Topic: Darwin Núñez (Darwin Gabriel Núñez Ribeiro)

[Coolie High]

Not necessarily. He'll be judged on how he performs and how the team performs. Drogba averaged 12 league goals a season at Chelsea, no-one would call him anything but a major success though. If he's a pest who doesn't score a vast amount for a striker but causes a load of shit for other players to shine and help us be successful, then who cares if he's not scoring 25 goals a season.

The bit in bold is peak Fromola. Never change, you're unique in a very special way.

True.

[afc tukrish]

The bit in bold is peak Fromola. Never change, you're unique in a very special way.

Peak implies positivity, though.

Maybe "abyssal" Fromola would be more appropriate...

[Asam]

it's unreasonable for a striker to come in to this league and expect them to score 20 goals in the first season, I'd say 12-15 of league goals and 20 in all comps is a fair target, 12-15 is on the high side but he is our record signing so the expectation is that he can deliver, second season he should be close to 20 league goals

The issue with him playing on the left is that is also the best position of Diaz and if we have to choose between one if them I'd select Diaz, could try a 4-2-3-1 with Diaz in the 10 with Jota on the left and Salah on the right but we just don't have the legs in midfield to accomodate them all.

[Egyptian36]

Personally I think the plan was to rebuild the midfield first then bring him but because how crazy the transfer market is and English clubs throwing money at players so we had to do it earlier. It's difficult for a top experienced striker if your midfield is struggling let alone a young one so we need to be patient and ignore the media comparing him and Haaland. Haaland has a settled attacking creative midfield behind him.

[Fromola]

it's unreasonable for a striker to come in to this league and expect them to score 20 goals in the first season, I'd say 12-15 of league goals and 20 in all comps is a fair target, 12-15 is on the high side but he is our record signing so the expectation is that he can deliver, second season he should be close to 20 league goals

The issue with him playing on the left is that is also the best position of Diaz and if we have to choose between one if them I'd select Diaz, could try a 4-2-3-1 with Diaz in the 10 with Jota on the left and Salah on the right but we just don't have the legs in midfield to accomodate them all.

The all comps part is key which has been my point. 20 league goals is too much to expect in 30 odd games in his first season (unless he blitzed it from the start like Torres did or Haaland is). 20 goals in 50 odd games is achievable for your main striker. Jota and Mane both achieved this last season. He's not a cheap punt like Minamino to grab a few goals here and there, he's our record buy which comes with expectations.

Incidentally Torres's first season at Liverpool is the only season in his career he scored 20 league goals, so it's longevity that you want from Nunez as well. One season at Chelsea Torres scored 22 goals as well but in 64 appearances and only 8 in the league. 20 goals in a season target is different if you're playing 55-60 games. Michael Owen never scored 20 league goals in his career. In 5 different seasons with us he did top 20 goals though in all comps.

It eases the burden a lot if Mo and Jota score regularly but the problem he'll have then is getting in the team over Jota. Without Mane or a productive midfield we do need whoever is playing through the middle to knock the goals in.

[classycarra]

this continues to be quote an 'interesting' thread!

couple of pages ago it seemed like some people were sort of shouting 'xg! its the volume of shots that matter' at those who expressed anything not rose-tinted about early signals from his very small number of minutes.

but lately it seems like the new one is 'it's not about the number of goals, what matters most is who he scores against and when'. not entirely sure how that tallies with the interpretation of xg.

plus the smattering of people thinking they're defending nunez by saying anyone slightly critical of his start is only doing it because they're deluded/jealous/worried about banter (on the weirder end of spectrum) because of haalands start - saying 'noone should be comparing the two, it's not fair', only to then compare the two again (and sur others on to continue comparisons).

that's not even mentioning the more conspiratorial posters, implying there's some kind of media hearts and minds campaign that's succeeding in fooling us supporters into thinking he's not had a perfect start. all kinds of fun in here!

[El Lobo]

this continues to be quote an 'interesting' thread!

couple of pages ago it seemed like some people were sort of shouting 'xg! its the volume of shots that matter' at those who expressed anything not rose-tinted about early signals from his very small number of minutes.

but lately it seems like the new one is 'it's not about the number of goals, what matters most is who he scores against and when'. not entirely sure how that tallies with the interpretation of xg.

plus the smattering of people thinking they're defending nunez by saying anyone slightly critical of his start is only doing it because they're deluded/jealous/worried about banter (on the weirder end of spectrum) because of haalands start - saying 'noone should be comparing the two, it's not fair', only to then compare the two again (and sur others on to continue comparisons).

that's not even mentioning the more conspiratorial posters, implying there's some kind of media hearts and minds campaign that's succeeding in fooling us supporters into thinking he's not had a perfect start. all kinds of fun in here!

And now of course the ‘must not question anyone being negative’ police

Always welcome, always welcome.

[Son of Spion]

this continues to be quote an 'interesting' thread!

couple of pages ago it seemed like some people were sort of shouting 'xg! its the volume of shots that matter' at those who expressed anything not rose-tinted about early signals from his very small number of minutes.

but lately it seems like the new one is 'it's not about the number of goals, what matters most is who he scores against and when'. not entirely sure how that tallies with the interpretation of xg.

plus the smattering of people thinking they're defending nunez by saying anyone slightly critical of his start is only doing it because they're deluded/jealous/worried about banter (on the weirder end of spectrum) because of haalands start - saying 'noone should be comparing the two, it's not fair', only to then compare the two again (and sur others on to continue comparisons).

that's not even mentioning the more conspiratorial posters, implying there's some kind of media hearts and minds campaign that's succeeding in fooling us supporters into thinking he's not had a perfect start. all kinds of fun in here!

Surely you aren't suggesting there might be a wide range of opinion on a public forum? 

[classycarra]

Surely you aren't suggesting there might be a wide range of opinion on a public forum? 

Oh I am! It's great, I love rawk!

some of the arguing has been a bit daft as has some of the (at-times factional) incredulity about posts sharing a view on one of our footballers, but the 'don't compare him to haaland because haaland [insert comparison here]' stuff is a highlight and very funny

[Frey Lockyer]

Aye, that lad seems like a good footballer—just like Linudden. He's a legendary one.

Strewth!

[K-B-K]

Based on his games for Benfica, particularly against us last season.

There's a few issues I see with that though. For one, I'll admit, I don't watch Benfica games, outside of the ones he had against us, I've done the usual player investigation that goes on when you first sign a new player. We play a high line, and Nunez is quick, he can exploit those high lines well, which he did against us in that 2nd half at Anfield, but that's not what we are facing, we have slowed our play down significantly as the seasons have gone on, and we tend to be playing against the deep block. We can rarely exploit the pace of our forwards, there's obviously situations where we can but for most of the game we are trying to break down a deep defence. If we can get him space in behind then he's an asset anywhere along that line, but against those deep blocks I don't think he has the dribbling ability or the creativity to play out wide. I'm not saying he has no ability in those areas, but not enough for width to be his primary position. He needs to be in the middle causing problems and using his height and strength in my opinion. We know he can finish and we know he is athletic, I feel we just need to get him into those positions and hope with some confidence he will start banging them in.

[Fromola]

There's a few issues I see with that though. For one, I'll admit, I don't watch Benfica games, outside of the ones he had against us, I've done the usual player investigation that goes on when you first sign a new player. We play a high line, and Nunez is quick, he can exploit those high lines well, which he did against us in that 2nd half at Anfield, but that's not what we are facing, we have slowed our play down significantly as the seasons have gone on, and we tend to be playing against the deep block. We can rarely exploit the pace of our forwards, there's obviously situations where we can but for most of the game we are trying to break down a deep defence. If we can get him space in behind then he's an asset anywhere along that line, but against those deep blocks I don't think he has the dribbling ability or the creativity to play out wide. I'm not saying he has no ability in those areas, but not enough for width to be his primary position. He needs to be in the middle causing problems and using his height and strength in my opinion. We know he can finish and we know he is athletic, I feel we just need to get him into those positions and hope with some confidence he will start banging them in.

I assumed that's a big part of why we signed him though?  To help breakdown deep defences as we mix it up more. Particularly after those three scoreless finals and games like the Spurs one which proved costly. As you say though you'd expect that to mean he needs to play through the middle.

We'd be well aware when assessing him he's not going to be playing against high lines, other than the odd opponent like City.

[plura]

He's also another type of threat for our endless crosses into the box with his height and strength(?)

[killer-heels]

I assumed that's a big part of why we signed him though?  To help breakdown deep defences as we mix it up more. Particularly after those three scoreless finals and games like the Spurs one which proved costly. As you say though you'd expect that to mean he needs to play through the middle.

We'd be well aware when assessing him he's not going to be playing against high lines, other than the odd opponent like City.

Those three finals where we didn't score, far too much was made about them. We absolutely should have scored in all of them, certainly in Paris and the FA Cup final.

[klopptopia]

and Mane missed what was basically an open goal in the League Cup final

[K-B-K]

I assumed that's a big part of why we signed him though?  To help breakdown deep defences as we mix it up more. Particularly after those three scoreless finals and games like the Spurs one which proved costly. As you say though you'd expect that to mean he needs to play through the middle.

We'd be well aware when assessing him he's not going to be playing against high lines, other than the odd opponent like City.

Yeah exactly, that's my point, my reply is strictly referring to the idea of playing him wide, not about why we signed him.

[Fromola]

Yeah exactly, that's my point, my reply is strictly referring to the idea of playing him wide, not about why we signed him.

Looks like Uruguay are playing him wide tonight, still trying to accommodate Suarez and Cavani

He's obviously a centre forward, City/Norway wouldn't play Haaland wide.

[K-B-K]

Looks like Uruguay are playing him wide tonight, still trying to accommodate Suarez and Cavani

He's obviously a centre forward, City/Norway wouldn't play Haaland wide.

Yeah, I mean I don't understand that personally, but like I'm no expert, I can only voice an opinion, although going by the scoreline that line up hasn't worked out for them tonight, but like i said, my opinion isn't worth much lool.

I just think, looking at the make up of the player, having him central makes sense, but obviously with how our system has been for a while now, we've never had a stronger, taller forward in the middle since the early Klopp days where he obviously wasn't a fan of Benteke (different player though of course, just the closest comparison we have), it's gonna take an adjustment, either that or it'll fail, I have no clue, I'm hoping the former obviously, I'm fairly confident he will come good. Who knows though.

[Fromola]

Yeah, I mean I don't understand that personally, but like I'm no expert, I can only voice an opinion, although going by the scoreline that line up hasn't worked out for them tonight, but like i said, my opinion isn't worth much lool.

I just think, looking at the make up of the player, having him central makes sense, but obviously with how our system has been for a while now, we've never had a stronger, taller forward in the middle since the early Klopp days where he obviously wasn't a fan of Benteke (different player though of course, just the closest comparison we have), it's gonna take an adjustment, either that or it'll fail, I have no clue, I'm hoping the former obviously

Klopp developed Lewandowski into a world class striker at a similar age at least.

[K-B-K]

Klopp developed Lewandowski into a world class striker at a similar age at least.

Yeah, that's very true, that's why I'm hopeful after an adjustment period things can really get going for Nunez, I don't think anyone can doubt he has potential.

[classycarra]

Klopp developed Lewandowski into a world class striker at a similar age at least.

Was a couple of years younger than Nunez, when he joined Dortmund (and he started every league game bar one from his first season, so very different situation in terms of developing in and with the team rather than working to become a feature of the team).

At the same age Lewandoski led Dortmund had won two leagues and the season they went to the CL final was just starting

[K-B-K]

Was a couple of years younger than Nunez, when he joined Dortmund (and he started every league game bar one from his first season, so very different situation in terms of developing in and with the team rather than working to become a feature of the team).

At the same age Lewandoski led Dortmund had won two leagues and the season they went to the CL final was just starting

Even still, footballers last longer now and so he has more time to develop I think, just look at Lewa now, his best basically came in his 30s (was obviously still banging them in earlier, but not 55 goals in a season). Plus, Salah was older than Nunez when he was getting binned off by Chelsea, and look how that turned out.

[afc tukrish]

Was a couple of years younger than Nunez, when he joined Dortmund (and he started every league game bar one from his first season, so very different situation in terms of developing in and with the team rather than working to become a feature of the team).

At the same age Lewandoski led Dortmund had won two leagues and the season they went to the CL final was just starting

CarraBuzzkill, reporting from RAWK... 

[Clint Eastwood]

The circus around him is incredible really. Every day, an idiot posting a new clip of him missing a chance/pass in training, or an equally stupid Liverpool fan countering by posting clips of strikes that are decent but have been saved. Never quite seen anything like it.

[MonsLibpool]

The circus around him is incredible really. Every day, an idiot posting a new clip of him missing a chance/pass in training, or an equally stupid Liverpool fan countering by posting clips of strikes that are decent but have been saved. Never quite seen anything like it.

People are desperate for him to fail.

[classycarra]

CarraBuzzkill, reporting from RAWK... 

[killer-heels]

The circus around him is incredible really. Every day, an idiot posting a new clip of him missing a chance/pass in training, or an equally stupid Liverpool fan countering by posting clips of strikes that are decent but have been saved. Never quite seen anything like it.

Yep. Its like his signing has somehow been the catalyst for all new media to really shine in its banterism. I have never experienced a situation where a player for us has been so scrutinised so early on. Video clips of him crossing the ball in training, a random shot wide, its really mad.

I think a lot of it could be because of whats happening in the league. We havent started well, teams with big to decent size followings like United, Spurs and Arsenal are doing better, you have Haaland being incredible that now people see an opportunity to strike and they have gone in bold like the Chancellor today.

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Getting fucked off with having the read that ugly fucks name on every bastard page.

[RedBec1993]

I can’t think of any other player in the premier league that has been scrutinised so early on, why is Nunez? It’s madness. Hope he doesn’t read any of the shite being written, especially by Liverpool fans, luckily can’t read English. Doubt he’d go through the trouble of translating. I know footballers tend to need to have thick skin but he’s a young lad desperate to impress. You’d swear he hasn’t influenced games since he signed for us. He’s scored a few and has looked dangerous.

[Historical Fool]

I can’t think of any other player in the premier league that has been scrutinised so early on, why is Nunez? It’s madness. Hope he doesn’t read any of the shite being written, especially by Liverpool fans, luckily can’t read English. Doubt he’d go through the trouble of translating. I know footballers tend to need to have thick skin but he’s a young lad desperate to impress. You’d swear he hasn’t influenced games since he signed for us. He’s scored a few and has looked dangerous.

I’m sure Uruguayan(42? 21? 666? Can’t remember) will translate stuff especially on RAWK for him. He used to help Suarez with it.

[xbugawugax]

The circus around him is incredible really. Every day, an idiot posting a new clip of him missing a chance/pass in training, or an equally stupid Liverpool fan countering by posting clips of strikes that are decent but have been saved. Never quite seen anything like it.

thats social media for you

sad life of bottom dwellers hoping others fail in their life as well

just saw highlight of his national game. thought he looked ok enough as a wide left. worked hard and managed to find some space with is pace. his ball control obviously not at mane's level. thought uruguay would put him at least in the middle and plan for the future instead of putting 2 aging forwards in the middle and shafting their most promising centre forward on the left.

[MonsLibpool]

He has now deactivated comments on his Twitter posts. He should take a clean break from social media or leave it to his agents IMO.

[Dim Glas]

Was a couple of years younger than Nunez, when he joined Dortmund (and he started every league game bar one from his first season, so very different situation in terms of developing in and with the team rather than working to become a feature of the team).

At the same age Lewandoski led Dortmund had won two leagues and the season they went to the CL final was just starting

Lewa only started 15 games in his first season at Dortmund, it was Lucas Barrios leading the line in that first league title season.  Lewa was 22 in that first season. 

Not that I’m comparing both, just pointing that out! Lewandowski is one of the greatest ever, a high bar not many will reach.

[killer-heels]

He has now deactivated comments on his Twitter posts. He should take a clean break from social media or leave it to his agents IMO.

Clearly affected by all of this. Think it was his response in the summer that made people sense blood.

[Eeyore]

He has now deactivated comments on his Twitter posts. He should take a clean break from social media or leave it to his agents IMO.

That is what he did in his first season at Benfica. It galvanized him and then he smashed it.

[killer-heels]

That is what he did in his first season at Benfica. It galvanized him and then he smashed it.

Did it? Thought it was his second season where he started scoring?

[classycarra]

Lewa only started 15 games in his first season at Dortmund, it was Lucas Barrios leading the line in that first league title season.  Lewa was 22 in that first season. 

Not that I’m comparing both, just pointing that out! Lewandowski is one of the greatest ever, a high bar not many will reach.

Sorry, mixed up the years I checked - meant played every league game bar one. Cheers for correcting. Took him to around halfway point of the season before back to back starts came, but then they were there to stay.

And yep him being 22 was my point (as it was suggested Klopp started working with him at a similar age to Nunez, who's older)

Clearly affected by all of this. Think it was his response in the summer that made people sense blood.

Yeah does seem to be. I'm surprised he continued to check/use it and allow comments after the stuff in preseason was bothering him

[Eeyore]

Did it? Thought it was his second season where he started scoring?

He got shit on facebook, it galvanised him and he got better.

[bird_lfc]

He’s a lad in his early 20’s with the world at his feet. In todays day and age it’s very easy to say ‘just come off social media’ which is a shame because I can only imagine how some of the shit these footballers see online make them feel

Disabling comments is a good start for sure. From what I’ve seen heard he’s had no one on his back at games (and rightly so) so blocking out that negativity will hopefully help him

Still got faith in the lad that he’s gonna be a beast for us long term

[Son of Spion]

It's bizarre really. There's been so much written about this guy and so many conclusions come to already, yet I feel like I've only seen him play about five minutes football in a Liverpool shirt.