Author Topic: The Anfield Wrap  (Read 3298928 times)

Offline ljycb

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27400 on: September 12, 2022, 04:23:22 pm »
Everything he's said about them up to now, even on a Liverpool podcast has been very "good people on both sides", as though the way City do things and have 'achieved' their success is just a different, but equally commendable way to Liverpool's.

I mean, I suppose it's good that he now comes out and says something like he did on Unwrapped the other day, but it goes against his whole annoying tone up to this point. And even in making the point, he still managed to list off all of Liverpool's biggest buys in the transfer market, as if to say, "look - Liverpool spend money too".

Sorry, but the bullshit of somehow lumping what Liverpool do in with what City, or indeed United or Chelsea do just does my head in. False equivalence at its worst.

I don’t subscribe anymore but I’ve always thought his ‘praise’ of City and how they’ve achieved their success was to do with good recruitment and a manager who tends to get the best out of players more often that not, which is fair comment and not all that different to how we’ve went about it. We obviously haven’t spent as much, although I would be cautious about us suggesting we are worlds apart from City - it’s a difference that we can recognise but most outside observers would look at our very expensive squad of players and think we’re not necessarily the sizeable underdogs that we often like to make out.

Offline decosabute

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27401 on: September 12, 2022, 04:47:19 pm »
I don’t subscribe anymore but I’ve always thought his ‘praise’ of City and how they’ve achieved their success was to do with good recruitment and a manager who tends to get the best out of players more often that not, which is fair comment and not all that different to how we’ve went about it. We obviously haven’t spent as much, although I would be cautious about us suggesting we are worlds apart from City - it’s a difference that we can recognise but most outside observers would look at our very expensive squad of players and think we’re not necessarily the sizeable underdogs that we often like to make out.

Even if you do the bullshit false-equivalence thing of saying "City have spent money, so have Liverpool" (despite the clear fact that the net spends over the past 10 years, past 5 years or past 3 years are worlds apart), then how do you hold the idea that there's a similarity in how the two clubs' success has been earned?

We made our money, grew our huge fanbase and created our history over generations of good management, laudable principles and stories. City were a nothing side, got bought by a country, went to the top because of that. Its self-made millionaires vs lottery winners.

That's why - in my opinion - City in their current incarnation deserve  zero respect, no matter how good their team is or how many things they win. Its all based on unearned (and if the rules were actually stuck to, illegal) financial doping - it's not sport to rise to the top based on that and not earn it through hard work and doing things the right way and within the rules. Why is this so difficult for people (including Liverpool fans apparently) to grasp?

Offline ljycb

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27402 on: September 12, 2022, 05:11:56 pm »
Even if you do the bullshit false-equivalence thing of saying "City have spent money, so have Liverpool" (despite the clear fact that the net spends over the past 10 years, past 5 years or past 3 years are worlds apart), then how do you hold the idea that there's a similarity in how the two clubs' success has been earned?

We made our money, grew our huge fanbase and created our history over generations of good management, laudable principles and stories. City were a nothing side, got bought by a country, went to the top because of that. Its self-made millionaires vs lottery winners.

That's why - in my opinion - City in their current incarnation deserve  zero respect, no matter how good their team is or how many things they win. Its all based on unearned (and if the rules were actually stuck to, illegal) financial doping - it's not sport to rise to the top based on that and not earn it through hard work and doing things the right way and within the rules. Why is this so difficult for people (including Liverpool fans apparently) to grasp?

I hold the idea there there’s a similarity based on the opinion that both clubs have backed their two great managers by spending a lot of money to assemble two squads full of very good players. If you want to talk about how that money ended up where it is then by all means, I completely agree with you, but like I’ve said already, whenever I’ve heard Neil talking about it, I’ve always thought the point he was making was more to do with good decisions being made by the people who are in charge of the football side at City. And if that is what he’s getting at then I agree with him, and me being a Liverpool supporter is completely irrelevant to that.

Offline decosabute

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27403 on: September 12, 2022, 05:17:00 pm »
I've been dying for someone to say this because I've felt it for a while, and I'm baffled that it doesn't get mentioned. Even on the main show Neil says he thinks Klopp would play him regardless of injuries but there isn't much evidence of that is there?

Second half of last season he didn't get a sniff, didn't make the bench most weeks, and it was arguably our most effective and consistent run ever. I think he flatters to deceive which to be fair, is fine for a 19 year old.

I think Elliott and Milner have huge parts in the system falling to bits, the same way that it fell to bits when Henderson and Fabinho had to play Centre half a few years ago.

Liverpool need the water carrying midfield and Elliott doesn't bring that. We wanted Tchoameni for a reason, we want Bellingham for a reason. Our main midfielders last year were Thiago, Henderson, Fabinho, Keita and Jones. Untl 2nd half v Napoli only one of them has been fit. Until it becomes 4 again, and we replace Keita, we're a bit fucked.

I also 100% agree with Paddy Fitzsimons and was happy to hear him be so forthright with that opinion. Been feeling the same for weeks. Harvey is a very good player individually, but his inclusion in midfield is a big departure from how we normally and, so far at least, it looks bad for our system.

But I also see what Neil means when he says that Klopp would be playing Elliott even without the injuries. It's clear that the manager saw that as something to aim for early last season, and only changed back to the tried-and-tested three solid midfielders once Harvey got injured. He even then tried to go back to using Elliott immediately after he was fit again (Inter away), before realising the player was going to take longer than expected to get up to speed and we were ingrained in our traditional way of playing by February/March anyway.

All this is a long-winded way of saying that I think Klopp is very determined to use and persist with Elliott in midfield. As stated, I'm on the side of Paddy Fitz in having huge doubts as to the overall benefits of it, but I don't think that plan is going anywhere anytime soon.

Offline decosabute

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27404 on: September 12, 2022, 05:28:30 pm »
I hold the idea there there’s a similarity based on the opinion that both clubs have backed their two great managers by spending a lot of money to assemble two squads full of very good players. If you want to talk about how that money ended up where it is then by all means, I completely agree with you, but like I’ve said already, whenever I’ve heard Neil talking about it, I’ve always thought the point he was making was more to do with good decisions being made by the people who are in charge of the football side at City. And if that is what he’s getting at then I agree with him, and me being a Liverpool supporter is completely irrelevant to that.

City might have football people making a lot of good decisions, but don't you see that it's far easier to do that when you have a massive safety net of unlimited money? - get something wrong and just correct the error with more money next window. We don't have the same safety net at all. It's one of the reasons why our ownership/DOF/management are extremely risk-averse - we absolutely need to get it right every time we go big, while City don't.

And even if you hold to the idea that they make as many good decisions as we do (or more), then I still argue you can't just separate that out from the unearned billions spent. The ability to do one simply doesn't exist without the other. Again, this is why I have zero respect for them, no matter how 'well-run' people say they are. Any good decisions made are all coming in the context of a totally artificial construct.

And by the way, lauding their decision-making and praising their management is simply doing exactly what their whole operation wants. They're craving the legitimacy as much as the trophies. The greatest success of all to City's owners is for the club to be seen as having earned and deserved it as much as other clubs - for the financial-doping stigma to no longer apply. We already have so much of the media helping to legitimise them undeservedly, which is why I haven't liked listening to Rory Smith talk about them in general, and why I was so surprised he suddenly changed his tune last week. I really don't feel like listening to people in our fanbase come out with this stuff too.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2022, 06:14:25 pm by decosabute »

Offline The Last Known Survivor

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27405 on: September 12, 2022, 05:31:56 pm »
Since Robbo has gone have they stopped doing the daily bids on YouTube?

Offline ljycb

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27406 on: September 12, 2022, 05:49:25 pm »
City might have football people making a lot of good decisions, but don't you see that it's far easier to do that when you have a massive safety net of unlimited money? - get something wrong and just correct with more money next window. We don't have the same safety net at all. It's one of the reasons why our ownership/DOF/management are extremely risk-averse - we absolutely need to get it right every time, while City don't.

And even if you hold to the idea that they make as many good decisions as we do (or more), then I still argue you can't just separate that out from the unearned billions spent. The ability to do one simply doesn't exist without the other. Again, this is why I have zero respect for them, no matter how 'well-run' people say they are.

And by the way, lauding their decision-making and praising their management is simply doing exactly what their whole operation wants. They're craving the legitimacy as much as the trophies. The greatest success of all to City's owners is for the club to be seen as having earned and deserved it as much as other clubs - for the financial-doping stigma to no longer apply. We already have so much of the media helping to legitimise them undeservedly. I really don't feel like listening to people in our fanbase come out with this stuff too.

You don’t have to listen to it. That is your right. I personally believe people can say “Guardiola is a good manager and Manchester City sign good players” without it meaning that they’re legitimising human rights abuses, but given that you disagree then I would say we’re a fair way apart on this particular issue and there is no real point in continuing with the discussion. Hopefully Neil can provide you with a response of some sort when he is next on here.

Offline decosabute

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27407 on: September 12, 2022, 05:49:37 pm »
Since Robbo has gone have they stopped doing the daily bids on YouTube?

They said a couple of weeks ago that they were only doing one Talking Reds a week from now on. Can't remember what the reason was.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27408 on: September 12, 2022, 06:13:18 pm »
I hold the idea there there’s a similarity based on the opinion that both clubs have backed their two great managers by spending a lot of money to assemble two squads full of very good players. If you want to talk about how that money ended up where it is then by all means, I completely agree with you, but like I’ve said already, whenever I’ve heard Neil talking about it, I’ve always thought the point he was making was more to do with good decisions being made by the people who are in charge of the football side at City. And if that is what he’s getting at then I agree with him, and me being a Liverpool supporter is completely irrelevant to that.
I understand what you are saying and tend to agree. And I tend to agree that that's how otherwise decent commenters are approaching it when they seem to be talking" positively" about City.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27409 on: September 12, 2022, 06:54:47 pm »
I guess the Elliott shout from Neil is based on the fact that he was seemingly first choice at the start of last season. It's fair to say that the injury took its toll in the spring so he was kept away rom a lot of first team action. I think Elliott would be getting game time but injuries have led to him getting too many minutes, I would suggest.

However, I do see the point about Elliott. He's playing well in that he's not doing anything wrong particularly and he uses the ball intelligently and with great confidence. However, systemically there may be something just not working with him in the side when we play against strong and robust midfields.

That said, injuries are a killer and forcing Klopp's hand.

It's hard to make the system (as it's been) work around a player like Elliott. The midfield needs runners and players who are defensively capable to protect the high line. Add in to the fact Thiago has been missing and you're having to carry a 36 year old Milner as well for most of the season so far and Fabinho is left with an impossible job and the defence is too exposed.

Depends on the opposition as well though. Bournemouth are ideal opponents for Elliott in midfield to play on the front foot, a European away against a tough side with a fast attack isn't.
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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27410 on: September 13, 2022, 10:47:00 am »
Good chirpy "Under The Lights" there. Choppy waters can make for good podcasts. Nice one Ian.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27411 on: September 14, 2022, 09:10:24 pm »
Hello, is the audio-only subscription being stopped?

Says my subscription ended at the beginning of the month, and the options are Video or Premium to renew.

[Edit - all sorted, Josh bossed it :) ]
« Last Edit: September 15, 2022, 01:23:03 pm by Andy »

Offline Fitzy.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27412 on: September 17, 2022, 11:26:21 am »
Neil in the queue or…?


:P

Offline Big Bamber

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27413 on: September 21, 2022, 11:06:23 pm »
Neil in the queue or…?


:P

😂 Doubt it but did miss him on the main show.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27414 on: September 26, 2022, 01:27:24 pm »
Anyone else unable to play the paid for shows? They’re showing as Premium and when I check my settings it says “None” under subscription. Have I stopped paying the bills or is it an error? :D

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27415 on: September 26, 2022, 01:56:58 pm »
Anyone else unable to play the paid for shows? They’re showing as Premium and when I check my settings it says “None” under subscription. Have I stopped paying the bills or is it an error? :D

I've downloaded what football means to me since lunch on a third party feed

Offline tmsneil

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27416 on: September 27, 2022, 06:40:38 am »
Rare to ask in here but why not...

Any questions for AFQ Football?

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27417 on: September 27, 2022, 08:01:39 am »
What’s the best team you can put together made up of players with the same first and last initial? I’ll start you off with Zinedine Zidane and Carlton Cole up top.

Offline kavah

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27418 on: September 27, 2022, 09:47:22 am »
Joey Jones (I assume this was on TAW)

Ha - didn't see they were questions for TAW  ;D
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 11:02:57 am by kavah »

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27419 on: September 27, 2022, 09:48:19 am »
What's your favourite non-Liverpool chant?
"If ever a club reflected what made football the biggest sport in the country, it was Liverpool with its ground set in the bosom of the labouring working class being led by a man-of-the-people idealist in Bill Shankly."

Offline kavah

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27420 on: September 27, 2022, 09:52:09 am »
^ best ever EDIT Ha - didn't see they were questions for TAW  ;D

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/39enJP3byRI&amp;t=68s" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/39enJP3byRI&amp;t=68s</a>
« Last Edit: September 27, 2022, 11:03:22 am by kavah »

Offline Kenny's Jacket

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27421 on: September 27, 2022, 09:54:21 am »
What’s the best team you can put together made up of players with the same first and last initial? I’ll start you off with Zinedine Zidane and Carlton Cole up top.

Will this be the only best XI to include Alberto Aquilani?
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27422 on: September 27, 2022, 10:10:24 am »
Rare to ask in here but why not...

Any questions for AFQ Football?

Whats the worst moment you've had inside Anfield?  (Michael Thomas)

Since its re-development, what thing about Anfield do you miss the most?  (The dugouts)

What pre match superstitions do you have?  (I used to buy chips n curry sauce from the same van, spell broken when we drew to Spurs)

Favourite pub near the ground and why?  (The Miden cos its easier to get served and you can drink outside)

As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27423 on: September 27, 2022, 10:52:37 am »
Will this be the only best XI to include Alberto Aquilani?

Was trying to think of you could just get a Liverpool team out of it! Lucas Leiva, Alvaro Arbeloa, Joey Jones, Kevin Keegan…not too shabby if you can fill out the rest.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27424 on: September 27, 2022, 11:03:16 am »
Was trying to think of you could just get a Liverpool team out of it! Lucas Leiva, Alvaro Arbeloa, Joey Jones, Kevin Keegan…not too shabby if you can fill out the rest.

Steve Staunton
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline kavah

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27425 on: September 27, 2022, 11:05:01 am »
John Jeffers (he played for our youth team - port vale cult hero  :P)

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27426 on: September 27, 2022, 11:08:40 am »
John Jeffers (he played for our youth team - port vale cult hero  :P)

Maybe if were having a subs bench ;D
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline Fitzy.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27427 on: September 27, 2022, 11:38:43 am »
Play for Liverpool a handful of times and then have a poor career in League 2.

Or...

Be a League 1 side's greatest ever player but stay there all your career.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27428 on: September 27, 2022, 11:44:22 am »
Was trying to think of you could just get a Liverpool team out of it! Lucas Leiva, Alvaro Arbeloa, Joey Jones, Kevin Keegan…not too shabby if you can fill out the rest.
Gary Gillespie, Ronny Rosenthal! Can't think of a goalie.

Hope we don't have to get Mick Mccarthy to manage them!
Some clubs were always destined for greatness...

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27429 on: September 27, 2022, 11:50:50 am »
Gary Gillespie, Ronny Rosenthal! Can't think of a goalie.

Hope we don't have to get Mick Mccarthy to manage them!

Bob Boulder.

I'm giving myself a pat on the back.


Manager - King Kenny??
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27430 on: September 27, 2022, 11:57:12 am »
Bob Boulder.

I'm giving myself a pat on the back.


Manager - King Kenny??
Er, Kevin Keegan!
Look up "Odious" in the dictionary and Martin Samuel is the given definition.  Call me Klopphooey please.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27431 on: September 27, 2022, 12:19:41 pm »
Er, Kevin Keegan!

In goal? Nah mate  ;)

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27432 on: September 27, 2022, 12:26:22 pm »
In goal? Nah mate  ;)
Steve Staunton.  Gary Gillespie.  Joey Jones.  Larry Lloyd.
Look up "Odious" in the dictionary and Martin Samuel is the given definition.  Call me Klopphooey please.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27433 on: September 27, 2022, 12:31:14 pm »
Mike Marsh, Lucas Leiva. 
Look up "Odious" in the dictionary and Martin Samuel is the given definition.  Call me Klopphooey please.

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27434 on: September 27, 2022, 01:03:03 pm »
Er, Kevin Keegan!

Id rather have the mash up Roy Rodgers. 
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline craiglfc7

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27435 on: September 27, 2022, 03:25:10 pm »
Anyone else unable to play the paid for shows? They’re showing as Premium and when I check my settings it says “None” under subscription. Have I stopped paying the bills or is it an error? :D

Can you email help@theanfieldwrap.com please mate?

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27436 on: September 27, 2022, 03:50:58 pm »
Can you email help@theanfieldwrap.com please mate?

Cheers Craig, just emailed a little while ago. Assume I get 3 months free for getting a question read out on AFQ Football? :D

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27437 on: September 27, 2022, 04:22:30 pm »
Cheers Craig, just emailed a little while ago. Assume I get 3 months free for getting a question read out on AFQ Football? :D

And free tickets for a game of your choice

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27438 on: September 27, 2022, 06:13:35 pm »
Was up all night unable to breathe with a heavy cold so enjoyed both John's Cup Of Tea and Adam's Teza interview. 3 Strikes and also the season (so far) review with Dan. Cheers lads (and lass.)

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Re: The Anfield Wrap
« Reply #27439 on: September 28, 2022, 09:26:33 am »
What’s the best team you can put together made up of players with the same first and last initial? I’ll start you off with Zinedine Zidane and Carlton Cole up top.

Just heard it

#proud  ;D