Topic: Naby Keita Watch

[LallanaInPyjamas]

There you go. I thought it would upset you!

Did the rest of my post upset you?

[Davidbowie]

Comparing Keita to anyone is utterly pointless. He's not like Aquilani or Oxlade or anyone.

Personally, I just haven't seen anything that's giving the impression of a top PL midfielder there. Yes, its his first season, yes, he's had injuries, but he's part of a squad with great confidence, at a team that's top of the league and has a manager that is behind his players more than any other.

And yet Keita looks weak, slow, unfit, clueless. He's 2 yards off not just his own teammates but the opposition players too.

I think he needs to build his physique, train hard and get fit and up to speed. The disappointing thing is he should already be at that point.

If we're still seeing the same thing from him mid-way through next season then it's REALLY time to worry if he'll ever make it, but right now, I wouldn't put my money on it. These things happen. Not every player signed by LFC is going to be a guaranteed success and the same goes for other clubs, just look at Fred at United and Jorginho at Chelsea.

[SinceSixtyFive]

Comparing Keita to anyone is utterly pointless. He's not like Aquilani or Oxlade or anyone.

Personally, I just haven't seen anything that's giving the impression of a top PL midfielder there. Yes, its his first season, yes, he's had injuries, but he's part of a squad with great confidence, at a team that's top of the league and has a manager that is behind his players more than any other.

And yet Keita looks weak, slow, unfit, clueless. He's 2 yards off not just his own teammates but the opposition players too.

I think he needs to build his physique, train hard and get fit and up to speed. The disappointing thing is he should already be at that point.

If we're still seeing the same thing from him mid-way through next season then it's REALLY time to worry if he'll ever make it, but right now, I wouldn't put my money on it. These things happen. Not every player signed by LFC is going to be a guaranteed success and the same goes for other clubs, just look at Fred at United and Jorginho at Chelsea.

 

Harsh.

Certainly, he still needs to prove himself but I'd love him to prove you wrong. Would you? Or would you rather be right?

[KingKolo]

Personally, I just haven't seen anything that's giving the impression of a top PL midfielder there.

I reckon there's something there, but he needs a run of games in his preferred position.

He might not get it though, because it ain't easy at a top club.

[lukeb1981]

If you watched him play before he got here , the lad glided up the pitch with the ball, conditions last night made that impossible so it’s was quite difficult for the lad to get any confidence going when everytime he tried to run the ball stuck to the pitch , should have been rewarded with a peno for that run into the box . The lad is too good to fail and in fairness he kept at it . This season is a learning curve for him , next season we will see the best from him.

[JackWard33]

And yet Keita looks weak, slow, unfit, clueless.

lol christ... I've really got to stop reading this forum....

[na fir dearg]

He won us a penalty that wasn't given with some beautiful play, that run was exactly what we needed against the way Leicester were defending, every confidence he is going to succeed at this club

[friendofrocky]

He won us a penalty that wasn't given with some beautiful play, that run was exactly what we needed against the way Leicester were defending, every confidence he is going to succeed at this club

Oxlade made these sort of runs last season before his injury - I can see the same traits in Keita. Oxlade got a fair amount of critism in his first few months and then clicked. I can see Keita doing the same. To be fair a goal would do wonders for his his confidence

[Sharado]

And yet Keita looks weak, slow, unfit, clueless. He's 2 yards off not just his own teammates but the opposition players too.

I've been kicking about on Rawk for nearly 9 years now. I'm 37 years old and a university educated professiona father of two. I've surely got better stuff to do with my time, but my addiction to all things liverpool football club keeps bringing me back.

Today is one of the fucking stupidest days in my entire time as a member of this website. I'm going to donate to the upkeep of rawk later today just to thank the mods for having to cope in this fucking lunatic asylum.

[FlashGordon]

I've been kicking about on Rawk for nearly 9 years now. I'm 37 years old and a university educated professiona father of two. I've surely got better stuff to do with my time, but my addiction to all things liverpool football club keeps bringing me back.

Today is one of the fucking stupidest days in my entire time as a member of this website. I'm going to donate to the upkeep of rawk later today just to thank the mods for having to cope in this fucking lunatic asylum.

Haven't been on here as long as yourself but agree with everything you say. Imagine we actually had real problems, this place would have to be sectioned.

[Dench57]

I've been kicking about on Rawk for nearly 9 years now. I'm 37 years old and a university educated professiona father of two. I've surely got better stuff to do with my time

[Sharado]

Problem?

[AndyMuller]

I've been kicking about on Rawk for nearly 9 years now. I'm 37 years old and a university educated professiona father of two. I've surely got better stuff to do with my time, but my addiction to all things liverpool football club keeps bringing me back.

Today is one of the fucking stupidest days in my entire time as a member of this website. I'm going to donate to the upkeep of rawk later today just to thank the mods for having to cope in this fucking lunatic asylum.

I didn’t know you could do a degree in being a professional father of two?

You can do anything in uni these days.

[mrantarctica]

Comparing Keita to anyone is utterly pointless. He's not like Aquilani or Oxlade or anyone.

Personally, I just haven't seen anything that's giving the impression of a top PL midfielder there. Yes, its his first season, yes, he's had injuries, but he's part of a squad with great confidence, at a team that's top of the league and has a manager that is behind his players more than any other.

And yet Keita looks weak, slow, unfit, clueless. He's 2 yards off not just his own teammates but the opposition players too.

I think he needs to build his physique, train hard and get fit and up to speed. The disappointing thing is he should already be at that point.

If we're still seeing the same thing from him mid-way through next season then it's REALLY time to worry if he'll ever make it, but right now, I wouldn't put my money on it. These things happen. Not every player signed by LFC is going to be a guaranteed success and the same goes for other clubs, just look at Fred at United and Jorginho at Chelsea.

I didn't think he looked that bad to be honest. I thought he had a decent game in very trying conditions against a very good team. On any other day, he would've been awarded a stonewall penalty which Mo would have slotted, and we would have taken all 3 points. Then the entire post-match thread would have been singing his praises for his incisiveness and penetration into the box which we've lacked since Coutinho.

It's hard for him to get fit and get up to speed with little niggling injuries that has stifled his progress initially. If you don't play week-in week-out it is also hard to get any rhythm in the game. You can be 100% fit and strong but without rhythm in the game, it is hard to be at your best. You combine that with the pressure to succeed and that sometimes he's played in a role that is perhaps a little new to him and its not surprising that he's not had the start that everyone perhaps expected.

I think it is fair criticism to say that perhaps he hasn't been as strong on the ball as you need to be in the EPL. Sometimes he's guilty of either giving it away, or being bullied off it or perhaps going down a bit too easily. This is an area he could work on, but otherwise I think he's done reasonably well.

I still think he was built up far too much by us buying him a year early. People saw what he did at RBL and then concluded that we had bought the best midfielder in Europe.

He's a good player and has shown enough glimpses of quality for me to have confidence that he'll be an important cog in the machine for our title tilt and CL cup run. We've not seen his best so far but I'm sure that a few things go his way, a goal or a good showing, a full 90 mins and sometimes the confidence comes back and everything else starts happening for you. 

[TepidT2O]

It’s slightly odd to see all the stick he’s receiving.

This is the first time we’ve really seen what he is capable off.  The first time where he has driven at a packed defence and caused havoc.

That he didn’t get the penalty is bizarre, but the fact is that we should be taking about the moment of the match where he took it by the scruff of the neck and got us the winner.

That he didn’t is not reallly his fault.

A way to go? Yes.  But he needs rhythm and confidence, it will come.

[KingKolo]

It’s slightly odd to see all the stick he’s receiving.

Yep

[Davidbowie]

I didn't think there was anything wrong in saying Keita has looked weak physically and not at the same level speed-wise or fitness-wise as his teammates - am I wrong?

He needs to bulk up a bit and get some muscle to make him stronger to push off the ball. He hasn't been on the same wavelength as players like Robertson and Mane who who he usually plays close to, getting in their way or missing passes etc. Am I wrong to say that?

Of course I want him to come good and be up there with the very best midfielders in the PL - thats what we thought we were getting. He still has time, which is why I said if he was still showing the same mid-way through next season then it'd be time to worry.

Just because I have doubts about that doesn't mean I'm not happy to be proved wrong - but I think one or two people need to turn their pacemakers down a bit and relax.

[KingKolo]

I didn't think there was anything wrong in saying Keita has looked weak physically and not at the same level speed-wise or fitness-wise as his teammates - am I wrong?

He needs to bulk up a bit and get some muscle to make him stronger to push off the ball. He hasn't been on the same wavelength as players like Robertson and Mane who who he usually plays close to, getting in their way or missing passes etc. Am I wrong to say that?

Of course I want him to come good and be up there with the very best midfielders in the PL - thats what we thought we were getting. He still has time, which is why I said if he was still showing the same mid-way through next season then it'd be time to worry.

Just because I have doubts about that doesn't mean I'm not happy to be proved wrong - but I think one or two people need to turn their pacemakers down a bit and relax.

The idea that 'bulking up a bit' would sort him out suggests you don't know an awful lot about football to be honest mate.

[PhaseOfPlay]

I don't think the extra touch was the wrong decision, though. I mean, he had the time, it was a tiny touch and it set him up really well for a much more controlled finish with lots of goal to aim at. The only reason it was the 'wrong' choice was because the defender had to foul him to disrupt his touch (and that challenge was almost certainly never going to get near the ball). If that was the 'wrong' choice it's almost like you could make an argument that every player needs to always play it/shoot as early as possible just to avoid the possibility of being fouled, which obviously isn't the case at all. He had the time, he took the touch. The main person who didn't do their job properly (or try to) was the ref.

The extra touch was wrong HB. His first touch was brilliant, he should have shot on his second. But he touched it again, most likely to get it onto his right foot, and then he was fouled. But the early shot was on, and is almost always the right time to shoot. Extra touches bring defenders to the ball is what we tell kids, and it's no different for pros

[KingKolo]

The extra touch was wrong HB. His first touch was brilliant, he should have shot on his second. But he touched it again, most likely to get it onto his right foot, and then he was fouled. But the early shot was on, and is almost always the right time to shoot. Extra touches bring defenders to the ball is what we tell kids, and it's no different for pros

Ok maybe, but usually fouls in the box bring penalties and goals

[TepidT2O]

The extra touch was wrong HB. His first touch was brilliant, he should have shot on his second. But he touched it again, most likely to get it onto his right foot, and then he was fouled. But the early shot was on, and is almost always the right time to shoot. Extra touches bring defenders to the ball is what we tell kids, and it's no different for pros

A confident player does just that though don’t they.

When he gets that confidence things like that will run for him

[wige]

I'd start him against West Ham.

Don't think he was brilliant last night, and he's played in patches this season generally, but think there'll be a lot more space for him and our forward line to exploit in that game.

Seems a very shy lad that needs a goal or special moment to give him a boost.

[88_RED]

I just want to see a midfield of Fabinho, Keita and the Ox next season..

                     Fabinho

          OX                      Keita

I think this midfield will destroy the low block and how..

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I'd start him against West Ham.

Don't think he was brilliant last night, and he's played in patches this season generally, but think there'll be a lot more space for him and our forward line to exploit in that game.

Seems a very shy lad that needs a goal or special moment to give him a boost.

I would as well. In fact I am hoping we go to a midfield 3 of Wijnaldum,Fabinho and Keita. Milner will more than likely play as RB, and I'd leave Shaqiri on the bench to make a difference later in the game.

[AndyMuller]

I just want to see a midfield of Fabinho, Keita and the Ox next season..

                     Fabinho

          OX                      Keita

I think this midfield will destroy the low block and how..

Gini on the bench? Been our best midfield all season.

[PhaseOfPlay]

A confident player does just that though don’t they.

When he gets that confidence things like that will run for him

For sure. It's almost certainly a confidence issue with him. He's a talent, and he's a good player. People are going overboard though, to excuse the overall averageness of his performances for the past number of games. "He's not playing his natural position", "he's not a left winger", "his teammates don't understand what he's doing", "the other team were counter attacking when he was on the field but stopped once he'd left" - they're just a bunch of excuses, some  - if not all - of which are ridiculous. He had a so-so game. So did Shaqiri. So did Salah. So did Van Dijk. There's no harm in it. He's not a dud. It'll come for him. But it didn't last night, and one penetrating run in 60ish minutes, although encouraging, does not a top performance make.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

A confident player does just that though don’t they.

When he gets that confidence things like that will run for him

I'm not sure confidence is ever going to give him a decent left-foot to be honest.

[PhaseOfPlay]

Ok maybe, but usually fouls in the box bring penalties and goals

Keita is not in control of the referee. He is in control of his own touches and decisions, though.

[Yorkykopite]

The extra touch was wrong HB. His first touch was brilliant, he should have shot on his second. But he touched it again, most likely to get it onto his right foot, and then he was fouled. But the early shot was on, and is almost always the right time to shoot. Extra touches bring defenders to the ball is what we tell kids, and it's no different for pros

I disagree PoP. His first touch was ok. It certainly wasn't brilliant. It left the ball too much under his feet and therefore narrowed his shooting options, so making it easier for the goalie. I thought he was quite clever over what he did next which was to take an extra touch to move the ball into clearer space and then, in order to make up for 'lost time', hit the ball with the outside of his right boot rather than delay the shot, even fractionally, by 'waiting' for his left boot to catch up. Unfortunately, just as he was about to strike the ball Ricardo stood on his left foot and brought him down.

[will2003]

He looks like he will be good for us once he is settled in. I know he is 6 months in now but players adjust differently. I think we need to accept this season isn't for him and play others in front of him while he is adjusting. Lalana and fabinho both looked streaks ahead of him yesterday in confidence and ability

[mrantarctica]

I didn't think there was anything wrong in saying Keita has looked weak physically and not at the same level speed-wise or fitness-wise as his teammates - am I wrong?

He needs to bulk up a bit and get some muscle to make him stronger to push off the ball. He hasn't been on the same wavelength as players like Robertson and Mane who who he usually plays close to, getting in their way or missing passes etc. Am I wrong to say that?

Of course I want him to come good and be up there with the very best midfielders in the PL - thats what we thought we were getting. He still has time, which is why I said if he was still showing the same mid-way through next season then it'd be time to worry.

Just because I have doubts about that doesn't mean I'm not happy to be proved wrong - but I think one or two people need to turn their pacemakers down a bit and relax.

Not sure that bulking him up will solve much. What he needs for his role is agility, great first touch, and the ability play the killer pass and finish with both feet. A lot of being able to shield the ball, and not be knocked off it is actually more about technique, balance and body positioning rather than how big you are.

[KingKolo]

Keita is not in control of the referee. He is in control of his own touches and decisions, though.

Yeah but criticising a player for being fouled for clear pen seems harsh

[PhaseOfPlay]

Yeah but criticising a player for being fouled for clear pen seems harsh

Who is critising Keita for being fouled?

[FlashGordon]

For sure. It's almost certainly a confidence issue with him. He's a talent, and he's a good player. People are going overboard though, to excuse the overall averageness of his performances for the past number of games. "He's not playing his natural position", "he's not a left winger", "his teammates don't understand what he's doing", "the other team were counter attacking when he was on the field but stopped once he'd left" - they're just a bunch of excuses, some  - if not all - of which are ridiculous. He had a so-so game. So did Shaqiri. So did Salah. So did Van Dijk. There's no harm in it. He's not a dud. It'll come for him. But it didn't last night, and one penetrating run in 60ish minutes, although encouraging, does not a top performance make.

This was me and was more related to the notion that Fabinho came on and took control of midfield, he didn't. He was playing outside their shape, which is ok when it's only one of your midfielders but Gini was doing the same. Keita had shown signs he was starting to penetrate that shape and it's why I would've taken off Wijnaldum instead of Fabinho. No need for the two of them on when Leicester were bunkering in.

[FlashGordon]

I'm not sure confidence is ever going to give him a decent left-foot to be honest.

Didn't he already hit a great shot from 25 yards with his left foot this season? Think it was against Burnley.

[PhaseOfPlay]

I disagree PoP. His first touch was ok. It certainly wasn't brilliant. It left the ball too much under his feet and therefore narrowed his shooting options, so making it easier for the goalie. I thought he was quite clever over what he did next which was to take an extra touch to move the ball into clearer space and then, in order to make up for 'lost time', hit the ball with the outside of his right boot rather than delay the shot, even fractionally, by 'waiting' for his left boot to catch up. Unfortunately, just as he was about to strike the ball Ricardo stood on his left foot and brought him down.

You may have a point, actually. Here's a better view of it.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/dPayw5EyIuI" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/dPayw5EyIuI</a>

I still say he could have swung with his left after the first touch, but looking at that, he was shaping for his right (which I mentioned), and the second touch is probably justified in that instance.

However, the point stands that "extra touches bring defenders", and he could have got a shot off with his left.

However (again) - this is a minor point overall. It's just a technical point on what he could have done with the ball he received. If I was doing his video analysis this morning, I would be asking him if he could have shot with his left. He might agree, he might disagree. A confident player, I think, swings at it, knowing full well the odds are more against a goal than for a goal for any shot. An on-form striker probably takes the shot and doesn't worry if he misses. Naby probably wanted this to be perfect. Even his action during the foul, though, doesn't scream "confidence" - he looks like he's trying to side-foot it. 

[88_RED]

Gini on the bench? Been our best midfield all season.

Harsh on Gini for sure..  But I think Keita and Ox breaking through the lines with power, pace and ability to beat players one on one is too good to pass up.. especially against the low block where we will dominate possession..

[PhaseOfPlay]

This was me and was more related to the notion that Fabinho came on and took control of midfield, he didn't. He was playing outside their shape, which is ok when it's only one of your midfielders but Gini was doing the same. Keita had shown signs he was starting to penetrate that shape and it's why I would've taken off Wijnaldum instead of Fabinho. No need for the two of them on when Leicester were bunkering in.

My question is "why wasn't he making those runs earlier?"

[FlashGordon]

My question is "why wasn't he making those runs earlier?"

Valid question and I suppose it points to a lack of confidence. Just not sure taking him off when he's just starting to a show a bit of a spark was the best idea.

[lionel_messias]

I'd start him against West Ham.

Don't think he was brilliant last night, and he's played in patches this season generally, but think there'll be a lot more space for him and our forward line to exploit in that game.

Seems a very shy lad that needs a goal or special moment to give him a boost.

An interesting point here, he does seem a quiet or shy lad. Whether that means he needs more encouragement behind the scenes - or from the stands - who knows.

I think he needs to start some games alongside Fabinho and possible Gini as well. Just get him running in behind a lot more and driving forward. I reckon there is a player in there, he just needs to start combining with the likes of Mane and Salah.

Let him get his 1st goal and then we'll see...