Author Topic: Rafa Benitez - It's a Gran O Tea  (Read 16320 times)

Offline zabadoh

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Rafa Benitez - It's a Gran O Tea
« on: August 24, 2019, 11:36:06 pm »
Here's an opinion piece from Hong Kong's English language daily, the South China Morning Post:

https://www.scmp.com/sport/football/article/3017046/rafa-benitez-has-swapped-newcastle-united-their-chinese-super-league

Allegedly, he's the second highest paid football manager in the world now.  Good for him!

The writer says Dalian are comparable to Newcastle in manager turnover, which doesn't bode well if Rafa's rebuilding project should falter.

Quote
He’ll have different constraints in China, one of the only places in the world he could have gone to that might be even more schizophrenic than Newcastle United.

There are similarities. These are two towns in the north east of their countries, historically built on shipbuilding and seen as football heartlands. They also share a disappointing football team defined by long past glories.

Billionaire owner Wang Jianlin, one of the richest men in China, won’t clutch the purse strings like Ashley, but Benitez enters a club that is struggling.

I've noticed that Dalian is frequently listed by Yahoo and Google sports results as Dalian Aerbin, which is the club's old name. 

This was changed to Dalian Yifang a couple of seasons ago as a part of corporate restructuring of Wanda Group conglomerate who own the club.

He's hired a 4th assistant, "Darko Matić, a Croatian who speaks fluent Mandarin after playing for 3 CSL clubs for 10 years."

Chinese Super League rules limit foreign players on the roster to 4.  The limit for foreign players on the field is 3.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2021, 04:54:20 pm by zabadoh »
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Offline leroy

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2019, 02:49:29 pm »
Chinese Super League rules limit foreign players on the roster to 4.  The limit for foreign players on the field is 3.

There is also new rules around transfers and transfer premiums and salary caps.

Quote
...A regulation that played a major part in cutting the cost was implemented in the summer of 2017, stipulating that a 100 percent levy would kick in on foreign players costing more than 45 million yuan ($6.7 million) and on domestic signings over 20 million yuan.

New rules taking effect this season include clubs being required to cap each domestic player's beforetax annual salary at 10 million yuan, while a club's total salary expenditure for first-team and reserve players cannot exceed 65 percent of its total expenditure.

Each club's total spending cannot exceed 1.2 billion yuan this year, 1.1 billion yuan in 2020 and 900 million in 2021, according to the rule.

You'd imagine with these kinds of caps in place then premium managerial talent would be pretty attractive.

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #2 on: September 2, 2019, 01:28:12 am »
I keep checking for Dalian Yifang news, but the CSL is on break until September 13th. 

Part of that should be for the traditional Chinese Autumn Moon Festival, and possibly some kind of international break too?

This article https://news.cgtn.com/news/3d3d414d7a51444e31457a6333566d54/share_p.html implies there is a per-player salary cap, as opposed to a US-style team-wide salary cap:

"And a salary cap will be introduced to domestic leagues for next season, with the cap set at 1.44 million U.S. dollars for a player and a maximum of 1.73 million U.S. dollars for a member of the national team."

I'm not sure if that's the same figures as leroy posted, but chopped up, or what.

Also interview with Rafa in Football365:

https://www.football365.com/news/fascinating-rafa-benitez-interview-the-full-transcript

There's a transcript of a live Q&A from 8/28 paywalled in The Athletic

https://theathletic.com/1168187/2019/08/28/rafa-benitez-qa-liverpool-2005-v-2019-players-ive-coveted-celtic-rumours-a-premier-league-return/
« Last Edit: September 2, 2019, 01:47:13 am by zabadoh »
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Offline Paully

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #3 on: September 4, 2019, 03:15:39 pm »
I've just noticed this thread when I was looking for a thread about that little shit-house Owen - I miss this man  :'( :'( :'(

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #4 on: September 4, 2019, 04:40:47 pm »
@Paully Me too, but it didn't seem right to clog up the NUFC thread with Dalian Yifang news.

As many bad owners as Rafa has worked for, I'm happy he's getting a fat payday in China.

If he lasts through the 2 1/2 year term of his contract and gets paid, that is.

Dalian Yifang/Aerbin has gone through a lot of managers these last couple of years.
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Offline Paully

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #5 on: September 5, 2019, 12:04:04 pm »
@Paully Me too, but it didn't seem right to clog up the NUFC thread with Dalian Yifang news.

As many bad owners as Rafa has worked for, I'm happy he's getting a fat payday in China.

If he lasts through the 2 1/2 year term of his contract and gets paid, that is.

Dalian Yifang/Aerbin has gone through a lot of managers these last couple of years.

I still hope and think he'll be back at NUFC under new owners - he loved it up here and was worshipped by our fans.

One day, one day!

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #6 on: September 6, 2019, 01:47:45 pm »
I still hope and think he'll be back at NUFC under new owners - he loved it up here and was worshipped by our fans.

One day, one day!

Yes why not, he's so canny it wouldn't surprise me if he was talking to the Chinese about funding for Newcastle to buy out soft shite. Rafa as CEO would be great for the club.

Offline Paully

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2019, 12:45:30 pm »
Yes why not, he's so canny it wouldn't surprise me if he was talking to the Chinese about funding for Newcastle to buy out soft shite. Rafa as CEO would be great for the club.

I'd have him  back as manager anyway!

I guess it's common knowledge for you lot but I wasn't aware of this;

"With some of the players we have worked with, it is very clear from the start — you know they will stay involved in football in some capacity, either as a coach or a manager. With Steven Gerrard, I honestly did not know. I remember our first meeting in Portugal, when we had just joined Liverpool and Stevie, who was playing for England in the European Championship, was close to leaving. We just talked football."

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2019, 03:25:26 am »
After a long international break, Dalian are back in action on Sunday 10/20 at Shanghai Shenhua who they last met and lost to 2-3 on 8/19 in the Chinese FA Cup Semifinal.

Not much news that I can find, other than a picture of Rafa coaching, in an article saying that the Chinese Super League has the highest pay disparity at 160x between players and the average pay in the country they play in. 

The next highest pay disparities are La Liga at 124x and the Premier League at 115x 

https://www.scmp.com/sport/football/article/3032839/chinese-super-leagues-millionaires-live-it-while-league-two-players

A post by Rafa on his blog on 10/9 he's pretty much building an organization from scratch again.  They're literally building new training grounds.

http://www.rafabenitez.com/web/in/blog/great-epl-day-and-work-progress/133/

The defending is terrible!  League rules say the goalie has to be Chinese, and Dalian's back 4 are Chinese as well, so they are beaten easily by imported attackers.

Here's highlights of the loss to Shanghai Shenhua that I mentioned previously:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdRSpaQ94r4
« Last Edit: October 18, 2019, 03:55:19 am by zabadoh »
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Offline Paully

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2019, 12:07:30 pm »
After a long international break, Dalian are back in action on Sunday 10/20 at Shanghai Shenhua who they last met and lost to 2-3 on 8/19 in the Chinese FA Cup Semifinal.

Not much news that I can find, other than a picture of Rafa coaching, in an article saying that the Chinese Super League has the highest pay disparity at 160x between players and the average pay in the country they play in. 

The next highest pay disparities are La Liga at 124x and the Premier League at 115x 

https://www.scmp.com/sport/football/article/3032839/chinese-super-leagues-millionaires-live-it-while-league-two-players

A post by Rafa on his blog on 10/9 he's pretty much building an organization from scratch again.  They're literally building new training grounds.

http://www.rafabenitez.com/web/in/blog/great-epl-day-and-work-progress/133/

The defending is terrible!  League rules say the goalie has to be Chinese, and Dalian's back 4 are Chinese as well, so they are beaten easily by imported attackers.

Here's highlights of the loss to Shanghai Shenhua that I mentioned previously:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdRSpaQ94r4

I'm stull gutted we let a world class manager who wanted to stay and try to realise our potential go and replaced him with Steve effing Bruce FFS

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2019, 08:10:39 am »
A 2-1 away loss to Shanghai Shenhua

https://youtu.be/8HGU8Ksdi9E
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Offline leroy

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2019, 06:01:13 am »
A 2-1 away loss to Shanghai Shenhua

https://youtu.be/8HGU8Ksdi9E

Damn. Shanghai are a scummy bunch.  My local team have played them a couple of times in the Champions League and it's just painful.  Time wasting and diving in a dead rubber from minute one.

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2019, 05:20:56 pm »
3-0 loss to 2nd placed Shanghai SIPG/East Asia, featuring Oscar and Hulk!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NE29JHwvuK8
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Offline Paully

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #13 on: November 6, 2019, 09:54:33 am »
Great read for you lot this! ;D

https://theathletic.co.uk/1351842/2019/11/06/rafa-benitez-liverpool-now-have-financial-muscle-maybe-the-great-title-obsession-will-finally-end/

In our first season, we finished fifth in the Premiership, but we were competing for something different. After so long without any of the most important trophies, it was understandable if the players lost a little focus when they were in the latter stages of the Champions League. The following year, we won two more trophies and finished third, so we were getting closer. Then it was third again and another Champions League final and then fourth.

After that? We finished second to Manchester United with 86 points, which was then a record for Liverpool in the Premier League. People still talk about ‘Rafa’s Rant’, the press conference I gave in the January, when they said Mr. Ferguson was getting under my skin. After that, I remembering going to Old Trafford and seeing a banner which read ‘Rafa Is Cracking Up’. I also remember beating them 4-1.

Offline demain

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #14 on: December 2, 2019, 03:16:34 pm »
Dalian finished 9th this season in the league, disappointing result as the team rather fell away in the last 10 games having at one point been up to 6th. Still to be convinced why Rafa chose Dalian as he is unlikely to win the league against the super clubs from Shanghai, Beijing, and Canton. Yes, he is getting paid very well for the privilege, but I won't pretend that it doesn't pain me somewhat to see him reduced to managing an also-ran club in China.
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Offline blacksun

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #15 on: December 2, 2019, 07:15:14 pm »
Arsenal should be all over him right now

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #16 on: December 5, 2019, 02:16:18 pm »
Not a great run of results but I suppose the test will be the next season - full set of games, full pre-season, the likes of Rondon fully integrated into the group.

Offline demain

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2019, 06:12:24 am »
Wonder what he makes of the decision to move to Dalian now, after the new salary cap regulations announced by the Chinese league.

He should be realistically looking for a job in Europe sharpish.
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Offline dimwit

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2019, 08:53:48 pm »
Surely they can't just disregard the contracts that they have agreed to, and which are legally binding? Unless they are paying off the remaining of the contract in a lump sum to avoid to salary cap.


Regardless, going on by the article from the echo during the Evertons search for a new manager, Rafa has apparently got control of the Dalian project to the extent that he has a say in how their 6 year olds are trained.

Reads like he sees it like he has a chance to change the way how footballers are developed in china.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rafa-benitez-everton-manager-vacancy-17391058

Unless he gets his contract called void and has to take a massive pay cut, I can really see him enjoying the project there, even if it means no star signings for his team.

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #19 on: January 9, 2020, 07:23:57 am »
This article says that Dalian Yifang's investors, the Wanda Group, are pulling funding from the team.

https://www.90min.com/posts/6531416-rafa-benitez-faces-loss-of-funds-as-dalian-yifang-s-sponsors-pull-investment

It's a sketchy summary of the first two readable paragraphs of an article from the Wall Street Journal:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/everything-is-a-chinese-real-estate-play-international-soccer-edition-11577961983

Does anyone have a WSJ subscription?

According to another teaser on a Chinese news site, Wanda Group doesn't own any shares in Dalian Yifang, so they want to put their money into a team they actually own, as opposed to sponsoring the team.

https://epaper.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202001/03/WS5e0e8222a310fb3de82eb448.html

« Last Edit: January 9, 2020, 07:43:43 am by zabadoh »
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Offline Yiannis

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2020, 12:20:21 pm »
Messi in fact doesn't have a recognizable trait.

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #21 on: July 26, 2020, 08:58:17 pm »
The Chinese Super League season has started, with Rafa's Dalian Pro (formerly known as YiFang) vs Shandong Luneng featuring Felony (Fellaini)

Full match here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4UtHa4Prjo

Rafa's lost some weight.
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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #22 on: July 27, 2020, 12:59:40 am »

'Congratulations to @LFC, after 30 years, the dream comes true! Very happy for all the Reds! You'll never walk alone #YNWA #Champions #Liverpool':-

https://twitter.com/rafabenitezweb/status/1276274465811431424
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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Yifang
« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2020, 10:11:25 am »
The Chinese Super League season has started, with Rafa's Dalian Pro (formerly known as YiFang) vs Shandong Luneng featuring Felony (Fellaini)

Full match here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4UtHa4Prjo

Rafa's lost some weight.

Fellaini scored a hat trick of headers against them.  :o

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #24 on: August 23, 2020, 10:49:47 pm »
A slow start for Rafa's Dalian Professionals at 0-2-4

Highlights vs Shenzhen FC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CVb8MrCbyo
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Offline gjr1

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #25 on: August 24, 2020, 11:45:04 pm »
A slow start for Rafa's Dalian Professionals at 0-2-4

Highlights vs Shenzhen FC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CVb8MrCbyo

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #26 on: August 25, 2020, 10:44:23 am »
What he has done with his career, it's crazy!
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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2020, 07:03:37 am »
What he has done with his career, it's crazy!

Yea seriously right - surely there's a better job around in England or Europe? Bizarre.
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Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2020, 11:12:20 pm »
Rafa's cashing it in for £12 million/year for 2 1/2 years.  To put that in perspective, he was being paid £6 million/year at Newcastle.

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rafa-benitez-dalian-yifang-newcastle-16519407

Given that he joined Dalian in July 2019, he's got 1.5 years left, unless they buy him out.
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Offline skipper757

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #29 on: August 28, 2020, 03:13:21 pm »
I suppose it was a good opportunity to earn money and experience a new culture, but there's not much quality in youth development there, and I don't really know if it's a good fit at all.  Rafa's best work has been at clubs where he had hungry, talented players ready to take the next step up.  They were willing to work hard and learn as much as possible to improve their game and try to win trophies.

If there was good young talent there, I can see it being a good project.  Essentially, the players can take the next step up working with Rafa, win in China, and then earn opportunities in European leagues.  They can also learn from Rafa what it'll be like as a professional at a top league.

This situation right now, though?  Not sure if it's a good fit at all.  Don't know much about the CSL, but traditionally it's not been producing good players of note.
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Offline IanZG

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #30 on: August 28, 2020, 03:20:32 pm »
Nothing wrong with taking that money. Shame he's not doing better, but understandable that his heart's not in it.

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #31 on: September 1, 2020, 09:22:11 am »
He's approaching possible retirement age. His chances of the really top jobs now appear to be gone (they shouldn`t be, but they do seem to be) so he is taking the money. His girls will be starting their own families soon and although he is a very wealthy man he can add another shed load to the family pot to set up generations for life. Nowt wrong with that. He can`t do much wrong in my eyes though.
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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #32 on: September 1, 2020, 01:28:09 pm »
It's a shame that he's eking out his career in such circumstances, far away from home and family, with all the restrictions and substandards involved. And why? Because he's still obsessed (not a criticism) with the game and doesn't want to retire. Oh and a huge pile of cash, not sure it's worth that alone especially in the current global situation.

When you look at his peers like Ancelotti (is he the highest paid manager above Rafa?  ;)) and Mourinho, it seems unfair. It seems his short stint at Madrid finished his reputation off at the top/CL level. I'd like to see him as a pundit, although not sure he's media-friendly enough. Sickening to say when the Neanderthal gobshite likes of Keys and Gray are still stealing a living (and oxygen) out in the UAE.
« Last Edit: September 1, 2020, 01:30:18 pm by rossipersempre »
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Offline Clayton Bigsby

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #33 on: September 3, 2020, 11:54:07 am »
This was a mercenary move, simple as that. That goes for anybody going to China as  a player/manager with no exceptions. Sad it's not going well for him but the money is a nice little buffer

Offline zabadoh

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #34 on: September 3, 2020, 06:57:11 pm »
China's wealthy, but their amateur and professional sporting infrastructure is still a decade or two behind the West.

They'll catch up eventually.

Remember how Arsene Wenger found that British football culture far less professional than what he was used to: Players smoked and drank alcohol, went out late, and ate whatever they wanted. 

Now there's sporting nutritional science, more coaches with UEFA licenses, psychologists, analytics, etc.
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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #35 on: September 3, 2020, 09:15:12 pm »
This was a mercenary move, simple as that. That goes for anybody going to China as  a player/manager with no exceptions. Sad it's not going well for him but the money is a nice little buffer
Agreed. Rafa's a brilliant man. He certainly went there with eyes wide open and certainly understood that he might be walking into a circus. It was first and foremost a cash move, with the secondary hope he might get lucky building a nice "project".
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Offline mattD

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #36 on: September 4, 2020, 02:21:13 am »
Never seems to work for anyone in China, it's football culture is just far too primitive and non-developmental at the moment. Whether that changes, who knows but it would probably take a generation before it produces anything productive.

It's a sport not deeply embedded in the Chinese psyche like it is for the English or Brazilians, and kids need to have that spark of enthusiasm that comes naturally within a footballing culture. That culture of expression, fun and flair in team sports like football also isn't evident in China - seems incredibly driven and well drilled to perfection but if the enjoyment isn't there, I don't think that intuition, individual creativity and spark of genius will be there in their footballers regardless of how hard they train (we often hear of the extreme lengths that coaches take when undertaking sports in China - works well in some sports, in football not much so I feel).

As for Rafa going for the money? Well he could embezzle the economy of a small country and I'd still think he's a legend.

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #37 on: September 5, 2020, 09:09:31 pm »
It's a shame that he's eking out his career in such circumstances, far away from home and family, with all the restrictions and substandards involved. And why? Because he's still obsessed (not a criticism) with the game and doesn't want to retire. Oh and a huge pile of cash, not sure it's worth that alone especially in the current global situation.

When you look at his peers like Ancelotti (is he the highest paid manager above Rafa?  ;)) and Mourinho, it seems unfair. It seems his short stint at Madrid finished his reputation off at the top/CL level. I'd like to see him as a pundit, although not sure he's media-friendly enough. Sickening to say when the Neanderthal gobshite likes of Keys and Gray are still stealing a living (and oxygen) out in the UAE.
I mean in regards to Ancelotti, Rafa probably could have been at an Everton, but he took the wedge and went to China instead.

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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #38 on: September 8, 2020, 10:13:50 pm »
I mean in regards to Ancelotti, Rafa probably could have been at an Everton, but he took the wedge and went to China instead.

I think that was the better choice of the two.
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Re: Rafa Benitez - Now with more Dalian Pro
« Reply #39 on: October 22, 2020, 02:34:57 pm »
His Dalian side have guaranteed top division status with a second leg playoff win. Saw the match earlier and Rafa's side is unsurprisingly well coached.  It's pleasant to see the methodology transfer so well,  the shape,  the cohesive movements of the players...whether it's Liverpool,  Napoli or Dalian.

Where next Rafa.