Topic: Star Trek

[kaesarsosei]

The Expanse is great. For anyone starting it, I found the first few episodes a little slow and confusing but 100% stick with it. Also the final season felt a little rushed and was definitely sub-par compared to before but I would put that down to a combination of Covid and possibly the issues they had with Cas Anvar (main actor who has been accused of sexual misconduct). I'm also a big Bosch fan (also on Amazon) and the final season of it was similar in that it felt rushed, but again possibly due to Covid.

It's been said before but The Orville, esp S2, is very like ST:TNG.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Ive never really been into Trek at all save for a few episodes of TNG which I actually enjoyed whenever I watched them. I watched Red Letter Media's take on this, and them being big into Star Trek, they share the same views as yourself. Mike even went as far as saying the same as yourself that he can't go back to viewing TNG.

It just seems to be a common thing these days. People get fed up with seeing the things they value in entertainment go down the drain because a bunch of talentless c*nts  with agenda's get their hands on something and destroy it. You're not allowed to complain about that, though. Not on here. Not from a select few.

You'll have to point out where someone has been prevented about complaining about anything

[Andy @ Allerton!]

This is a terrible argument, utterly awful.

I was trying to take it easy in this thread because I respect everyone's right to enjoy what they want, even though I find it incomprehensible that someone can enjoy Picard having watched 19 episodes of it now. Its fucking objectively shite.

ST:TNG is my desert-island series. If I could have only 1 box set of any TV show, ever, to watch over and over it would be TNG ahead of things like even Sopranos & Breaking Bad. So there is no way I was going into Picard thinking I am going to hate this. And how can I "watch stuff I might enjoy" without trying it anyway? Bizarre statement.

Picard is so offensively bad that it makes TNG retrospectively worse. Picard has ruined the JL Picard character itself so badly that I have lost some of the respect that I had for him watching TNG. How can I go back and watch something like Inner Light when I know that 20 years after it, JL Picard is going to be creaking around in a resurrected android body of some ungodly nature - for no discernible reason other than to enable a Season 2.

Here are some random cliff notes of nonsense and other, hateful things about Picard the series:

• Raphae is a horrible, badly written character with no clear motives and nothing sympathetic about her at all. Every time she opens her mouth, something stupid or un-necessarily aggressive comes spilling out
• 7of9 in Voyager was an unsure former Borg member who was trying to adapt to being a regular human. By the time Picard rolled around, she was some sort of murdering, psychopathic vigilante but only dealing with mundane crap. Why?
• JL Picard - in 170 episodes of TNG we had about maybe 3-4 of them dealing with JL's history. It feels like half of his screen time in Picard are flashback's or close ups of him reminiscing, often in the middle of gunfights or when he is trying to save the galaxy's future. Why does anyone care about JL's childhood? This is crap that should have been left in a novel
• Eleanor - the writers obviously were teenage boys when LotR came out and thought Legolas was the most amazing thing in the history of the world. Orlando Bloom is so washed up and lacking-charisma that I am sure they could have approached him for this role, which is about as far from anything that should be in the world of anything sci-fi, let alone ST, that its frankly offensive to the audience. A guy who brings a sword to a laser fight.

Now to the plot/writing itself. None of it makes sense and its clearly written by people who have heard "of" Star Trek and some of the concepts like the Borg, Q, but never watched it.

• Why does Soong look exactly like a descendent 300 years in the future, beyond giving a job to Brent Spiner?
• Why did Guinan, who met Picard in 19th Century USA in "Time's Arrow", not recognize him?
• Why is she working in an LA bar called "10 Forward", when "10 Forward" was named after the deck and position of the bar she worked in on TNG?
• What is the purpose of Q beyond clicking his fingers in episode 1 (which was actually a very good episode) to set up the season? His motives, abilities and actions since then make no sense. Are they saying he lost all his powers immediately after that click?
• I might have fallen asleep for this bit, but why does the 21st century timekeeper or whatever Talinn is actually look like a Romulan housekeeper 300 years in the future?
• How did an incompetent, unconfident ancient relative of Picard get the job on the most important, expensive manned mission in the history of humanity? Has anyone read or watched anything about the sort of guys who got onto the Apollo program? Its actually offensive to the memory of the likes of Neil Armstrong.

I got fooled by these clowns a few times now. Discovery Season 2 was actually kind of OK, but Seasons 1 and 3 were garbage. But at least thats done no harm. Picard S1 & S2 are so bad they have made me dislike ST in general and I'll find it difficult to ever go back to TNG again now. I'm never watching another episode of this new Trek after this Picard finale on Friday.

If this was a generic sci-fi show without the Trek name it would have died a death a long time ago. Instead these bastards are getting to spew their rubbish out indefinitely under the Trek banner.

I love all the Star Trek series, but TNG S1 and a lot of S2 was as ropey as fuck - random storylines, mischaracterisation, bizarre contraditary plots and shady effects when they ran out of money - but I still loved them.

How has Picard ‘ruined’ the character, not sure if you’re just a kid, but a lot of people have tragic or upsetting real-life backstories and this series has fleshed out the character more and shown why he turned out as he did. Patrick Stewart said that was the key reason he did the series. People get old. How he ages (or how anyone ages) doesn’t ‘ruin’ their younger selves. Again, you sound like you’re a kid. Unless you’re older and somehow are still the exact same person that you were when you were 18 (And just don’t think you are? )

Your observations about the characters seem to be that you don’t like them. Bit odd, but hey, fine. I’ve seen plenty of series with annoying characters that is still a good series.

There have been more than a few mentions that the reality they are in is likely to be an alternate reality (The Borg Queen says it several times) and there are noticeable changes - for instance when Picard and co met Guinan originally in the 1900s she didn’t recognise him then and this Guinan is clearly a lot younger than that one. If the older one didn’t recognise him then I’m at a loss to see why you’d think a younger one would?

Who said Picard’s descendant is incompetant? Star Trek has shown for years since it first came out that jumping into transporters and joining a Star Ship is something that pretty much anyone can do if they get through the academy - although in most series they focus on the Bridge Crew, there are clearly hundreds of people on each ship which can be seen to be very ordinary. The relative hasn’t been put forward as anything massively special from what I’ve seen - it’s just her mission is lucky enough to identify extraterrestrial life which led to more investment into Space Technology and brought the future on - a timeline/reality where she didn’t do that meant that the World cut the funding and became very insular and like the ‘Mirror Darkly’ alternative timeline.

I liked Discovery as well - again, not quite what I’m used to and bit ‘touchy feely’ in places, but as has been mentioned before, it’s given screenwriters a chance to write different stories in different ways that may well appeal differently to different target audiences. Seems fair enough to me - why shouldn’t different demographics get a chance to enjoy Star Trek. They don’t even need to remain anything like on Canon if the series is set in alternate timelines and we’ve seen that with the Traveller and Q from the beginning.

You seem really, really angry about it. Doesn't seem healthy that. Maybe watch some Pepper Pig and get a chill on

Talinn - again pretty obviously an alternate dimension.

[losCHUNK]

Kurtzman and co have said a few times that Picard and Disco are in the prime timeline, it's why the series starts off showing the destruction of Romulus and why Vulcan is still a thing Disco and presumably Picard.  He has talked about uniting the timelines, Kelvin and prime, so mebbe that's what they're alluding to.

In regards to diminishing your love the OG Trek, I get it, they're retconning your star character into something that wasn't, watching Picard in the new series was a bit depressing but luckily enough my brain can detach it from the original without it spoiling it.

[Red Beret]

I didn't dislike the first season of Picard, but the problem with season one is that the end felt guillotined - like they squeezed a 12 episode season into 10. The ending was so badly botched I was seriously pissed off and felt really let down.

They seemed to have learned slightly in this new season, but I can't say for sure because I'm basing that opinion on clips I saw on Youtube - enough to get the gist of what was going on without risking getting burned again by investing in a series that might let me down again.

Based on what I've seen, the ending was predictable, but not unenjoyable; and seems marginally better quality than season one at least.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Really enjoyed that last episode

Spoiler

I always wondered what happened to Wes Crusher - the Traveller always said that one day he'd become one and that now makes sense of 'The Watchers' - a group to help Space and Time - a concept explored in several Star Trek series and hopefully will lead to a spin-off series

I loved the idea that Q really bothered Picard because he was his friend and that end to his existance had him meddle one more time to help Picard not face the future that he himself faced - dying alone and unremarked. A beautiful moment that was really moving.

The series has set up some really good ideas with the Borg joining up with the Federation to oppose whatever the hell that is

Thought there were some great moments through the series and it has opened the door on quite a few different ideas for the future.

[close]

[Riquende]

Really enjoyed that last episode

[kaesarsosei]

I have been extremely critical of Picard, but the first episode of S2 was great and the last one was also pretty damn good. Its a pity they had to ruin it with 8 episodes of unmitigated shite in between.

I also read that several of the cast members aren't coming back for S3. Most of them shouldn't have been there for S2.

[oojason]

Really enjoyed that last episode

Spoiler

I always wondered what happened to Wes Crusher - the Traveller always said that one day he'd become one and that now makes sense of 'The Watchers' - a group to help Space and Time - a concept explored in several Star Trek series and hopefully will lead to a spin-off series

I loved the idea that Q really bothered Picard because he was his friend and that end to his existance had him meddle one more time to help Picard not face the future that he himself faced - dying alone and unremarked. A beautiful moment that was really moving.

The series has set up some really good ideas with the Borg joining up with the Federation to oppose whatever the hell that is

Thought there were some great moments through the series and it has opened the door on quite a few different ideas for the future.

[close]

Same here. Enjoyable episode and quality season finale too.


The new series 'Strange New Worlds' had a strong start as well.

[Trada]

I enjoyed the first episode of Star Trek strange new world just good old fashion Star Trek.

[Red Beret]

I have been extremely critical of Picard, but the first episode of S2 was great and the last one was also pretty damn good. Its a pity they had to ruin it with 8 episodes of unmitigated shite in between.

I also read that several of the cast members aren't coming back for S3. Most of them shouldn't have been there for S2.

Seemed pretty obvious early on that at least two characters wouldn't be returning. Looks to be more like three now though.

[oojason]

I enjoyed the first episode of Star Trek strange new world just good old fashion Star Trek.

Fully agree mate - the second episode was pretty good too.

Loving the TOS vibes - and the feel that there is a proper crew here.

[[new username under construction]]

Strange New Worlds seems to be the best of the bunch out of the new series

[[new username under construction]]

Got to say I'm actually really enjoying New Worlds so far, seems like Star Trek

[RedSince86]

Strange New Worlds seems to be the best of the bunch out of the new series

It has the best Captain since Sisko as well.

[Armand9]

It has the best Captain since Sisko as well.

the best thing about Discovery was pike, was awesome in that so i was really looking forward to this new series. for some reason the acting and character of pike doesn't seem quite on the money atm compared to discovery pike but im putting that down to a new cast and all that, first seasons often seems a bit naff when you look back compared to latter season (TNG is a perfect example of that). so im kinda underwhelmed atm but i like it's old format Star Trek (original series/TNG style - episodic adventures into new territory) after we've had a number of Star Trek's that are season themed stories.

which brings me onto Picard. I was in pig's heaven after watching the first episode (i always go in blind on shows/movies i think i'll like, knowing fuckall) with certain entities turning up and i thought, this could be something special.

It's not but overall i enjoyed it by hanging on to morsels, scraps of scenes cos it's star trek with characters (some at least) that i've loved for years

Spoiler

ralfie is fucking woeful, they can't kill her off quick enough but no, they kill the romulan kid i actually like, the murderous treacherous dr chick apparently did fuckall worth of considering a crime so she's promoted

[close]

the writing and story telling is terrible from choices to dialogue, absolutely terrible, again the odd morsel i can enjoy, then back to asinine writing, so much makes no sense

Spoiler

they emphasise we can't change the timeline, they fuck up at every juncture thus changing timelines everywhere and even start changing things by choice not unfortunate circumstance they have little choice/control over

[close]

What did grate on me was the more than few quite baffling illogical story telling choices, or rather, down right gaffs as far as im concerned

Spoiler

eg a doctor from the 21st century just being handed medical technology from the 24th century and she's fine and just get on with the medical procedure - give me a fucking break. And the final fight - j h christ, they did everything they said they wouldn't do, kept moaning about not having weapons but not taking weapons off borg they down (tho there is the dna thing brought up when 'data' picks up a gun - they do that a lot in this show, dumb shit then a throw away comment to cover it over), run across half mile of fields with a gun and knife between two of them, literally, through fields of borg with auto weapons but somehow turn up in the ship having succeeded but no borg follow them in, it never ends it was absolute garbage

[close]

Spoiler

after watching ep1 i thought there's two ways they can go with this, sort it out in space, sort it out on the ground. i was really hoping for the space option but unfortunately they chose the ground option, which i feel hamstrung its potential. Looking beyond the actual set-up in ep1, for the most part that could've been a show that didn't even involve a cast from space and beyond, with the vast majority being a string of quite ordinary 'problems' to solve in fairly mundane ways. I'm left feeling it's such a missed opportunity as it had all the ingredients for a stellar story and a return to a Star Trek quality i feel hasn't hit the mark since Voyager, for me that was the last great Star Trek show.

[close]

Spoiler

i wrote the above having literally just finished the binged season minutes before. having had hours now to digest the season, allowed sentiment to settle and so am left with what actually happened in the season and it is garbage if im totally honest, after a stellar opening they fucked it over so bad, so bad, in so many ways. there is so much wrong with this season on so many levels i could fill a whole rawk page of posts listing them, i actually could but instead i'll leave you with this to illustrate one of the many things these dumbass writers have done - they've ruined the borg, for me the best antagonists not only in star trek but in all sci-fi, they've actually ruined the motherfucking borg, way to go you pricks

[close]

[oojason]

Strange New Worlds - episode 1x10 spoiler...

Spoiler

A character named 'Hansen Al Salah'... seems one of the writers, or someone on the show, is a Liverpool fan!

[close]

Quality episode, too.

[Armand9]

i thought there was a thread on strange new worlds but can't find it, so here it is

for a first season i think you have to be generally happy, especially when you think how ropey season 1 of TNG was and that turned into a fantastic show

what is most obvious to me is this IS star trek, for fans that go way back to the original or at least TNG, this is better than any of 'new' star trek, from discovery to picard and you have to go all the way back to voyager for the last quality star trek

not without weakness or flaws, but no star trek can boast that, and as a first season some very good episodes, an interesting overall arc with pike and a general decent quality throughout

the 'fantasy' episode was a little much for me but even the very best of star trek would throw one of these in here and there, and i wasn't a fan of those either

so finally we appear to have a star trek that is hitting all the right buttons and will grow into something much better, as did the classics

finally

[Dench57]

Strange New Worlds is pretty good innit. Refreshing to get some proper episodic Trek after the complete trainwrecks of Discovery and Picard.

[Armand9]

while i thought discovery was ok but it's not really star trek and panders to the world of PR and is way over touchey feely (for no real apparent reason half the time), Picard season 2 especially was extremely poor

as you say, strange new worlds is back on track and if they focus on what is good and tweak what could be better, has the chance to be what trekkies have wanted since voyager

[oojason]

'Star Trek: Picard Season 3 Comic-Con Teaser' (coming in 2023):-

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/cqApTpJMWOk" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/cqApTpJMWOk</a>

[thejbs]

This is a terrible argument, utterly awful.

I was trying to take it easy in this thread because I respect everyone's right to enjoy what they want, even though I find it incomprehensible that someone can enjoy Picard having watched 19 episodes of it now. Its fucking objectively shite.

ST:TNG is my desert-island series. If I could have only 1 box set of any TV show, ever, to watch over and over it would be TNG ahead of things like even Sopranos & Breaking Bad. So there is no way I was going into Picard thinking I am going to hate this. And how can I "watch stuff I might enjoy" without trying it anyway? Bizarre statement.

Picard is so offensively bad that it makes TNG retrospectively worse. Picard has ruined the JL Picard character itself so badly that I have lost some of the respect that I had for him watching TNG. How can I go back and watch something like Inner Light when I know that 20 years after it, JL Picard is going to be creaking around in a resurrected android body of some ungodly nature - for no discernible reason other than to enable a Season 2.

Here are some random cliff notes of nonsense and other, hateful things about Picard the series:

• Raphae is a horrible, badly written character with no clear motives and nothing sympathetic about her at all. Every time she opens her mouth, something stupid or un-necessarily aggressive comes spilling out
• 7of9 in Voyager was an unsure former Borg member who was trying to adapt to being a regular human. By the time Picard rolled around, she was some sort of murdering, psychopathic vigilante but only dealing with mundane crap. Why?
• JL Picard - in 170 episodes of TNG we had about maybe 3-4 of them dealing with JL's history. It feels like half of his screen time in Picard are flashback's or close ups of him reminiscing, often in the middle of gunfights or when he is trying to save the galaxy's future. Why does anyone care about JL's childhood? This is crap that should have been left in a novel
• Eleanor - the writers obviously were teenage boys when LotR came out and thought Legolas was the most amazing thing in the history of the world. Orlando Bloom is so washed up and lacking-charisma that I am sure they could have approached him for this role, which is about as far from anything that should be in the world of anything sci-fi, let alone ST, that its frankly offensive to the audience. A guy who brings a sword to a laser fight.

Now to the plot/writing itself. None of it makes sense and its clearly written by people who have heard "of" Star Trek and some of the concepts like the Borg, Q, but never watched it.

• Why does Soong look exactly like a descendent 300 years in the future, beyond giving a job to Brent Spiner?
• Why did Guinan, who met Picard in 19th Century USA in "Time's Arrow", not recognize him?
• Why is she working in an LA bar called "10 Forward", when "10 Forward" was named after the deck and position of the bar she worked in on TNG?
• What is the purpose of Q beyond clicking his fingers in episode 1 (which was actually a very good episode) to set up the season? His motives, abilities and actions since then make no sense. Are they saying he lost all his powers immediately after that click?
• I might have fallen asleep for this bit, but why does the 21st century timekeeper or whatever Talinn is actually look like a Romulan housekeeper 300 years in the future?
• How did an incompetent, unconfident ancient relative of Picard get the job on the most important, expensive manned mission in the history of humanity? Has anyone read or watched anything about the sort of guys who got onto the Apollo program? Its actually offensive to the memory of the likes of Neil Armstrong.

I got fooled by these clowns a few times now. Discovery Season 2 was actually kind of OK, but Seasons 1 and 3 were garbage. But at least thats done no harm. Picard S1 & S2 are so bad they have made me dislike ST in general and I'll find it difficult to ever go back to TNG again now. I'm never watching another episode of this new Trek after this Picard finale on Friday.

If this was a generic sci-fi show without the Trek name it would have died a death a long time ago. Instead these bastards are getting to spew their rubbish out indefinitely under the Trek banner.

This! All of it.

Picard is utter garbage. You could write a book on why it is, objectively, utter garbage.

[thejbs]

Strange New Worlds is pretty good innit. Refreshing to get some proper episodic Trek after the complete trainwrecks of Discovery and Picard.

I’ve been so burned by those two that I can’t bring myself to watch SNW.

[Gili Gulu]

I’ve been so burned by those two that I can’t bring myself to watch SNW.

I'd give it go if I were you.

Didn't watch the second season of Picard, after struggling through the first.

SNW however is really enjoyable.

[thejbs]

I'd give it go if I were you.

Didn't watch the second season of Picard, after struggling through the first.

SNW however is really enjoyable.

I tried s2 of Picard and had to stop. It’s rare that I dump a tv show - I’ve sat through a lot of shit stuff to see where it goes. I truly didn’t give a shit about a single character in Picard.

[Ray K]

This is a terrible argument, utterly awful.

I was trying to take it easy in this thread because I respect everyone's right to enjoy what they want, even though I find it incomprehensible that someone can enjoy Picard having watched 19 episodes of it now. Its fucking objectively shite.

ST:TNG is my desert-island series. If I could have only 1 box set of any TV show, ever, to watch over and over it would be TNG ahead of things like even Sopranos & Breaking Bad. So there is no way I was going into Picard thinking I am going to hate this. And how can I "watch stuff I might enjoy" without trying it anyway? Bizarre statement.

Picard is so offensively bad that it makes TNG retrospectively worse. Picard has ruined the JL Picard character itself so badly that I have lost some of the respect that I had for him watching TNG. How can I go back and watch something like Inner Light when I know that 20 years after it, JL Picard is going to be creaking around in a resurrected android body of some ungodly nature - for no discernible reason other than to enable a Season 2.

Here are some random cliff notes of nonsense and other, hateful things about Picard the series:

• Raphae is a horrible, badly written character with no clear motives and nothing sympathetic about her at all. Every time she opens her mouth, something stupid or un-necessarily aggressive comes spilling out
• 7of9 in Voyager was an unsure former Borg member who was trying to adapt to being a regular human. By the time Picard rolled around, she was some sort of murdering, psychopathic vigilante but only dealing with mundane crap. Why?
• JL Picard - in 170 episodes of TNG we had about maybe 3-4 of them dealing with JL's history. It feels like half of his screen time in Picard are flashback's or close ups of him reminiscing, often in the middle of gunfights or when he is trying to save the galaxy's future. Why does anyone care about JL's childhood? This is crap that should have been left in a novel
• Eleanor - the writers obviously were teenage boys when LotR came out and thought Legolas was the most amazing thing in the history of the world. Orlando Bloom is so washed up and lacking-charisma that I am sure they could have approached him for this role, which is about as far from anything that should be in the world of anything sci-fi, let alone ST, that its frankly offensive to the audience. A guy who brings a sword to a laser fight.

Now to the plot/writing itself. None of it makes sense and its clearly written by people who have heard "of" Star Trek and some of the concepts like the Borg, Q, but never watched it.

• Why does Soong look exactly like a descendent 300 years in the future, beyond giving a job to Brent Spiner?
• Why did Guinan, who met Picard in 19th Century USA in "Time's Arrow", not recognize him?
• Why is she working in an LA bar called "10 Forward", when "10 Forward" was named after the deck and position of the bar she worked in on TNG?
• What is the purpose of Q beyond clicking his fingers in episode 1 (which was actually a very good episode) to set up the season? His motives, abilities and actions since then make no sense. Are they saying he lost all his powers immediately after that click?
• I might have fallen asleep for this bit, but why does the 21st century timekeeper or whatever Talinn is actually look like a Romulan housekeeper 300 years in the future?
• How did an incompetent, unconfident ancient relative of Picard get the job on the most important, expensive manned mission in the history of humanity? Has anyone read or watched anything about the sort of guys who got onto the Apollo program? Its actually offensive to the memory of the likes of Neil Armstrong.

I got fooled by these clowns a few times now. Discovery Season 2 was actually kind of OK, but Seasons 1 and 3 were garbage. But at least thats done no harm. Picard S1 & S2 are so bad they have made me dislike ST in general and I'll find it difficult to ever go back to TNG again now. I'm never watching another episode of this new Trek after this Picard finale on Friday.

If this was a generic sci-fi show without the Trek name it would have died a death a long time ago. Instead these bastards are getting to spew their rubbish out indefinitely under the Trek banner.

I like you. We should be friends. 

I agree with everything you wrote, apart from the last bullet point. Because I bailed out halfway through S2 so have no idea about the ancient relative of Picard.

I did watch the first episode of Strange New Worlds. It's like dating again after you realised your ex was a psychopath who broke your heart. We went for a coffee, it was pleasant, I might go for another coffee again. But I'm being careful and calling bullshit the first time I see it.

[Riquende]

One problem I have with SNW is the same one I've had since Enterprise. I want the the setting to move on, not just rehash its own past. Make a new, new TNG set in the 2600s or something.

And stop casting Brent Spiner as various members of the Soong family. It was a cute joke once.

[Gili Gulu]

If they wanted a "grittier, darker" Star Trek, they could have made a series about Section 31 and Star Fleet Intelligence, where there would be people who would behave differently to Star Fleet culture, as they would be usually operating on planets outside the Federation. I haven't watched DS9 a lot, and I understand that fans consider DS9 a darker show that worked well.

I found the sudden introduction of swearing in Picard a bit jarring, and the whole way the characters behaved seemed to belong to a completely different culture from that of previous ST shows, as if most people were simply transposed from early 21st Century West Coast United States.

[Yosser0_0]

Great to see this thread resurface again.

I haven't watched any of the 'new' stuff for ages now, Discovery was average at best, I think I got through season 2 and didn't realise they'd made more? It seemed unnecessarily violent to me, I know that there has always been violence in Star Trek with Kirk setting the trend of biffing up aliens but this seemed to be filled with prolonged coreographed Jason Statham type martial arts fighting scenes. I can't remember any of the storylines or even who the captain was, arguably the most important character of the series! I'm surprised people have described it as touchy feely, must have missed that but then again I did give up on the series half way through. Picard was a disaster, and by the end of season 1 it had finished me in terms of looking out for the latest Star Trek series to watch and I'd pretty much given up.

Now I just watch reruns of the TNG or Enterprise, maybe the odd Voyager episode. I wasn't a big fan of Voyager mainly because the Janeway character bugged me or maybe it was the actor that played her but the Ships doctor was fantastic and I enjoyed the episodes when he was highly featured. I didn't really like DS9, it was a real chore to get through all the episodes and I probably wouldn't do it nowadays given how many other choices we have. It was alright when they went on a mission and left the station but most of the time it felt like Coronation Street in space. I thought the actor that played Sisko was quite wooden and I never took to the character. The security chief Odo was good though.

As I've said key to these series are the captain's and I think Kirk, Picard and Archer are all outstanding characters which is as you'd expect being in charge of the flagship of the fleet. I think Enterprise has now become my favourite series, I love the retro look of the ship with the serial numbered Rittal type avionic control panels and a warp engine that resembles a Buick engine block amongst other details that I could go on and on about. I like the fact that the technology has flaws and doesn't always work as designed. The naivety of the humans in space and their relationships with other species provides an interesting thread throughout as does the ability to apply streetwise tactics to outwit opponents. As with TNG I found the multiple series rich with storylines which was refreshing from TOS which would often feel like 'which character has been taken over by an alien this week'? Voyager too should have hit this mark but didn't quite do it for me due to the character of the captain.

[Riquende]

Voyager too should have hit this mark but didn't quite do it for me due to the character of the captain.

The trouble that the writing team had in putting a 'strong independent woman' in charge in the 90s was that she was purposefully written to never need any help or advice from anyone else, on any matter ever. Her background was as a science officer, so she could handle all the technobabble herself, conversing as equals with Seven or Torres in engineering. And despite Chakotay being this supreme academy tactics instructor, it was always Janeway firmly in charge during battles. In fact if you listen to Robert Beltran now (Chakotay) he's pretty scathing of his time on the show and towards the end of it you could tell he'd checked out mentally and was just collecting paychecks.

It's interesting you say the Doctor was a good character as he was the only one with a specialist area Janeway wasn't written as the best on the ship at!

I can't agree with you about Archer though, I thought he was really terrible (but only one amongst a terrible crew all round).

[kaesarsosei]

I just can't bring myself to watch SNW, I can't. Got burned too badly on Picard/Disco and there's too much good stuff on TV these days.

[[new username under construction]]

I just can't bring myself to watch SNW, I can't. Got burned too badly on Picard/Disco and there's too much good stuff on TV these days.

Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it!

[Dench57]

i like SNW but Pike saying "hit it" is arguably the worst thing about the show. dreadful. every starfleet captain should be contractually obliged to say "engage"

[ianburns252]

Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it!

I second this motion

[Armand9]

i like SNW but Pike saying "hit it" is arguably the worst thing about the show. dreadful. every starfleet captain should be contractually obliged to say "engage"

he's got a bit of Kirk about him, so 'hit it' kinda fits, green ladies and all, but i agree, not the best but you can see what they're going for as he's obviously the most laid back capt of a starship that a Trek series has ever had

personally, i'd have gone with 'release the kraken'

[[new username under construction]]

i like SNW but Pike saying "hit it" is arguably the worst thing about the show. dreadful. every starfleet captain should be contractually obliged to say "engage"

Seeing the tone of the first series with the crew interaction, they could easily get away with some crew members taking the piss out of him saying it, so easy to change

[TepidT2O]

Nichelle Nichols has died.

A true legend.

A trailblazer and her mark was an indelible one on the future

[TepidT2O]

MLK. Was a fan!

She showed him the future

[Red Beret]

Nichelle Nichols has died.

A true legend.

A trailblazer and her mark was an indelible one on the future

Just seen the news. A sad loss, but an outstanding character and actress.

I know William Shatner is a bit of an ass, but I feel for him tonight.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

RIP