Topic: RAWK Flags/Banners/Surfer - Volunteers needed for Everton & West Brom

[Chivasino]

yes that's the one - didn't realise how big it was until i pulled it out the bag in my kitchen - went down well!

Superb and well in, Mate.

[Alan_X]

I have asked about whats required to satisfy them in terms of certification - the quote i had was to issue a certificate for five years to BS-5867 Part 2 Type B standard - anyone on here know anything about that?!?!

BS 5867: Part 2: 2008

Fabrics for curtains, drapes and window blinds.

Flammability requirements. Specification

BS 5867 was updated and republished in 2008. The Standard sets requirements for different ignition levels of fabrics and fabric combinations for use as curtains, drapes
and window blinds – including combinations of curtains and linings. The Standard assists those involved in the supply chain to specify required fire safety levels in different non-domestic end-use environments.

Compliance with the Standard involves three key elements:

●  Meeting technical requirements for ignition resistance
●  Frequency of testing
●  Product labelling.

I'll have to look into testing. We don't want to have to set alight to a bit of it each time so I think you would need the material specification and details of the printing to show that each one complied with the BS. I would assume that would be on the old certificate. Either that or we'd need to check back with the people who printed it. It may need a fire-retardent treatment as well.

[dudleyred]

BS 5867: Part 2: 2008

Fabrics for curtains, drapes and window blinds.

Flammability requirements. Specification

BS 5867 was updated and republished in 2008. The Standard sets requirements for different ignition levels of fabrics and fabric combinations for use as curtains, drapes
and window blinds – including combinations of curtains and linings. The Standard assists those involved in the supply chain to specify required fire safety levels in different non-domestic end-use environments.

Compliance with the Standard involves three key elements:

●  Meeting technical requirements for ignition resistance
●  Frequency of testing
●  Product labelling.

I'll have to look into testing. We don't want to have to set alight to a bit of it each time so I think you would need the material specification and details of the printing to show that each one complied with the BS. I would assume that would be on the old certificate. Either that or we'd need to check back with the people who printed it. It may need a fire-retardent treatment as well.

That's interesting cheers Alan

You're right we definitely don't want to lose a bit each time!

I'll take the plunge and contact the original manufacturers tomorrow if I haven't heard back from Armin

[Alan_X]

That's interesting cheers Alan

You're right we definitely don't want to lose a bit each time!

I'll take the plunge and contact the original manufacturers tomorrow if I haven't heard back from Armin

Do you have the old certificate?

[dudleyred]

Do you have the old certificate?

no nothing - had hoped it would be with it but it's not. that's why i took it out the bag in the kitchen!

i have popped an enquiry email to the manufacturers asking if they keep records back to when it was done - if they do then we may get a result - fingers crossed on that front

[Barneylfc∗]

yes that's the one - didn't realise how big it was until i pulled it out the bag in my kitchen - went down well!
cheers - long way to go but seems a good start!

Fucking hell mate, how big is your kitchen? 

[dudleyred]

Fucking hell mate, how big is your kitchen? 

Not big enough it turns out. Once I dug the wife and dog out from under it I hastily repacked it before I got a kicking

[AJL]

https://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?action=pm
Not big enough it turns out. Once I dug the wife and dog out from under it I hastily repacked it before I got a kicking

Cant wait to see it unveiled next season and your labrador comes bouncing out 

[dudleyred]

BS 5867: Part 2: 2008

Fabrics for curtains, drapes and window blinds.

Flammability requirements. Specification

BS 5867 was updated and republished in 2008. The Standard sets requirements for different ignition levels of fabrics and fabric combinations for use as curtains, drapes
and window blinds – including combinations of curtains and linings. The Standard assists those involved in the supply chain to specify required fire safety levels in different non-domestic end-use environments.

Compliance with the Standard involves three key elements:

●  Meeting technical requirements for ignition resistance
●  Frequency of testing
●  Product labelling.

I'll have to look into testing. We don't want to have to set alight to a bit of it each time so I think you would need the material specification and details of the printing to show that each one complied with the BS. I would assume that would be on the old certificate. Either that or we'd need to check back with the people who printed it. It may need a fire-retardent treatment as well.

Alan - i have been in touch with the treatment company today again and they have advised they wont have to test the material as they will be able to ascertain at the outset whether the treatment would work or not. Guess this is good news in light of no other paperwork etc materialising

They will treat the flag and issue the certificate to the above standard

As a reminder i am expecting to hear back from the club next week so i will chase them Tuesday / Wednesday if they don't come back to me

that should give us a picture of next steps i guess!

[Hij]

Nice one mate.
When you have a quote please let us know what help you need.

[dudleyred]

Vaughan at the club has come back to me today so we are moving things along a bit

Just discussing the fire safety requirements and then should be good to progress.

I have only found one company who will treat a flag that's not their own at the moment. Quote of Ł3.25/sq meter so we are talking about Ł1000. this lasts for five years so would of course be a rolling cost.

Once Vaughan lets me know the score i will try the original manufacturer again as they didn't reply to my email - didn't bother chasing as need to know the clubs position first of all

as always will keep you updated - apologies its not moved along as far as we'd hope!

UPDATE - Vaughan back in touch and has given me the fire safety standard details it needs (BS 5867-2:2008 if anyone is interested!) and has also given me a company name who he knows frank uses for the other surfer so that was pretty helpful

I will contact them, get a quote, come back to you all. If we think the price is doable i will go from there. Vaughan has asked to see it so will pop it down to him if all the other bits fall into place 

Second update - apologies for another update but i've had another exchange with Vaughan - we will be ok to store the flag at the ground once its all sorted. dont know what format that takes or indeed where but at least it means it will be accessible for a few people to help out and gets me out of trouble with the wife for having it in the garage

You can ignore that quote above as I have had a better one from this other company. To be fair i forgot to ask if it needs doing annually but the cost makes it immaterial anyway. We can get it washed, treated, certified and returned to me for..............Ł60 

I will get the flag to the company and sorted and then will make arrangements to meet Vaughan and get the flag signed off as it were

Everyone ok with that as a plan?

[oojason]

^ quality work mate - and that's some good news re the price too

[Hij]

You can ignore that quote above as I have had a better one from this other company. To be fair i forgot to ask if it needs doing annually but the cost makes it immaterial anyway. We can get it washed, treated, certified and returned to me for..............Ł60 

Jesus . I was just doing the workings out based on a grand over five years which would be Ł200 a year and the relevant donations we'd need to make that a flyer - about 40 donations of Ł5 per season. But Ł60 is fantastic- how long does that last?

Sounds fantastic mate, thanks for taking on the mantle so far and what timing to get it sorted for (hopefully) a return to Champions League football. When it's done we should be able to get five of us to send you a tenner towards the treatment. Then we have the hard yards of getting it on the Kop

[dudleyred]

cheers both

To be fair i forgot to even ask how long the treatment lasts. Even annual its going to be well achievable isnt it. I had to say Ł60 a few times as thought he was taking the piss. seemed a nice fella

Vaughan has offered to link us in with frank which will be the next main task to make sure we coordinate any efforts with the existing surfer. Think Stoz knows him so will wait and see on that.

To be fair the club have been very good and replied when they said they would so hopeful we can get it over the line

[Rhi]

That's awesome, mate.

If we can store it at the ground, that's a MASSIVE positive. Have we decided which stand it might be best to use? There are obviously several surfers in the Kop as it is. There's also one in the Lower Cent. Might be nice to give this flag a home elsewhere. Just something to think about anyway. Regardless of that, if the club will store it, that's amazing news. Lugging it around is no mean feat, as I'm sure you are aware . Well done to Vaughan at the club too - seems like he's been very helpful. I remember someone trying to get the club to store the banner last time around and getting absolutely no help whatsoever.

I'll happily chip in for the money to have it washed, treated etc. Let us know what you need.

[dudleyred]

so storing at the ground is definitely ok. Quoted from e-mail "if it is a goer then we will be able to keep it at Anfield with the other flags, that is not an issue"

in terms of where to use it no, havent discussed it further at the moment. I agree a permanent location would be good. Anny road lower seemed logical. Sadly we may have missed out for this year if main volunteers are elsewhere for europe. I'm in the Kop on the ACS i must admit as wanted to keep cost down as well as stand and get involved obviously!

re funds from all - thanks for the offer -  let me get it sorted first and can sort afterwards. I still want to check that i heard right at Ł60 (asked him three times) and then asked how much on top cleaning was and he said its all in.

another bloody update - sorry its in dribs and drabs - meeting Vaughan at club Monday - he's going to give the flag the nod all being well, will then take it to the cleaners to be treated and then thats that - once back will report back on here to let you all know how we've got on

[Hij]

Spot on mate nice one.

I'm also in the Kop for Europe, will have to see whats viable. It went up on the Kop previously but agree space is at a premium on there.

[John C]

To be fair i forgot to even ask how long the treatment lasts.

You mentioned 5 years.
Irrespective of the how many times we'd expect it to appear, it's worth investing for those 5 years.
We'll raise a grand easy mate. Like Rhi and the others, I'll contribute.

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Let me know the paypal account so that I can contribute.

[AJL]

  excellent work

[koppitemk]

Hi guys, great work. I dont post very often but am local and season ticket holder for 20+ years.
I think a great home for a big surfer would be the upper tier of new main stand. There is a really good atmosphere up there as all the GA tickets are there so quite a lot of locals get in as well.
A surfer  up there would look great and help even more getting people up for it.
Everyone may disagree, but worth thinking about.

[Hij]

Hi guys, great work. I dont post very often but am local and season ticket holder for 20+ years.
I think a great home for a big surfer would be the upper tier of new main stand. There is a really good atmosphere up there as all the GA tickets are there so quite a lot of locals get in as well.
A surfer  up there would look great and help even more getting people up for it.
Everyone may disagree, but worth thinking about.

Good suggestion.

[rhylred]

Let me know the paypal account so that I can contribute.

Same here 👍

[Rhi]

Hi guys, great work. I dont post very often but am local and season ticket holder for 20+ years.
I think a great home for a big surfer would be the upper tier of new main stand. There is a really good atmosphere up there as all the GA tickets are there so quite a lot of locals get in as well.
A surfer  up there would look great and help even more getting people up for it.
Everyone may disagree, but worth thinking about.

That's a good shout actually. Me and my brother ended up in there for most of the league games last season and it's surprisingly decent with people wanting to get involved. Pricey though, unfortunately.

[thekitkatshuffler]

You mentioned 5 years.
Irrespective of the how many times we'd expect it to appear, it's worth investing for those 5 years.
We'll raise a grand easy mate. Like Rhi and the others, I'll contribute.

It's not a grand, it's Ł60!

Superb job on getting this all sorted, Chris.  If/when contributions are required, I'll deffo throw in.  Love this surfer.   

Hi guys, great work. I dont post very often but am local and season ticket holder for 20+ years.
I think a great home for a big surfer would be the upper tier of new main stand. There is a really good atmosphere up there as all the GA tickets are there so quite a lot of locals get in as well.
A surfer  up there would look great and help even more getting people up for it.
Everyone may disagree, but worth thinking about.

The only issue I can see with that is it wouldn't be visible on TV because the cameras are in the Main Stand.  Obviously that's just me as an armchair fan who'd quite fancy seeing it on the big European nights but obviously those getting hands-on with sorting it can absolutely put it wherever works best for them.   

[dudleyred]

Phase one complete - flag was unfurled in the car park and got the nod from Vaughan

We have been given a permanent home of Annie road lower - that'll be our spec going forward

Now onto the cleaners- there is a slight tear on it too so will get them to fix that all being well

Will report back on that later and give a bit more detail on discussions

[Alan_X]

Well done. Will be great to see it get an airing again. Let us know if there's any fundraising required.

[Big Red Richie]

The only slight spanner in the works I can see, is that the Anny road doesn't have that many regulars to help out.

The fanbase in the Anny Rd, seems to be more transient, so you might have to 'train' the crowd on an almost game by game basis.


You're probably gonna have to put out regular requests for help, as it probably takes at least say 3 people to un-roll it, get it surfing, and recover it, back to it's holding bag etc.



Other than that, Great work fella. It'll be good to see it out again. It's been hidden away for far too long. 

[dudleyred]

The only slight spanner in the works I can see, is that the Anny road doesn't have that many regulars to help out.

The fanbase in the Anny Rd, seems to be more transient, so you might have to 'train' the crowd on an almost game by game basis.


You're probably gonna have to put out regular requests for help, as it probably takes at least say 3 people to un-roll it, get it surfing, and recover it, back to it's holding bag etc.



Other than that, Great work fella. It'll be good to see it out again. It's been hidden away for far too long. 

Yes you're right it will be more challenging but I think the benefits of a permanent spec without having to check with others will be worth it

Let's see how we go - nice to be discussing this aspect as shows progress!

[Rhi]

That's brilliant news. Stoz made the point that the Upper Main Stand doesn't have room to unfurl it at the bottom like the Lower Anny or Kop, so the Lower Anny seems to be the logical new home for it.

Well done for getting this all sorted, mate.

[No666]

I'll throw something in for the cleaning/repair. Well done.

[AJL]

Just talking with my mate about it but he reckons he cant remember it.

Anyone got a picture from when it was last out ?

[dudleyred]

Just talking with my mate about it but he reckons he cant remember it.

Anyone got a picture from when it was last out ?

Can't ever work out how to imbed images!!

https://www.flickr.com/photos/torlporl/484356425

[Big Red Richie]

Just talking with my mate about it but he reckons he cant remember it.

Anyone got a picture from when it was last out ?

Couldn't tell you what game it was last out, but here's the 2007 Semi against Chelsea.


Edit:  Can't remember who designed it. Macphisto?  Kitster?  Someone else?



http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/photos/liverpool-chelsea-1-may-2007?editorialproducts=sport&family=editorial&page=2&phrase=liverpool%20chelsea%201%20may%202007&excludenudity=true&sort=best#license

[Alan_X]

KItster designed it.

[Big Red Richie]

KItster designed it.

Knew it was one of them. Just couldn't remember which one. 

[oojason]

These 3 threads may be of interest to you mate... (there may be a few more? - but think these are the main ones on how it all came about etc)

https://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=70354.0

https://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=72354.msg1136559#msg1136559

https://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=92558.0

[gray19lfc]

Such a good looking banner.

[DougLFC94]

I remember seeing this banner on the kop and if my memory is correct it's first appearance was against Benfica in 2006? Didn't realise it was a RAWK made one until coming across this thread just now.

Great banner and it would be good to see it back at Anfield again! Would be more than happy to make a contribution to any costs involved.

Good work!   

[kavah]

The shade of red looks the same to me as the new kit, he was ahead of his time that Kitster chap. And I seem to remember there was some concern about the design being different to the traditional Liver Bird. Maybe after a few years off it will be better received?