Topic: Macbook/Macbook Pro thread

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Fuckin ell Andy, you'll be dancing round the room in a pair of AirPods next

I might be a knobhead, but I do admit when I'm wrong.

It's hilariously bad at games, but as I've been using one for about a year in work, I have to admit that it's quite a decent package.

My problem with Windows stuff is that I hate Powershell and love Linux/Unix.

Imagine if Microsoft bit the bullet and produced a Linux-based Windows platform. Or imagine if these companies that do stuff for Apple or Microsoft built good stuff for Linux?

Thing is with Linux eveyone wants everything for free.



But you live and learn and in this instance, I have to admit Apple is very good for what it does in this capacity

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Is Monterey stable on intel MacBook Pro 16's yet, initial reports of bricking some?

Installed it on my i9 and it's fine. Having to install it on the work i7 now and I'll let you know

[PaulF]

I might be a knobhead, but I do admit when I'm wrong.

It's hilariously bad at games, but as I've been using one for about a year in work, I have to admit that it's quite a decent package.

My problem with Windows stuff is that I hate Powershell and love Linux/Unix.

Imagine if Microsoft bit the bullet and produced a Linux-based Windows platform. Or imagine if these companies that do stuff for Apple or Microsoft built good stuff for Linux?

Thing is with Linux eveyone wants everything for free.



But you live and learn and in this instance, I have to admit Apple is very good for what it does in this capacity

Doesn't the linux subsystem on windows not do what you need?  Never actually tried it myself as I don't mind Powershell (I wouldn't want to use it a lot though).

@Tepid/claire , If ive got a powerplug providing ethernet to one room upstairs, could I use the ethernet connction for a router and it'd provide better wifi upstairs?
I've got a £20 tenda thing that's supposed to boost the wireless, but it's not great.  Mesh seems a tad excessive.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Doesn't the linux subsystem on windows not do what you need?  Never actually tried it myself as I don't mind Powershell (I wouldn't want to use it a lot though).

@Tepid/claire , If ive got a powerplug providing ethernet to one room upstairs, could I use the ethernet connction for a router and it'd provide better wifi upstairs?
I've got a £20 tenda thing that's supposed to boost the wireless, but it's not great.  Mesh seems a tad excessive.

Yeah it's full Linux, but it gets confused as I have windows apps that are available on Windows, but not Linux - getting them to talk across from WSL2 -> Windows isn't always easy or in some cases possible.

I also have the situation where I have x installed in Windows and WSL2 and it gets confused what it's using and uses the other one occasionally.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Note to those installing Monerey

BE PATIENT

On my i9, the screen went black for five minutes and looked like it was shagged. Got a coffee and it had rebooted - but then rebooted about five times

Work Mac went black for a full ten minutes. Rebooted. Went black for 5 minutes and rebooted again.

Be patient.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

.. rebooted twice more

lol @ Apple

[Andy @ Allerton!]

.. rebooted again

Ha ha

[Andy @ Allerton!]

So from doing mine, it seems to reboot about five times. Grab a coffee, serenade your dog, write some poetry...

.. but leave it alone

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Aaaand.. rebooting again..

[Andy @ Allerton!]

.. now installing.

Arf

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Installed. So when installing it.

1. Be patient
2. It will go black and look like it's stuffed
3. It'll then reboot 5 times
4. Then it takes 10-20 minutes to install
5. Then it reboots and takes about 5 minutes to start up
6. It'll have cocked all your rotations up on all your screens
7. It'll notify you that several apps are no longer compatible with Apple..

[Claire.]

.. now installing.

Arf

Christ, I've been using it since first beta on my iMac and had no issues with installs or updates. Only big issue was one release when everything went sloooow but was sorted fast.

@Tepid/claire , If ive got a powerplug providing ethernet to one room upstairs, could I use the ethernet connction for a router and it'd provide better wifi upstairs?
I've got a £20 tenda thing that's supposed to boost the wireless, but it's not great.  Mesh seems a tad excessive.

Yeah, I've done that in my Dad's house. Can't recommend switching to a mesh enough though

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Weirdly installed it on the Mini-Mac (M1) and that was much quicker, so it's installing on the Intel chips that's taking the extra time and messing.

[PaulF]

My 2016 MacBook took a long time. I think I feared I'd bricked it

Ps any recommendations for mesh kit? Might as well hote the bullet.

[the 92A]

My 2016 MacBook took a long time. I think I feared I'd bricked it

Ps any recommendations for mesh kit? Might as well hote the bullet.

I'm holding off for a few weeks then

[PaulF]

I'm holding off for a few weeks then

That's mainly down to me having never done a Mac update though.  It went fine in the end, but like Andy says, wait until you have half an hour or so ...

[Millie]

Ive got a MacBook Air.  Took around 15 mins I think.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Ive got a MacBook Air.  Took around 15 mins I think.

M1?

[Claire.]

the reboots are likely firmware updates aren't they? I've got it on both of mine and didn't notice but the beta version might mean I got them incrementally so didn't notice on the intel.

[Millie]

M1?

?  Laptop.  It's pretty new though.

[Millie]

Just checked - yes it has M1 chip - if that's what you mean. 

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Just checked - yes it has M1 chip - if that's what you mean. 

Yeah I've got a Mini-Mac and that took about 15-20 minutes

The two Intel Macbook Pros (i7 and i9) took about an hour or so and had multiple reboots and went black for 5-10 minutes halfway through

[RainbowFlick]

anyone with the latest MBP have any criticisms? other than price it seems to be universally loved?

i'm somewhere between your average 'casual' user and a professional i think. can't really decide between next gen MBA or the new MBP. My current MBP is bulging and very slow now.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

anyone with the latest MBP have any criticisms? other than price it seems to be universally loved?

i'm somewhere between your average 'casual' user and a professional i think. can't really decide between next gen MBA or the new MBP. My current MBP is bulging and very slow now.

I got the intel MBP After initally buying an M1 Mini Mac.

The M1 has many, many problems including virtualisation. For the work I do and the stuff I'm doing, it's unfit for purpose and many vital apps simply currently do not work.

I'm sure Apple will address it, but it's worthless for many development tasks involving Docker, Kubernetes and the applications around that.

[PaulF]

Tbf I can't imagine virtualization is top for many Mac owners?
Though I do stereotype Mac owners as arty people doing graphics stuff. In which case they've no need to virtualize.
JavaScript front end Devs too probably don't have a use case , nor dB backend people?

For tasks that do work though , how are you finding the M1? Are you doing anything where you can clock a speed increase over what you'd expect for equivalently priced intel?

[Claire.]

This no good? https://docs.docker.com/desktop/mac/apple-silicon/

[Andy @ Allerton!]

This no good? https://docs.docker.com/desktop/mac/apple-silicon/

No, it's got loads of problems. You also have to run quite a lot of it under emulation - which means it runs like an injured ant.

You also can't use stuff like Kiali, Prometheus, Flagger and the like as the istio framework doesn't install correctly in M1.

I'm sure they'll work it out eventually

There are several work-arounds, but the idea is to have an environment up and running which matches what I'm doing professionally. Once you start hacking and changing configs and the like then it *might* work but it also isn't going to be the same thing.


From a site that has the workarounds, this is what they have to say;

What is the time frame for this roadmap

Looking at the links to the roadmap in the blog, you will quickly find out that there is none. Based on the complexity of the project and the dependency on Apple I would expect minimum 6 to 8 months for this to be fixed. The only possibility to solve this quicker would be a direct involvement of Apple which has not happened in the past.


I could also move the docker environment to the cloud but that's absolutely not what I want to do for a local fully-controllable development environment.

[PaulF]

Do you mean the docker roadmap?
I can't imagine there's that many people wanting to run it on M1 just yet?

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Do you mean the docker roadmap?
I can't imagine there's that many people wanting to run it on M1 just yet?

Not sure what you mean?

I'm talking about Docker

[PaulF]

Yes . Sorry wasn't sure if you meant the apple roadmap. Not sure why I'd think they will fix it.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Yes . Sorry wasn't sure if you meant the apple roadmap. Not sure why I'd think they will fix it.

Yeah it's a problem with the M1 (That they'll sort - it's the virtualisation I believe)

As Claire helpfully pointed out, they have got an M1 version of docker, but it's very odd and somethings randomly don't work at all/very well/without issues which when you are trying to set something up 'like something else' isn't really helpful

[Claire.]

The joys of being front end all my tools are seemingly popular enough (or they're just js!) to be all silicon-ed up.

[TepidT2O]

The flesh is fucking weak….

I’ve just ordered a MacBook Pro ….

[PaulF]

The flesh is fucking weak….

I’ve just ordered a MacBook Pro ….

M1 or intel?

I don't think I can justify a new one, but no complaints with my 2nd hand one.

Ps thanks for the heads up on the mesh folks. Got a cheap one in the sales. Not as good as the 'fast' ones but more than good enough for what I need and picks up signal nicely enough everywhere which is all we need. (not streaming 4k on anything daft like that, though it could probably manage one or two. The virgin media cable will crap out long before these do)

--edit-- obviously they pay teachers too much 

[TepidT2O]

New one…..

And I had a pay rise last year!

(And I’m paying for it monthly )

[Claire.]

An Air would've likely done everything you need but I don't think you ever asked

[Andy @ Allerton!]

M1 or intel?

I don't think I can justify a new one, but no complaints with my 2nd hand one.

Ps thanks for the heads up on the mesh folks. Got a cheap one in the sales. Not as good as the 'fast' ones but more than good enough for what I need and picks up signal nicely enough everywhere which is all we need. (not streaming 4k on anything daft like that, though it could probably manage one or two. The virgin media cable will crap out long before these do)

--edit-- obviously they pay teachers too much 

Well you don't buy Macs for the speed of them. I've got 7 year old laptops that wipe the floor with it - the tech itself doesn't really compare with modern Windows laptops.

You buy it for the OS.

As an example, my recent RTX 2070 super laptop runs Farming Simulator at 172 fps.

The Macbook Pro (Intel i9) manages 26 fps

[thejbs]

Longevity is a factor, in my experience.  Every apple computer I've ever owned (2004 onwards) is still in use.  I own a one year old MBPro16, but still use my old 2012 mbpro for many things.  My mate still uses my old 2004 iMac still!

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Longevity is a factor, in my experience.  Every apple computer I've ever owned (2004 onwards) is still in use.  I own a one year old MBPro16, but still use my old 2012 mbpro for many things.  My mate still uses my old 2004 iMac still!

I've got laptops that are 10-20 years old that I still use.

Granted they can't run Windows 10, but I have them running a variety of things from XP, 7, OS2/Warp, Ubuntu, Mint, Centos 6, Centos 7 and the like.

It's a myth that most laptops don't last or break easily. Some have, certainly, but not many if you look after them.

[CraigDS]

I don’t know anyone who has a working windows laptop which also gives decent performance still and prob seen people go through a shit load of them.

Def agree Macs have longevity. All of mine have lasted years upon years, way more than my windows machines, and they’ve all been treated the same.