Topic: 90s Football Draft - Semi Finals

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Forget Marseilles, let's have a look at Ajax 95

This so called unbeatable machine of yours seems to have been penetrated again



This time the likes of Finidi George & Ronnie De Boer seemed to have found a way through. Kluivert with the goal but my point remains

You can not stop FIGO + KLINSSMAN +GULLIT , not for 90 mins, at some point Jurgen wins a penalty, at some point Figo finds the net...like he does below against the mighty England

 I have that same Davids in this side. That Ajax side was hungry and eager for success, and the Milan trio at the back was already in their what, 4th or 5th European Cup final in 10 years maybe less [off the top of my head]. Panucci also can't be compared to Tassotti.
I also have Moller who was a bigger goal threat from midfield than any of the midfielders Milan had in that side.

[Trendisnotdestiny]

Let's make sure we are talking about the same Ruud Gullit who went in the 6th round.  Nice pick and all, plus I love Ruud as a player, but make no mistake --- he was not the same player after his injury.

This plus DeFacto's catenaccio means:

1.  If Signori cannot do it, a one legged Dutchie with a smallish Portuguese flank player is not going to find love with an isolated Klinsmann

2.  4-2-3-1 against a Christmas tree defense is only sustainable if the marking backs get forward -- Staunton and Petrescu and this plays right into Zamarano and the attack middies of Defacto..

Of all of the possibly close matches people, and this one is not even close --- smoke and mirrors (imo)... Robbie's done well, but lets not carried away. 

DeFacto's done the business here.  Is there a better middle three blocking the gate then Mendieta, Davids and DeSailley

The quality comparisons here versus Ince and Simeone are unbelievable

[RobbieRedman]

"a smallish Portuguese flank player" pretty much tells you Trends agenda here folks.

He lost the QF earlier today, perhaps tomorrow we can hug it out but today he remains a wounded animal

Trends sisters/wives at home watching, beware!

[Betty Blue]

Boy, things sure did escalate since this morning.

[Trendisnotdestiny]

"a smallish Portuguese flank player" pretty much tells you Trends agenda here folks.

He lost the QF earlier today, perhaps tomorrow we can hug it out but today he remains a wounded animal

Trends sisters/wives at home watching, beware!

Love me some Figo, but not against these lads mate. 

Agenda?  I played against you and thought my team would have some joy (Romario/Nedved/Bebeto/Hassler/B Laudrup) and they would have.   But my central defenders and defensive middies would have had moment that got exposed.

But against Defacto, he has no such weaknesses (would not give up much --- and Klinsmann, Figo and hobbled stardust is all you have against 7 defenders and a system which has proven to be successful). 

Let's not exaggerate here.  My agenda was that Hazell got screwed.  My agenda was that my team was very close to yours but I was down 6-1 in the first hour of the match.  My agenda sees Mikey's team as the one to beat with the best balance.  And my agenda adjudges DeFacto as the prototypical 1-0 team that wins almost all of their matches.

Your team relies upon a quick nimble clever boots player and a target who requires service with Gullit (whom you know my opinion of in this draft) with an ordinary midfield.  Your centrebacks are very good but can give up fouls and their mobility is no where close to DeFactos.

This is just one assessment, but one that I think is accurate - not biased by loss nor biased by marketing of great players but one that holds the line to the 90's type players.

Good luck either way it goes mate. 

[Trendisnotdestiny]

Boy, things sure did escalate since this morning.

Betty, that's enough from you, hipster.   

You've done quite enough recommending that I not take Gullit (in the 3rd round before you joined our draft)  as it would be viewed as cheating the spirit of the 90's draft because of his injuries.

Instead, I would prefer you just thank me --- for carrying your water.   

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Boy, things sure did escalate since this morning.

I've had to stir it up, so it was interesting 

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Let's make sure we are talking about the same Ruud Gullit who went in the 6th round.  Nice pick and all, plus I love Ruud as a player, but make no mistake --- he was not the same player after his injury.

This plus DeFacto's catenaccio means:

1.  If Signori cannot do it, a one legged Dutchie with a smallish Portuguese flank player is not going to find love with an isolated Klinsmann

2.  4-2-3-1 against a Christmas tree defense is only sustainable if the marking backs get forward -- Staunton and Petrescu and this plays right into Zamarano and the attack middies of Defacto..

Of all of the possibly close matches people, and this one is not even close --- smoke and mirrors (imo)... Robbie's done well, but lets not carried away. 

DeFacto's done the business here.  Is there a better middle three blocking the gate then Mendieta, Davids and DeSailley

The quality comparisons here versus Ince and Simeone are unbelievable

Beautifully said and defended 

[Betty Blue]

Betty, that's enough from you, hipster.   

You've done quite enough recommending that I not take Gullit (in the 3rd round before you joined our draft)  as it would be viewed as cheating the spirit of the 90's draft because of his injuries.

I don't remember using the word cheating, but I definitely advised against it. He was a shadow of his former self post-injury. Still a very good player, but at this level he'd be in no man's land. Especially facing a force as great as peak Desailly. Holy moly. He'll probably be off on a stretcher before the 90 is out.

[RobbieRedman]

No wingers, no support strikers, no one holding the ball up, no flare, no trickery, no beautiful moments of football joy.

Just a ten man defence and Zamarano

Tickets on sale for the final everywhere, even defactos fans have sent 60% of their allocation back, not arsed!

[Trendisnotdestiny]

I don't remember using the word cheating, but I definitely advised against it. He was a shadow of his former self post-injury. Still a very good player, but at this level he'd be in no man's land. Especially facing a force as great as peak Desailly. Holy moly. He'll probably be off on a stretcher before the 90 is out.

Quite right in all aspects (apologies for the word cheat).....

Thank you

[deFacto please, you bastards]

No wingers, no support strikers, no one holding the ball up, no flare, no trickery, no beautiful moments of football joy.

Just a ten man defence and Zamarano

Tickets on sale for the final everywhere, even defactos fans have sent 60% of their allocation back, not arsed!

Jarni is there to provide width. Moller is there to provide the goal threat from midfield, Prosinecki had plenty of flair and ability, as did Mendieta. There's tactically flexibility within the side, to adjust in various ways.

All we need is one goal 

[El Lobo]

Went for Robbie too, just prefer an attacking side over a defensive one.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Went for Robbie too, just prefer an attacking side over a defensive one.

Jabroni 

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Wives,sisters,mums, have clearly been paid today

[mikey_LFC]

Hell of a battle between you guys. Still could go anywhichway

[Hazell]

Hell of a battle between you guys. Still could go anywhichway

Don't mention anywhichway. If you say his name five times in front of a mirror, he'll come and haunt the draft threads.

[Betty Blue]

What's with all the hate for Defacto's more defensive line-up? This is classic Arrigo Sacchi - suffocate the opposition and walk off with a 1-0 win. He was doing it long before Mourinho came along. Football isn't all Cruyff turns. In fact, that's a good example of the one of the most beautiful attacking total football teams (the Dutch) being crushed by a more meachanical and ruthless Germany in 74. Personally, I've always loved watching a truly great defensive performance. I like Robbie's team, but when you subtract a hobbled Gullit and a so-so Lombrado, he's basically got two attacking players. No way are they getting anything against the best parts of Milan's defence + Desailly + Davids!

[Hazell]

Hazell and Big Dick Nick for me.

Lovely stuff.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

What's with all the hate for Defacto's more defensive line-up? This is classic Arrigo Sacchi - suffocate the opposition and walk off with a 1-0 win. He was doing it long before Mourinho came along. Football isn't all Cruyff turns. In fact, that's a good example of the one of the most beautiful attacking total football teams (the Dutch) being crushed by a more meachanical and ruthless Germany in 74. Personally, I've always loved watching a truly great defensive performance. I like Robbie's team, but when you subtract a hobbled Gullit and a so-so Lombrado, he's basically got two attacking players. No way are they getting anything against the best parts of Milan's defence + Desailly + Davids!

I've always liked you Betty. 

To me this is the epitome of the 90's most successful sides, Italian football's dominant era, and it was on this blueprint that they managed to be successful.

I like attacking football as well, but ultimately my side is superior. I mean come on I'm losing to a Paul Ince and SImeone midfield?! 

[RobbieRedman]

Sacchi played 5 central midfielders? Pretty sure he played with two up top nearly always and players of fantastic flare and out wide like Donadoni

[Betty Blue]

Sacchi played 5 central midfielders? Pretty sure he played with two up top nearly always and players of fantastic flare and out wide like Donadoni

Come off it, neither Moller nor Prosinecki are CMs. Both were attacking midfielders with bags of flair. Mendieta alone is more creative than anyone in your team bar Figo.

[Crosby Nick]

What's with all the hate for Defacto's more defensive line-up? This is classic Arrigo Sacchi - suffocate the opposition and walk off with a 1-0 win. He was doing it long before Mourinho came along. Football isn't all Cruyff turns. In fact, that's a good example of the one of the most beautiful attacking total football teams (the Dutch) being crushed by a more meachanical and ruthless Germany in 74. Personally, I've always loved watching a truly great defensive performance. I like Robbie's team, but when you subtract a hobbled Gullit and a so-so Lombrado, he's basically got two attacking players. No way are they getting anything against the best parts of Milan's defence + Desailly + Davids!

There’s not an overwhelming amount of attacking talent in DeFacto’s line up to say he couldn’t be in the wrong end of a 1-0. Every defence can let one in now and again no matter how stronger they look.

[El Lobo]

To be fair his Milan defence would be great in a ‘late 80s’ draft. 90s was more the likes of Albertini and Boban in midfield 

[RobbieRedman]

Come off it, neither Moller nor Prosinecki are CMs. Both were attacking midfielders with bags of flair. Mendieta alone is more creative than anyone in your team bar Figo.

You mentioned classic Sacchi style though, it's nothing of the sort, it's a bus and defacto has as much admitted that already

he's happy to sneak a 1-0 and fair play if he does but you can't expect to play a team like that and not get some stick

i have Lombardo because i built a spine of quality, from Klinssman to Figo to Maldini to Schmiechel and had to pay the price elsewhere, anyway he was a fine player who could play out wide unlike any of defactos fantastic five

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Sacchi played 5 central midfielders? Pretty sure he played with two up top nearly always and players of fantastic flare and out wide like Donadoni

Moller and Prosinecki both are attacking midfielders in this formation, and both have abundance of creativity and flair. They aren't defensive players by any means, it's quite clear what their purpose is in this side. Prosinecki was injury prone and didn't hit the heights he should have, but that doesn't change the fact that he had abundance of ability, and it's not like he didn't show it on the biggest stages of club and international football when he had a chance to do so.

Moller was a 1 in 4 goal-scoring midfielder and his importance to Dortmund's success is well known.

To suggest anything other than that is clearly wrong. Your midfield has no chance of dominating this match, as you'd be outnumbered and outclassed by a country mile. Davids wasn't just a yard-dog, he was a quality player on and off the ball, and Desailly, nothing needs to be said about that, and then you have Mendieta who was creative.

[Crosby Nick]

Moller and Prosinecki both are attacking midfielders in this formation, and both have abundance of creativity and flair. They aren't defensive players by any means, it's quite clear what their purpose is in this side. Prosinecki was injury prone and didn't hit the heights he should have, but that doesn't change the fact that he had abundance of ability, and it's not like he didn't show it on the biggest stages of club and international football when he had a chance to do so.

Moller was a 1 in 4 goal-scoring midfielder and his importance to Dortmund's success is well known.

That description of Prosinecki could apply word for word to Gullit in the 90s couldn’t it?

[deFacto please, you bastards]

That description of Prosinecki could apply word for word to Gullit in the 90s couldn’t it?

Thats up to you, but I never dismissed Gullit here. My midfield imo doesnn't lose this game by any means given their quality in every department. Simeone was a class midfielder, but Paul Ince? Not on the level as everything I have in my side overall.

[Betty Blue]

There’s not an overwhelming amount of attacking talent in DeFacto’s line up to say he couldn’t be in the wrong end of a 1-0. Every defence can let one in now and again no matter how stronger they look.

Honestly, I don't think defacto's attack is that much poorer than Robbie's. Figo and Klinsmann are great, but then you've got a hobbled Gullit and Lombardo who was never much of anything, while Ince and Simeone don't offer that much attacking intent. Petrescu gives some decent width though. Conversely defacto has Zamorano, Prosinecki, and Moller who each had bags of flair, plus Mendieta who was monstrously creative in the 90s, and Jarni who is one of the great attacking fullbacks of the 90s IMO. Is his attack really that much poorer? It feels like people are getting swept up in the idea of Gullit still doing the business, when in fact he was not really capable of it in the 90s at this kind of level. 

[RobbieRedman]

Moller and Prosinecki both are attacking midfielders in this formation, and both have abundance of creativity and flair. They aren't defensive players by any means, it's quite clear what their purpose is in this side. Prosinecki was injury prone and didn't hit the heights he should have, but that doesn't change the fact that he had abundance of ability, and it's not like he didn't show it on the biggest stages of club and international football when he had a chance to do so.

Moller was a 1 in 4 goal-scoring midfielder and his importance to Dortmund's success is well known.

They were great players but I think Prosinecki instead of someone with some pace, funny enough like a Lombardo or a Donadoni, or even a second striker like a Vialli may cost you in the final if you get there

[Betty Blue]

They were great players but I think Prosinecki instead of someone with some pace, funny enough like a Lombardo or a Donadoni, or even a second striker like a Vialli may cost you in the final if you get there

I agree about Prosinecki by the way. I think he was the wrong pick for defacto's side. But a hipster favourite, so I can't blame him.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I agree about Prosinecki by the way. I think he was the wrong pick for defacto's side. But a hipster favourite, so I can't blame him.

Yeah, he wasn't what I had on my mind initially, I wanted Scholl 

I think overall my side outweighs the ''negatives'' of Prosinecki.

[Crosby Nick]

It’s Just a shame the most balanced side in the tournament went out on penalties.

Isn’t that right Trend?

[RobbieRedman]

Yeah, he wasn't what I had on my mind initially, I wanted Scholl 

I think overall my side outweighs the ''negatives'' of Prosinecki.

Donadoni was the biggest blow for me, I would have still got the rest of my team and I missed him by one draft vote

with the benefit of hindsight i shouldn't of touched Gullit but like you with Prosinecki we can carry him and whoever plays mikey his soft midfield will be a pushover

[Crosby Nick]

I toyed with Gullit and then also wanted Mancini but ended up going for the more sensible option of more width. Surprised he and Vialli went unpicked though.

[Elzar]

Yeah, he wasn't what I had on my mind initially, I wanted Scholl 

I think overall my side outweighs the ''negatives'' of Prosinecki.

You can have Scholl, doing fuck all for me here

[Trendisnotdestiny]

It’s Just a shame the most balanced side in the tournament went out on penalties.

Isn’t that right Trend?

Nick, you had your chance to win in penalties and without a GK'er coach I might add --- before I volunteered to write up your emails. 

Speaking of Emails - here's what Elzar sent me

I told nick to do everything from keepers perspective to make it easier, as are mine.

Keeper:
Left
Middle
Middle
Right
Left

Takers:
Crespo - Left
Totti - Middle
Deschamps - Middle
Leonardo - Right
Blind - Left

and here is what you sent me ----->  now my write up was more about free associating and entertaining - but certainly not bias or favoring another team

Nick's email

Laudrup - Keepers Left
Petit - keepers left
Overmars - down the middle
Kluivert - keepers Right
Vieira keepers left


Big Bodo
1) dives left
2) dives left
3) dives right
4) stats down the middle
5) dives right

Is that ok? Let me know if you need me to give you any more details!

[Trendisnotdestiny]

As far as this discussion, this is absurd. 

DeFacto by a lot.

Mikey by a little

Final -- a very good battle

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Hahaha, this should be close, but down by 5?  Some of yous are suffering from amnesia.

[Crosby Nick]

Nick, you had your chance to win in penalties and without a GK'er coach I might add --- before I volunteered to write up your emails. 

Speaking of Emails - here's what Elzar sent me

and here is what you sent me ----->  now my write up was more about free associating and entertaining - but certainly not bias or favoring another team

Nick's email

I meant you lost on pens too so I could have been talking about your team.