Topic: Genocide denial - Turkey and the Armenians

[Yorkykopite]

Turkish governments of all stripes have traditionally had a big problem in recognising what happened to the Armenians 100 years ago. Turkish writers and historians who mention the genocide or who attempt to write books about the massacres are censored, criminalised and often gaoled ("for insulting Turkishness"!). One presumes that the ordinary Turkish citizen has only a scant notion of the genocide that took place in the land of their birth since school history books either avoid the subject, trivialise it or blame the Armenians.

For reasons of realpolitik it has been usual for other governments to also 'forget' what happened in 1915-1916. Turkey is too 'important' to ever be reminded of the atrocities. Their own disgraceful erasure of the historical record has had to be officially indulged by other nations.

But not now. Germany has just done an amazing thing by acknowledging the past. Naturally the Islamists in Ankara are grievously unhappy and have recalled the Turkish ambassador from Berlin. They wish to keep living under an illusion and to stuff the inconvenient past down George Orwell's Memory Hole.   

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/02/germany-braces-for-turkish-backlash-as-it-votes-to-recognise-armenian-genocide

Turkey has recalled its ambassador from Berlin after German MPs approved a motion describing the massacre of Armenians by Ottoman forces a century ago as genocide – a decision that the Turkish president said would “seriously affect” relations between the two countries.

The five-page paper, co-written by parliamentarians from the Christian Democrats, Social Democrats and Green party, calls for a “commemoration of the genocide of Armenian and other Christian minorities in the years 1915 and 1916”. It passed with support from all the parties in parliament. In a show of hands, there was one abstention and one vote against.

The German chancellor, Angela Merkel, had voted in favour of the resolution during a test vote at a party meeting on Tuesday, but was absent from the actual vote on Thursday, as were the deputy chancellor, Sigmar Gabriel, and the minister for foreign affairs, Frank-Walter Steinmeier. Gregor Gysi of the Left party described Merkel’s absence as “not very brave”.

Turkish governments have always rejected the use of the term genocide to describe the massacre and expulsion of an estimated 1.5 million Armenians and members of Christian minorities in the Ottoman empire.

The Turkish government, bitterly opposed to labelling the 1915 mass killings of Armenians by Ottoman forces as genocide, has said the German parliament’s approval of the Armenian genocide bill was “null and void”.

Speaking on a visit to Kenya, the Turkish president, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, said the German vote would “seriously affect” ties between the two countries, and confirmed that Ankara has recalled its ambassador to Germany for consultations. Ankara also summoned Germany’s charge d’affaires to the foreign ministry.

Earlier, in the first official reaction to the vote, the deputy prime minister, Numan Kurtulmuş, said: “Turkey will give the necessary response to Germany. We consider this decision null and void. This is not a decision that should be made by politicians or parliaments; it is a decision that has to be made by historians.”* On Twitter Kurtulmuş called the decision a “historic mistake”.

The Turkish prime minister, Binali Yıldırım, harshly condemned the decision as “irrational” and said it would put the friendship between the two countries to a serious test.

The foreign minister, Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu, currently in Africa with Erdoğan, tweeted: “The way to close one’s own dark pages of history is not by maligning another country’s history.”

Turkish media reported that the ruling Justice and Development party (AKP) was preparing a written rebuke in parliament. In a statement, members of the Turkish parliament’s foreign relations commission said they “strongly condemn and reject this bill falsifying historical facts about 1915 events”, arguing it was “contrary to international and European case-law”.

“It is utterly unacceptable that the events, which took place under the special conditions of WWI 101 years ago and caused heartbreaking suffering for both Turks and Armenians, be introduced as ‘genocide’ based on biased, distorted and various subjective political motives,” said the statement.

The agreement to return migrants arriving on the Greek islands to Turkey has in recent months reduced the number of refugees arriving in central Europe, easing pressure on Merkel. But Erdoğan has since repeatedly questioned the conditions of the deal, with members of his party threatening to cancel the agreement altogether.

Opening Thursday’s debate, Germany parliament speaker Norbert Lammert acknowledged that addressing historical events can be painful. “But we have also seen that an honest and self-critical appraisal of the past does not endanger relations with other countries,” he said. “In fact, it is a precondition for understanding, reconciliation and cooperation.”

He said Turkey’s current government is not responsible for what happened 100 years ago, “but it shares responsibility for what happens with it in the future”.

Some historians have argued that Germany, a close ally of the Ottoman empire during the first world war, was aware of the massacre at the time and supported it politically. The Bundestag’s resolution contains a passage acknowledging “the German Reich’s complicity in the events”, as well as six references to the Holocaust.

Over the course of the one-hour debate, the German Green party’s Turkish-German co-chair, Cem Özdemir, argued that the resolution was “not about pointing fingers or claiming the moral high ground”, but came from “a historic duty to encourage Turkish-Armenian reconciliation in friendship”.

Both members of the Turkish and the Armenian embassy in Germany were present during the vote, with the latter group holding up signs reading “Recognition now – thank you” at the end of the session.

Twenty governments, including those of France, Italy and Russia, have in the past described the mass killings of Armenians as a genocide, and Pope Francis referred to the killings as “the first genocide of the 20th century” in 2015. The German president, Joachim Gauck, also used the phrase in a speech in April last year.

Thursday’s vote was originally scheduled for last year, but was put on ice due to pressure from Germany’s governing coalition, reportedly for fear of destabilising Turkish-German relations.

*Here are some historians for anyone keen to know what happened 100 years ago: https://www.bostonglobe.com/arts/2015/09/25/seven-books-armenian-genocide/vXumdvQTsNR061mOupX7xJ/story.html

http://www.amazon.com/Shameful-Act-Armenian-Genocide-Responsibility/dp/080508665X

[vagabond]

Turkey could learn a thing or two from the Germans on how to deal with their past. No nation is innocent but some are just more mature in coming to terms with their own failings.

[Caligula?]

Oh boohoo, I'm sure the whole of Germany is absolutely quivering in their boots now that Turkey has recalled their ambassador. A few other nations could learn from Germany on recognizing this as what it really was - a genocide.

[viteslesrouges]

Turkish governments of all stripes have traditionally had a big problem in recognising what happened to the Armenians 100 years ago.

Thanks for posting this Yorky.

The final stage of genocide is its denial

"UK House of Lords to consider recognition of the Armenian Genocide on June 16"

http://www.armradio.am/en/2015/06/03/uk-house-of-lords-to-consider-recognition-of-the-armenian-genocide-on-june-16/

[Xabi Gerrard]

Oh boohoo, I'm sure the whole of Germany is absolutely quivering in their boots now that Turkey has recalled their ambassador. A few other nations could learn from Germany on recognizing this as what it really was - a genocide.

I dont know mate, I think you're underestimating how big a principled stand this is by Germany. I think there's around 3m people of Turkish descent in Germany so they make a very significant part of the electorate. If these Germans of Turkish descent feel strongly about the issue (and its a big if as I have no idea whether 2nd/3rd generation German Turks care enough about it), then it may be reflected in election results.

Plus they export around 20bn EUR to Turkey each year (not their most significant trading partner, but definitely not something they'd want damaged).

It would have been easy for Germany to just ignore it - that would have been more beneficial to the German economy and their politicians' popularity amongst their largest ethnic minority group. But they didn't ignore it, so well done Germany.

[west_london_red]

Also worth remembering that a decent proporion of the Turks in Germany are actually Kurds so won't have any real sympathy with the Turkish state or government.

[CornerFlag]

Thanks for posting this Yorky.

The final stage of genocide is its denial

"UK House of Lords to consider recognition of the Armenian Genocide on June 16"

http://www.armradio.am/en/2015/06/03/uk-house-of-lords-to-consider-recognition-of-the-armenian-genocide-on-june-16/

That doesn't seem right, the HoL is in recess then.

http://calendar.parliament.uk/calendar/Lords/All/2016/6/16/Daily

[SP]

That doesn't seem right, the HoL is in recess then.

http://calendar.parliament.uk/calendar/Lords/All/2016/6/16/Daily

The article was dated: 18:05, 03 Jun 2015

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201516/ldhansrd/text/150616-0001.htm#15061659000404

[CornerFlag]

The article was dated: 18:05, 03 Jun 2015

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld201516/ldhansrd/text/150616-0001.htm#15061659000404

Ah, that makes more sense.  Thought it'd been brought up pretty recently in parliament.  They stopped short of calling it a genocide though if I recall correctly.

[Yorkykopite]

Some very hopeful movement on this now.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/21/armenian-genocide-joe-biden-turkey

[liverbloke]

Joe Biden has become the first US president to issue a statement formally describing the 1915 massacre of Armenians as a genocide.

But the issue is highly sensitive, with Turkey acknowledging atrocities but rejecting the term "genocide".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56874811

[Yorkykopite]

Another key line from the article is from this guy:

Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu said on Saturday that Turkey "entirely rejects" the US decision.

"We will not take lessons from anyone on our history," he tweeted.

Unfortunately for Turkish citizens keen to discover something honest about their past, this means they will continue to be fed a diet of lies and evasions about the genocide from the Turkish State. Those Turkish scholars who have published their own works on the Armenian genocide have been silenced, exiled or imprisoned.  So clearly, the powers-that-be in Turkey won't take 'lessons' from them either.

Well done Joe Biden. One day this will end with Turkey becoming a free country with its people and its universities able to discuss the genocide and expand everyone's knowledge about what happened and why. 

[liverbloke]

yorky i want to get your thoughts on this famous forged photograph



it was included in the first edition of the 'great game of genocide' originally published by oxford university press though after an investigation of the photograph - in which it was found to be a composite forgery - they quickly withdrew the book and destroyed its copies before a new edition was run

the thing is, why 'composite' this image and with that run the risk that it will be discovered and therefore could possibly undermine your conclusions especially by the instigators

was it because photographs of the genocide were rare or hardly taken and the author wanted to give the book that shock value, or was he using his own propaganda (as in creating an image to show the 'true' horror albeit a lie in itself) to strengthen his argument?

it all seems a bit ill-conceived - though with the right intentions

[Sangria]

yorky i want to get your thoughts on this famous forged photograph



it was included in the first edition of the 'great game of genocide' originally published by oxford university press though after an investigation of the photograph - in which it was found to be a composite forgery - they quickly withdrew the book and destroyed its copies before a new edition was run

the thing is, why 'composite' this image and with that run the risk that it will be discovered and therefore could possibly undermine your conclusions especially by the instigators

was it because photographs of the genocide were rare or hardly taken and the author wanted to give the book that shock value, or was he using his own propaganda (as in creating an image to show the 'true' horror albeit a lie in itself) to strengthen his argument?

it all seems a bit ill-conceived - though with the right intentions

Where's the image from? I've found an article on it, but given that the site is called tc-america, ie. Turkish Coalition of America, I'm wary of its credentials.

[liverbloke]

it's titled 'a turkish official taunting starving armenians'

further reading and explorations of its forgery:

https://www.groong.com/orig/ak-20100222.html

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Fake_image_claiming_to_be_Ottoman_official_teasing_Armenian_starved_children_by_showing_bread,_1915.jpg

https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/turkish-official-taunting-starved-armenians-1915/

[Yorkykopite]

That's interesting. I'd never seen that before. A "cautionary tale" indeed.

I guess it's doubly important to verify your sources when dealing with (any) genocide because mistakes and deceptions are always seized on by 'deniers' who are then allowed to ignore all the real evidence and focus exclusively on the forgery.

[liverbloke]

That's interesting. I'd never seen that before. A "cautionary tale" indeed.

I guess it's doubly important to verify your sources when dealing with (any) genocide because mistakes and deceptions are always seized on by 'deniers' who are then allowed to ignore all the real evidence and focus exclusively on the forgery.

it is interesting isn't it - came across it whilst looking into the subject