Poll

RAWK and Brexit

No Deal!
65 (8.8%)
Mays Deal!
14 (1.9%)
No Brexit!
539 (72.8%)
Don't Know
10 (1.4%)
Don't Care
15 (2%)
I don't live in the UK
97 (13.1%)

Total Members Voted: 740

Author Topic: Brexit: "Vultus inanis est et mori in fossa ego sum!"  (Read 1440312 times)

Online oldfordie

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24200 on: August 14, 2019, 11:58:40 pm »
Ha. I'd translate it as he doesn't want a GE while there's still time to have one before 31st October. More leverage for him nearer to the cliffedge. He's also not keen on losing votes to the Lib Dems and Greens so he has to offer something, so why not the most politically indigestible offer possible? Put him in Downing Street and then run a GE election campaign after having put him there with nothing to show for it but a further extension. MPs will sooner try to legislate for a further extension to hold an election without needing to do that.
Is there time to call a VONC and have a GE before the 31st October. I think remember reading something about a minimum 3 weeks from calling the election to election day but not sure but if that's right, maybe it is possible. strange nobody's mentioned it.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24201 on: August 14, 2019, 11:59:48 pm »
He is white, which is important for the Green’s.
And not Jewish...
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24202 on: August 15, 2019, 12:01:19 am »
A source for Trada's claim of SNP agreement, as he couldn't be arsed to provide us with one of his own.

Quote
.@Emmabarnett: Do you have a problem putting Jeremy Corbyn in Number 10?

“We don’t have a problem with Jeremy Corbyn if he commands the House…”

@StephenGethins on whether the SNP would prop up a Corbyn-led caretaker government

#newsnight

https://twitter.com/BBCNewsnight/status/1161761677768978433

It's like Johnson saying he's happy to agree a deal with the EU as long as the backstop is dropped.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24203 on: August 15, 2019, 12:02:12 am »
A source for Trada's claim of SNP agreement, as he couldn't be arsed to provide us with one of his own.

https://twitter.com/BBCNewsnight/status/1161761677768978433

It's like Johnson saying he's happy to agree a deal with the EU as long as the backstop is dropped.
‘If he commands the house’

And he can’t command the confidence of 80% of his own MPs
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W

Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24204 on: August 15, 2019, 12:04:05 am »
Is there time to call a VONC and have a GE before the 31st October. I think remember reading something about a minimum 3 weeks from calling the election to election day but not sure but if that's right, maybe it is possible. strange nobody's mentioned it.

There is time for a VoNC route to a GE - but only if it is done as soon as MPs are back. Think it's 25 working days before the election day for campaigning (under current legislation...), and then there's another two weeks before that needed to dicker about a government. Which works out to a VoNC on 4th September (going from memory) and the VoNC needing to be lodged the day before on the 3rd.

Johnson doesn't need the extra two weeks to ask Parliament for an election, obviously, so he can call one any time up to mid-September if he wanted to try and get 2/3 of MPs to have one before 31st October.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 12:08:23 am by Zeb »
"And the voices of the standing Kop still whispering in the wind will salute the wee Scots redman and he will still walk on.
And your money will have bought you nothing."

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24205 on: August 15, 2019, 12:11:27 am »
I don't really know  :)
I will have a look to see if I can find one.
EDIT, Another link but you tube again so not sure if it will work for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1QYx2E222Y
Bloody hell. I was hoping for something more than that. I was in the US when Extras was on - never seen it, but understand that it was great. But, FFS, Les Dennis doing that takes me right back to the early 80s and my Mum and Dad watching Russ Abbot's Madhouse (or something like that). I hated it back then (or maybe that's just me looking back at it now), but at the same time I can't help but feel nostalgic about it too. Though, I seem to recall Dustin Gee being a cut above the rest of them. Maybe tomorrow I'll pull up some Youtube videos for some cringe-worthy moments of nostalgia. :)
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24206 on: August 15, 2019, 12:14:28 am »
What I find funny about the Blairites for months they were saying that the country needs is a 2nd Ref, and as soon as  Jeremy agreed to a 2nd Referendum in all circumstances they went oh fuck and then when to immediately campaigning for a National Unity Government.
Don't blame me I voted for Jeremy Corbyn!!

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24207 on: August 15, 2019, 12:29:49 am »
There is time for a VoNC route to a GE - but only if it is done as soon as MPs are back. Think it's 25 working days before the election day for campaigning (under current legislation...), and then there's another two weeks before that needed to dicker about a government. Which works out to a VoNC on 4th September (going from memory) and the VoNC needing to be lodged the day before on the 3rd.

Johnson doesn't need the extra two weeks to ask Parliament for an election, obviously, so he can call one any time up to mid-September if he wanted to try and get 2/3 of MPs to have one before 31st October.
Yep, backs up what you were saying but wouldn't the 31 st Oct be too late to hold a GE, the result wouldn't be known till we are out of the EU.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

Offline DJBrenton

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24208 on: August 15, 2019, 12:32:16 am »
Dammit. Blocked in France. Do you have another link?

Get used to being on the wrong side of  La Manche once we leave the continent of Europe for parts unknown.
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Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24209 on: August 15, 2019, 12:32:23 am »
What I find funny about the Blairites for months they were saying that the country needs is a 2nd Ref, and as soon as  Jeremy agreed to a 2nd Referendum in all circumstances they went oh fuck and then when to immediately campaigning for a National Unity Government.

You been on holiday this summer then? Quick catch-up, the current PM and government are threatening to take us out of the EU and bypassing Parliament to do it. The only sure way to stop them from doing that is for them not to be the government and we're running out of time to force an election before the 31st October.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 12:36:25 am by Zeb »
"And the voices of the standing Kop still whispering in the wind will salute the wee Scots redman and he will still walk on.
And your money will have bought you nothing."

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24210 on: August 15, 2019, 12:38:02 am »
What I find funny about the Blairites for months they were saying that the country needs is a 2nd Ref, and as soon as  Jeremy agreed to a 2nd Referendum in all circumstances they went oh fuck and then when to immediately campaigning for a National Unity Government.
Nope, it had sod all to do with Corbyn agreeing to another referendum, it was about stopping us crashing out with a no deal by default on 1st Nov. Corbyn is doing a Boris, he is now running in front of the crowd shouting follow me if you want another referendum. ive no problem with that as am not arsed about Corbyn but we have to do what it takes to stop a no deal.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24211 on: August 15, 2019, 12:41:26 am »
Yep, backs up what you were saying but wouldn't the 31 st Oct be too late to hold a GE, the result wouldn't be known till we are out of the EU.

Think the working out includes that:

Quote
If no alternative government is formed after the government lost the confidence of the House, then the incumbent government has a duty to act only in a caretaker capacity until a successful government is formed. However, it would be responsible for facilitating a general election in the face of an extremely tight timetable. For a new government to attempt to win a general election and be in place before the 31 October deadline, the no confidence process leading up to a fall of the government would have to begin as soon as Parliament returns from summer recess on 3 September. Even then it could require some flexibility in when an election took place, for example breaking the convention of holding elections on Thursdays. The process could be sped up if Parliament legislated for a shorter campaign period, but this would require the support of the government.

p.13, Institute for Government's  Voting on Brexit: Parliament’s role before 31 October (pdf)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 12:46:59 am by Zeb »
"And the voices of the standing Kop still whispering in the wind will salute the wee Scots redman and he will still walk on.
And your money will have bought you nothing."

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24212 on: August 15, 2019, 12:53:28 am »
Think the working out includes that:

p.13, Institute for Government's  Voting on Brexit: Parliament’s role before 31 October (pdf)
So maybe the 25 days can be cut to 3 weeks(21 days) giving the new PM time to ask for a extension to hold a GE.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24213 on: August 15, 2019, 01:01:55 am »
So maybe the 25 days can be cut to 3 weeks(21 days) giving the new PM time to ask for a extension to hold a GE.

It's possible. Just same issue with all the legislative fixes suggested by MPs is that you need the government to at least not be actively hostile to something for it to go through. Same issue as with legislating to say Johnson has to go and request an extension - it only works if he's not dead set on not having an extension even if MPs get past the hurdles he can put up to stop it getting into law in the first place.
"And the voices of the standing Kop still whispering in the wind will salute the wee Scots redman and he will still walk on.
And your money will have bought you nothing."

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24214 on: August 15, 2019, 01:15:20 am »
Corbyn doing all he can to grab power, and quite effectively it seems. He as leader of the opposition is the only person that commands legitimacy in the event of a vote of no confidence. He can hold this position and call the bluff of anti-no dealers dealers in other parties. As we run closer to the 31st the anti-no dealers will grow more desperate with no budge coming from the Labour camp, as well of course the prospect of crashing out. They may very well be forced to choose between no deal or giving power to Corbyn.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24215 on: August 15, 2019, 01:21:25 am »
It's possible. Just same issue with all the legislative fixes suggested by MPs is that you need the government to at least not be actively hostile to something for it to go through. Same issue as with legislating to say Johnson has to go and request an extension - it only works if he's not dead set on not having an extension even if MPs get past the hurdles he can put up to stop it getting into law in the first place.
Am sure many in the government would be hostile but it's all about majorities. if enough MPs want it to happen then there's still time, all boils down to your first point on whether Corbyns stalling the VONC.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24216 on: August 15, 2019, 01:29:53 am »
Corbyn doing all he can to grab power, and quite effectively it seems. He as leader of the opposition is the only person that commands legitimacy in the event of a vote of no confidence. He can hold this position and call the bluff of anti-no dealers dealers in other parties. As we run closer to the 31st the anti-no dealers will grow more desperate with no budge coming from the Labour camp, as well of course the prospect of crashing out. They may very well be forced to choose between no deal or giving power to Corbyn.

If it was Corbyn or no deal then no deal is not an option. But I would never forgive the scheming c*nt for his complicity in landing us where we are.

As miserable and desperate for his five minutes of glory as Johnson.

What a miserable country we live in where we have to choose between the lesser of two absolute c*nts.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24217 on: August 15, 2019, 01:52:44 am »
Corbyn doing all he can to grab power, and quite effectively it seems. He as leader of the opposition is the only person that commands legitimacy in the event of a vote of no confidence. He can hold this position and call the bluff of anti-no dealers dealers in other parties. As we run closer to the 31st the anti-no dealers will grow more desperate with no budge coming from the Labour camp, as well of course the prospect of crashing out. They may very well be forced to choose between no deal or giving power to Corbyn.
What power would Corbyn have? he would be nothing more than a representative of the remain alliance to ask the EU to give us time to hold a GE by giving us a extension, ive only heard clips of news tonight but it seems the smaller parties are telling him to get stuffed,i can only assume they have asked him to clarify his stance and he is putting the Labour party ahead of the country.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24218 on: August 15, 2019, 02:35:38 am »
Am sure many in the government would be hostile but it's all about majorities. if enough MPs want it to happen then there's still time, all boils down to your first point on whether Corbyns stalling the VONC.

Commons is only one part of the equation, tough as that will be, sadly. Think back to Cooper's bill and how quickly it went through the Lords - in the end, because May chose not to block it and to allow it to be sped through rather than test it to the limit. Even in allowing it to be pushed forward, May was turning a blind eye to some things as there were questions about other things too. eg with the idea around legislating to force Johnson to get an extension, next EU budget is decided April next year - does anyone but the government have the authority to sign us up to 7 more years of EU payments if an extension goes past that point? 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 02:37:37 am by Zeb »
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And your money will have bought you nothing."

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24219 on: August 15, 2019, 02:38:48 am »
Corbyn doing all he can to grab power, and quite effectively it seems. He as leader of the opposition is the only person that commands legitimacy in the event of a vote of no confidence. He can hold this position and call the bluff of anti-no dealers dealers in other parties. As we run closer to the 31st the anti-no dealers will grow more desperate with no budge coming from the Labour camp, as well of course the prospect of crashing out. They may very well be forced to choose between no deal or giving power to Corbyn.

He can't command legitimacy if he can't command confidence. One follows from the other.
"And the voices of the standing Kop still whispering in the wind will salute the wee Scots redman and he will still walk on.
And your money will have bought you nothing."

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24220 on: August 15, 2019, 03:15:57 am »
Commons is only one part of the equation, tough as that will be, sadly. Think back to Cooper's bill and how quickly it went through the Lords - in the end, because May chose not to block it and to allow it to be sped through rather than test it to the limit. Even in allowing it to be pushed forward, May was turning a blind eye to some things as there were questions about other things too. eg with the idea around legislating to force Johnson to get an extension, next EU budget is decided April next year - does anyone but the government have the authority to sign us up to 7 more years of EU payments if an extension goes past that point?
Do you expect a extension till April,what would it be for, I wouldn't worry about any EU long term commitments if we are still in the EU in April 2020 as this is reaching crunch time. it's a good point you have made though, I would of been happy with a 2 yr extension but it will be far harder to win if the WA is bumped with 7 more yrs of EU commitments.
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24221 on: August 15, 2019, 03:57:10 am »
Do you expect a extension till April,what would it be for, I wouldn't worry about any EU long term commitments if we are still in the EU in April 2020 as this is reaching crunch time. it's a good point you have made though, I would of been happy with a 2 yr extension but it will be far harder to win if the WA is bumped with 7 more yrs of EU commitments.

Not sure how we get to an extension to be honest, although I suspect April 2020 would be the final deadline for us with the EU for that reason, among the host of others.

Just was an example of the stuff which gets thrown up when we're this far into a place where the executive and the legislature are at total odds with each other over the powers of the executive being exercised - such as negotiating international agreements, and even when elections are held. The Speaker ruled that Cooper's Bill didn't need the government's permission to go to the Lords, even though it touched on spending powers and diplomacy, whereas that's harder to do if you're giving Johnson very specific directions (cos he's an untrustworthy sod) or playing about with election law. Just gives government room to delay and block, and delays in September/October risk any fixes coming too late to be of much use. May be something of nothing, just minded that one of the legislative experts who was raising all the issues (and explaining them) has been hired by Johnson.
"And the voices of the standing Kop still whispering in the wind will salute the wee Scots redman and he will still walk on.
And your money will have bought you nothing."

Offline DerKaiser

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24222 on: August 15, 2019, 04:44:08 am »
What power would Corbyn have? he would be nothing more than a representative of the remain alliance to ask the EU to give us time to hold a GE by giving us a extension, ive only heard clips of news tonight but it seems the smaller parties are telling him to get stuffed,i can only assume they have asked him to clarify his stance and he is putting the Labour party ahead of the country.
Well I suppose that is the point. The route to power is there, the cronies recognise this and will grow ever more underhanded to get there. However his on paper legitimacy does not translate to having command over the house. Paper tiger comes to mind.


How much bloody better off we would be if we had a competent leader of the opp who had cross-party appeal.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24223 on: August 15, 2019, 09:44:58 am »
I'm not one for capital punishment but, given legal licence, I'd happily put a bullet through Arron Banks' skull.

 https://twitter.com/Phil_Ripley/status/1161909014436831233

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24224 on: August 15, 2019, 10:13:34 am »
So true.

Jimothy
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Strange how Corbyn somehow has the magic ability to stop Brexit at any point and is constantly berated for it, except at the point at which he makes a move to actually do it, when he miraculously becomes incapable of doing anything.
Don't blame me I voted for Jeremy Corbyn!!

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24225 on: August 15, 2019, 10:26:05 am »
All credit to the Lib Dems who would happily get in bed with the tories for 5 years but seem unwilling to comprehend a short term agreement to work with Corbyn to prevent no deal.

Definitely not a Tory-lite party, not at all.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24226 on: August 15, 2019, 10:38:49 am »
All credit to the Lib Dems who would happily get in bed with the tories for 5 years but seem unwilling to comprehend a short term agreement to work with Corbyn to prevent no deal.

Definitely not a Tory-lite party, not at all.

Is Barry Gardiner still propping up the Tories?

LibDems are happy to work with the likes of Watson or Harmon though, although maybe they are Tory lite as well these days its so hard to keep track...

Offline Circa1892

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24227 on: August 15, 2019, 10:50:53 am »
Corbyn insisting he leads an interim government is foolish, short sighted and arrogant. Surely even thickos like him and Milne realise that it doesn't give him any power - the minute he either does or doesn't do something that blocks or postpones Brexit he himself loses a vote of no confidence?

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24228 on: August 15, 2019, 11:08:30 am »
That said if I was the LibDems I wouldn't have ruled it out, just said they would support it if Corbyn had the votes from elsewhere to make it work, but that they thought that was unlikely to happen under his leadership.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24229 on: August 15, 2019, 11:25:15 am »
Skynews are saying  the Tories "rebels" have said they are happy to talk to and meet Jeremy about his plan.
Don't blame me I voted for Jeremy Corbyn!!

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24230 on: August 15, 2019, 11:31:29 am »
Is Barry Gardiner still propping up the Tories?

LibDems are happy to work with the likes of Watson or Harmon though, although maybe they are Tory lite as well these days its so hard to keep track...

I thought no deal was apocalyptic though?

Surely the Lib Dems would work with the devil himself if it were to avoid it? That's their entire platform currently isnt it, prevent no deal. Fuck knows what else they stand for beyond Brexit.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24231 on: August 15, 2019, 11:32:02 am »
So true.

Jimothy
‏ @XRedTimX


Strange how Corbyn somehow has the magic ability to stop Brexit at any point and is constantly berated for it, except at the point at which he makes a move to actually do it, when he miraculously becomes incapable of doing anything.


I suppose that (apparent) conundrum to you and your peers could probably be solved if you understand that he is berated for not having tried to stop brexit (you said yourself he's pro a labour brexit), but then on the rare occasions he puts his mind to something to try and achieve anything his embarrassing incompetence shows him up.

There's an easy solution to that real 'thinker' of a problem you're struggling with mate.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24232 on: August 15, 2019, 11:32:35 am »
Skynews are saying  the Tories "rebels" have said they are happy to talk to and meet Jeremy about his plan.

If a compromise can be found that enough of them will fall in behind, then the LibDems will look pretty stupid for saying "No" off the bat when they will rapidly have to come around to say "yes".

That said I remain unconvinced Corbyn can get enough Tories on board to get the votes required, given its not as though every non Tory vote is locked in, I don't think he could depend on Hoey's vote and there is no leverage to apply there given she is standing down anyway, and some of the current hefty number of "Independents" aren't sure things either.

It's a big win for Corbyn if he can make it happen though, likely to ease Labour's problem with some of the Remainer vote it is haemorrhaging and if he can not behave like a total tit in his short time in office probably eases some of his personal negatives as well

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24233 on: August 15, 2019, 11:34:05 am »
All credit to the Lib Dems who would happily get in bed with the tories for 5 years but seem unwilling to comprehend a short term agreement to work with Corbyn to prevent no deal.

Definitely not a Tory-lite party, not at all.

Do you ever look beyond the optics and tribal identity? Politics can be quite interesting, if you take an interest.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24234 on: August 15, 2019, 11:34:45 am »
I thought no deal was apocalyptic though?

Surely the Lib Dems would work with the devil himself if it were to avoid it? That's their entire platform currently isnt it, prevent no deal. Fuck knows what else they stand for beyond Brexit.

Sorry you are mixing it up with Labour's platform which is stop No Deal, the LibDems is to stop Brexit.

To be honest a fair few of the politically active Remainers I know, are just as opposed to May's deal as they are to No Deal.

As I said anyway I think the LibDems have made a misstep on this, all they needed to say was that they aren't convinced Corbyn is the right person to lead a GNU, but if he can get the votes to make it work they will provide temporary support. Then say that they equally hope that in the same spirit of compromise they hope that if Corbyn cannot get the votes to form a government he will support any other compromise candidates who emerge with the same aim.

« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 11:40:23 am by filopastry »

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24235 on: August 15, 2019, 11:39:37 am »
Sorry you are mixing it up with Labour's platform which is stop No Deal, the LibDems is to stop Brexit.

To be honest a fair few of the politically active Remainers I know, are just as opposed to May's deal as they are to No Deal.

Start with preventing no deal shall we? Probably more pressing.

Constant calls to be grown up and pragmatic soon go out of the window as soon as its the centrists needing to compromise.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24236 on: August 15, 2019, 11:39:50 am »
Don't blame me I voted for Jeremy Corbyn!!

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24237 on: August 15, 2019, 11:40:47 am »
That said if I was the LibDems I wouldn't have ruled it out, just said they would support it if Corbyn had the votes from elsewhere to make it work, but that they thought that was unlikely to happen under his leadership.
Yep, that should have been the message. The Lib Dems are in danger of claiming some of the 'credit' for this going disastrously wrong themselves, if they're not careful. If the reason for not supporting a Corbyn anti-no-deal temporary government is that the Tory rebels won't support it, let the Tory rebels say that.

Of course in reality, the Lib Dems are also putting party a little ahead of country, and don't want Labour to recover any partial credit for heading off a no deal.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24238 on: August 15, 2019, 11:42:50 am »
Start with preventing no deal shall we? Probably more pressing.
Hmm, it's pressing is it?

How come your man didn't call a vote of no confidence in Johnson when he had the chance, instead of standing on a platform outside parliament to be verbally felated by Richard Burgon and a gang of two hundred SWP weirdos.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24239 on: August 15, 2019, 11:42:51 am »
Start with preventing no deal shall we? Probably more pressing.

Constant calls to be grown up and pragmatic soon go out of the window as soon as its the centrists needing to compromise.

I agree on the need for compromise, and I repeat I think it was a bit daft of the LDs to say No (I'm assuming they did, I haven't seen the statement) but that applies to all sides.

If Corbyn can get enough Tory support to make it work the LDs will fall in line anyway