Author Topic: What would you do?  (Read 1837 times)

Offline Port_vale_lad

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What would you do?
« on: August 3, 2019, 08:31:51 pm »
Really fecking angry at the moment.

Turns out a guy that iv known for the best part of 40 years likes to beat his wife on a regular basis.

Really good mate of mine, been on holiday with him and his wife on numerous occasions, used to be more like a brother to me during our match going / drinking days.

No clues what so ever they genuinely seem like the perfect couple, had a phone call this morning from said bloke telling me if the police ask hes staying at my address, thought he was taking the piss, tried to ring him back and was getting no answer from his mobile couldn't get hold of him all day so rang him on his home phone and his wife answers.

Ask her what he's on about then she tells me that after a skinfull of beer last Saturday he punched her twice and knocked her clean out, he's got worried and rang the ambulance service and they have arrived and rang the police, he's been arrested but its not the 1st time this has happened and its 2 - 3 times a month he lashes out.

Speaking to his wife it turns out she has no intention of pressing charges and she is standing by him - that's probably shocked me more than anything else
From everything she said the police are going ahead and charging him and they arnt allowed to see each other but she has begged me not to say anything to anybody, not to any of his friends and family  (which I know really well)

Now I don't give a shit about him he can fuck off but I really feel for her, if I tell familyI reckon he would get the shit kicked out of him and be disowned but if I stay silent and she forgives him and the next time he kills her I don't know if I could live with that.

Genuinely don't know what to do, would you tell the family?

Offline dudleyred

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #1 on: August 3, 2019, 08:38:36 pm »
Tricky position to be in but perhaps see what comes of his arrest first?

If he gets charged etc he’ll struggle to keep it quiet anyway. You’ll also keep her trust as well

What I would make clear to him is he can fuck off if he thinks you’re lying for him (if that’s your view of course). Perhaps see what he says to that and see if he admits it to you

Tricky though as I say and I’m not speaking from a position of any experience

Offline Red Beret

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #2 on: August 3, 2019, 08:46:32 pm »
Tough one.  My head says don't say a damned thing unless you're asked - and if you are asked be honest, even if it costs a friendship.  At the end of the day he's not the man, and they're not the couple, you thought they were; and he's seen fit to drag you into this.  I know that's hard but I had to cut my family off four years ago because it had become toxic.  You have to decide where you stand on your morals and what you can personally handle.

In the meantime, my heart says get a couple of mates together and kick seven shades of shit out of the guy and tell him there's more where that came from if he doesn't buck the fuck up.  The guy clearly needs to sort himself out, but I fear he's in too deep to seek help.
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Offline rob1966

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #3 on: August 3, 2019, 10:33:42 pm »
My advice is to stay out of it and walk away. She takes regular beatings and is standing by him, you'll just be wasting your time.
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Offline John C

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #4 on: August 3, 2019, 10:41:27 pm »
but she has begged me not to say anything to anybody, not to any of his friends and family  (which I know really well)

But this is the controlling nature of domestic violence and the relentless fear-factor bestowed on the victims mate. Excuses range from blind love, children, more violence and often financial reasons. This lady deserves intervention for her long term health and dignity. Tell the family, tell everyone and let her get the support to make an immediate and positive change for her life. There may be struggles for her at first but in a couple of years she will be happier.

This isn't the hard choice people are making out, this is a choice to liberalise someone from a fucking c*nt.

Offline soxfan

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #5 on: August 3, 2019, 10:46:34 pm »
but if I stay silent and she forgives him and the next time he kills her I don't know if I could live with that.
I'm no expert, not at all. I know this must be incredibly hard for you.

If you say nothing, he's likely to keep beating her. And yes, there's a small chance he could kill her someday, whether he would mean to or not (he hits her, she falls backward and her head is split open on furniture, etc). Her life will guaranteed to be hell forever, living in fear, no matter what. He's not going to miraculously change.

If you say something, the beatings might not stop, but others will be aware of the animal he is. And she'll have a chance at a better life.

Good luck, keep getting advice from people. But remember your quote above.
“Do not intermingle with people who act like 'they know it all'. If you do, you will wind up as lost and lonely as they are.”
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Offline hixxstar

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #6 on: August 3, 2019, 10:58:06 pm »
My advice is to stay out of it and walk away. She takes regular beatings and is standing by him, you'll just be wasting your time.
Bang on... just blank them, leave them to it... they have bigger problems than you..
if you get involved i guarantee ... you will end up being the bad man... probably off both sides  ;D
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Offline John C

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #7 on: August 3, 2019, 11:01:29 pm »
But remember your quote above.
His concern shouldn't be just what if next time he kills her, it should be merely what if he does it again!

Some replies are classic misunderstandings of domestic violence. Women eventually have to get out of these situations. It may take time, bravery, intervention or the perpetrator being jailed. So the sooner it ends, the better for the person.





« Last Edit: August 4, 2019, 01:11:07 am by John C »

Offline Brian Blessed

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #8 on: August 3, 2019, 11:50:39 pm »
1. Don’t lie for him to anyone, let alone the police.

2. If you tell the family and they do beat him, that’s entirely on him, not you.
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Offline Ciara (with a capital "C")

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #9 on: August 3, 2019, 11:52:37 pm »
I would do everything I could to ensure the man is put in prison, and that starts with being honest with the Police when you are approached - that is the best way to stop the abuse and protect the victim.

Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #10 on: August 4, 2019, 12:02:14 am »
His concern shouldn't be just what if next time he kills her, it should be merely what if he does it again!

Some replies are classic misunderstandings of domestic violence. Women eventually have to get out of of these situations. It may take time, bravery, intervention or the perpetrator being jailed. So the sooner it ends, the better for the person.

You're spot on John.

Domestic violence (and from either partner though admittedly female on male is rare though it does happen and is likely under reported) always requires timely intervention by friends and authorities if it's not to escalate and lead to sometimes truly tragic consequences.

Certainly there's been far too many women subjected to it, and also family who have witnessed it and also suffer or even worse continue the pattern learned as if it's normal behaviour, and due to non intervention, then subjected to it happening time and time again and over generations.

It's abhorrent and unnecessary behaviour, an indication of a  complete lack of control, and is pretty unforgiveable in a supposed loving and caring environment.

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Offline Jake

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #11 on: August 4, 2019, 07:14:57 am »
A large portion of my job is dealing with situations like this. Not stepping in for those unwilling, but when the victim seeks help.

If wife isn't willing to leave, then I'm afraid there's nothing you can do. If you get the chance to speak to her alone then maybe there is.

Perhaps she's afraid to leave because she thinks she's financially tied to him and he'll kick her out of the house etc. There's a way she can get him out of the house and banned from coming back. Tell her to visit a family lawyer that does legal aid (there are still some of us out there) and ask about a non molestation order and an occupation order. If she's scared of what he'll do when she applies, she can ask to go ex parte, which means the judge will consider making the order before he even gets to out his side of events across. Then at least when they are in court together the orders are already in place.

Don't be spreading gossip about them to third parties, you've just got to support her as much as possible.

And if there's kids, which your post didn't mention either way, the police will have informed social services (if they are any good) and the risk is if they see the DV, or are exposed to it through wife being emotionally damaged afterwards, they could even say she is not putting them first and they might try to intervene.

Best of luck to her.
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Offline redbyrdz

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #12 on: August 4, 2019, 07:45:44 am »
He needs to sort his drinking out and he needs to do some sort of anger management therapy. When you talk to him, make that clear to him. From all that you said, it sounds like he does love her, but there's something in him that makes him lash out and he can't control it.

She needs some sort of counseling too - something to make her realise that what she's going through is not right and can't continue.
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Offline Red Beret

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #13 on: August 4, 2019, 08:41:27 am »
One of my besties was trying to break up with her gaslighting prick of an ex for the best part of three years.  He damaged her self confidence and self image very badly, without ever laying a finger on her.  I get very edgy when she starts chatting with new guys, but I have to let her get on with it and just offer advice and support as best I can.  But I've only known her four or five years.  If I'd known somebody for 40 odd years then I'd feel bound to offer some intervention.  Silence and secrecy is what allows this kind of stuff to flourish.
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Offline Medellin

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #14 on: August 4, 2019, 09:56:03 am »
If she wants to stay in a relationship being a punchbag there is little you can do.
The little thing i would do is confront him,let him know what will happen if he touches her again,the likelihood of him stopping is remote but it's the first step.
You can't be a bystander.
If it means exposing him to his family & losing your friendship so be it.
There is no way in the world i would do nothing.
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Offline rob1966

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #15 on: August 4, 2019, 10:09:56 am »
His concern shouldn't be just what if next time he kills her, it should be merely what if he does it again!

Some replies are classic misunderstandings of domestic violence. Women eventually have to get out of these situations. It may take time, bravery, intervention or the perpetrator being jailed. So the sooner it ends, the better for the person.

I have two exes who suffered domestic violence before I knew them and my sister in law was with a controlling prick, so I know more than I'd like to know about the subject. I fully understand that she needs to get out of it and her life will vastly improve, but the OP won't be the one who can help.

This utter c*nt has been arrested and will be charged and go before the courts, the Police are now involved, so the support services for domestic abuse are now aware and will be assisting her. All the OP will do is end up alienating himself from the woman, she will put blame on him if anything happens to the lowlife.

If the Police were not aware, I would give different advice, but they are aware, so the dynamic has changed.
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Offline DangerScouse

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #16 on: August 4, 2019, 10:10:20 am »
My advice is to stay out of it and walk away. She takes regular beatings and is standing by him, you'll just be wasting your time.

Have to say I completely disagree with this advice. Presumably you know his missus well, she needs help as does he. Imagine the feeling of guilt you'd have, if something serious was to happen to her.

Offline rob1966

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #17 on: August 4, 2019, 10:12:03 am »
Have to say I completely disagree with this advice. Presumably you know his missus well, she needs help as does he. Imagine the feeling of guilt you'd have, if something serious was to happen to her.

You replied as I was posting. As I've stated, the Police, courts and support services are already involved,so what else will he do other than cause more violence?.
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Offline Lusty

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #18 on: August 4, 2019, 10:22:33 am »
Honestly would rather take advice from the experts on something like this rather than a bunch of randoms on a football forum.

Refuge have a confidential helpline. Give them a call, get the facts and see what they advise.

Offline John C

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #19 on: August 4, 2019, 10:56:41 am »
OK, I've shown my daughter the OP. She has been trained and has worked in a domestic violence support centre giving advice. She states that it is best for you to keep out of it.
If the victim isn't seeking support there is nothing you can do to help her and it may actually make things worse for her.

I struggle to agree as it seems irresponsible and uncaring, but there you go.

Offline Billy The Kid

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #20 on: August 4, 2019, 11:05:12 am »
I would do everything I could to ensure the man is put in prison, and that starts with being honest with the Police when you are approached - that is the best way to stop the abuse and protect the victim.

While I agree with the sentiment of what you're saying, I think it's worth noting that the victim doesn't seem to want protection, so there's probably more to this than meets the eye. Sounds like quite a fucked up state of affairs. I would stay out of it
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Offline rob1966

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #21 on: August 4, 2019, 11:21:21 am »
OK, I've shown my daughter the OP. She has been trained and has worked in a domestic violence support centre giving advice. She states that it is best for you to keep out of it.
If the victim isn't seeking support there is nothing you can do to help her and it may actually make things worse for her.

I struggle to agree as it seems irresponsible and uncaring, but there you go.

It is none of those things, sadly, it the facts of the matter that has been learned from years of working with these cases. Ask a police officer/doorman/member of the public how many times they have intervened in cases where someone was beating their partner and ended up getting attacked by the victim. Ask people who have tried to help in these circumstances and how they they have been pushed away and blamed for interfering. You cannot force your help on them and it can lead to more violence as the abuser blames the victim.

At least in this case the Police have taken action, so hopefully she will see sense, although getting knocked out doesn't seem to have opened her eyes.
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Offline Billy The Kid

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #22 on: August 4, 2019, 11:26:21 am »
It is none of those things, sadly, it the facts of the matter that has been learned from years of working with these cases. Ask a police officer/doorman/member of the public how many times they have intervened in cases where someone was beating their partner and ended up getting attacked by the victim. Ask people who have tried to help in these circumstances and how they they have been pushed away and blamed for interfering. You cannot force your help on them and it can lead to more violence as the abuser blames the victim.

At least in this case the Police have taken action, so hopefully she will see sense, although getting knocked out doesn't seem to have opened her eyes.

Fully agree with Rob here. I've come across situations similar to this in the past. You can have the best intentions in the world, but if you're dealing with someone who doesn't want to be helped then all bets are off. There's nothing you can really do
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Offline Port_vale_lad

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #23 on: August 4, 2019, 12:42:57 pm »
Thanks for all the replies.

Have sobered up a up and bit and calmed down a lot.

Just gonna stay out of it I think, wash my hands of him now he can feck off, spent quite a bit of time talking to her on the phone yesterday and doubt im gonna change her mind anytime soon if she hasn't changed her mind after 14 years I reckon im pissing in the wind.

just got to hope the police prosecute him and she has some sort of epiphany and leaves the scumbag.

As good as it would feel to kick the shit out of him what would it achieve really? absolutely feck all

have tried to speak to her again this morning but getting no answer so iv text her to tell her we will be here for her whatever she needs, I cant really see what else I can do

So thanks everyone  :wave

Offline Jake

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #24 on: August 4, 2019, 12:47:04 pm »

This utter c*nt has been arrested and will be charged and go before the courts, the Police are now involved, so the support services for domestic abuse are now aware and will be assisting her. All the OP will do is end up alienating himself from the woman, she will put blame on him if anything happens to the lowlife.


I bet he gets off scot free. Have seen horrible cases NFA'd because of not enough evidence (read: not enough money in the system to look into it)
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Offline Red Beret

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #25 on: August 4, 2019, 02:49:55 pm »
I bet he gets off scot free. Have seen horrible cases NFA'd because of not enough evidence (read: not enough money in the system to look into it)

The police assumed powers to prosecute against the will of victims in situations like this for the very reason they will rarely press charges themselves.  We can only hope justice is served in this matter.
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Offline Mark Walters

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #26 on: August 5, 2019, 10:59:04 am »
I find it very difficult to believe that victims in these situations don't want help.  They do, but they're scared of the loss of financial security, stability, being alone and scared of their partner seeking revenge.  They feel trapped and it's often a case of better the devil you know. But for their sake they should know that there absolutely is a way out.
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Offline End Product

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #27 on: August 5, 2019, 02:15:07 pm »
Horrible to read about this .

To give some insight as someone who has gone through this, and share what it was like so to better understand the nature of this as it is not simple.

 In my case its slightly different as it was family based but the same mentality applies. Feelings a victim has for the abuser are very complex and do not seem rational to the outsider.

Firstly you don't understand that you are being abused .That sounds mad right ?

 Between the incidents everything can be fine , you said yourself that they seem the perfect couple, then something will happen an outburst a violent event.

 what do you do ? You blame yourself, it's something you did to trigger the attack, you blame yourself, as the abuser will blame you for making them do the thing they did,  the level of control this person has on you is difficult to understand to the outsider.  Plus this is done by people who you believe love you, and you love them or have at some point loved them and you can have fun happy times together. To have someone like that beat you your confidence and self worth are at zero and it's difficult to be strong with no self worth. Also it just becomes pattern what happens the mind is so powerful that it displaces what happened, you don't consider yourself abused.       

Secondly why don't they leave ? Well your biggest fear is fear of death.

 And there is fear that you will be killed,  "i'll fucking kill you , tell anyone i'll fucking kill you," whilst having a knife held to your throat so tight that you can hear the blade pressing against your skin will soon sober you, and have you acting in a ways that make no sense, it's where logic goes out the window.
 
"well if they don't want help you can't help them" ,

Imagining the above circumstances. 

can you see why the victim might not want appear to want help?
Can you see why even the victim would defend the abuser?
Can you see why she would beg for you not to tell anybody ?

 Unless the abuser is locked up for the rest of there lives from the point of calling 999 (which we know is not going to happen) the victim is fearing for there life and having been through it myself that fear is overpowering.   

The chances of being killed after you leave are at the highest and most dangerous. I bet you she will have attempted to reach out or leave and that's when the violence ramps up as the abuser has nothing to lose.

  Were will you go ? Without a support network the person will find it very very hard to leave as much of that is to do with is protection for fear of reprisals and not just a roof over your head.     

I left only when the violence was so bad that i welcomed death , i wanted them to do it, i no longer cared i would rather be dead than put up with it, so the fear was gone, but fuck me that is dire set of affairs to go through,  i was lucky it did not go over the edge, but this women, if she is being knocked out she is on the edge,           


Lastly your friend, is the lowest form of scum.He really is. Shocking isn't it?  that he appears perfectly normal and probably very likeable , only adding to the fact people would not believe your story police etc   

  The idea that he just  lashes out as a sign of frustration after a drink or a rough day is inaccurate, the disturbing fact is that the people who do it, enjoy it .

 There is a pleasure in what they do , I've been hit by people who are lashing out and then there's the other kind who enjoy it, it is absolute mind fuck that someone who is supposed to love you takes pleasure in what they do and i guarantee this scumbag does. 

My advice is this is only going to get worse in silence. Support this women tell her family, tell the police everything you know, do not kick the shit out of him , violence begets violence, dismiss this man from your life.

 She will and can only leave if she feels like she has support and protection the more she has the better chance in my opinion.

Hope the post helps people understand the warped state that a victim can get into.   
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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #28 on: August 5, 2019, 02:53:04 pm »
The only thing that is clear is you should speak to her and find out about the state of their relationship, which you seem to have done.

Has he been hitting her 2 - 3 times a month for the 14 years of marriage or is it something recent?

If it's the latter, wait for information and see how both can be helped.

 If it's the former she should have left him a long time ago and you shouldn't really be relying on her judgement at all, her head's gone. If more can be done to get her out by outing him to family then consider doing it.