported by the west shamelessly. This is another step in their shameless support with a pathetic excuse .


They repeatedly targeted the Kurds who were fighting against ISIS as well. NATO will try to turn this into Russia being the bully and no fault of Turkey with their PR work and media