Topic: Do you support the strikes?

[killer-heels]

French know how to protest

Yep. They really take no shit. Not enough things are smashed here.

[PaulF]

Apparently HMRC are thinking about striking

[redbyrdz]

Just reminded myself that in the 60s dockers in Liverpool went on strike on behalf of the nurses as they knew they wouldn’t vote to……

Yes, thats the thing that is missing right now and is stopping the multiple strikes from turning into a general strike. There are basically no actions in solidarity with the strikes (I'm sure there are lots of words and praise).

[Nobby Reserve]

Yes, thats the thing that is missing right now and is stopping the multiple strikes from turning into a general strike. There are basically no actions in solidarity with the strikes (I'm sure there are lots of words and praise).

There's enough people whining about strikers being greedy and demanding pay rises the government can't afford. Or the parroting that the rail workers are living in the past and need to 'modernise'.

It's become an accepted 'fact' that all the industrial strife of the 1970's was solely the fault of militant unions. The shite and 'do as I say' macho-management; shft in business-owning culture toward more US-style short-term results and profit; the accompanying reduction in capital investment into new technology (preferring to 'sweat' pre-WW" machinery; idiotic 'prices & incomes' policies by successive governments, doesn't get mentioned.



Solidarity is dead.

[Rawkybalboa]

There's enough people whining about strikers being greedy and demanding pay rises the government can't afford. Or the parroting that the rail workers are living in the past and need to 'modernise'.

It's become an accepted 'fact' that all the industrial strife of the 1970's was solely the fault of militant unions. The shite and 'do as I say' macho-management; shft in business-owning culture toward more US-style short-term results and profit; the accompanying reduction in capital investment into new technology (preferring to 'sweat' pre-WW" machinery; idiotic 'prices & incomes' policies by successive governments, doesn't get mentioned.



Solidarity is dead.

Theres a lot of people in Civil service who had 10 years of austerity a pay freeze. At the end of that they were told Covid. And now they being told we aint got the money. Wot a load of bollix. Those in power can afford to give themselves a big rise and all the other perks they abuse. Claps dont pay the bills.

[Nobby Reserve]

Theres a lot of people in Civil service who had 10 years of austerity a pay freeze. At the end of that they were told Covid. And now they being told we aint got the money.

Absolutely (my missus worked at HMRC until 2018; I did until the end of 1999 - I was a union rep till I left  )

[andy07]

Can we not just have a national day of action where all those that are striking together are supported by the rest of us?  Maybe however many million bringing London to a halt? Too much unilateral action that the tories will ride out.

[killer-heels]

Can we not just have a national day of action where all those that are striking together are supported by the rest of us?  Maybe however many million bringing London to a halt? Too much unilateral action that the tories will ride out.

I was thinking we should all ram our local tory mp’s off the road but a national strike day sounds good as well.

[gazzalfc]

RMT have been offered this as their best and final offer

9% over 2 years (4.5% for 2022 and 4.5% in 2023). Backdated to April 2022
No compulsory redundancies until the end of December 2024 (was April 2024)
£1,750 lump sum to be paid to the lowest earners
No inclusion of driver-only operations
Offer of voluntary redundancies to those who want to leave before December 2024
Creation of 'Multi Skilled' station roles (basically increasing the role at ticket offices so the can start phasing out manned ticket offices)

This wasn't thrown out by the RMT and will be considered. I think this will probably be accepted

[Andy @ Allerton!]

There's enough people whining about strikers being greedy and demanding pay rises the government can't afford. Or the parroting that the rail workers are living in the past and need to 'modernise'.

It's become an accepted 'fact' that all the industrial strife of the 1970's was solely the fault of militant unions. The shite and 'do as I say' macho-management; shft in business-owning culture toward more US-style short-term results and profit; the accompanying reduction in capital investment into new technology (preferring to 'sweat' pre-WW" machinery; idiotic 'prices & incomes' policies by successive governments, doesn't get mentioned.



Solidarity is dead.

"There's enough people whining about strikers"

Absolutely no one around here - not one person. Where do you live?

[TepidT2O]

Got to admire the French strikers…



A BBQ on rails!  OMFG! That’s living the best life isn’t it?

[PaulF]

We've just had our first letter from the school detailing the impact of the strikes. Or , as it's not greatly worded, not detailing the impact.
I think we'll have a very happy year 7 at home next Wed, and a grumpy year 4 sibling in school.

Fucking militant communists (joking Stick it to the corrupt bunch of tossers "running" the country. )

[PaulF]

More school strikes announced.

If a union 'goes on strike' , do all their members have to strike?

[Barneylfc∗]

More school strikes announced.

If a union 'goes on strike' , do all their members have to strike?

No. Each member makes their own decision.

[gazzalfc]

Still support the strikes.

[rob1966]

Both kids home from school today, so not today I don't no

[west_london_red]

Today was an excellent opportunity to explain to my 5 year old daughter that the reason she’s not going school today is because of these evil people called Tories who don’t like good people like teachers and nurses.

[Millie]

My daughter was on strike today (teacher) and she went on the march in Liverpool.  Yes I support the strikes.

[Millie]

Today was an excellent opportunity to explain to my 5 year old daughter that the reason she’s not going school today is because of these evil people called Tories who don’t like good people like teachers and nurses.

Brilliant - my daughter took her own daughter on the protest march today.

[reddebs]

I hope everyone with kids is educating them on why so many public service employees feel they have no other option than to strike 👍

[Nobby Reserve]

Today was an excellent opportunity to explain to my 5 year old daughter that the reason she’s not going school today is because of these evil people called Tories who don’t like good people like teachers and nurses.

 


Mine already know all too well.

[AlphaDelta]

I'm a civil servant and have been on strike today. As already mentioned we had a pay freeze for long enough, then they blamed covid and now its 'well the pots empty so sorry'.

It doesn't help when you have the likes of Rees-Mogg saying nobody would notice if we went on strike anyway, and they wonder why moral is on the floor.

I think from own point of view, I respect anyones decision regarding strikes. We have a lot of agency staff who aren't in the PCS and they've been threatened with the sack if they don't come in. These people have families to feed, homes to heat so I have absolutely no problem with them.

Again, a lot of our staff are under 30 and quite frankly haven't a clue what a union is or more importantly what its done for them in the past. I see it as my job to educate them and make them understand that sick pay, flexi and that is because of the union.

What hurts the most is the bullshitters in work. I know a guy, who I used to describe as my perfect manager. Jovial, kind, never got upset, a real down to earth fella. He is a massive red and self-proclaimed socialist.
Yet he left the union and refuses to strike. I don't understand him. He's in his 50's, he was brickie in the 80s before the civil service, so he should know better.

These fookin strikes, they create divisions, break friendships, tear apart families........... Literally, our government is a cesspit.  :'(

[Ed-Zeppelin]

I hope everyone with kids is educating them on why so many public service employees feel they have no other option than to strike 👍

Civil Servant married to a nurse here. Kids off school today and they’re not old enough to really get it yet but we’ve both been able to explain why it’s happening, and who’s to blame!

[PaulF]

My daughters want strikes every day if they don't have to go to school. So I've not mentioned the Tories, otherwise they'd be campaigning for them!

[24/7]

I'm a civil servant and have been on strike today.

Literally, our government is a cesspit.  :'(

I'm a former civil servant and it was nailed into me from Day One that the Civil Service exists to serve society and not the incumbent ruling government. These fucking Tory bastards have not forgotten this - they know it very well - and they've taken a fucking massive shit on that principle and then gaslit the entire workforce whilst simultaneously brainwashing the public. The worst part is that it appears to have worked. The only hope is that the magic spell has worn off and the next election can't come too soon.....

[reddebs]

Civil Servant married to a nurse here. Kids off school today and they’re not old enough to really get it yet but we’ve both been able to explain why it’s happening, and who’s to blame!

Good for you mate.

For humanity to have any hope of a better future for everyone it's essential to educate the younger generation to know why solidarity is strength and which of the political parties will help us achieve that.

All the best to everyone who's recently  voted for strike action 👏👏👏

[west_london_red]

I'm a civil servant and have been on strike today. As already mentioned we had a pay freeze for long enough, then they blamed covid and now its 'well the pots empty so sorry'.

It doesn't help when you have the likes of Rees-Mogg saying nobody would notice if we went on strike anyway, and they wonder why moral is on the floor.

I think from own point of view, I respect anyones decision regarding strikes. We have a lot of agency staff who aren't in the PCS and they've been threatened with the sack if they don't come in. These people have families to feed, homes to heat so I have absolutely no problem with them.

Again, a lot of our staff are under 30 and quite frankly haven't a clue what a union is or more importantly what its done for them in the past. I see it as my job to educate them and make them understand that sick pay, flexi and that is because of the union.

What hurts the most is the bullshitters in work. I know a guy, who I used to describe as my perfect manager. Jovial, kind, never got upset, a real down to earth fella. He is a massive red and self-proclaimed socialist.
Yet he left the union and refuses to strike. I don't understand him. He's in his 50's, he was brickie in the 80s before the civil service, so he should know better.

These fookin strikes, they create divisions, break friendships, tear apart families........... Literally, our government is a cesspit.  :'(

There are some absolute tossers out there. One girl I used to work with point blank refused to join a union despite all of us explaining the point of a union to her. Then came the inevitable re-org as we tend to have about every 5 years and she ended up in trouble because the new manager she was mapped to didn’t like her working from home two days a week. So she goes running to our team mate whose the union rep who takes on the case, got the company and manager to back down over their opposition to her working from home two days a week, you’d think after that she’d sign up to the union out of gratitude but nope, minge bag still wouldn’t join and cough up her monthly subscription.

[oldfordie]

I hope everyone with kids is educating them on why so many public service employees feel they have no other option than to strike 👍

Shame many never did it in the past, Maggie stole our Milk made me think people didn't know just how evil she was. , it's not enough to tell your kids not to vote Tory because they are evil. you have to tell them all the laws they past that hit you and impacted them as a result. all the laws they past that impacted them directly, in this case. all Teachers wage rises have to be paid out of the Schools budget. that means less to spend on employing enough teachers, school facilities for the kids to enjoy and learn.

[reddebs]

Shame many never did it in the past, Maggie stole our Milk made me think people didn't know just how evil she was. , it's not enough to tell your kids not to vote Tory because they are evil. you have to tell them all the laws they past that hit you and impacted them as a result. all the laws they past that impacted them directly, in this case. all Teachers wage rises have to be paid out of the Schools budget. that means less to spend on employing enough teachers, school facilities for the kids to enjoy and learn.

It doesn't even need to be that mate just a simple nurturing of wanting to be good people.  Instill those values and the politics should follow.

[PaulF]

Sooo.... I was wondering.
Unionised labour now seems to mostly be for public sector workers ( I know I can caveat that with Amazon, Royal mail and the railways, but bear with me please).
In the private sector, I kind of believe if you don't like the salary or the terms and conditions you change job.  You might have to study more or gain experience, but that's the way it is (under capitalism).
But in the public sector you don't necessarily have alternatives (you can't join the private private fire service).
For teachers though, could many of them quit and join private schools? Is it the sense of wanting to serve the general public that keeps them in schools, or something else (not enough posts in private schools maybe)?.  I guess we are seeing doctors and nurses bleeding out into the private sector.

Possibly this is one for the captialist vs communist thread, but I'm just curious about teachers really.

[oldfordie]

It doesn't even need to be that mate just a simple nurturing of wanting to be good people.  Instill those values and the politics should follow.

I get where your coming from but if people are going to tell their kids to never vote Tory then they have to explain why by giving examples of how the Torys passed cruel laws that hurt your life which in turn hurt their life, the cruel laws they passed that directly hurt their lives. as I say Maggie stole our milk was a sign people never could give examples.
Politics is complicated, what seems obviously fair and decent to 1 person may feel unfair to someone else. we've seen it plenty of times over the years just on these threads, it's not that these people were bad or didn't care, they just never realised they were supporting the Torys race to the bottom.

 

[reddebs]

I get where your coming from but if people are going to tell their kids to never vote Tory then they have to explain why by giving examples of how the Torys passed cruel laws that hurt your life which in turn hurt their life, the cruel laws they passed that directly hurt their lives. as I say Maggie stole our milk was a sign people never could give examples.
Politics is complicated, what seems obviously fair and decent to 1 person may feel unfair to someone else. we've seen it plenty of times over the years just on these threads, it's not that these people were bad or didn't care, they just never realised they were supporting the Torys race to the bottom.

Then you're in PaulF territory where his kids are loving not having to go to school so to them it's 'yay vote tory'.

The nuances are hard to distinguish but starting from a starting point of wanting a fairer society for all is as good as anywhere.

[west_london_red]

Sooo.... I was wondering.
Unionised labour now seems to mostly be for public sector workers ( I know I can caveat that with Amazon, Royal mail and the railways, but bear with me please).
In the private sector, I kind of believe if you don't like the salary or the terms and conditions you change job.  You might have to study more or gain experience, but that's the way it is (under capitalism).
But in the public sector you don't necessarily have alternatives (you can't join the private private fire service).
For teachers though, could many of them quit and join private schools? Is it the sense of wanting to serve the general public that keeps them in schools, or something else (not enough posts in private schools maybe)?.  I guess we are seeing doctors and nurses bleeding out into the private sector.

Possibly this is one for the captialist vs communist thread, but I'm just curious about teachers really.

7% of children go to a private school, so there’s not that many jobs to go around for most teachers for one.

There’s also people like me who work in jobs like IT, finance, HR, etc who just happen to work for a public sector employer and are subject to the same derisory pay increase. Now, could I get a job in the private sector and earn more money? Definitely, but at the same time it is nice knowing that you are actually making a difference. Even in my lower management role I’ve worked on preparing for the Olympics, Euro 2020 the planning for the Queens funeral and a load of very interesting pieces of work like rolling out 4G in the Underground stations and tunnels, and whatever I would be doing in the private sector just wouldn’t get the juices flowing I suspect. And while the last 6-8 years or so have been shit in terms of money, it wasn’t always that way and maybe naively I’m hoping things will improve (they will have to sooner or later or everything will just fall apart eventually). There’s also a degree of stubbornness on my part, I’m not letting the Tory bastards force me out from an employer I am loyal to and proud to work for, I’ll decide when I leave.

[PaulF]

7% of children go to a private school, so there’s not that many jobs to go around for most teachers for one.

There’s also people like me who work in jobs like IT, finance, HR, etc who just happen to work for a public sector employer and are subject to the same derisory pay increase. Now, could I get a job in the private sector and earn more money? Definitely, but at the same time it is nice knowing that you are actually making a difference. Even in my lower management role I’ve worked on preparing for the Olympics, Euro 2020 the planning for the Queens funeral and a load of very interesting pieces of work like rolling out 4G in the Underground stations and tunnels, and whatever I would be doing in the private sector just wouldn’t get the juices flowing I suspect. And while the last 6-8 years or so have been shit in terms of money, it wasn’t always that way and maybe naively I’m hoping things will improve (they will have to sooner or later or everything will just fall apart eventually). There’s also a degree of stubbornness on my part, I’m not letting the Tory bastards force me out from an employer I am loyal to and proud to work for, I’ll decide when I leave.

Good point wlr, we all, where we can balance the joy of the job against the financial rewards. Or lack thereof.
I did think the relatively small private sector for teachers would be a factor.  Again for the other thread, but the difficulty in valuing things is a huge failure of capitalism.  Good teachers (for example) aren't just there for good grades, they boost the economy in future.

[oldfordie]

Then you're in PaulF territory where his kids are loving not having to go to school so to them it's 'yay vote tory'.

The nuances are hard to distinguish but starting from a starting point of wanting a fairer society for all is as good as anywhere.

I doubt if the odd day off school has the slightest effect on possible Labour voters voting Tory, theres a massive difference between telling a child how you had to struggle through every day just to pay the bills because of welfare cuts, how you had to work every hour possible just to have enough money to pay to keep a roof over our heads, telling them the reason you went to school hungry was because the Torys chopped your free school meals, the comparisons aren't even close and if people didn't suffer like this then they should have the Their before the Grace of God go I attitude as it can happen to anyone, most of the time it's just one thing after another beyond their control.

[Johnny Foreigner]

One of my best mates; higher education - being teacher for 20 years now. putting in extra hours etc - i am going to the gym with him (mainly drinking coffee) - constantly younger people coming over to him; chatting to him  about the footie etc - but some saying he saved them etc.. his son doing trade now private - making 10k more being 23... cant be right

[reddebs]

I doubt if the odd day off school has the slightest effect on possible Labour voters voting Tory, theres a massive difference between telling a child how you had to struggle through every day just to pay the bills because of welfare cuts, how you had to work every hour possible just to have enough money to pay to keep a roof over our heads, telling them the reason you went to school hungry was because the Torys chopped your free school meals, the comparisons aren't even close and if people didn't suffer like this then they should have the Their before the Grace of God go I attitude as it can happen to anyone, most of the time it's just one thing after another beyond their control.

Possibly but shouldn't we be educating those who haven't suffered like that too?  Those whose kids are likely to be the managers or employers or self employed of the future or those who become politicians and decision makers?

My hubby grew up in a pit village, the youngest son of a mining family and suffered as a schoolchild during the strikes but I had to remind him today how everything the labour party and the unions fought for in terms of better pay and conditions, a safer working environment for everyone etc was thrown away when those same folks voted for brexit.

Just because they believed the pack of lies that their lives would be better with less brown people arriving in the country. 

[oldfordie]

Possibly but shouldn't we be educating those who haven't suffered like that too?  Those whose kids are likely to be the managers or employers or self employed of the future or those who become politicians and decision makers?

My hubby grew up in a pit village, the youngest son of a mining family and suffered as a schoolchild during the strikes but I had to remind him today how everything the labour party and the unions fought for in terms of better pay and conditions, a safer working environment for everyone etc was thrown away when those same folks voted for brexit.

Just because they believed the pack of lies that their lives would be better with less brown people arriving in the country.

Yes, that's the point I made, people should have the Their before the grace of God attitude, am sure there are many people who voted Tory who were getting along fine a year ago who are now really struggling, all down to circumstances beyond their control. we aren't really all on the same page on this, we might all tear into the cruel corrupt Torys but others will be convincing others on Labour being no better than the Torys.
Am not sure if Miners themselves voted for Brexit but I wouldn't rule out the younger people who grew up in these neglected places falling for it and even voted Tory. they were wrong to do so but why they did this is another subject. some may have been racist but I think it was more about being sick and tired of the old Labour politics they saw all around them growing up.

[reddebs]

Fuck off BBC constantly asking why should millions of people suffer due to the strikes and doubting people's accounts that colleagues are having to take 2nd jobs to survive.

People are leaving these jobs in their droves, they can't retain the staff that have been trained and they can't recruit to fill the vacancies, does that suggest it's a worthwhile, well paid job to want to have?

["21C or 70F?" SchizoidWeatherMan!]

Train workers earn an average of 65k a year. Lmao, they are striking for more pay.

Care workers on the other end of the spectrum make peanuts.