Author Topic: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)  (Read 582118 times)

Offline ScottScott

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6040 on: March 20, 2024, 09:14:25 am »
I think both Bradley and Quansah will go further than Harvey eventually, even though they have similar status in the squad now. They have that atheleticism that Harvey is missing, and which I personally think will limit him from becoming a real top player at the level of say Mac.  But thats just a guess of course, and it doesnt make him a bad player.

He needs to stop playing those loose, low crosses through midfield though, we get punished badly

I'm assuming you mean speed here because I'd say Elliott is probably the fittest player we have and puts himself about for 90 (and 120) minutes with very little drop off

He also has more than enough technical ability to make up for any lack of speed (which is massively overblown). Look at Macca at the minute, slower than Harvey and yet he's the best CM in the league currently. Harvey can do the same, use his ability and his workrate to dominate in the middle. Plus he'll only get better as he learns more about his role and how the game can be played

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6041 on: March 20, 2024, 09:23:38 am »
I'm assuming you mean speed here because I'd say Elliott is probably the fittest player we have and puts himself about for 90 (and 120) minutes with very little drop off

He also has more than enough technical ability to make up for any lack of speed (which is massively overblown). Look at Macca at the minute, slower than Harvey and yet he's the best CM in the league currently. Harvey can do the same, use his ability and his workrate to dominate in the middle. Plus he'll only get better as he learns more about his role and how the game can be played

And look at what Henderson achieved. He was our key midfielder in a team that won everything (and even in 13/14 when we should have won the league).

Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season

Offline Knight

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6042 on: March 20, 2024, 09:34:05 am »
Elliot has outstanding technical ability and it’ll certainly make up for his athletic limitations. It already has. He’s 20 and has how many appearances? That said I’m not convinced by some of the comparisons in here. Milner was strong and powerful at his peak as well as being able to run all day. Elliot can run all day but doesn’t have the sort of power that used to make Milner a driving wide midfielder before he moved more central. Henderson was athletically brilliant. Quick across the ground, strong in duels. It’s not just that he could run all day, he’d also get to the ball first. Elliot doesn’t quite have that. MacAllister is so good at being in the right place in CM whilst not being the quickest, hopefully Elliot will develop that as he gets older.

Offline Sheer Magnetism

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6043 on: March 20, 2024, 10:41:11 am »
Elliot has outstanding technical ability and it’ll certainly make up for his athletic limitations. It already has. He’s 20 and has how many appearances? That said I’m not convinced by some of the comparisons in here. Milner was strong and powerful at his peak as well as being able to run all day. Elliot can run all day but doesn’t have the sort of power that used to make Milner a driving wide midfielder before he moved more central. Henderson was athletically brilliant. Quick across the ground, strong in duels. It’s not just that he could run all day, he’d also get to the ball first. Elliot doesn’t quite have that. MacAllister is so good at being in the right place in CM whilst not being the quickest, hopefully Elliot will develop that as he gets older.
Who's this 'Elliot' of which you speak?

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6044 on: Yesterday at 07:25:32 am »
There’s no ‘athletic limitations’.  By virtue of his game time in a Klopp side, he has the stamina and strength to play at the top level.  Technically he’s excellent, so creative and puts in a fantastic defensive shift.  It’s almost like he’s so good at everything, that people can’t pigeon hole him and just class him as average. If he lacks anything it’s only some explosive pace, but few players have that anyway.  Seems to have the right sort of attitude and mentality too…honestly this season I think he’s been fantastic and the lad’s not even 21 yet.
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Offline BriarcliffInmate

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6045 on: Today at 05:22:50 am »
There’s no ‘athletic limitations’.  By virtue of his game time in a Klopp side, he has the stamina and strength to play at the top level.  Technically he’s excellent, so creative and puts in a fantastic defensive shift.  It’s almost like he’s so good at everything, that people can’t pigeon hole him and just class him as average. If he lacks anything it’s only some explosive pace, but few players have that anyway.  Seems to have the right sort of attitude and mentality too…honestly this season I think he’s been fantastic and the lad’s not even 21 yet.

This is exactly it. The only thing he doesn't have is lightning pace and height. But he's got everything else to compensate for it, and he has an engine that means he's a pressing machine.

You can tell he's played under Klopp for longer because he's developed that, whereas Jarell and Conor can be flagging by 60 minutes because this is their first season doing it. Now if Xabi or a similar athletic-minded manager comes, they'll get another season to develop their engines.
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Offline Knight

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6046 on: Today at 08:58:57 am »
We may or may not agree with his lack of pace being an ‘athletic limitation’ but it’s not simply that he isn’t lightning quick. Rather he often appears to be one of the slower players on the pitch when you watch him. And I’d argue that, given the clear importance of pace to the modern game, his lack of pace is a genuine limitation. I think he’ll be good enough to make up for it though.

Offline Asam

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6047 on: Today at 10:31:33 am »

He 20 years old and not perfect in every single way, shoot the bastard

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6048 on: Today at 10:37:56 am »
By their age, he will be more than twice the player of Mount and Gallagher.

People have been banging on about his pace since we got him, hasn't held him back any, because they were as wrong then as they are now.
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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6049 on: Today at 11:53:06 am »
By their age, he will be more than twice the player of Mount and Gallagher.

People have been banging on about his pace since we got him, hasn't held him back any, because they were as wrong then as they are now.

He's not quick and it absolutely does have an effect, there's nothing controversial about that and acknowledging it isn't akin to writing him off.

Offline Knight

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6050 on: Today at 12:38:41 pm »
He's not quick and it absolutely does have an effect, there's nothing controversial about that and acknowledging it isn't akin to writing him off.

Absolutely. I really rate him and really like him, it's so good to see a player with such clear passion for the club. He absolutely empties himself for us every time he plays and is clearly overjoyed when he scores. So my worries about pace are because I rate him and really want him to become absolutely world class. I'm just fretting. And like you say I'm not fretting about something which is irrelevant, it's not.

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6051 on: Today at 12:42:09 pm »
He 20 years old and not perfect in every single way, shoot the bastard
but first, hang him by the balls outside Anfield for a few weeks so some RAWK posters can whack him with a stick every day.

Offline JackWard33

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6052 on: Today at 01:21:56 pm »
I'm a bore on this topic.. I accept that.. but why do we need to debate his pace or anything else anymore when he's doing this at 20?

https://fbref.com/en/players/b9e1436c/Harvey-Elliott

I'm not sure I get the discussion anymore... 2+ years ago when he was a prospect ,sure, but he's basically outstanding at the top level of football - right now, today.. .and he's probably 3 or 4 years from his peak
So we can talk about how good he can get I guess but when people talk about him not being quick or strong or some shit it just reads like it's a discussion about someone at Bobby Clark's point of his career not where Elliott is
If his physical limitations were a problem he wouldn't be able to get on the ball at the top level or keep the ball or play under pressure etc etc .. he has no such problems .. I mean the kid is in the top 3rd percentile for progressive carries how slow can he be?
Yeah pace is a thing but football isnt a 100 metre running race lads!
« Last Edit: Today at 01:27:11 pm by JackWard33 »

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6053 on: Today at 02:22:41 pm »
I'm a bore on this topic.. I accept that.. but why do we need to debate his pace or anything else anymore when he's doing this at 20?

https://fbref.com/en/players/b9e1436c/Harvey-Elliott

I'm not sure I get the discussion anymore... 2+ years ago when he was a prospect ,sure, but he's basically outstanding at the top level of football - right now, today.. .and he's probably 3 or 4 years from his peak
So we can talk about how good he can get I guess but when people talk about him not being quick or strong or some shit it just reads like it's a discussion about someone at Bobby Clark's point of his career not where Elliott is
If his physical limitations were a problem he wouldn't be able to get on the ball at the top level or keep the ball or play under pressure etc etc .. he has no such problems .. I mean the kid is in the top 3rd percentile for progressive carries how slow can he be?
Yeah pace is a thing but football isnt a 100 metre running race lads!


It's useful when discussing where he can play for us, how it effects the team and how it matches up with opponents. He's had some good performances in Salah's position for example but his lack of pace and physicality does result in him struggling to run onto passes in behind or beat a player 1 on 1, so if he were to play there longer term we'd need to alter the team elsewhere. Similarly, a season ago he was one of the last players I'd want to see starting in midfield against City because they could easily isolate him and force him off the ball, but since then he has improved a lot at keeping mobile when receiving the ball so he can't be surrounded and pinned down as easily.

Ultimately, we're just here to discuss football because we don't have anything better to do, and discussing a players strengths and weaknesses is part of that, so I'll keep doing it regardless of how much others try to dictate what can and can't be said.

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Re: Harvey Elliott (Harvey Daniel James Elliott)
« Reply #6054 on: Today at 02:37:45 pm »
I'm a bore on this topic.. I accept that.. but why do we need to debate his pace or anything else anymore when he's doing this at 20?

https://fbref.com/en/players/b9e1436c/Harvey-Elliott

I'm not sure I get the discussion anymore... 2+ years ago when he was a prospect ,sure, but he's basically outstanding at the top level of football - right now, today.. .and he's probably 3 or 4 years from his peak
So we can talk about how good he can get I guess but when people talk about him not being quick or strong or some shit it just reads like it's a discussion about someone at Bobby Clark's point of his career not where Elliott is
If his physical limitations were a problem he wouldn't be able to get on the ball at the top level or keep the ball or play under pressure etc etc .. he has no such problems .. I mean the kid is in the top 3rd percentile for progressive carries how slow can he be?
Yeah pace is a thing but football isnt a 100 metre running race lads!
That Fowler bloke wasn't much in the supreme speedster ratings.  Surprised we gave him a look-in.