Author Topic: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *  (Read 28559 times)

Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #160 on: November 24, 2015, 06:51:59 pm »


The Russians saying it was hit 1km inside Syrian territory. This is a map of the flight-path apparently, which would have been an 11-second incursion.
And the Turks managed to shout "Do one Russkie" ten times. And within an hour or so Obama says, the Turks had the right to shoot....

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Offline CornerFlag

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #161 on: November 24, 2015, 06:53:30 pm »
I just see incidents like this now and just wonder what's next.  One new thing to another and often either over imaginary people or imagined land borders.

Religion and nationality, fucking hell.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #162 on: November 24, 2015, 06:59:39 pm »
It's starting to remind me of Yorky's 37 Days.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #163 on: November 24, 2015, 07:00:22 pm »
Just rename the thread "the end of the world is nigh"
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #164 on: November 24, 2015, 07:12:49 pm »
As a 46 year old man with a 5 year old and a 9 year old,  I have to ask myself whether it was a good idea bringing them into this world ......Jesus H Christ , where is this going to lead to ?
Grandchildren.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #165 on: November 24, 2015, 07:14:02 pm »
russia is saying 1 pilot died, turks say both alive and turkmans in syria saying both dead.
given that soldiers in parachute are shot by turkmans in syria, i go with their info.

edit: here is the video of dead russian soldier.


mod edit: Do not post videos of dead soldiers, insurgents or anyone else on here. This is a football site first and foremost. If anyone wants to watch propoganda or other videos released there are literally hundreds of sites you can find them. RAWK will not be one of them. Anyone from this point on posting videos or photographs will be banned.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2015, 07:23:32 pm by Claire. »

Offline Zeb

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #166 on: November 24, 2015, 07:20:59 pm »
Russians putting out their version of where the plane was.



One of those radar tracks is not like the other one. One of those radar tracks just has to be wrong.
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Offline stevensr123

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #167 on: November 24, 2015, 07:23:09 pm »
Turkey are idiots who should be kicked out of nato for backing isis via funding them by buying their oil, killing the kurds who are trying to actually defeat isis and for generally being fuck wits lately. Hope we and the rest of the western world don't back them.
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Offline GregCharrua

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #168 on: November 24, 2015, 07:23:10 pm »
The Russians do like to stir up some shit don't they. The whole region is just such a fucking mess, though.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #169 on: November 24, 2015, 07:27:46 pm »
The Russians do like to stir up some shit don't they. The whole region is just such a fucking mess, though.

This one seems to be fairly squarely on the Turkish and not the Russians.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #170 on: November 24, 2015, 07:33:12 pm »
It's starting to remind me of Yorky's 37 Days.

It was obvious that one was going to end in war given he put Emperor Palpatine in charge.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #171 on: November 24, 2015, 07:36:55 pm »
And the Turks managed to shout "Do one Russkie" ten times. And within an hour or so Obama says, the Turks had the right to shoot....

I was a miner, I was a docker
I was a railway man between the wars
I raised a family in times of austerity
With sweat at the foundry between the wars

I paid the union and as times got harder
I looked to the government to help the working man
But they brought prosperity down at the armoury
We're arming for peace, me boys between the wars

I kept the faith and I kept voting
Not for the iron fist but for the helping hand
For theirs is a land with a wall around it
And mine is a faith in my fellow man

Theirs is a land of hope and glory
Mine is the green field and the factory floor
Theirs are the skies all dark with bombers
And mine is the peace we knew between the wars

Call up the craftsmen, bring me the draftsmen
Build me a path from cradle to grave
And I'll give my consent to any government
That does not deny a man a living wage

Go find the young men never to fight again
Bring up the banners from the days gone by
Sweet moderation, heart of this nation
Desert us not, we are between the wars

Read more: Billy Bragg - Between The Wars Lyrics | MetroLyrics


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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #172 on: November 24, 2015, 07:48:01 pm »
This one seems to be fairly squarely on the Turkish and not the Russians.
Did they change their borders when no one was looking?

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #173 on: November 24, 2015, 07:49:24 pm »
This one seems to be fairly squarely on the Turkish and not the Russians.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #174 on: November 24, 2015, 07:50:02 pm »
This one seems to be fairly squarely on the Turkish and not the Russians.

Two to tango and all that but they violated Turkish airspace (apparently) so there's no excusing them. They knew the potential consequences and did it anyway. They don't violate air space, there is no issue. Assuming that they did violate airspace, that is.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #175 on: November 24, 2015, 07:54:25 pm »
Two to tango and all that but they violated Turkish airspace (apparently) so there's no excusing them. They knew the potential consequences and did it anyway. They don't violate air space, there is no issue. Assuming that they did violate airspace, that is.
But surely you should take into context what is happening in syria and why russia are so close to their border?
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #176 on: November 24, 2015, 07:55:05 pm »
Did they change their borders when no one was looking?

They were well within their right to shoot down the jjet, sure. But they shouldn't have and the escalation is purely on Turkish shoulders.

It was in Turkish airspace for 11 seconds, and only ever headed back towards Syrian territory. Missle-lock, buzz it, send another angry letter to the Russian ambassador. Now they've just opened a hornet's nest. There's zero gain for Turkey.

I'm sure their bombing runs on Syrian Kurds will be several factors more dangerous for the pilots now, too. Just all a bit silly from Turkey, ain't it. And those Turkmen they swore to protect, good luck with that now.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #177 on: November 24, 2015, 07:57:44 pm »
We're all gonna die soon.

Defo - I reckon within the next 50 years, most of us posting in this thread will be dead.  Although if Putin is left to his own devices it could well bring that figure down significantly...

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #178 on: November 24, 2015, 08:08:02 pm »
But surely you should take into context what is happening in syria and why russia are so close to their border?

Why? And they are bombing rebels not Isis which makes me even less sympathetic.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #179 on: November 24, 2015, 08:10:02 pm »
Why? And they are bombing rebels not Isis which makes me even less sympathetic.

And the oil Turkey are buying from ISIS?

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #180 on: November 24, 2015, 08:13:23 pm »
They were well within their right to shoot down the jjet, sure. But they shouldn't have and the escalation is purely on Turkish shoulders.
Flying into Turkish airspace was the escalation - last month Turkey shot down a Russian drone, didn't they? Russia escalated, this was the response.

Quote
It was in Turkish airspace for 11 seconds, and only ever headed back towards Syrian territory. Missle-lock, buzz it, send another angry letter to the Russian ambassador. Now they've just opened a hornet's nest. There's zero gain for Turkey.
Two things - 1) If it was only 11 secs it shows how easily they could have flown around the area in question, but they chose not to. 2) Today it's 11 secs. Next week it's 20 secs. The week after, 30secs. Or maybe two planes for 11 secs at the same. Allowing this would have set a dangerous precedent for Turkey.

Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #181 on: November 24, 2015, 08:16:02 pm »
The Russians do like to stir up some shit don't they. The whole region is just such a fucking mess, though.
I think you'll find all sides like to do that, mate. And that's why the whole world is in a mess. But as for the middle east, I've been watching this go on since the 80's now.

First real notice I took of it, around about the time she called Nelson Mandella a Terrorist, Margaret Thatcher called some Afghan Geezers, "Freedom Fighters."

They called themselves the Mujahadeen. Ronnie and Maggie sent the CIA and SAS to arm them and show them how to bring down Russian Tanks and Helicopters. The Russians fucked off home. The Mujahadeen changed it's name to the Tali Ban and Al Queida. Our Estate got flooded with cheap smack. And it's gone on and on and on ever since.

The faces and names have changed, but the one constant... smack, oil and arms kept getting traded, at lower and lower prices, and a handful of people made more and more money.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #182 on: November 24, 2015, 08:18:48 pm »
Why? And they are bombing rebels not Isis which makes me even less sympathetic.
Bombing rebels say who? and are their such things as "just rebels" In syria now?

It's very clear now their is an extreme fine line. a lot of the so called rebels are "isis" members, their is no such thing as the free Syria army either.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #183 on: November 24, 2015, 08:19:20 pm »
the rest of the western world don't back them.

The USA have already backed Turkey.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #184 on: November 24, 2015, 08:19:42 pm »
Quote from: zero zero
...

Its not an escalation. They've been doing it before and the Turks have been responding proportionally, by not shooting it down. Now like I said, if it happened - intentionally or otherwise - who are we to say that Turkey can't open fire? It was still mind-boggingly stupid though. There was no need, no threat to Turkish territory and no benefit from it whichever way you look at it.

Turkey just made everybody's lives a lot harder, and especially their own.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2015, 08:23:26 pm by El_Pistolero »

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #185 on: November 24, 2015, 08:21:15 pm »
Flying into Turkish airspace was the escalation - last month Turkey shot down a Russian drone, didn't they? Russia escalated, this was the response.
Two things - 1) If it was only 11 secs it shows how easily they could have flown around the area in question, but they chose not to. 2) Today it's 11 secs. Next week it's 20 secs. The week after, 30secs. Or maybe two planes for 11 secs at the same. Allowing this would have set a dangerous precedent for Turkey.
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #186 on: November 24, 2015, 08:21:38 pm »
Flying into Turkish airspace was the escalation - last month Turkey shot down a Russian drone, didn't they? Russia escalated, this was the response.
Two things - 1) If it was only 11 secs it shows how easily they could have flown around the area in question, but they chose not to. 2) Today it's 11 secs. Next week it's 20 secs. The week after, 30secs. Or maybe two planes for 11 secs at the same. Allowing this would have set a dangerous precedent for Turkey.

I guess Turkey would know a lot about respecting air space, what with their 50+ violations in the last year.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #187 on: November 24, 2015, 08:37:25 pm »
Its not an escalation. They've been doing it before and the Turks have been responding proportionally, by not shooting it down. Now like I said, if it happened - intentionally or otherwise - who are we to say that Turkey can't open fire? It was still mind-boggingly stupid though. There was no need, no threat to Turkish territory and no benefit from it whichever way you look at it.

Turkey just made everybody's lives a lot harder, and especially their own.
That's NATO airspace. It might not have been a unilateral decision.
I guess Turkey would know a lot about respecting air space, what with their 50+ violations in the last year.
Look I'm not here to defend Turkey.

Offline El_Pistolero

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #188 on: November 24, 2015, 08:40:27 pm »
That's NATO airspace. It might not have been a unilateral decision.

NATO doesn't have any airspace. Its Turkeys decision and theirs only and since Turkish jets shot it down, that's all that matters really.

R

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #189 on: November 24, 2015, 08:53:11 pm »
The aircraft was flying over hostile territory,who knows what kind of shit was getting fired at them,

they would also be flying quite fast so an incursion into Turkish airspace would more than likely be due to error especially when it was for only 11 seconds. 

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #190 on: November 24, 2015, 08:54:38 pm »
Look I'm not here to defend Turkey.
They can defend themselves.

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #191 on: November 24, 2015, 08:56:52 pm »
Dear goodness..

What the hell are the Turks doing?

Fucking hell...  Fucking madness
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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #192 on: November 24, 2015, 09:18:33 pm »
I think you'll find all sides like to do that, mate. And that's why the whole world is in a mess. But as for the middle east, I've been watching this go on since the 80's now.

First real notice I took of it, around about the time she called Nelson Mandella a Terrorist, Margaret Thatcher called some Afghan Geezers, "Freedom Fighters."

They called themselves the Mujahadeen. Ronnie and Maggie sent the CIA and SAS to arm them and show them how to bring down Russian Tanks and Helicopters. The Russians fucked off home. The Mujahadeen changed it's name to the Tali Ban and Al Queida. Our Estate got flooded with cheap smack. And it's gone on and on and on ever since.

The faces and names have changed, but the one constant... smack, oil and arms kept getting traded, at lower and lower prices, and a handful of people made more and more money.

Ever feel like an over played piano?

Don't omit the insidious involvement of the truly scumbaggish Saudis. They were the ones chiefly bankrolling the Mujahidin terrorists. They bankrolled al Qaeda. They created IS to act as their proxy militia to fight Iran-backed Shias and, in a wider geopolitical sense, stimy the OPEC-circumventing oil ambitions of the Russia-Iran axis.

This bunch of inbred arab hypocrits, who whore, drink & coke their way around the world, use their petro-wealth to hold guns to the heads of countries like the UK and even the US.

They are the biggest funders of terrorism in the world right now, and are exporting their particularly perverted brand of a religion that is already pretty fucked-up (IMHO).

If it weren't for an aversion to having to spend half my salary on fuel, I'd advocate turning the entire region into a vast glass car park.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2015, 09:23:25 pm by Weby72 »

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #193 on: November 24, 2015, 09:46:47 pm »
Daily Mirror now quoting a Russian military analyst who suggests this will lead to "nuclear war "  ::)

Not that they're trying to scare us or anything  :o

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #194 on: November 24, 2015, 10:10:24 pm »
I think you'll find all sides like to do that, mate. And that's why the whole world is in a mess. But as for the middle east, I've been watching this go on since the 80's now.

First real notice I took of it, around about the time she called Nelson Mandella a Terrorist, Margaret Thatcher called some Afghan Geezers, "Freedom Fighters."

They called themselves the Mujahadeen. Ronnie and Maggie sent the CIA and SAS to arm them and show them how to bring down Russian Tanks and Helicopters. The Russians fucked off home. The Mujahadeen changed it's name to the Tali Ban and Al Queida. Our Estate got flooded with cheap smack. And it's gone on and on and on ever since.

The faces and names have changed, but the one constant... smack, oil and arms kept getting traded, at lower and lower prices, and a handful of people made more and more money.

Ever feel like an over played piano?

You're a lot younger than me then Leo. I remember the Six Day War in 67, The Palestinian Terrorism if the 70s including the Israeli athletes being murdered at the Munich Olympics. I remember the overthrow if the Shah and the Iranian Revolution. I remember the Russians scaring the shit out of me when they invaded Afghanistan on Christmas Eve 1979 long before the wall came down. And I remember their puppet government murdering tens of thousands of political prisoners...

Thatcher and Papa Bush have a lot to answer fit but the problems in the Middle East didn't start in the eighties. It goes back to the post war breakup of the British Empire, before that to the mistakes of various colonial powers, to the petty and major conflicts between Arabs and non Arabs and different sects of Islam. If you include Afghanistan you have to factor in the results of Independence in India and the ongoing consequences of Partition. If you want you could go back to the Pharaoh expelling the 12 tribes from Egypt.

The problems we face today have many causes and none of us should be using the appalling death toll (in the millions) for cheap political point scoring.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2015, 10:12:04 pm by Alan_X »
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Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #195 on: November 24, 2015, 10:12:04 pm »
Don't omit the insidious involvement of the truly scumbaggish Saudis. They were the ones chiefly bankrolling the Mujahidin terrorists. They bankrolled al Qaeda. They created IS to act as their proxy militia to fight Iran-backed Shias and, in a wider geopolitical sense, stimy the OPEC-circumventing oil ambitions of the Russia-Iran axis.

This bunch of inbred arab hypocrits, who whore, drink & coke their way around the world, use their petro-wealth to hold guns to the heads of countries like the UK and even the US.

They are the biggest funders of terrorism in the world right now, and are exporting their particularly perverted brand of a religion that is already pretty fucked-up (IMHO).

If it weren't for an aversion to having to spend half my salary on fuel, I'd advocate turning the entire region into a vast glass car park.

As I'm sure you can tell from the post, Weby, I was being unfunnily sarcastic. But the truth's in there, we're being played like pianos by sinister shites. And the Saudi's are right up the top of the sinister shites list.

As for drugs... Iran/Contra, Olly North, "Coalition Forces," guarding the poppy crops and moving the skag, it's been going on for 40 years. 

We could go on and on about the machinations. But that's it, bottom line, we're being played like pianos. Simplistic nonsense... not according to Harry Patch, Smedley Butler and the millions upon millions of Veterans from all sides, used as cannon fodder through out this perpetual century of War.

How we stop it is the question. And I'm first to admit, I've no idea. But while we've got this system it will never stop.
"A peasant you are. A peasant you will remain. And we shall use all our wealth and power, to make your lot even worse and keep you exactly where you are, Bondage!"    The Boy King, Richard II, after  putting down the The Peasants Revolt in 1381.

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Offline Alan_X

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #196 on: November 24, 2015, 10:12:56 pm »
Sorry - but autocorrect can go duck itself.
Sid Lowe (@sidlowe)
09/03/2011 08:04
Give a man a mask and he will tell the truth, Give a man a user name and he will act like a total twat.
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Offline BarryCrocker

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #197 on: November 24, 2015, 10:16:41 pm »
The USA have already backed Turkey.

Think that was a given considering they've got a couple of military bases in Turkey.
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Offline HighSix

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #198 on: November 24, 2015, 10:20:04 pm »
Turkey keen to dissuade Russia from bombing the opposition it has trained?

Syria is fucking complicated man.

I always check the chart although does not include the dark relationships.


Offline bigbonedrawky

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Re: Russian Jet Downed by Turkey *
« Reply #199 on: November 24, 2015, 11:48:03 pm »
I always check the chart although does not include the dark relationships.


Thats looks a complicated mess and thats without adding the Kurds Russia UK France etc .

No worries though, Dave the pig botherer has a cunning plan and its as "cunning as a fox who's just been appointed Professor of Cunning at Oxford University"   :)