Author Topic: Support - You're Doing it Wrong  (Read 41246 times)

Offline Z e u s

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #80 on: April 8, 2012, 07:37:02 pm »
Do you know what, I used to think that it was ok to vent frustration on the net after a game just like having a moan in the pub with  your mates and the post match pint. But I realised that there were people just waiting for that ammunition and use it to fill there internet warrior agendas.

There's to many lurking in the shadows looking for as many negatives that they can find and that's why the net is the wrong place to let off steam.

Its about showing solidarity and maintaining Shanks' Holy Trinity.

Well yeah, that is frustration which also is understandable at times, as we all want to succeed and love the club.

As long as people are not abusing the players and making valid / fair points, I don't see what is wrong with debating issues at the club.  I thought that was the whole point of a discussion forum.

Offline Always_A_Red

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #81 on: April 8, 2012, 07:37:29 pm »
Im not going to go on about this because i could rant all day but if im completely honest, as a 26 year old lad who has grown up never 'seeing' us lift a PL title, winning the PL is the bread and butter for me. I know im not alone. I would say that anyone who is 28 or younger can relate to what im about to say.

We have grown up watching us fall short year after year for ever since I can remember. We have come 'so close' on a number of occassions but never got there. We have done this whilst UTD win title after title, year after year. I cant even explain to you what going to school was like with loads of UTD fans in the class. It may as well have been 11 years of constant mickey taking and gloating from your mates as we yet again fail to live up to expectations.

Year on year we have the expectation that 'this will be our year. This year we'll do it'. Yet year after year we are left disappointed.

Now dont get me wrong, we've had some very good moments. Some VERY good moments. 2001 (at 16) i remember bunking out of my prom venue to get to the pub opposite to watch us beat Alaves in the Uefa Cup Final, 2005 Istanbul was probably the best night of my life, 2008 at Old trafford as we demolished UTD in their own back yard 4-1. They are all great memories, but they are not what I, and many people my age crave. We want the league. I just want to know what that feeling is like...to win the League. Just once.

I've waited 22 years....well actually, probably 19-20 of them I can briefly remember. We have all waited, patiently. I am patient. I will wait even longer as long as I can see the end is getting closer and not getting further away.

Thats when frustration comes in. Jealousy of your friends that they know what it feels like to win it (not that they support them as i'd rather cut my leg off that support them), that then turns to anger and resentment. We look for reasons. Why?? Why can we not do it? Why has it been so long? Not just this year, not the last 5 years, but 22 years!

Like i've said, all we want (and i say 'we' as the support who have grown up like me) is to know that it will happen. We will win it, one day. We will have that day in May stood in the KOP watching us lift that title. Apart from the birth of my 2 girls, winning the PL will probably be the best day of my life.
« Last Edit: April 8, 2012, 07:41:27 pm by Always_A_Red »
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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #82 on: April 8, 2012, 07:38:18 pm »
We actually all know that FS has a condo apartment in The Colonnades at Albert Dock....and it's aperitifs at 8 in that neck of the woods. Off for a pint, more like a Manhatten....
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Offline john_mac

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #83 on: April 8, 2012, 07:43:33 pm »
Im not going to go on about this because i could rant all day but if im completely honest, as a 26 year old lad who has grown up never 'seeing' us lift a PL title, winning the PL is the bread and butter for me. I know im not alone. I would say that anyone who is 28 or younger can relate to what im about to say.

We have grown up watching us fall short year after year for ever since I can remember. We have come 'so close' on a number of occassions but never got there. We have done this whilst our UTD win title after title, year after year. I cant even explain to you what going to school was like with loads of UTD fans in the class. It may as well have been 11 years of constant mickey taking and gloating from your mates as we yet again fail to live up to expectations.

Year on year we have the expectation that 'this will be our year. This year we'll do it'. Yet year after year we are left disappointed.

Now dont get me wrong, we've had some very good moments. Some VERY good moments. 2001 (at 16) i remember bunking out of my prom venue to get to the pub opposite to watch us beat Alaves in the Uefa Cup Final, 2005 Istanbul was probably the best night of my life, 2008 at Old trafford as we demolished UTD in their own back yard 4-1. They are all great memories, but they are not what I, and many people my age crave. We want the league. I just want to know what that feeling is like...to win the League. Just once.

I've waited 22 years....well actually, probably 19-20 of them I can briefly remember. We have all waited, patiently. I am patient. I will wait even longer as long as I can see the end is getting closer and not getting further away.

Thats when frustration comes in. Jealousy of your friends that they know what it feels like to win it (not that they support them as i'd rather cut my leg off that support them), that then turns to anger and resentment. We look for reasons. Why?? Why can we not do it? Why has it been so long? Not just this year, not the last 5 years, but 22 years!

Like i've said, all we want (and i say 'we' as the support who have grown up like me) is to know that it will happen. We will win it, one day. We will have that day in May stood in the KOP watching us lift that title. Apart from the birth of my 2 girls, winning the PL will probably be the best day of my life.


Sorry mate but you've waited no longer than any other c*nt, and looks to me as though you've seen your tem win plenty in the meantime, probably more than fans of any team bar united. Stop feeling sorry for yourself, you've been a lucky twat.
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Offline Alan_X

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #84 on: April 8, 2012, 07:45:05 pm »
"viscous" like it :D

He means they're a bit thick...
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Offline john_mac

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #85 on: April 8, 2012, 07:45:26 pm »
and forget to say uou'll never win any league that will come bear Istanbul
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Offline Dick Emery

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #86 on: April 8, 2012, 07:46:27 pm »
There have always been moaners. Ronnie Whelan got stick when he first got in the team, John Barnes and Phil Neal were abused when their legs went and Danny Murphy was cheered off when he was substituted at Anfield.

It's the know-it-alls now that really piss me off. They are so smart and have heard of every player in every shit league under the sun. They know all the tactics and love to let everyone know how expert they are. They know better than Kenny and find it amazing that Kenny can't see what they see. They also seem to have an insight into the inner workings of the club and love a conspiracy theory or two, especially when they can pick on a pantomime villain in the club who is the root of all our problems. These are the people who love to dish out the abuse. They don't see the contradiction of them abusing a player who is being paid £50,000 a week and yet they are paying £40 to get in.

Still, if they keep it out of the ground and only on forums with fellow Reds, I even don't see this as a problem. It's when they are on national radio waffling shite that I want them found, tortured and hung from the nearest tree. What possesses them to feed the media machine?

Offline Always_A_Red

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #87 on: April 8, 2012, 07:49:19 pm »
Sorry mate but you've waited no longer than any other c*nt, and looks to me as though you've seen your tem win plenty in the meantime, probably more than fans of any team bar united. Stop feeling sorry for yourself, you've been a lucky twat.

Not feeling sorry for myself one bit mate. I think you are completely missing the point. Like i've said, i've had some great nights, some great memories, however the OP, and others who have commenting, are singling out this 'new generation' of moaners who have no patience. I personally dont think anything could be further from the truth.
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Offline Shanks1965

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #88 on: April 8, 2012, 07:50:08 pm »
We've become lazy fans. A terrible symptom of modern society.
I'd responsd to that but.... I really can't be arsed.
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Offline Marty 85

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #89 on: April 8, 2012, 07:51:28 pm »
Quality thread and OP! Nice one Rhi!

Im not going to go on about this because i could rant all day but if im completely honest, as a 26 year old lad who has grown up never 'seeing' us lift a PL title, winning the PL is the bread and butter for me. I know im not alone. I would say that anyone who is 28 or younger can relate to what im about to say.

We have grown up watching us fall short year after year for ever since I can remember. We have come 'so close' on a number of occassions but never got there. We have done this whilst UTD win title after title, year after year. I cant even explain to you what going to school was like with loads of UTD fans in the class. It may as well have been 11 years of constant mickey taking and gloating from your mates as we yet again fail to live up to expectations.

Year on year we have the expectation that 'this will be our year. This year we'll do it'. Yet year after year we are left disappointed.

Now dont get me wrong, we've had some very good moments. Some VERY good moments. 2001 (at 16) i remember bunking out of my prom venue to get to the pub opposite to watch us beat Alaves in the Uefa Cup Final, 2005 Istanbul was probably the best night of my life, 2008 at Old trafford as we demolished UTD in their own back yard 4-1. They are all great memories, but they are not what I, and many people my age crave. We want the league. I just want to know what that feeling is like...to win the League. Just once.

I've waited 22 years....well actually, probably 19-20 of them I can briefly remember. We have all waited, patiently. I am patient. I will wait even longer as long as I can see the end is getting closer and not getting further away.

Thats when frustration comes in. Jealousy of your friends that they know what it feels like to win it (not that they support them as i'd rather cut my leg off that support them), that then turns to anger and resentment. We look for reasons. Why?? Why can we not do it? Why has it been so long? Not just this year, not the last 5 years, but 22 years!

Like i've said, all we want (and i say 'we' as the support who have grown up like me) is to know that it will happen. We will win it, one day. We will have that day in May stood in the KOP watching us lift that title. Apart from the birth of my 2 girls, winning the PL will probably be the best day of my life.


I'm just a year older than you mate but i realise nobody can promise or guarantee me that we will in it again. I'm hopeful that we will but i don't demand it just because of our history.

I wouldn't worry about those Mancs that you went to school with, they'll start to fall by the wayside when Mr Alex Ferguson leaves and things get tough.

I'm not jealous of any of my Manc, Chelsea, or Arsenal mates just because they've celebrated winning the league in recent years. Winning the league is huge and was a daily occurence for us back in the 70's and 80's but we're about a lot more and if anything I think my mates are jealous of me when they see Anfield on a European night and the fantastic support and identity we have. City or Chelsea can go out and buy the league but they can't buy that.

The only time I enviesd another clubs supporters was in 89 when Thomas scored that goal. I imagined what it must have been like to be an Arsenal fan that day and that nothing could top that. Then came Istanbul ;)
« Last Edit: April 8, 2012, 07:54:36 pm by Magin85 »

Offline john_mac

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #90 on: April 8, 2012, 07:56:38 pm »
Not feeling sorry for myself one bit mate. I think you are completely missing the point. Like i've said, i've had some great nights, some great memories, however the OP, and others who have commenting, are singling out this 'new generation' of moaners who have no patience. I personally dont think anything could be further from the truth.

i've actually said the opposite, i know younger lads who are great fans. I'd single out the moaning bastards on the internet more arsed that they chose to support Liverpool in 2005 and now get stick off their Man U mates when we draw at home to Norwich.

Anyone who has travelled to watch LFC is lucky to have done so.
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Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #91 on: April 8, 2012, 08:01:53 pm »


I understand what you're saying. It must be shite. I'm not taking the piss. I was lucky enough to have been born a 5 minute walk from Anfield. In Shankly's barren years, what a lot of aul arses use to preach patience, going the match was fucking great, probably some of the happiest times of me life. We didn't have all the distractions either. Leisure time... we pretty much played football in the street and went to watch it when we weren't playing. And, believe it or not, it might sound like sentimental twaddle, but, despite the fights we had amongst ourselves, standing on the kop did feel like being a member of a big society.
I have lived outside of Liverpool and been surrounded by Mancs and Man U supporters at times. I know how shite it feels to be at the end of all the piss taking. I also know what John means when he says you're spoilt rotten. I often say it meself to young fellas when they start moaning. It's true. For all our failings in the league, we still have a record most clubs fans will never see in ten life times. But me point is....
We probably won't win a title again until we all stop moaning and get behind the team. Dalglish is facing fearsome odds. The Mancs are entrenched. The mega bucks of City and Chelsea haven't knocked them off the perch just yet. If it wasn't for Arsenal, they'd be titles ahead of us by now. For us to start catching them up, with our resources, we will need every one of us pulling in the same direction, all doing our job. Our's is suporting, not putting pressure on the team. It's been there to see for years now... the team start like a train. If we can't break teams down, the rumblings start in the stands the nerves start to fray on the pitch.
We need to get that old swagger, confidence and self belief back. The teams not that far behind the rest. The mentality needs to change. But if we expect the players to get their heads down, work hard and put it right, well, shouldn't we expect the same of ourselves?
Just a thought like, as I know getting on their backs hasn't worked.
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Offline hitman89762000

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #92 on: April 8, 2012, 08:02:19 pm »
Im 32 this year and the way ive always seen it is the lads need support they should get it from us and being a lfc fan should not mean being a short termist whinging auld bastard wanting everything NOW... Im telling ya the appointment of hodgson and that civil war against the two pricks have caused more damage to this club and given those that think they know everything more of a chance to stick the knife in when things arent going right. Oh and im still the one guy thinking we can get fourth.

And those of us that seem to want things the old way are the ones becoming the minority.

Then again its never just been about the trophies for me i just love the club love the king and i still harbour ambitions that one day kennys gonna ask me to replace stevie g when hes injured.. Yeah i know... Plus ive always thought we should be considering ourselves lucky we support the greatest club on the planet.. Some people dont get to do that.. We call them mancs.

Ive a mate though (ex mate) who when rafa was being forced out he rounded on everyone that he blamed for it called em all c*nts demanded tey fucked off and supported some other club... These days hes openy campaigning againt kenny.. I dont get its o sacked him off. Guys like tat do me head in.

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #93 on: April 8, 2012, 08:03:34 pm »
Let people support in their own individual and unique way. Humour them if you find their manner of supporting contrary to your own.


I recall the hooligan documentaries of the 90s (of course it was pretty much wiped out during that decade), and Stuart Hall was on one of them (the one in which he glorified Souness as a 'Rembrandt with a razor blade'). In this documentary he pointed out that working class men, in shitty manual jobs, used football as a cathartic outlet for the their frustrations in life.


Most of the moaners these days are probably not working class, nor down the pits during the work week, but football as an outlet for frustrations, imagined or real, still applies. If I pay £40 for a ticket, spend £100 on petrol, I don't want anyone to tell me how to support my team ta. If I want to have a good bitch and moan, I'll do it, be that against the referee, opposing team, and even my own team if I feel it is warranted (haven't had the fortune to do this at matches but I do like a good rant in my armchair every now and again).


Getting behind the team mantra is not going to improve the movement or technical ability of Andy Carroll.
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Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #94 on: April 8, 2012, 08:05:42 pm »
It's when they are on national radio waffling shite that I want them found, tortured and hung from the nearest tree. What possesses them to feed the media machine?
Turned Talk Shite on this morning, purposely to hear the moaning. Some masochist streak or something. Turned on just in time for Mick Quinn's "Sack Race." Complete with Alan Fluff Freeman's old Sunday top twenty music, the fat prick went reading out the top five... Kenny is top of the charts. I turned it off and sincerly hope I never put the fucking thing back on in me life.
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Offline john_mac

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #95 on: April 8, 2012, 08:10:38 pm »
Let people support in their own individual and unique way. Humour them if you find their manner of supporting contrary to your own.


I recall the hooligan documentaries of the 90s (of course it was pretty much wiped out during that decade), and Stuart Hall was on one of them (the one in which he glorified Souness as a 'Rembrandt with a razor blade'). In this documentary he pointed out that working class men, in shitty manual jobs, used football as a cathartic outlet for the their frustrations in life.


Most of the moaners these days are probably not working class, nor down the pits during the work week, but football as an outlet for frustrations, imagined or real, still applies. If I pay £40 for a ticket, spend £100 on petrol, I don't want anyone to tell me how to support my team ta. If I want to have a good bitch and moan, I'll do it, be that against the referee, opposing team, and even my own team if I feel it is warranted (haven't had the fortune to do this at matches but I do like a good rant in my armchair every now and again).


Getting behind the team mantra is not going to improve the movement or technical ability of Andy Carroll.

Honestly that's more mixed up than a Catholic Orangeman
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Offline Juanyboy

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #96 on: April 8, 2012, 08:13:00 pm »
I'm a little late but excellent OP, my sentiments exactly, but to add to what FS is saying - to me it seems that's the way things are now. But that is not to say that I'll change to keep the status quo, fuck that, I'll support my team to the last, as will many on here,and the ones who agree with this post are the ones who maintain the most reason in their posts I've noticed - an obvious pattern maybe. I'm not even that old. The rest who want instant gratification will keep on suffering, hopefully our management will  have the strength to believe in what is being built and shut out all the whingers. go and play the Xbox if you want instant success.   

Offline Always_A_Red

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #97 on: April 8, 2012, 08:20:02 pm »
I understand what you're saying. It must be shite. I'm not taking the piss. I was lucky enough to have been born a 5 minute walk from Anfield. In Shankly's barren years, what a lot of aul arses use to preach patience, going the match was fucking great, probably some of the happiest times of me life. We didn't have all the distractions either. Leisure time... we pretty much played football in the street and went to watch it when we weren't playing. And, believe it or not, it might sound like sentimental twaddle, but, despite the fights we had amongst ourselves, standing on the kop did feel like being a member of a big society.
I have lived outside of Liverpool and been surrounded by Mancs and Man U supporters at times. I know how shite it feels to be at the end of all the piss taking. I also know what John means when he says you're spoilt rotten. I often say it meself to young fellas when they start moaning. It's true. For all our failings in the league, we still have a record most clubs fans will never see in ten life times. But me point is....
We probably won't win a title again until we all stop moaning and get behind the team. Dalglish is facing fearsome odds. The Mancs are entrenched. The mega bucks of City and Chelsea haven't knocked them off the perch just yet. If it wasn't for Arsenal, they'd be titles ahead of us by now. For us to start catching them up, with our resources, we will need every one of us pulling in the same direction, all doing our job. Our's is suporting, not putting pressure on the team. It's been there to see for years now... the team start like a train. If we can't break teams down, the rumblings start in the stands the nerves start to fray on the pitch.
We need to get that old swagger, confidence and self belief back. The teams not that far behind the rest. The mentality needs to change. But if we expect the players to get their heads down, work hard and put it right, well, shouldn't we expect the same of ourselves?
Just a thought like, as I know getting on their backs hasn't worked.

I know what John means as well and I feel lucky to have witnessed those moments. Im grateful that my dad put a video on and showed me what LFC was all about and that I supported the greatest team in the world even though we weren't winning at the time. However at the same time, I have grown up as a liverpool fan being told what standards to expect at our great club. No matter how many cups we win, we always want more because we are the greatest club in the world. So even though I may sound ungrateful to have not seen us win the PL when I have had so many great experiences, I still feel that LFC's standards should never be lowered to expect that we challenge every year.

I totally agree with your second point mate.
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Offline Vulmea

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #98 on: April 8, 2012, 08:20:08 pm »
Let people support in their own individual and unique way. Humour them if you find their manner of supporting contrary to your own.


I recall the hooligan documentaries of the 90s (of course it was pretty much wiped out during that decade), and Stuart Hall was on one of them (the one in which he glorified Souness as a 'Rembrandt with a razor blade'). In this documentary he pointed out that working class men, in shitty manual jobs, used football as a cathartic outlet for the their frustrations in life.


Most of the moaners these days are probably not working class, nor down the pits during the work week, but football as an outlet for frustrations, imagined or real, still applies. If I pay £40 for a ticket, spend £100 on petrol, I don't want anyone to tell me how to support my team ta. If I want to have a good bitch and moan, I'll do it, be that against the referee, opposing team, and even my own team if I feel it is warranted (haven't had the fortune to do this at matches but I do like a good rant in my armchair every now and again).

Getting behind the team mantra is not going to improve the movement or technical ability of Andy Carroll.

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Offline Always_A_Red

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #99 on: April 8, 2012, 08:26:34 pm »
Let people support in their own individual and unique way. Humour them if you find their manner of supporting contrary to your own.


I recall the hooligan documentaries of the 90s (of course it was pretty much wiped out during that decade), and Stuart Hall was on one of them (the one in which he glorified Souness as a 'Rembrandt with a razor blade'). In this documentary he pointed out that working class men, in shitty manual jobs, used football as a cathartic outlet for the their frustrations in life.


Most of the moaners these days are probably not working class, nor down the pits during the work week, but football as an outlet for frustrations, imagined or real, still applies. If I pay £40 for a ticket, spend £100 on petrol, I don't want anyone to tell me how to support my team ta. If I want to have a good bitch and moan, I'll do it, be that against the referee, opposing team, and even my own team if I feel it is warranted (haven't had the fortune to do this at matches but I do like a good rant in my armchair every now and again).


Getting behind the team mantra is not going to improve the movement or technical ability of Andy Carroll.

No matter how much money you have spent getting to the game, you should not think that it is right to vent frustrations on your own players. Ever.
We’ll still finish in top four - and they won’t. You can quote me on this in May.

Offline garcia-alonso

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #100 on: April 8, 2012, 08:27:49 pm »
To be honest, I can avoid the internet, turn the radio off and not read the papers, but I can't avoid going to my local shop as I did this morning. As usual people were talking about the match and some saying ' we were shit, time to get rid..'

It doesn't matter how much you try to suggest that it's better to support Kenny and the players etc etc, once the rot has started it's really difficult to stop it. It hasn't reached Rafa levels yet, but it's starting and I'm talking about what local, match going reds are saying.

Offline Alan_X

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #101 on: April 8, 2012, 08:27:50 pm »
Sorry mate but you've waited no longer than any other c*nt, and looks to me as though you've seen your tem win plenty in the meantime, probably more than fans of any team bar united. Stop feeling sorry for yourself, you've been a lucky twat.

It's quite possible that we might not win the league again for a couple of years, or ten years, or ever again for that matter. No team has the right to win the league. Most clubs never have or have won it only once or twice. Only six teams have won it more than five times and one of those is Sunderland who last won it in 1936. Fourth and fifth are Everton (last win 1987) and Villa (last win 1981).

So when people are whinging about not winning the league title for twenty odd years they should have a quiet think about what utter fucking cocks they sound like to most of the rest. The fact that some of us have seen the team win it a few times is irrelevant. That's the past - the future might even be mid-table, could be relegation. So fucking what?

What attracted Shankly to Liverpool wasn't all the trophies in the cabinet, the fantastic ground and the facilities. It was the potential and it was the supporters. Supporters of a second division club with a meagre 5 league titles to their name and no FA Cups.

Liverpool became the success it did because of Shanks' holy trinity - the manager, the team and the supporters.

“Ladies and Gentlemen, yesterday at Wembley we might have lost the Cup but you the Liverpool people have won everything. You have won the admiration of the policemen in London and you have won the admiration of the public in London." Bill Shankly after losing the FA Cup in 1971 to Arsenal

"I'm just one of the people who stands on the kop. They think the same as I do, and I think the same as they do. It's a kind of marriage of people who like each other." Bill Shankly on the fans
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Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #102 on: April 8, 2012, 08:28:40 pm »
I really hope you are fishing
Not at all. I see LFC supporters as a wide church incorporating many types of fans. Swearing, abusing player's was all part of the football I saw at grounds during the 80's when I was growing up. Apart from the racism, I put it all down to colourful banter. Of course the game is more civilized and middle class now, probably an improvement for many. I preferred it back then. Football feels a lot more sterile now. The big clubs of the North being the last bastions where working class supporters can still just about see their teams.
The courts, the rich, the powerful or those in authority never lie. It has been dealt with 'by the courts' nothing to see here run along.

Offline Nin

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #103 on: April 8, 2012, 08:29:02 pm »
So now there's only one way of supporting this club and people who show their support differently aren't real supporters? this has basically been the theme of this forum lately, and I don't agree with it. On a public forum you have to accept that people will vent their frustrations after a game and a lot of it will be shite. But there has also been good constructive criticism and analysis of our problems. I think the sad thing is a lot of this constructive criticism has been overlooked as coming from the "sky generation" who only want short term-success (which is a pile of shit in itself) On either side there's been a reluctance to properly debate the issues we have, and  an eagerness resort to two extremes which are just as bad as each other.

Offline BCCC

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #104 on: April 8, 2012, 08:29:05 pm »
Let people support in their own individual and unique way. Humour them if you find their manner of supporting contrary to your own.


I recall the hooligan documentaries of the 90s (of course it was pretty much wiped out during that decade), and Stuart Hall was on one of them (the one in which he glorified Souness as a 'Rembrandt with a razor blade'). In this documentary he pointed out that working class men, in shitty manual jobs, used football as a cathartic outlet for the their frustrations in life.


Most of the moaners these days are probably not working class, nor down the pits during the work week, but football as an outlet for frustrations, imagined or real, still applies. If I pay £40 for a ticket, spend £100 on petrol, I don't want anyone to tell me how to support my team ta. If I want to have a good bitch and moan, I'll do it, be that against the referee, opposing team, and even my own team if I feel it is warranted (haven't had the fortune to do this at matches but I do like a good rant in my armchair every now and again).


Getting behind the team mantra is not going to improve the movement or technical ability of Andy Carroll.

I keep looking at that post then at your forum name and then at that post.. I'm confused.
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Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #105 on: April 8, 2012, 08:30:05 pm »
No matter how much money you have spent getting to the game, you should not think that it is right to vent frustrations on your own players. Ever.
On the whole no, of course not, but sometimes it can happen. It is no big deal. And your right money should not come into the argument.
The courts, the rich, the powerful or those in authority never lie. It has been dealt with 'by the courts' nothing to see here run along.

Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #106 on: April 8, 2012, 08:30:59 pm »
Well, my arse is taking root sat here. So, I'm going to stand up and stroll over to the couch.
Last word from me...
There's a Dirk Kuyt thread there. They're going on about Dirk and the possibility of him leaving. One comment... "Get rid."
That's it... "Get rid."
That... "Get rid" ...about Dirk, an old throwback, loyalist type player, not seen in years, all club no self, well, just about sums it up in my eyes.
Time for me exercise.
"A peasant you are. A peasant you will remain. And we shall use all our wealth and power, to make your lot even worse and keep you exactly where you are, Bondage!"    The Boy King, Richard II, after  putting down the The Peasants Revolt in 1381.

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Offline Black Bull Nova

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #107 on: April 8, 2012, 08:31:58 pm »
As I have said many times, what makes us different than the other teams, apart from having less money than 4 of them, just one thing, the supporters. If that difference is worth nothing then 5th is the best we can hope for and 5th, as we all know these days, is nothing..

Important, yes.
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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #108 on: April 8, 2012, 08:32:02 pm »
Any need for that abuse?


 
anyone who takes "fuck off mate" as abuse has never been in a pub that I use.

Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #109 on: April 8, 2012, 08:35:18 pm »
Well, my arse is taking root sat here. So, I'm going to stand up and stroll over to the couch.
Last word from me...
There's a Dirk Kuyt thread there. They're going on about Dirk and the possibility of him leaving. One comment... "Get rid."
That's it... "Get rid."
That... "Get rid" ...about Dirk, an old throwback, loyalist type player, not seen in years, all club no self, well, just about sums it up in my eyes.
Time for me exercise.
Now here is a player who will always get my full support.
The courts, the rich, the powerful or those in authority never lie. It has been dealt with 'by the courts' nothing to see here run along.

Offline Alan_X

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #110 on: April 8, 2012, 08:37:14 pm »
Thats when frustration comes in. Jealousy of your friends that they know what it feels like to win it (not that they support them as i'd rather cut my leg off that support them), that then turns to anger and resentment. We look for reasons. Why?? Why can we not do it? Why has it been so long? Not just this year, not the last 5 years, but 22 years!

Like i've said, all we want (and i say 'we' as the support who have grown up like me) is to know that it will happen. We will win it, one day. We will have that day in May stood in the KOP watching us lift that title. Apart from the birth of my 2 girls, winning the PL will probably be the best day of my life.

So you're mates are all United fans? Why not just tell them to fuck off? The only teams that have won the league since we did are Leeds (Who have fuck all to laugh about) Blackburn (ditto) United, Chelsea and Arsenal. Chelsea are a bunch of c*nts, Arsenal haven't won a trophy for seven years so the only team you can be talking about is United.

Anger and resentment? You're doing it all wrong mate. Following your team is a craic. If you don't enjoy it seriously don't do it. Because it may not get any better anytime soon. I hope it does and if we win the league again I'll be over the moon, but United could be stretch out away from us over the next few years. And if you and the other young fans are going to use that as an excuse to get bitter and shitty then maybe you should steer clear. Have a look across the Park at what happens when you dwell on what coulda, shoulda been.
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Its all about winning shiny things.

Offline Alan_X

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #111 on: April 8, 2012, 08:44:18 pm »

Getting behind the team mantra is not going to improve the movement or technical ability of Andy Carroll.

So getting behind the team makes no difference? Thank fuck for that.

Hey lads, we can all stop going to the game and giving a fuck!
Sid Lowe (@sidlowe)
09/03/2011 08:04
Give a man a mask and he will tell the truth, Give a man a user name and he will act like a total twat.
Its all about winning shiny things.

Offline Alan_X

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #112 on: April 8, 2012, 08:45:30 pm »
I keep looking at that post then at your forum name and then at that post.. I'm confused.

Haha - the irony.
Sid Lowe (@sidlowe)
09/03/2011 08:04
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Offline The G in Gerrard

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #113 on: April 8, 2012, 08:50:28 pm »
Turned Talk Shite on this morning, purposely to hear the moaning. Some masochist streak or something. Turned on just in time for Mick Quinn's "Sack Race." Complete with Alan Fluff Freeman's old Sunday top twenty music, the fat prick went reading out the top five... Kenny is top of the charts. I turned it off and sincerly hope I never put the fucking thing back on in me life.

I heard that. Quinn thought we'd win league this season. Him and what he allows his co-host to say about Liverpool, well he should be fucking embarrassed.

Offline -HH-

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #114 on: April 8, 2012, 08:55:28 pm »
So now there's only one way of supporting this club and people who show their support differently aren't real supporters?

Think about what the word support means and come back to me.

Balotelli, Falcao, Cavani...

I'll be shocked if it's anyone other Etoo. Etoo or no-one. Simples.

In fact, I'll do you all a favor and ban myself from the January transfer window forum if we get anyone other than Etoo.

Offline Twelfth Man

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #115 on: April 8, 2012, 08:55:32 pm »
So getting behind the team makes no difference? Thank fuck for that.

Hey lads, we can all stop going to the game and giving a fuck!
Of course it helps confidence, belief etc, but it will not make a player more intelligent or improve his technique. Anyway I'm on a loser on this one, so shall bow out gracefully (CL 2005 semi versus the c*nts, Istanbul etc...).
The courts, the rich, the powerful or those in authority never lie. It has been dealt with 'by the courts' nothing to see here run along.

Offline mercurial

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #116 on: April 8, 2012, 08:56:03 pm »
So you're mates are all United fans? Why not just tell them to fuck off? The only teams that have won the league since we did are Leeds (Who have fuck all to laugh about) Blackburn (ditto) United, Chelsea and Arsenal. Chelsea are a bunch of c*nts, Arsenal haven't won a trophy for seven years so the only team you can be talking about is United.

Anger and resentment? You're doing it all wrong mate. Following your team is a craic. If you don't enjoy it seriously don't do it. Because it may not get any better anytime soon. I hope it does and if we win the league again I'll be over the moon, but United could be stretch out away from us over the next few years. And if you and the other young fans are going to use that as an excuse to get bitter and shitty then maybe you should steer clear. Have a look across the Park at what happens when you dwell on what coulda, shoulda been.

Someone should tell them that the easiest way to achieve mid table mediocrity is to abuse the team when its down. Its no use hiding behind the fact that it is the net and thy are not abusing the team from the stands. The world today is a mix of the real and virtual. Today the virtual support count as much as the match going support. So thinking that people are contributing towards the well being of the club by being critical then you are wrong. Something is desperately wrong and it has nothing to do with the playing team.

When I think about the dictionary meaning of the word support, I just cannot reconcile some of the shit posts on here and the number of those are substantial. The sad thing is that the people who post them will probably not even read this thread. They will read a couple of posts and find people disagree with their views and skip it at best or enter into vain arguments to assuage their ego at worst. I sometimes doubt if the well being of the club is important to them. The same shit will be repeated for the next manager in line. The old support will slowly but surely step away from the club and without them we would be plastic. At some point we are losing that which we held dear and giving way to mediocrity before we achieve that. That mediocrity is in the standards of our support.
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Offline bepoq

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #117 on: April 8, 2012, 08:57:48 pm »
Great post. Sound sentiments beautifully put, which is why it does indeed deserve its own thread in my opinion, AAR. I've been struggling with it myself this season, though I still think we were right to break from it under Hodgson. But it is put into clear perspective both by positive and thoughtful posts like this one, and the one from that swine the other day that ended suggesting that Kenny Dalglish owed us an apology, which left me wanting to punch the computer and having to get up and walk around in very small circles.

It is tricky, in this new age of the fan forum, to get it right in a number of ways. We were, those of us old enough, raised in the old Liverpool Football Club traditions that Rhi speaks so well of, and yet we did, as Always a Red points out, always moan. But FS is right, the echo chamber of the internet does odd things to what used to be a chat down the pub. It gives weak personalitied wankers who would have been put in their place in a pub discussion and whose opinions would have gone largely unheard and very soon ignored by their mates, a platform that resonates to other like minded fans and on into the media. Worse still, sensible points of critique from thoughtful supporters likewise get turned by new and casual fans (consumers?) and a cowardly, lazy and mendacious sports journalism into useful sticks to beat the team and the management with, and these reports in turn inform and back up our less well informed (in many ways) "supporter," who frequently promptly hops on twitter to vent his or her spleen in an increasingly pernicious cycle.

Likewise, the interweb skews the supporter demographic, and its apparent collective opinion, drastically, toward new and foreign supporters, a smaller percentage of whom are clued in to older traditions of football and Liverpool supporting. Yet this skewed collective opinion is once more seized on gleefully (and totally uncritically as regards its true genesis or meaning) by a lazy media, assumed to be representative, and trumpeted on the back pages.

It isn't clear just how the interweb works as cause and effect in football yet, to what degree and so on, but it is clear that the old paradigms of chatting down the pub and on the way to work no longer apply in the same way they did when they are applied to the web and as FS has been frantically repeating for several years now, that we should be wary of acting as though they do and of their effects when we simply use them the same way. It is equally clear, most obviously from the Benitez to Hodgson and Suarez/Evra cases that the media are delighted to use fan declarations on various social media (ach, ugly term) in any loose and handy way they find most immediately useful, not least because it makes their research time for an article almost nonexistent. Blokes like Lawton, Winter and co, who are decent writers (that is to say, they use the English language reasonably competently) now just check their twitter feed, scan RAWK and listen to 606, and as far as they're concerned they've done their research and only have to spin an article out of it to have done their job. That they never ever critically consider the validity of these sources is shockingly simple minded, but then that's about what there is to expect from sports journalism today in the UK. That is its current paradigm.

Attempting to simply carry on in the way that we did prior to the web is, as FS points out, attempting to hold back the tide. However, it seems to me that while one cannot turn it back, it can be used and directed and treated as a force that doesn't simply wipe out our old traditions. For us, as football supporters[/i] bearing this in mind and being thoughtful in considering how we can best bring our old values into the changed world of football in the age of social media and the cheap yet influential journalism that accompanies it, should, in my opinion and whether we like it or not, be a serious consideration as we hope to help support[/i] our team.

Offline Always_A_Red

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #118 on: April 8, 2012, 09:01:53 pm »
So you're mates are all United fans? Why not just tell them to fuck off? The only teams that have won the league since we did are Leeds (Who have fuck all to laugh about) Blackburn (ditto) United, Chelsea and Arsenal. Chelsea are a bunch of c*nts, Arsenal haven't won a trophy for seven years so the only team you can be talking about is United.

Anger and resentment? You're doing it all wrong mate. Following your team is a craic. If you don't enjoy it seriously don't do it. Because it may not get any better anytime soon. I hope it does and if we win the league again I'll be over the moon, but United could be stretch out away from us over the next few years. And if you and the other young fans are going to use that as an excuse to get bitter and shitty then maybe you should steer clear. Have a look across the Park at what happens when you dwell on what coulda, shoulda been.

Not all my mates are UTD fans mate, but I would say growing up, 65% were UTD fans, 25-30% liverpool, then the rest were random and yes I do tell them to fuck off. I get fed up of telling the c*nts to fuck off!  :D But yes, im talking about UTD. I hate them and everything they represent. Their arrogant chants of 'we'll do what we want' epitomises their club,fanbase and everything they are. They are c*nts. I couldnt give a shit about arsenal, chelsea, man city etc. Its them. Its heartbreaking watching them go from strength to strength and win title after title and we cant get near them. The anger and resentment is against them, its against Fergie and his agenda, its against the arrogant twats who sing 'we'll do what we want'. Its not anger at LFC. 

I love going to the game more than anything and every week I look at some sat in the KOP whinging and shouting abuse at players (clearly not enjoying it) and think 'the day I stop enjoying it will be the day I stop going the game'. Be assured that the people I am referring to are not 'the other young fans' that you refer to, they are the older generation who sit there moaning becasue they have seen the 70's and 80's and have been sat there for 30 years and think they have the devine right to shout abuse and whinge because they have been sat there for so long.

We’ll still finish in top four - and they won’t. You can quote me on this in May.

Offline Z e u s

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #119 on: April 8, 2012, 09:19:03 pm »
anyone who takes "fuck off mate" as abuse has never been in a pub that I use.

It wasn't that part of the post, it was the other part.

I also got banned and I am being watched for doing that (once).