Author Topic: The Real Ronaldo  (Read 38974 times)

Offline I've been a good boy

  • "There are two ways of spreading light; to be the candle or the mirror that receives it." Loves a good set of open flaps. And a bowl of Coco Poops! No chance of getting a coffee in his house.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 6,213
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #240 on: November 15, 2022, 09:20:49 pm »
When I said players that had flair, it wasn't limited to dribbling. Batistuta, Raul and Inzaghi scored some absolute worldies that most players could only dream about. And Raul nothing special? :o

Offline Port_vale_lad

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,533
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #241 on: November 15, 2022, 09:33:27 pm »
Ronaldo was fecking amazing, along with Maradona and Ronaldhino my favourite players of all time.

Shit haircuts though  ;D

If Ronaldo stayed fit think more people would have him as the goat above messi and the greasy one.

Offline oojason

  • The Official RAWK Audio Visual God. Founder Member of the Ricky Gervais' 'David Brad Fan Club'.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 23,807
  • The Awkward Squad
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #242 on: November 15, 2022, 09:47:16 pm »

^ Don't forget Smicer there too mate ;)
.
Some 'Useful Info' for following the football + TV, Streams, Highlights & Replays etc - www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=345769

A mini-index of RAWK's 'Liverpool Audio / Video Thread' content over the years; & more - www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=345769.msg17787576#msg17787576

Online Hazell

  • Ultimate Movie Night Draft Winner 2017. King - or Queen - of Mystery. Hyzenthlay. The 5th Benitle's sex conch.
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 76,792
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #243 on: November 15, 2022, 09:52:20 pm »
Talking of flair players, anyone mentioned Harry Kane? He's better than Bergkamp anyway.
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

Offline Ravishing Rick Dude

  • Cut the music! Missed the 'Saka is shite!' memo.
  • No new LFC topics
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,849
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #244 on: November 15, 2022, 10:31:28 pm »
I would say you have a very narrow definition of what the word "flair" in football entitles. It is also about ingenuity and craftiness, which is something Raul excelled at with those chip finishes. In any case, Raul also had an exquisite touch and was an excellent dribbler and passer, which is why he still could do an excellent job playing deeper, when Madrid signed Ronaldo. So even on your own very narrow definition of "flair", you would be wrong.

When someone mention "flair", Raul is not the first player that comes to mind.

How would you rate him anyway, would he make top3 or even top5 of Real Madrid's best ever forwards?
Rick for the rikes, prick for the pricks

SLAVA
UKRAINI

Offline PeterTheRed ...

  • Edgelord. Fabrizio Romanovic, Tancredi Palmerovic, Christian Falkovic, Duncan Castlovic, Jan Aage Fjortovic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,240
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #245 on: November 15, 2022, 10:34:57 pm »
Not sure Batistuta should get mentioned in the same sentence with Bergkamp and Ronaldo. Even Raul wasn't really that special. Inzaghi, Batistuta and Raul had no flair whatsoever.

But i understand, nostalgy sometimes does that to you.

To be honest, Gerd Muller had no flair at all ...

Offline PeterTheRed ...

  • Edgelord. Fabrizio Romanovic, Tancredi Palmerovic, Christian Falkovic, Duncan Castlovic, Jan Aage Fjortovic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,240
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #246 on: November 15, 2022, 10:39:16 pm »
When someone mention "flair", Raul is not the first player that comes to mind.

How would you rate him anyway, would he make top3 or even top5 of Real Madrid's best ever forwards?

I'd say that he comes into the top 3, alongside Di Stefano and Puskas ...

Offline Ravishing Rick Dude

  • Cut the music! Missed the 'Saka is shite!' memo.
  • No new LFC topics
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,849
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #247 on: November 15, 2022, 10:43:14 pm »
I'd say that he comes into the top 3, alongside Di Stefano and Puskas ...

Raul over Benzema and Ronaldo?
Rick for the rikes, prick for the pricks

SLAVA
UKRAINI

Offline Lastrador

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 5,940
  • Not Italian
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #248 on: November 15, 2022, 10:51:29 pm »
When someone mention "flair", Raul is not the first player that comes to mind.

How would you rate him anyway, would he make top3 or even top5 of Real Madrid's best ever forwards?
I would probably agree somewhat with that (although I do think he was one of the most inventive finishers of the last couple of decades). There's a big difference between that statement and saying he had no flair whatsoever though. The latter is just not true at all.

In the top 5 when you consider the entirety of his career and all the titles won. Sadly, he probably didn't reach his full potential due to Ronaldo's signing, and the whole galacticos shitshow. Still, a fantastic striker on his day.

Offline PeterTheRed ...

  • Edgelord. Fabrizio Romanovic, Tancredi Palmerovic, Christian Falkovic, Duncan Castlovic, Jan Aage Fjortovic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,240
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #249 on: November 15, 2022, 11:27:44 pm »
Raul over Benzema and Ronaldo?

Definitely. The real Ronaldo and Benzema should be in the conversation for the top 5, but Raul was such a great player, so he gets into the top 3 ...

Offline Ravishing Rick Dude

  • Cut the music! Missed the 'Saka is shite!' memo.
  • No new LFC topics
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,849
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #250 on: November 15, 2022, 11:38:31 pm »
Definitely. The real Ronaldo and Benzema should be in the conversation for the top 5, but Raul was such a great player, so he gets into the top 3 ...

Not for me. Benzema is their best #9 ever. I'd even say he's the best #9 in La Liga's history, when you take into consideration the contribution, consistency and trophies.
Rick for the rikes, prick for the pricks

SLAVA
UKRAINI

Offline 4pool

  • Mr. ( last name) Minister Of Truth - 1984 to 1984. The first to do a Moyesed. A pore grammarist.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 52,860
  • Liverpool: European Capital of Football 2005/2006
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #251 on: November 16, 2022, 04:34:18 am »
Someone mention Flair..




Either we are a club of supporters or become a club of customers.

Offline I've been a good boy

  • "There are two ways of spreading light; to be the candle or the mirror that receives it." Loves a good set of open flaps. And a bowl of Coco Poops! No chance of getting a coffee in his house.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 6,213
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #252 on: November 16, 2022, 12:42:50 pm »
Someone mention Flair..
That's Richard Morgan Fliehr to you

Offline Broad Spectrum

  • Antibiotic
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,633
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #253 on: November 16, 2022, 12:45:08 pm »
Ronaldo was fecking amazing, along with Maradona and Ronaldhino my favourite players of all time.

Shit haircuts though  ;D

If Ronaldo stayed fit think more people would have him as the goat above messi and the greasy one.

Honestly it's not even close when it comes to Messi. He's so far ahead of everyone else.

Online Hazell

  • Ultimate Movie Night Draft Winner 2017. King - or Queen - of Mystery. Hyzenthlay. The 5th Benitle's sex conch.
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 76,792
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #254 on: November 19, 2022, 11:24:53 am »
Well worth a watch...





'The Phenomenon: Ronaldo' - a 90 minute documentary on Brazilian great...

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m001ffsj/the-phenomenon-ronaldo


Thought this was excellent, I normally find football documentaries dull but this was great, especially because of how open he was and the interviews with ex-teammates, opponents and doctors (though I wish they had more of his opponents talking about him). It was probably a good choice to focus on 1998-2002 narratively and it allowed them to talk about his injuries extensively but I was hoping they would do a bit post 2002 because he was still pretty great after that. What could have been though, he was an amazing player.
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

Offline Wullie160975

  • Oor Wullie! Your Wullie! A'body's Wullie!
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,488
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #255 on: November 19, 2022, 03:28:13 pm »
Ah crap. Watching that has made me remember how much I enjoy watching a World Cup.

Almost makes it harder to not watch the one coming up. Almost.

Offline oojason

  • The Official RAWK Audio Visual God. Founder Member of the Ricky Gervais' 'David Brad Fan Club'.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 23,807
  • The Awkward Squad
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #256 on: November 19, 2022, 03:35:01 pm »
Ah crap. Watching that has made me remember how much I enjoy watching a World Cup.

Almost makes it harder to not watch the one coming up. Almost.

'Football on TV: for anyone wanting to watch footy - but avoid the 2022 World Cup' thread: www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=353342.0

^ plenty of older World Cup content in there mate (plus some vintage Liverpool content too)...


Plus links to re-watch every World Cup match from 1970-2018 - and the 'official FIFA World Cup films' to watch for free too.

I'll be giving this 2022 World Cup in Qatar a wide berth though - and won't be watching a minute of it.

« Last Edit: November 19, 2022, 03:52:32 pm by oojason »
.
Some 'Useful Info' for following the football + TV, Streams, Highlights & Replays etc - www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=345769

A mini-index of RAWK's 'Liverpool Audio / Video Thread' content over the years; & more - www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=345769.msg17787576#msg17787576

Offline oojason

  • The Official RAWK Audio Visual God. Founder Member of the Ricky Gervais' 'David Brad Fan Club'.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 23,807
  • The Awkward Squad
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #257 on: November 19, 2022, 03:40:08 pm »

Thought this was excellent, I normally find football documentaries dull but this was great, especially because of how open he was and the interviews with ex-teammates, opponents and doctors (though I wish they had more of his opponents talking about him). It was probably a good choice to focus on 1998-2002 narratively and it allowed them to talk about his injuries extensively but I was hoping they would do a bit post 2002 because he was still pretty great after that. What could have been though, he was an amazing player.

Yeah, same here - I thought they could have mentioned / shown some footage of the 2006 World Cup - especially as he did break Müller's record of World Cup goals scored (15 in total?) in that one.

But was a quality watch, overall ;D
.
Some 'Useful Info' for following the football + TV, Streams, Highlights & Replays etc - www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=345769

A mini-index of RAWK's 'Liverpool Audio / Video Thread' content over the years; & more - www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=345769.msg17787576#msg17787576

Offline AndyMuller

  • Has always wondered how to do it. Rice, Rice, Baby. Wants to have George Michael. Would batter A@A at karate.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 15,266
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #258 on: November 19, 2022, 03:48:59 pm »
Ah crap. Watching that has made me remember how much I enjoy watching a World Cup.

Almost makes it harder to not watch the one coming up. Almost.

Yep, watched it earlier today and made me nostalgic to watch a World Cup.

Won’t be watching this farce though!

Online mattD

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,158
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #259 on: November 19, 2022, 05:30:43 pm »
Watching clips of the real Ronaldo up against his spoilt bastard namesake puts the game in stark contrast to what it was.

The real Ronaldo is one of those players from that generation of players that had an almost mythical quality to them. Growing up, there was that sense of wonder from players like him that you just don't get today.

Maybe it's because I'm an adult now, but the game loses a lot by its over saturation in the mass media with easy access to all games and emphasis on players being social media personalities. I'd be lucky to watch Ronaldo in a game outside of a World Cup, relying on one of his teams to play an English club in the Champions League or UEFA Cup so that ITV would show it (I only grew up with four terrestrial channels). And social media has turned players from almost gladiatorial mythical figures into shallow corporate shrills. It's sucked the wonder and curiosity out of the game for me.

It made the match ups with Liverpool even more fascinating. The sense of occasion you got when Liverpool played against big teams and players on the continent was palpable, the idea of our lads going up against these mythical figures and then beating them gave a sense of elation like nothing else. It's likely aging, losing innocence and wide eyed wonderment that makes me think so cynically about the game today, but I still crave for that mystique to the game that has long gone.  That journey and sense of discovery, and the infrequent glimpses of these great teams and players that sparked the imagination, that's where the fun was. Maybe the game wasn't better and maybe the players weren't necessarily superior human beings either, but that naivety made it worth believing in it. Everyone needs stories to believe in. Having all the football and more than I could ever imagine at my fingertips is not nearly as fulfilling or meaningful.

Online Hazell

  • Ultimate Movie Night Draft Winner 2017. King - or Queen - of Mystery. Hyzenthlay. The 5th Benitle's sex conch.
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 76,792
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #260 on: November 19, 2022, 05:45:31 pm »
Watching clips of the real Ronaldo up against his spoilt bastard namesake puts the game in stark contrast to what it was.

At least you can take comfort from the fact that Cristiano Ronaldo was named after Ronald Reagan.
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

Offline AndyMuller

  • Has always wondered how to do it. Rice, Rice, Baby. Wants to have George Michael. Would batter A@A at karate.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 15,266
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #261 on: November 19, 2022, 05:58:22 pm »
Watching clips of the real Ronaldo up against his spoilt bastard namesake puts the game in stark contrast to what it was.

The real Ronaldo is one of those players from that generation of players that had an almost mythical quality to them. Growing up, there was that sense of wonder from players like him that you just don't get today.

Maybe it's because I'm an adult now, but the game loses a lot by its over saturation in the mass media with easy access to all games and emphasis on players being social media personalities. I'd be lucky to watch Ronaldo in a game outside of a World Cup, relying on one of his teams to play an English club in the Champions League or UEFA Cup so that ITV would show it (I only grew up with four terrestrial channels). And social media has turned players from almost gladiatorial mythical figures into shallow corporate shrills. It's sucked the wonder and curiosity out of the game for me.

It made the match ups with Liverpool even more fascinating. The sense of occasion you got when Liverpool played against big teams and players on the continent was palpable, the idea of our lads going up against these mythical figures and then beating them gave a sense of elation like nothing else. It's likely aging, losing innocence and wide eyed wonderment that makes me think so cynically about the game today, but I still crave for that mystique to the game that has long gone.  That journey and sense of discovery, and the infrequent glimpses of these great teams and players that sparked the imagination, that's where the fun was. Maybe the game wasn't better and maybe the players weren't necessarily superior human beings either, but that naivety made it worth believing in it. Everyone needs stories to believe in. Having all the football and more than I could ever imagine at my fingertips is not nearly as fulfilling or meaningful.

Fucking hell this is absolutely spot on and how I feel too. I feel like the magic of the game has been lost.

Offline The G in Gerrard

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 45,235
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #262 on: November 27, 2022, 11:11:57 am »
The BBC documentary on him could have been better. Isn't there a Netflix one on him?

Offline The G in Gerrard

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 45,235
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #263 on: November 27, 2022, 11:13:20 am »
Watching clips of the real Ronaldo up against his spoilt bastard namesake puts the game in stark contrast to what it was.

The real Ronaldo is one of those players from that generation of players that had an almost mythical quality to them. Growing up, there was that sense of wonder from players like him that you just don't get today.

Maybe it's because I'm an adult now, but the game loses a lot by its over saturation in the mass media with easy access to all games and emphasis on players being social media personalities. I'd be lucky to watch Ronaldo in a game outside of a World Cup, relying on one of his teams to play an English club in the Champions League or UEFA Cup so that ITV would show it (I only grew up with four terrestrial channels). And social media has turned players from almost gladiatorial mythical figures into shallow corporate shrills. It's sucked the wonder and curiosity out of the game for me.

It made the match ups with Liverpool even more fascinating. The sense of occasion you got when Liverpool played against big teams and players on the continent was palpable, the idea of our lads going up against these mythical figures and then beating them gave a sense of elation like nothing else. It's likely aging, losing innocence and wide eyed wonderment that makes me think so cynically about the game today, but I still crave for that mystique to the game that has long gone.  That journey and sense of discovery, and the infrequent glimpses of these great teams and players that sparked the imagination, that's where the fun was. Maybe the game wasn't better and maybe the players weren't necessarily superior human beings either, but that naivety made it worth believing in it. Everyone needs stories to believe in. Having all the football and more than I could ever imagine at my fingertips is not nearly as fulfilling or meaningful.
Absolutely. I have hazy memories of him at Madrid just being a different level to those around him.

Offline Redknight60

  • Main Stander
  • ***
  • Posts: 246
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: The Real Ronaldo
« Reply #264 on: November 27, 2022, 02:30:32 pm »
Watching clips of the real Ronaldo up against his spoilt bastard namesake puts the game in stark contrast to what it was.

The real Ronaldo is one of those players from that generation of players that had an almost mythical quality to them. Growing up, there was that sense of wonder from players like him that you just don't get today.

Maybe it's because I'm an adult now, but the game loses a lot by its over saturation in the mass media with easy access to all games and emphasis on players being social media personalities. I'd be lucky to watch Ronaldo in a game outside of a World Cup, relying on one of his teams to play an English club in the Champions League or UEFA Cup so that ITV would show it (I only grew up with four terrestrial channels). And social media has turned players from almost gladiatorial mythical figures into shallow corporate shrills. It's sucked the wonder and curiosity out of the game for me.

It made the match ups with Liverpool even more fascinating. The sense of occasion you got when Liverpool played against big teams and players on the continent was palpable, the idea of our lads going up against these mythical figures and then beating them gave a sense of elation like nothing else. It's likely aging, losing innocence and wide eyed wonderment that makes me think so cynically about the game today, but I still crave for that mystique to the game that has long gone.  That journey and sense of discovery, and the infrequent glimpses of these great teams and players that sparked the imagination, that's where the fun was. Maybe the game wasn't better and maybe the players weren't necessarily superior human beings either, but that naivety made it worth believing in it. Everyone needs stories to believe in. Having all the football and more than I could ever imagine at my fingertips is not nearly as fulfilling or meaningful.
Great post and agree wholeheartedly.

And it wasn't just the south American teams either. I'd never heard of Davor Sukur before Euro 1996 and remember being mesmerised watching him at that tournament. There's none of that kind of surprise to me in football anymore.