Topic: Trent Alexander-Arnold

[El Lobo]

I got mocked to hell on here for saying exactly that last week.  Lobo will be along in a minute to tell you youre full of crap.

When it happens you can parade in smugness, until then it’s pretty clear the manager doesn’t want him playing anywhere other than RB. And Gomez as RB would be even worse, shift two players away from their best position.

[Knight]

Gomez playing like walker does for city and Trent playing RCM and pulling wide lots isn’t actually a terrible way of making use of their talents and would make us much more solid defensively. It’s never going to happen and it’d take way too much adjustment but a fun hypothetical.

[Ravishing Rick Dude]

Gomez playing like walker does for city and Trent playing RCM and pulling wide lots isn’t actually a terrible way of making use of their talents and would make us much more solid defensively. It’s never going to happen and it’d take way too much adjustment but a fun hypothetical.

It's all hypothetical indeed. Has Klopp ever changed someone's position during his career?

[redmark]

"Let's put the best right back in the world in midfield/rightwing/number ten" is certainly hypothetical, but not convinced it's much fun.

[killer-heels]

Trent is pretty much playing in midfield already. Only issue I have with him playing the role he is now is the system has Salah far too wide.

[Ravishing Rick Dude]

"Let's put the best right back in the world in midfield/rightwing/number ten" is certainly hypothetical, but not convinced it's much fun.

People will remember him as a great footballer rather than a great fullback, if that makes any sense.

[Magix]

When we were chasing the winner against Palace, he was as out and out a midfielder than ever before. Wonder if that's by design.

[lfcred1976]

"Let's put the best right back in the world in midfield/rightwing/number ten" is certainly hypothetical, but not convinced it's much fun.

Best attacking right back in world football - certainly not the best defender. Putting him RM might not be the most crazy thing as it means he could concentrate more on attacking and leave the majority of the defending to Joe Gomez behind him.

[thaddeus]

When we were chasing the winner against Palace, he was as out and out a midfielder than ever before. Wonder if that's by design.

I think in part because we were short of a forward player (for obvious reasons...) and also because in Gomez we have the perfect centre/right-back hybrid.  I'm certain Gomez wasn't match fit or he would have started but Klopp would have known that he couldn't give Trent that much attacking license if Phillips was going to be tasked with covering a quarter of the pitch by himself.

[El Lobo]

Best attacking right back in world football - certainly not the best defender. Putting him RM might not be the most crazy thing as it means he could concentrate more on attacking and leave the majority of the defending to Joe Gomez behind him.

True, or it could mean we actually see him in those dangerous positions less often than we do now since he'd be doing CM work instead.

The only way it makes any sense whatsoever is if we had another top, top class RB waiting in the wings (which we dont). Then we'd have a decision to make. Until that point we've got Trent, a world class right back who has never played in midfield for us. And Gomez, a world class centre back who is a pretty decent RB but nowhere near the level of Trent. And we've got a plethora of midfielders, including Harvey Elliott who seems pencilled in to play that RCM role for us moving forward. If Calvin Ramsay gets himself fit and quickly starts doing a Trent impression then it might be something we try.

Plus we all forget, he's still a baby in defender terms. Dani Alves, Cafu, Zanetti etc were all nowhere near his ability when they were 23. So instead of thinking 'he's good going forward but a rubbish defender, lets move him to midfield' is it not more sensible to think 'he's already the best RB in the world, mainly due to his attacking, and his defending will just get better and better with experience'? Him and Robbo are often praised for revolutionising the position, its barmy to me that people then think we should move him away from it.

[thaddeus]

True, or it could mean we actually see him in those dangerous positions less often than we do now since he'd be doing CM work instead.

The only way it makes any sense whatsoever is if we had another top, top class RB waiting in the wings (which we dont). Then we'd have a decision to make. Until that point we've got Trent, a world class right back who has never played in midfield for us. And Gomez, a world class centre back who is a pretty decent RB but nowhere near the level of Trent. And we've got a plethora of midfielders, including Harvey Elliott who seems pencilled in to play that RCM role for us moving forward. If Calvin Ramsay gets himself fit and quickly starts doing a Trent impression then it might be something we try.

Plus we all forget, he's still a baby in defender terms. Dani Alves, Cafu, Zanetti etc were all nowhere near his ability when they were 23. So instead of thinking 'he's good going forward but a rubbish defender, lets move him to midfield' is it not more sensible to think 'he's already the best RB in the world, mainly due to his attacking, and his defending will just get better and better with experience'? Him and Robbo are often praised for revolutionising the position, its barmy to me that people then think we should move him away from it.

I always think of Ashley Cole.  He used to get hammered for his defending but by the time Chelsea nabbed him he was excellent at out-right defending.  That Mourinho signed him says how much he'd improved as a defender.

For me Trent is a good defender now anyway, he's shown that against countless of the world's best wingers.  His blind spot is defending the back-post and that was one of the criticisms levelled at Cole also.  Neither are/were ever going to match up against the big target man steaming in at the back post but Cole learned to impede sufficiently that the forward couldn't get a clean header.

Of course Trent like Virgil will be nit-picked by rival fans (and some of our own) over every tiny mistake or misjudgement.  That doesn't mean he's a bad defender, it means he's so good that people are desperate to tear him down.  There was some of that from ours after Reece James's involvements in the late Spurs equaliser.

[tubby]

Did Cole get hammered for his defending?  The main thing I remember about him defensively is that he always pocketed Ronaldo.

[thaddeus]

Did Cole get hammered for his defending?  The main thing I remember about him defensively is that he always pocketed Ronaldo.

A bit like Trent 

Cole replaced Nigel Winterburn and played on the opposite side to Lee Dixon in his early Arsenal career - the epitome of old-school English full-backs.  He got a lot of praise for his attacking play but also a lot of criticism for basic defensive lapses.  Us as a country being slow to accept more progressive full-backs certainly isn't a new thing.

Beckham changed the narrative with one kick against Greece but Greece's whole game plan in that 2-2 game was isolating Cole against the taller Charisteas and hitting him with big diagonals.  Cole got completely dominated in that game but within a few years no player of any style or physique was bettering him.

[Crosby Nick]

A bit like Trent 

Cole replaced Nigel Winterburn and played on the opposite side to Lee Dixon in his early Arsenal career - the epitome of old-school English full-backs.  He got a lot of praise for his attacking play but also a lot of criticism for basic defensive lapses.  Us as a country being slow to accept more progressive full-backs certainly isn't a new thing.

Beckham changed the narrative with one kick against Greece but Greece's whole game plan in that 2-2 game was isolating Cole against the taller Charisteas and hitting him with big diagonals.  Cole got completely dominated in that game but within a few years no player of any style or physique was bettering him.

Did he? My memory of Cole was of him always being a very good, tenacious defender who got forward well but wasn’t overly creative.

I don’t remember that Greece match (bar the finale) but don’t always think it’s fair to single out a full back when they get isolated by a much taller, better aerially kind of player. Bit like Mitrovic scoring the header, he’s almost always going to win that kind of battle.

[tubby]

Did he? My memory of Cole was of him always being a very good, tenacious defender who got forward well but wasn’t overly creative.

Yeah same for me, I remember Cole as an excellent one vs one defender, he was rarely ever beaten by quick, tricky forwards.  And he really was the only England player from that generation who performed at a world class level for both domestic and international teams.  Personally think he's one of the best left backs of all time.

[thaddeus]

Did he? My memory of Cole was of him always being a very good, tenacious defender who got forward well but wasn’t overly creative.

I don’t remember that Greece match (bar the finale) but don’t always think it’s fair to single out a full back when they get isolated by a much taller, better aerially kind of player. Bit like Mitrovic scoring the header, he’s almost always going to win that kind of battle.

It's not meant to be a criticism of him but more to show that at that point he was viewed as being somebody with a weakness that could be exposed in a fairly rudimentary way.  It was something Cole very clearly worked on as he was never exposed like that again (that I'm aware of, at least).

Winning a clean header against a taller opponent is very difficult but using your body to make sure they also can't win a clean header isn't.  There was one in the Chelsea vs. Spurs game where Loftus-Cheek looked for the world like he was going to head in from close range.  I can't remember who the Spurs defender was that was caught under the ball but they 'simply' levered Loftus-Cheek sufficiently that he ended up heading thin air.

Those are the sort of almost dark arts of defending that Trent is still a bit weak on but they're very learnable (certainly easier to learn that than to learn how to drive a 60-yard pass onto a sixpence!).  He'll get there.  Robbo is a similar height to Trent but is excellent at impeding opposition players.

[tubby]

Trent just needs to have more awareness of people behind him, think that's his only real issue as a defender.  He struggles with someone making a late run to the back post and should stay switched on and defend that area more aggressively.

But I do wonder if his back post lapses are because he's literally running up and down the pitch all day long.  Plays as a midfielder when we have the ball and then has to leg it back and instantly assess the defensive situation when teams transition against us.

We ask an awful lot of him.

[Ghost Town]

It's all hypothetical indeed. Has Klopp ever changed someone's position during his career?

Milner as left back for a whole season? Gini going from AM to a ball winner/firefighter/recycler

Trent is pretty much playing in midfield already. Only issue I have with him playing the role he is now is the system has Salah far too wide.

He often is, but he does so with three other midfielders on the pitch doing the covering and donkey work. If he were deployed as a midfielder then it would be he and only two others. That's the difference and why it won't happen at the moment

[SamLad]

not sure about others, but my floating of the idea was predicated on "if we lose more midfielders".  I don't think anyone's suggesting we do it just for shits and giggles.

[Stubbins]

It's all hypothetical indeed. Has Klopp ever changed someone's position during his career?

At Dortmund, he took Lukasz Piszczek on a Bosman from Hertha Berlin. He was a recognised 'right winger' and Klopp played him predominantly as a right full back. But an attack minded full back in the style of Trent.

[Crosby Nick]

It's all hypothetical indeed. Has Klopp ever changed someone's position during his career?

He changed Marco Silva’s from Manager to Unemployed.

[Ghost Town]

He changed Marco Silva’s from Manager to Unemployed.

And Mourinho

[Crosby Nick]

And Mourinho

Knew there were others.

[afc tukrish]

And Mourinho

Knew there were others.

The Other One?

[El Lobo]

Wan-Bissaka is apparently available so that could potentially solve the problem. Good solid defensive RB and then Trent at RM.

[SerbianScouser]

This season there will be more clamour for Trent in midfield than ever.

A first year we won't have a false 9 but a regular one who will be around a penalty spot a lot waiting for service.

Trent has more creativity in his toe than all our attacking midfield options put together which is why I think Klopp will have to consider this move during the season because the days of our midfield just being there to stop counter attacks and cover fullbacks are close to be being numbered.

Trent can obviously form this partnership with Darwin from RB as well but I just think if we put him in the right half-space he could even go on to the next level in terms of chance creation numbers.

Not only would he be in a better position to create even more chances but also he could get among the goals which is another thing we painfully lack from our midfield.

Regardless of how much people hate this idea if our midfield don't dramatically improve their numbers this season reckon Klopp would be forced to consider this.

[MonsLibpool]

This season there will be more clamour for Trent in midfield than ever.

A first year we won't have a false 9 but a regular one who will be around a penalty spot a lot waiting for service.

Trent has more creativity in his toe than all our attacking midfield options put together which is why I think Klopp will have to consider this move during the season because the days of our midfield just being there to stop counter attacks and cover fullbacks are close to be being numbered.

Trent can obviously form this partnership with Darwin from RB as well but I just think if we put him in the right half-space he could even go on to the next level in terms of chance creation numbers.

Not only would he be in a better position to create even more chances but also he could get among the goals which is another thing we painfully lack from our midfield.

Regardless of how much people hate this idea if our midfield don't dramatically improve their numbers this season reckon Klopp would be forced to consider this.

The thing is that he has already "moved" to midfield because the way we play give him licence to drop in from time to time and this has been the case since last season.

[SerbianScouser]

The thing is that he has already "moved" to midfield because the way we play give him licence to drop in from time to time and this has been the case since last season.

Yes he does spend a lot of time in the right half-space but hopefully we get him to be there 90 mins.

[G Richards]

Trent is reinventing the fullback position and largely played as a midfielder anyway, to my mind.

I see the appeal of sticking Gomez behind him in a Kyle Walker sort of role, and having Trent play RCM, but that overlooks Harvey Elliott, who is bubbling along quite nicely. Elliott is doing well in between Trent and Mo on the right flank, and if he keeps growing as a player he might well have the position boxed off before too long.

So to my mind, all things considered, leave Trent where he is. If for some reason Elliott doesn't make the grade (I think he will) then we could revisit Trent at RCM.

[Chris~]

We won't, but if you want someone to play like Walker has you just get Robertson to do it and have Trent continue doing his thing from right back.

[Ravishing Rick Dude]

He changed Marco Silva’s from Manager to Unemployed.

 

[sattapaartridge]

I think in an ideal world, you want him to remain as the creative fullback that he is, and just do what he's currently doing. People are only talking about Trent in midfield because we know he can do it, and we are struggling in midfield with Thiago out, and Keita made of biscuits. Trent's stature is also quite big, shoulders have broadened and looks stronger than he ever has been.

So yeah, I'm down for Trent to play midfield if we're short there in numbers. Just against Palace the other night, he was properly in a midfield position on the left hand side, and played a lovely ball for Salah to miss with his header.

[lamonti]

Trent is reinventing the fullback position and largely played as a midfielder anyway, to my mind.

I see the appeal of sticking Gomez behind him in a Kyle Walker sort of role, and having Trent play RCM, but that overlooks Harvey Elliott, who is bubbling along quite nicely. Elliott is doing well in between Trent and Mo on the right flank, and if he keeps growing as a player he might well have the position boxed off before too long.

So to my mind, all things considered, leave Trent where he is. If for some reason Elliott doesn't make the grade (I think he will) then we could revisit Trent at RCM.

I don't think it's reinventing the right back position if no one else is doing what he does to be honest. I think he's more of a maverick than a guy who is setting out a template for how the position will be played. Klopp and Lijnders definitely give him license to interpret his role on the right in a number of ways. Personally I think he spends a bit too much time in the right half-space. I think we tend to get crowded there unless Henderson is able to create space on the right.

I'd say Guardiola moving his fullbacks into a defensive block beside his defensive midfielder (rather than overlapping wide) and pushing his 8s up and his wingers wide is going to be more of a map for progressive teams.

[afc tukrish]

I don't think it's reinventing the right back position if no one else is doing what he does to be honest. I think he's more of a maverick

Top Gun?

Trent Alexander Cruise?

[Dave McCoy]

Wan-Bissaka is apparently available so that could potentially solve the problem. Good solid defensive RB and then Trent at RM.

[mrantarctica]

Wan-Bissaka is apparently available so that could potentially solve the problem. Good solid defensive RB and then Trent at RM.

Haha 

Genuinely funny guy

[stonecold_jpm]

I'd say Guardiola moving his fullbacks into a defensive block beside his defensive midfielder (rather than overlapping wide) and pushing his 8s up and his wingers wide is going to be more of a map for progressive teams.

We both pretty much play in the same formation on the pitch in a 2323. On the right side Trent already generally occupies De Bruyne's inside right and Mo hugs the touchline more like Mahrez does for them (which i don't think we get the best of him cos of it). Whilst on the left its possibly where we are going wrong now with both Robbo and Diaz wanting to hug that touchline and nobody really staying in Bernado Silva's inside left position which Sadio did more of. Our trio in midield generally resemble their defensive block with Rodri and their full backs Cancelo and Walker but with Elliott in there the other day being further advanced it leaves Fab with too much to do and further highlights that we lack the speed and athleticism in midfield now to what we used to in getting back to defend compared to them.

[Funky_Gibbons]

I could forgive him for the Mitrovic goals as he’s a strong and powerful forward, but his defending at times tonight was abysmal, especially the first goal.

[newterp]

I could forgive him for the Mitrovic goals as he’s a strong and powerful forward, but his defending at times tonight was abysmal, especially the first goal.

At times? It was bad all night long - despite starting off so brightly with 2 dispossessions of Elanga.

He then got roasted on a give and go, almost committed a penalty on Rashford, and was just never looking secure.

[Chakan]

I could forgive him for the Mitrovic goals as he’s a strong and powerful forward, but his defending at times tonight was abysmal, especially the first goal.

His jogging around is just unexplainable. I don't get it.

I understand there's time to take your foot off the gas and jog and get a breather, when their players are attacking the goal and you just let them run right past you then shrug your shoulders and just jog around, that's not the fucking time!

Saint-Maximin is going to absolutely destroy him.