Topic: COVID-19:VERIFIED news sources, 0 politishit, 0 CONSPIRACY SHITE

[reddebs]

Been into our village this morning and we've got a vaccination centre set up. 

We thought we'd have to go into Rotherham when our turn came so that's great to have one on the doorstep.

[TepidT2O]

Interesting article from the BBC bout vaccination process;

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20210114-covid-19-how-effective-is-a-single-vaccine-dose?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB

Very interesting

Having had covid, I wonder if I will get a benefit from the vaccine.  Or will it act like a booster shot? Would be interested to know.

[filopastry]

Interesting article from the BBC bout vaccination process;

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20210114-covid-19-how-effective-is-a-single-vaccine-dose?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB

It will be interesting to see how Janssen/J&J gets on when it releases the Phase 3 data from its one dose trial, expected to report before the end of the month.

[west_london_red]

Vaccination data by day for England, not sure if there are any unusual factors at work in terms of reporting delays, but yesterday also looking a little lower.

It’s also worrying that the 2nd dose number are hardly moving, and they are just storing up problems for later when (and this is just a hunch on my part) they can’t deliver the second doses in 12 weeks and then we get told there is in fact no need for a second dose.

[classycarra]

Very interesting

Having had covid, I wonder if I will get a benefit from the vaccine.  Or will it act like a booster shot? Would be interested to know.

Acting like a booster shot would be you getting a benefit from the vaccine.

It’s also worrying that the 2nd dose number are hardly moving, and they are just storing up problems for later when (and this is just a hunch on my part) they can’t deliver the second doses in 12 weeks and then we get told there is in fact no need for a second dose.

It's not concerning in and of itself. The decision was made to lengthen the dose interval a while ago now, so these are partly just the final leftover 3 week interval appointments that clinicians chose not to extend to 12 weeks. Would expect the overnight increase on those to keep trending to a lower increase up until around the end of Feb at the earliest (unless way ahead of schedule and many peoples second dose is moved to a shorted interval than the maximum of 12).

[CraigDS]

Seems to be some talk of going back into tiers for Easter weekend.

The problem being that cases got so out of control that it will take many weeks to get them back under control again. What joys.

Especially with this lockdown looking seemingly more like a lockdown lite 2.0.

Roads are chocker outside heading into town. Drove through yesterday to the supermarket and it was as packed as a normal day.

Supermarkets themselves need investigating after this is over too. In March-May they had queues outside as they limited numbers in, and they had one way systems in place. Those places a are fucking free for all now though - and they’re certainly not enforcing mask wearing (in my experience) even now they’ve said they’re not allowing those in without. They’ve played a huge role in this spreading imo.

[redgriffin73]

There's a hell of a lot of people who moved their holiday from last year to this year. I have two myself with Lanzarote in June which was booked myself direct with villa owner and Ryanair and Paphos in Sept booked through Tui that we moved from last year.

Who knows what's happening next week though never mind June and Sept.....

Yep, same here, sweating on a June holiday which was moved from last June.

[west_london_red]

It's not concerning in and of itself. The decision was made to lengthen the dose interval a while ago now, so these are partly just the final leftover 3 week interval appointments that clinicians chose not to extend to 12 weeks. Would expect the overnight increase on those to keep trending to a lower increase up until around the end of Feb at the earliest (unless way ahead of schedule and many peoples second dose is moved to a shorted interval than the maximum of 12).

Yeah, that was a thought as well, but will mean we get no new people vaccinated for a period while they go back over everyone whose been vaccinated once already.

[Andy82lfc]

Especially with this lockdown looking seemingly more like a lockdown lite 2.0.

Roads are chocker outside heading into town. Drove through yesterday to the supermarket and it was as packed as a normal day.

Supermarkets themselves need investigating after this is over too. In March-May they had queues outside as they limited numbers in, and they had one way systems in place. Those places a are fucking free for all now though - and they’re certainly not enforcing mask wearing (in my experience) even now they’ve said they’re not allowing those in without. They’ve played a huge role in this spreading imo.

Many supermarkets in other countries have mandatory mask wearing policies, no exemptions, nothing. Some also check temperatures before you go in and spray your hands. The culture in the UK of people being selfish and shops not enforcing anything is disgraceful. How many extra people will have died because people don’t bother wearing a mask in places like grocery shops where people have no choice but to go.

[filopastry]

I am lucky enough to have basically managed to avoid supermarkets since last Spring, but form those I know who do go out locally I would say Costco is about the only place which I am aware of properly enforcing mask guidance.

[CraigDS]

I am lucky enough to have basically managed to avoid supermarkets since last Spring, but form those I know who do go out locally I would say Costco is about the only place which I am aware of properly enforcing mask guidance.

Yeah Costco has been very strict. Someone has been on the door refusing entry for non-mask wearing since this all started and they constantly have people queuing outside as they enforce a strict max number policy.

Tesco Park Rd and ASDA Sefton though.... it’s just let as many people in as possible, mask or no mask.

[west_london_red]

I am lucky enough to have basically managed to avoid supermarkets since last Spring, but form those I know who do go out locally I would say Costco is about the only place which I am aware of properly enforcing mask guidance.

Yeah, my local Costco has not really changed much since the first lockdown, they have pretty much just kept everything in place since then. Just a shame they stock such a limited range of groceries and such large packets of everything that you still need to go to another supermarket to do a proper shop.

[TepidT2O]

Especially with this lockdown looking seemingly more like a lockdown lite 2.0.

Roads are chocker outside heading into town. Drove through yesterday to the supermarket and it was as packed as a normal day.

Supermarkets themselves need investigating after this is over too. In March-May they had queues outside as they limited numbers in, and they had one way systems in place. Those places a are fucking free for all now though - and they’re certainly not enforcing mask wearing (in my experience) even now they’ve said they’re not allowing those in without. They’ve played a huge role in this spreading imo.

You say that, but cases are falling quite quickly ...especially in London.  I wonder if we haven’t just got better at doing what we can without much risk.

Acting like a booster shot would be you getting a benefit from the vaccine.

That’s what I imagined. Cant see much on it though.

[CraigDS]

You say that, but cases are falling quite quickly ...especially in London.  I wonder if we haven’t just got better at doing what we can without much risk.

Or you wonder just how fast they would fall if people took it more seriously...

[djahern]

I really hope we can get to get away too, but all the noise seems to be that we are getting ready to impose a NZ/Australia level quarantine procedure. The change in tone over the past 3 weeks is quite stark with the Cabinet, remains to be seen whether they will go ahead with it but I have a feeling they may.

Now with us entering the warmer months in the future they may relax this over the summer as opposed to shutting our borders.

I was looking forward to getting away in the summer but now I am not as confident. I do wonder if we might shut up shop for 2021, allow the world to get vaccinated before travel returns in early 2022. Probably means by the summer we can lift most restrictions but as a consequence you cannot enter the country without quarantining.

I think also there's been a change in thinking with the cabinet.

To me there appears to be two options available post Easter:
1) open up the pubs/restaurants gradually when the numbers are sufficiently low enough for it and track and trace can cope. Prevent most tourism from coming into the country and make it very difficult for our own to go on a foreign holiday. Can do this by enforcing strict (and expensive) quarantine. Let people vacation in the UK
2) have many restrictions remain in place for pubs/restaurants. Allow foreign travel and holidays to the continent.

Learning from last Summer, all the above can't happen and a choice needs to be made for this Summer. Our issue last Summer was people returning from foreign holidays in Spain, France, Italy and reintroducing the virus multiple times. I would say with the recent emergence of different variants that the government may lean for something like option 1 until at least the Autumn. In option 1 they could if they wanted try to create some sort of bubble with Ireland - travel between both counties is allowed, travel from either to a third country is made extremely difficult.

What they choose has to give the best chance that this is the last lockdown, the last time that businesses will be shut (even if they are to reopen slowly) and the last time the health system is put under this kind of pressure.

[Qston]

Interesting article from the BBC bout vaccination process;

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20210114-covid-19-how-effective-is-a-single-vaccine-dose?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB

Thanks for posting. Interesting and useful read.

[Qston]

I am lucky enough to have basically managed to avoid supermarkets since last Spring, but form those I know who do go out locally I would say Costco is about the only place which I am aware of properly enforcing mask guidance.

Costco were the leaders from the start to be honest. They were one of the first with key staff hours. I have been twice since this all began and on both occasions the rules have been strictly applied. Hats off to them for getting it right. That said, it is easier to police somewhere like costco with quite big open aisles, fewer shoppers and so on that it would be like a large busy supermarket where I suspect footfall is much higher.

[TepidT2O]

Or you wonder just how fast they would fall if people took it more seriously...

Well very few wore masks in lockdown 1 so we’ve improved there,  I think we’ve just managed to keep more going by being a bit smarter.  Is compliance lower? Probably a bit, but we’re probably a bit smarter too.

[thaddeus]

You say that, but cases are falling quite quickly ...especially in London.  I wonder if we haven’t just got better at doing what we can without much risk.

I can't find the Tweet now but the traffic volumes in Greater London dropped far more proportionally after the lockdown that other parts of the country.  They surmised this was because proportionally less of the traffic there was 'essential' compared to other areas.

There was also the artificial peak caused by Christmas but it does seem that R nationally is below 1 so the lockdown, although appearing relatively slack, is having a positive impact.  As you say, maybe a lot of those out and about are doing so in a "Covid safe" way and schools - the definition of "Covid unsafe" - being closed is surely helping.

With my tinfoil hat on I also think in time the B117 variant will be shown to be less than the additional 70% transmissible currently accepted.  That figure seems to be entirely based on how it has taken hold here but there were so many other factors at play during that time period.  Less than 25% of the astonishing spike in cases in Ireland were the B117 mutation, for example.  That said, I have zero experience or training in the field of microbiology

[redbyrdz]

It’s also worrying that the 2nd dose number are hardly moving, and they are just storing up problems for later when (and this is just a hunch on my part) they can’t deliver the second doses in 12 weeks and then we get told there is in fact no need for a second dose.

I think so far only people who had their second dose booked in from the start has had it, that's why there is no increase in that number. Since the beginning of January, they've changed the interval between 1st and 2nd dose to 12 weeks - but there haven't been 12 weeks yet for anyone to get their second dose.

[AmSeeker]

The ZERO covid approach could have worked back last summer when we bought the numbers down after a long lockdown - it should have been the approach. To try that now in the second year would be pushing the limits of peoples adherence. 

You would effectively have to close EVERYTHING DOWN (even more than the first lockdown), over a period of 3 months or more, then fix the track and trace system, close borders, strict hardcore rules on those who have to isolate. Doubt the country could afford that, and the people would be willing to go for it ? Maybe i'm wrong though.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/01/19/pfizer-vaccine-may-prevent-transmission-coronavirus-others-israeli/

Would be nice to see if the Oxford one might be the same

Would be a shame if it didn't, and we plucked for the wrong vaccine.

[thaddeus]

I think also there's been a change in thinking with the cabinet.

To me there appears to be two options available post Easter:
1) open up the pubs/restaurants gradually when the numbers are sufficiently low enough for it and track and trace can cope. Prevent most tourism from coming into the country and make it very difficult for our own to go on a foreign holiday. Can do this by enforcing strict (and expensive) quarantine. Let people vacation in the UK
2) have many restrictions remain in place for pubs/restaurants. Allow foreign travel and holidays to the continent.

Learning from last Summer, all the above can't happen and a choice needs to be made for this Summer. Our issue last Summer was people returning from foreign holidays in Spain, France, Italy and reintroducing the virus multiple times. I would say with the recent emergence of different variants that the government may lean for something like option 1 until at least the Autumn. In option 1 they could if they wanted try to create some sort of bubble with Ireland - travel between both counties is allowed, travel from either to a third country is made extremely difficult.

What they choose has to give the best chance that this is the last lockdown, the last time that businesses will be shut (even if they are to reopen slowly) and the last time the health system is put under this kind of pressure.

It would be useful if they could share their medium/long term vision - with the caveats that it could all be left in ruins if the facts change.  Rolling out a mass vaccination programme only to then have a mass holiday exodus with the potential for introducing Covid variants that evade the vaccines would be the height of stupidity.

I'd hope they use the vaccine rollout along with the grace of entering the summer (where the virus just seems to spread less easily) to bring numbers down to such a low level that the much lauded/mocked Test & Trace system can stamp out any breakouts before they begin.

[rob1966]

Yeah Costco has been very strict. Someone has been on the door refusing entry for non-mask wearing since this all started and they constantly have people queuing outside as they enforce a strict max number policy.

Tesco Park Rd and ASDA Sefton though.... it’s just let as many people in as possible, mask or no mask.

Tesco have suddenly started radio ads saying they are enforcing the law now, traffic light system, one way systems, masks unless exempt or no entry, shop alone unless with a carer or children. Where was all this in the run up to Christmas when the shops were packed?

[redbyrdz]

You say that, but cases are falling quite quickly ...especially in London.  I wonder if we haven’t just got better at doing what we can without much risk.

I'm more surprised that cases increased that much before the lockdown. It must mean that we did something wrong before that - for example, that shops aren't safe, or that schools are a much bigger infection risk that we thought. A lot of what's changed between pre-lockdown and now was guidance turned into law. Even before the lockdown, you were advised not to mix with too many people, keep distance, only go out if you had too, etc. Either loads weren't careful or the few hard measures (restaurants, shops, and school closures) make a much bigger impact than we thought. Which wouldn't be good going forward - we do want to open them again sometime.

[Cu Chulainn]

I think also there's been a change in thinking with the cabinet.

To me there appears to be two options available post Easter:
1) open up the pubs/restaurants gradually when the numbers are sufficiently low enough for it and track and trace can cope. Prevent most tourism from coming into the country and make it very difficult for our own to go on a foreign holiday. Can do this by enforcing strict (and expensive) quarantine. Let people vacation in the UK
2) have many restrictions remain in place for pubs/restaurants. Allow foreign travel and holidays to the continent.

Learning from last Summer, all the above can't happen and a choice needs to be made for this Summer. Our issue last Summer was people returning from foreign holidays in Spain, France, Italy and reintroducing the virus multiple times. I would say with the recent emergence of different variants that the government may lean for something like option 1 until at least the Autumn. In option 1 they could if they wanted try to create some sort of bubble with Ireland - travel between both counties is allowed, travel from either to a third country is made extremely difficult.

What they choose has to give the best chance that this is the last lockdown, the last time that businesses will be shut (even if they are to reopen slowly) and the last time the health system is put under this kind of pressure.

They have to prioritise domestic reopening, surely?

[CraigDS]

Tesco have suddenly started radio ads saying they are enforcing the law now, traffic light system, one way systems, masks unless exempt or no entry, shop alone unless with a carer or children. Where was all this in the run up to Christmas when the shops were packed?

Well it would have cost them money then. Now, shopping numbers are naturally lower at this time of year, so they can do it without must loss of custom.

[rob1966]

Well it would have cost them money then. Now, shopping numbers are naturally lower at this time of year, so they can do it without must loss of custom.

Yeah there is always a lull after Christmas, you've probably noticed less Tesco trailers banging past your apartment (Its not me anymore)

[CraigDS]

Yeah there is always a lull after Christmas, you've probably noticed less Tesco trailers banging past your apartment (Its not me anymore)

Haha, I thought they’d driven past nice and quietly lately!

[buttersstotch]

I think also there's been a change in thinking with the cabinet.

To me there appears to be two options available post Easter:
1) open up the pubs/restaurants gradually when the numbers are sufficiently low enough for it and track and trace can cope. Prevent most tourism from coming into the country and make it very difficult for our own to go on a foreign holiday. Can do this by enforcing strict (and expensive) quarantine. Let people vacation in the UK
2) have many restrictions remain in place for pubs/restaurants. Allow foreign travel and holidays to the continent.

Learning from last Summer, all the above can't happen and a choice needs to be made for this Summer. Our issue last Summer was people returning from foreign holidays in Spain, France, Italy and reintroducing the virus multiple times. I would say with the recent emergence of different variants that the government may lean for something like option 1 until at least the Autumn. In option 1 they could if they wanted try to create some sort of bubble with Ireland - travel between both counties is allowed, travel from either to a third country is made extremely difficult.

What they choose has to give the best chance that this is the last lockdown, the last time that businesses will be shut (even if they are to reopen slowly) and the last time the health system is put under this kind of pressure.

I think they could go with number 1. There was some noise in The Times/Telegraph about it at the weekend, but even with the messaging to the public now it's all about "new strains". And constantly we're hearing of new mutations, which is completely normal of course but we also don't know if they hamper the vaccine programme. I have a feeling we might aire on the side of caution this summer unless the rest of the world are on a par with our vaccination programme.

I honestly think this is the last time we will hopefully lockdown fully so something has to give. The problem is if you tell people they can't go away in the summer, the only way to balance that out would be to have life almost back to normal in the UK. For which I think people would take..

[CraigDS]

I’d be amazed if they don’t try and open up some travel before summer. It’s a MASSIVE industry for the UK, and would require huge financial support, if they do not.

Maybe with much stricter testing in place upon arrival, harsher punishments for non-quarantining when arriving back, etc.

[filopastry]

I think that is a new record for reported deaths in a day (although obviously a lot of catchup today from the weekend)

[buttersstotch]

I’d be amazed if they don’t try and open up some travel before summer. It’s a MASSIVE industry for the UK, and would require huge financial support, if they do not.

Maybe with much stricter testing in place upon arrival, harsher punishments for non-quarantining when arriving back, etc.

That's easily done though if the majority of the rest of the economy is open up and booming. I still am not convinced it's happening and I was looking to get away, but the shift in tone from the Cabinet does seem a little bit different. Something is going to have to give this summer be it vaccine passports, mandatory quarantine etc. - I just think the risk is too big in the summer until we know more about the vaccine e.g. if you can still carry and infect others.

I hope I am wrong but I really am starting to wonder if we might just go it alone ala NZ/Aus. Think of it from an idelogical perspective too- it's good Brexit PR for them (even though we probably could have done this in 2020).

[TepidT2O]

Case numbers good again...

The trouble is that reduction in numbers is also exponential so we won’t see these rapid gains so quickly in weeks to come.  (Although they are a wee bit quicker to fall than might have been expected)

[CraigDS]

That's easily done though if the majority of the rest of the economy is open up and booming. I still am not convinced it's happening and I was looking to get away, but the shift in tone from the Cabinet does seem a little bit different. Something is going to have to give this summer be it vaccine passports, mandatory quarantine etc. - I just think the risk is too big in the summer until we know more about the vaccine e.g. if you can still carry and infect others.

I hope I am wrong but I really am starting to wonder if we might just go it alone ala NZ/Aus. Think of it from an idelogical perspective too- it's good Brexit PR for them (even though we probably could have done this in 2020).

Not sure it is great PR. As much as the brexit lovers want closed boarders they also love getting away to the Costa del Sol to turn red every summer.

[rob1966]

Not sure it is great PR. As much as the brexit lovers want closed boarders they also love getting away to the Costa del Sol to turn red every summer.

If they can't invade Benidorm to eat Fish and Chips and Sunday Dinner, they'll go mental.

[Andy82lfc]

Tesco have suddenly started radio ads saying they are enforcing the law now, traffic light system, one way systems, masks unless exempt or no entry, shop alone unless with a carer or children. Where was all this in the run up to Christmas when the shops were packed?

“Nobody’s on the naughty list” “people are dying so everyone gorge on as much as you can”

[Fromola]

Seems to be some talk of going back into tiers for Easter weekend.

The problem being that cases got so out of control that it will take many weeks to get them back under control again. What joys.

Tier 3/4 has generally been enough to keep things under control as long as the R rate isn't too high to begin with, in which cases stronger measures needed. R rate is slowly but surely coming down again.

The problems have occurred when areas have been opened up too much beyond that. Putting London and the South East into tier 2 through December (and Liverpool too) has had disastrous consequences.

If they'd just kept the country in tier 4 through December then we wouldn't be in this mess but Boris didn't have the bollocks to 'cancel Christmas' and wanted the headlines for 'saving Christmas' and keeping the high streets and shopping centres packed out with Christmas shoppers wasn't thought through.

[filopastry]

Trending data by date

[classycarra]

Would be a shame if it didn't, and we plucked for the wrong vaccine.

A vaccine that's currently available, is being further mass-manufactured, is effective at offering protection against illness/death, and that's already been rolled out into millions of peoples' arms in the past month is not 'the wrong vaccine' by absolutely any definition.

[Lee1-6Liv]

Vaccination numbers down again today.